Getting off Valor early in St Kitts instead of final stop in San Juan

[Shmoo here]

Right, but the passenger would not be therefore it isn't a PVSA violation. There may be other problems such as with Carnival policy and local immigration in St. Kitts but isn't about the PVSA.

 

Let's say for the sake of argument that the ship embarked from Miami for a closed loop cruise. If the passenger got off in Key West, that would be a PVSA violation because he is going from one US port to a different US port without visiting a distant foreign port. In the OP's example the change is not a violation because he is ending in a foreign port where the PVSA does not apply. For the passenger to be violating the PVSA it doesn't matter what the ship is doing, it matters what the passenger is doing.

 

Correct.

 

I think the confusion is happening due to the fact that those closed loop cruises from US ports used to allow late/early embarkation/disembarkation with no problem because of the no issue with the PVSA. But the problem now is Carnival, at least, doesn't want to mess with the different immigration procedures in the cases where it changes what type of cruise the ship is doing.

[lostdart1]

Facts: (which doesn't answer this question)

 

 

1. The Valor accepts new passengers in Barbados.

 

2. I live in St Thomas......I asked if I could board the Valor in St Thomas instead of San Juan.......I was told yes, but there was a $300 upcharge.

[WLHyatt]

We had a friend do this in Cozumel in 2012. He called carnival and they arranged a customs person to meet him in the lobby to do the paper workand he was of the ship. He returned a couple of months later.

 

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[Shmoo here]

Facts: (which doesn't answer this question)

 

 

1. The Valor accepts new passengers in Barbados.

 

2. I live in St Thomas......I asked if I could board the Valor in St Thomas instead of San Juan.......I was told yes, but there was a $300 upcharge.

 

That $300 "upcharge" is the exact cost of the fine for violating the PVSA. St. Thomas and San Juan are both US ports.

 

A foreign-flagged ship cannot transport a passenger (regardless of citizenship) between 2 different US ports, without a stop in a distant foreign port. A distant foreign port (according to the PVSA) is "any port not in North America, Central America, the Bermuda Islands, or the West Indies (including the Bahama Islands, but not including the Leeward Islands of the Netherlands Antilles, i.e., Aruba, Bonaire, and Curacao)." 19 CFR § 4.80a(a)(2)."

[vjmatty]

Correct.

 

I think the confusion is happening due to the fact that those closed loop cruises from US ports used to allow late/early embarkation/disembarkation with no problem because of the no issue with the PVSA. But the problem now is Carnival, at least, doesn't want to mess with the different immigration procedures in the cases where it changes what type of cruise the ship is doing.

 

Oh I agree it is problematic for whatever reasons may exist coming from immigration and perhaps I am being unnecessarily pedantic in saying it isn't a PVSA issue as I can see why Carnival might not want to get caught up in whatever other mess is caused by an early disembarking.

[cece9922]

Hi everyone,

I did several searches in the forum before starting a new topic. Most searches regarding 'debarking' or 'leave ship' mainly pertained to when guests are allowed to leave the ship on their last day..

Hopefully this isn't a duplicate post - if it is, I'm sorry.

 

So we are cruising on the Valor on March 30th - our plans for the rest of our holidays have been a bit up in the air until just recently..

Anyway, we decided we wanted to get off the ship in St Kitts and spend two weeks in the country, before flying back to San Juan and making our way to South America.

To be safe we emailed Carnival asking them if there was anything we could do to ensure we would be allowed to get off in St Kitts...and they replied today saying we can't. Apparently they changed their procedures and guests are no longer allowed to leave the ship before the end of the cruise, or to join the cruise after the first day.

 

We recently cruised in Europe with Celebrity and saw several people with their bags all packed, leaving the ship before we arrived at our final destination....

 

Question is, can they actually MAKE US stay? I mean, if we settle our on board account and leave on time, what difference does it make to them?

 

I wish we had emailed them before we booked our accommodation and flights in St Kitts as now we're caught in a pickle.

 

Any help with this would be highly appreciated

 

I'll be with you on this cruise so I guess we will see what happens ;)

[vjmatty]

Facts: (which doesn't answer this question)

 

 

1. The Valor accepts new passengers in Barbados.

 

2. I live in St Thomas......I asked if I could board the Valor in St Thomas instead of San Juan.......I was told yes, but there was a $300 upcharge.

 

So for you this would be a round trip St. Thomas with the same number of days? Wonder why there is an upcharge? :confused: Must be they would lose a cabin for a couple days after you disembark before filling it again in San Juan.

[Smiling Cruiser]

So how does not being able

To get off the ship in a foreign

Country ( closed loop/ open loop ) match up with carnivals Vacation Protection Where you can get off at the first port and fly home if your not happy?? Anyone know? Just curious- never had a bad cruise but this topic just had me wondering.

 

 

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[1kaper]

So how does not being able

To get off the ship in a foreign

Country ( closed loop/ open loop ) match up with carnivals Vacation Protection Where you can get off at the first port and fly home if your not happy?? Anyone know? Just curious- never had a bad cruise but this topic just had me wondering.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

They pay for your flight home so they are ensuring you are leaving the country asap, like the guy who got kicked off.

There have been some people wondering on another thread who will pay the fines the are incurred. I assume from reading the guarantee that Carnival would cover that, but some think they may bill you for it.

The guarantee isn't that great, yeah, they fly you home, but you are still out the money you paid for return tickets to get there. I doubt many people would even bother.

[Shmoo here]

So how does not being able

To get off the ship in a foreign

Country ( closed loop/ open loop ) match up with carnivals Vacation Protection Where you can get off at the first port and fly home if your not happy?? Anyone know? Just curious- never had a bad cruise but this topic just had me wondering.

 

 

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On the Carnival Vacation Guarantee, you are disembarked at the first non US port, directly to airport, paid for by Carnival. You are not getting off the ship and going into the port.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Shmoo here

[missdebi]

This is slightly off topic but I am curious. The comedians get on and off at different ports how does that work?

[vjmatty]

This is slightly off topic but I am curious. The comedians get on and off at different ports how does that work?

 

They aren't considered passengers so the act probably doesn't apply. Same likely goes for the harbor pilot... some ports such as Southampton they are on board for hours before jumping back into their little boat.

Edited March 20, 2014 by vjmatty

[Shmoo here]

They aren't considered passengers so the act probably doesn't apply. Same likely goes for the harbor pilot... some ports such as Southampton they are on board for hours before jumping back into their little boat.

 

Exactly so. They are employees and not subject to the same restrictions.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Shmoo here

[bccruiser2007]

We are the family from Canada that debarked from the Valor when we got to St Martin last week. Three years ago we did the same cruise and got off in St Martin. This time we were told by our travel agent before we left that we would not be allowed to get off the ship so booked flights to return at the end of the cruise in Puerto Rico. As mentioned we did ask at guest services if we could possibly take our luggage off and leave at our accommodation when we were in port and then continue the cruise. We were told we could get off the ship whenever we wanted as long as immigration cleared us. The night before we were to arrive in St Martin we gave the guest services our passports, the address of where were going to stay and proof (airline tickets) that we were indeed leaving St Martin. The next day we took our luggage to the counter and were given our stamped passports and told to have a nice stay and left the ship.

Hope this helps.

[Lerin]

Whatever you decide, please go through the proper channels and don't just go sneaking off the ship with a small backpack. :eek: Bad idea.

Best case scenario, that may land you on the tSA no fly list or with a very large fine. Worst case, it could land you in a foreign jail.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Lerin

[Disconnections]

You can read about a guest's experience disembarking the Carnival Splendor early to permanently live and retire in Ecuador here: http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1754997

[irishnyc]

You can read about a guest's experience disembarking the Carnival Splendor early to permanently live and retire in Ecuador here: http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1754997

 

 

That situation is completely irrelevant to the one being discussed here.

 

 

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[Disconnections]

That situation is completely irrelevant to the one being discussed here.

 

 

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Are they both threads not about disembarking the ship prior to your port of disembarkation?

[irishnyc]

Are they both threads not about disembarking the ship prior to your port of disembarkation?

 

 

The Splendor was on a repo itinerary then, not a closed loop cruise, and it was in South America, not the Caribbean where different rules apply.

 

 

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[Disconnections]

The Splendor was on a repo itinerary then, not a closed loop cruise, and it was in South America, not the Caribbean where different rules apply.

 

 

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http://www.royalcaribbean.com/customersupport/faq/details.do?pagename=frequently_asked_questions&pnav=5&pnav=2&faqSubjectName=Antes+de+comprar+&faqId=623&faqSubjectId=322&faqType=faq

[chengkp75]

Okay, I know this is a done deal for the OP, but just to shed some light on the subject. What the OP wished to do is in no way a violation of the PVSA, since the OP wanted to leave in a foreign port. PVSA deals with carriage of passengers BETWEEN US ports.

 

The reason that the cruise lines are tending to not allow later port embarkation (missed sailing) or early disembarking, at foreign ports is that the passenger manifest made up at embarkation is given to US CBP for pre-clearance at disembarkation, and is also used at each foreign port to clear the ship. When someone leaves early, or arrives late, a new passenger manifest must be made and submitted. This manifest must also be submitted to USCG either 72 hours prior to arrival in US waters, or at departure from last port before arriving in US waters. Getting on or off in a different US port then becomes a PVSA problem, with the attendant $300 fine.

[jwalk03]

Puerto Rico is exempt from the PVSA anyway. That why cruises are allowed to offer say a 1 way cruise from New York to San Juan and vice versa without visiting a distant foreign port.

[newzealandpower]

Hey everybody,

thank you very much for all your input and feedback. We are really pleased you all discussed our question at such length!!

 

We have decided to follow the rules and not risk anything and therefore have bought a ticket to St Kitts from SJU, after final disembarkation.

 

It sounds like we could have talked to Guest Services and perhaps managed to do what we wanted, but decided to play it safe. Besides, the $300 extra costs are more than the ticket to St Kitts anyway.

 

I guess I was not really keen on flying from SJU to St Kitts, but having flown just the other day from SJU to Vieques in a very small 17-seater I actually think it's not such a big deal!! I did enjoy that quite a bit as you can see the pilot and the windows on the aircraft are huge and you basically get an areal tour of the islands!!

 

Thank you all - look forward to meeting some of you on the cruise (and on the Miami-Miami, 11day Southern Caribbean cruise on the Norwegian Sun from April 17th!!)

[BeachChik]

Thanks for all the replies folks..

Ok, so first off, I wouldn't want to break any laws. I wasn't aware that when you are cruising you don't go through immigration. I just figured we could disembark, have our passport stamped, and go on ourmerry way to Nevis island. My wife and I are on a Round the World tour and 7 months into it there haven't been any problems so I wouldn't want to start now..

 

I think our best bet would be to try and cancel the two extra nights accommodation we have already booked in Nevis and buy a cheap plane ticket from SJU to St Kitts.

 

I guess by staying on the ship we will get our money's worth as we will be staying there those two nights..

 

It's just a shame because I hate flying, and that's one of the reasons we were wanting to get off in St Kitts - but also this way we lose two days to spend there...but I think there isn't any other way.

 

Now the big question is, do I book the ticket to St Kitts now or do I wait until we board the cruise and ask Guest Services?? I.e. I would be pretty upset if we did all this and then, like others mentioned, we were able to organize the early debarkation!!

 

Anyway, flying to Puerto Rico tomorrow..well actually in a few hours since we have to be at the airport at 4.30am!! Not looking forward to the two flights to SJU and especially to flying the little plane from there to Vieques Island, where we'll spend a week before getting back to SJU ready to go on our cruise!!

 

Wow! 7 months in to a round the world trip. That's pretty amazing. How long are you taking to do the full world trip? I can't imagine being able to take this amount if time and expense to do a trip like this. Someday when I win the lottery. :D