Service Charges on NCL

[timmo44]

All I am going to say on this topic is this....all you people that post to feel high and mighty and belittle people who dont agree with the tipping policy are what is wrong with this world. You are not better then anyone on this site. You are not a better person for tipping even when the service is bad, you are not a better person because you tried to make someone feel bad on an internet site. These things dont make you a better person they make you SMALL. If you have to get your self worth by belittle people I really feel sorry for you, and anyone that is in your life because this behavior likely spills out onto them as well. Reading the comments a lot of you people are making really makes me sick to my stomach that I like NCL cruises. If the boats were filled with people like you the company would go under very quickly.

 

BE AN AMBASSADOR FOR NCL THROUGH PLEASANT INTERACTION, NOT THROUGH TREATING OTHERS LIKE CRAP. Each and everyone of you that made a comment just to belittle should be ashamed of yourself. Go to other cruise line boards on this site. NONE OF THEM have half the negativity this board does....

 

6&8

 

Well said.

[sparks1093]

Your opinion does not change my facts (for the win Alex). Bye, thanks for playing.

 

Nice. NCL does define what the parameters are for using one's discretion which is conveniently overlooked by many.

[hpecorari]

Using you discretion to change the amount of anythign names DISCRSTIONARY is not even close to cheating the system. It is in absolute 100% fact by its very name, playing within the rules.

 

But actually, it's not. On NCL US website: http://www.ncl.com/faq#service-charge it clearly explains:

 

"If there is a service issue can the service charges be adjusted on board?

 

Guest satisfaction is the highest priority at Norwegian Cruise Line. We have structured a guest satisfaction program designed to handle any concerns about service or on-board product quickly and efficiently. However in the event a service issue should arise during your cruise please let our on-board guest services desk staff know right away, so that we can address these in a timely manner. It is our goal to reach a satisfactory solution to any issue when it happens and make sure our guests can focus on enjoying their cruise. Should your concerns not be met with satisfaction you can adjust the charges.

 

I, as well as many others, read this at yes, you may adjust your service charges IF you follow the rules and NCL's guidelines.

 

1. If you have a problem report it and allow them some time to correct it.

(After all, who in their right mind would allow a problem to continue without trying to get it corrected?)

 

2. IF they can't or do not correct the problem then you may adjust your service charges.

 

So yes, you are correct in that it says it can be adjusted. You're just not stating the REASON why they say it can be adjusted.

Also, if there is a problem one does not need to REMOVE it, but can adjust it by lowering it.

 

Tipping those that serve you to your satisfaction is great....but it does not take care of the 'behind the scene" people like the cooks, the people who wash your towels, etc. etc. etc.

 

Harriet

Edited April 11, 2014 by hpecorari

[hpecorari]

Nice. NCL does define what the parameters are for using one's discretion which is conveniently overlooked by many.

 

 

Harriet

[smeyer418]

you know I am pro leaving it on. but the reality is that if you and stand on line they will do what you want...butI encourage you to leave it on. handing cash to someone may make you feel good but it just makes more work for the recipient. how? you may ask? because they are required to turn it in and the vast majority do.

[Shacky316]

Butlers and concierges in the Haven as well have to submit?

[johnql]

Butlers and concierges in the Haven as well have to submit?

Butlers and concierges do not share in the distribution of the daily service charge. They are tipped separately and AFAIK get to keep their tips entirely to themselves.

[Out to sea!]

lol yep

 

 

found this

 

http://www.cruisecritic.com/articles.cfm?ID=132

 

It is only somewhat recently that cruise lines began placing automatic service charges on shipboard accounts. They did this for two reasons. The first reason was the rising number of Europeans traveling on cruise ships. Europeans are accustomed to having a service charge added to their bills at first-class hotels. It is not in their culture to tip further. Likewise, it is not the custom in Japan to tip at all. As cruise lines attracted passengers from countries where tipping is not customary, they added service charges to guarantee their employees' compensation.Over the course of the week, they may encounter a number of servers in the process. Because it might be impractical for passengers to tip on each occasion -- and cruise lines have touted the advantages of cashless cruising -- the lines implemented service charges.

 

If you ask at the Purser's Office or Information Center whether the automatic service charge replaces traditional tipping, the answer you will receive is "yes." But it is anyone's guess just how much of the daily charge on your account will go to a particular steward or waiter. Tips are distributed on a schedule that includes those who previously went unrewarded like the servers in the Lido restaurant where most passengers eat their breakfast and lunch. To accomplish the admirable task of compensating the overlooked steward without causing undue complaint from passengers, the amount given to dining room and room stewards is less under this scheme than it was previously. I know this because I have asked stewards who have served under both systems. The top cabin and dining room stewards made out better before.

 

To me, therein lies the problem. The way the DSC is set up (to be reduced or completely removed) does not guarantee the employees compensation. If they could not be removed (either at the end of the cruise or as I suggested, paid before the cruise starts as in port charges and taxes), the the employees compensation would be guaranteed.

[Out to sea!]

It's about playing bank. We (guests) are not the bank. If it is a fee used to compensate workers what on Earth is wrong with being charged on your final account instead of ahead of time? The workers are not being paid 75 days ahead of time for servicing us (they get paid in arrears as well). NCL and other cruise lines are getting a heck of a lot more than a few cents interest when you combine the tens of thousands of people paying in to the pot.

 

For the record, I think the daily fee all these cruises lines charge is reasonable. In many cases the hard working employees deserve and earn more (cold hard cash) from me. I find additional value in services they provide and I thank them and compensate them additional as I feel fit to do so. After service. Not before. That hardly makes me the bad guy.

 

And I still am not the bank. Fiscal responsibility dictates that I keep my money as long as is reasonably practical. Additionally, for the record, on my next cruise I am paying for 6 people and have no option but to pre-pay all of their gratuity charges. That's money out of my pocket 75+ days before services are rendered (final payment plus actual length of cruise). In addition to paying out $500 nearly 3 months earlier than the vacation, I now can not use OBC to offset those gratuities. The $500 was real money out of pocket. OBC is not money in pocket; it is just an offset. It is a booked liability for the cruise line until I use it, my money is cash flow / revenue to them though. See why I don't want to be the bank?

 

I think a fallacy in your line of reasoning is that you think that anyone that wants to be billed automatically afterwards is looking to find loopholes in the system or otherwise shaft hard working and deserving people out of a fair shake. That's really not the case, at least for me anyways.

 

Would you go pay your mechanic today and say "In two and a half to three months I'll be in for an oil change and tire rotation"? Of course not, you would pay for services at the time they are rendered. Maybe tomorrow stop off at a favorite local vendor of yours, barber shop, pizza restaurant, dry cleaners, etc., and pay for services and tell them you will come back in 3 months to use those services.

 

Yes, this is part of the cruise type vacation. And yes, while I find it odious it does not stop me from booking and enjoying a vacation. I do not mind voicing my opinion though.

 

Actually, yes, you are playing bank. Do you pay your port charges before visiting the port? You are playing bank. Do you pay for your cruise before you take it? You are playing bank. Are you paying taxes on a service you have not even used yet? You are playing bank. Where are the threads complaining about those mandatory payments before a cruise is taken? Are you going to call NCL today and tell them you are taking a cruise with them and not paying until you board the ship? No, because almost anything that requires a reservation usually requires some money up front as well and then you become the bank, whether it be a cruise, hotel, all-inclusive land vacation, airline flight, etc.... I've never needed reservations to get my oil changed or to eat at Chili's. :rolleyes:

 

I actually have no problem with paying the DSC after the cruise (which is what I usually do). I have a problem with the ability to remove the DSC......for ANY reason.......and that is why I sugest it be paid the same as port charges and taxes. NCL (and other cruise lines) could simply make the DSC non-removeable and that would work just as well.

 

It is immaterial what NCL would make off the extra $84 per person up front. The example was someone not wanting to give up their cash before they have to. I simply showed what they would actually lose if they did.

 

That $500 "real money" is going to be paid anyway. So what do you lose paying it 75 days early? 25 cents. If that breaks the bank, well, what can I say that hasn't already been said.

[Out to sea!]

It's not about interest, it is about maintaining control of one's money for as long as one can and for many people it's about what they have to pay at final payment date. People are going to look at NCL's price and compare it to the competing line and see that NCL's price is higher, even though at the end of the cruise they would pay roughly the same amount (again, assuming that only $12 pp/pd is added but I suspect that it would be more. They would need to increase their marketing budget to explain why their fares appear to be higher).

 

I also abhor people cheating the system but it's not something for you or I to fix, it's for NCL to fix if it needs fixing at all. As much as I hate to see people cheating the system I also hate to see everyone suffer for the infractions of a few. I personally prefer to pre-pay the service charges about 30 days before the cruise but it's my choice to do so.

 

No budgeting dollars required if this were implemented across the board (is there another cruise line that doesn't expect payment of port charges at final payment date?).

 

The only reason I can't fix it is because I do not work for NCL and therefore don't have the ability to fix it. But knowing that NCL reads these forums, maybe, just maybe, i have put a bug into someone's ear who will think "Hey, that's a pretty good idea!" and pass it along to those who DO have the ability to fix it. :)

 

Again, how is it suffering or will the next thread started be titled "Why do I have to pay my port charges before I go to a port?"?

[Out to sea!]

"Cheating the system" is in my opinion rather strong. If anybody wishes not to pay the discretionary $12 a day service charge, it is their own choice. It is certainly not cheating which quite frankly is an insulting comment

 

I used the term and I still agree with it. The DSC is not supposed to be removed and if it is, only for true service related issues that could not be fixed. Yet, in my experience, I have found it to be removed for the most part by people looking to lower their final bill and that is "cheating the system". And I will never believe (nor have I ever seen) anyone walking around with a wad on $1s or $5s tipping those that serve them everywhere on the ship. And I highly doubt I ever will. If I saw someone hand the guy clearing the tables in the buffet a tip, I think i would probably have a stroke! :D

[Out to sea!]

Cheating the system would be buying the UBP, getting a drink at one bar and giving it to someone who doe snot have eh UBP, then walking up to the next bar and getting another drink for yourself. Using you discretion to change the amount of anythign names DISCRSTIONARY is not even close to cheating the system. It is in absolute 100% fact by its very name, playing within the rules.

 

Except it's not named "Discretionary". It's "Daily". :rolleyes:

[Out to sea!]

Nice. NCL does define what the parameters are for using one's discretion which is conveniently overlooked by many.

 

True. it's interesting how they see only one word in a 102 word paragraph (yes, i counted ;)). And funny thing is, the word "discretion" is not even in the paragraph.

Edited April 11, 2014 by Out to sea!

[sparks1093]

No budgeting dollars required if this were implemented across the board (is there another cruise line that doesn't expect payment of port charges at final payment date?).

 

The only reason I can't fix it is because I do not work for NCL and therefore don't have the ability to fix it. But knowing that NCL reads these forums, maybe, just maybe, i have put a bug into someone's ear who will think "Hey, that's a pretty good idea!" and pass it along to those who DO have the ability to fix it. :)

 

Again, how is it suffering or will the next thread started be titled "Why do I have to pay my port charges before I go to a port?"?

 

You are asking quite a bit from an entire industry and since those that sit in the board room at NCL have access to all of the data that you and I don't maybe they should be left to run things. I said "I also hate to see everyone suffer for the infractions of a few" which simply means that because some people choose a wrong action I (and everyone else) have to suffer the consequences of said wrong choice made by someone else by the elimination of a choice that everyone currently enjoys. (I don't know if I've said it in this thread or not but any change in this practice will probably be influenced more by the crews than by the passengers.)

Edited April 11, 2014 by sparks1093

[Out to sea!]

You are asking quite a bit from an entire industry and since those that sit in the board room at NCL have access to all of the data that you and I don't maybe they should be left to run things. I said "I also hate to see everyone suffer for the infractions of a few" which simply means that because some people choose a wrong action I (and everyone else) have to suffer the consequences of said wrong choice made by someone else by the elimination of a choice that everyone currently enjoys. (I don't know if I've said it in this thread or not but any change in this practice will probably be influenced more by the crews than by the passengers.)

 

I don't necessarily mean that NCL contact all the other major companies and get together to change things. But when an industry leader changes something for the better (in any industry), other players follow suit quickly (especially when it increases revenue). I understood what you meant, I was trying to say, I don't see it as suffering. Whether the DSC be collected at the end (mandatory) or before the cruise (so that people would know their entire cruise is paid in full with no "surprise charges") works just fine.

[Ewoodspark]

I used the term and I still agree with it. The DSC is not supposed to be removed and if it is, only for true service related issues that could not be fixed. Yet, in my experience, I have found it to be removed for the most part by people looking to lower their final bill and that is "cheating the system". And I will never believe (nor have I ever seen) anyone walking around with a wad on $1s or $5s tipping those that serve them everywhere on the ship. And I highly doubt I ever will. If I saw someone hand the guy clearing the tables in the buffet a tip, I think i would probably have a stroke! :D

You just don't get it do you? The $12 pppd service charge is DISCRETIONARY. Fact ! If the terms and conditions of booking said that the service charge was MANDATORY, then a different story. I will also not be walking around with a fist full of dollars. Euros maybe !

[sparks1093]

You just don't get it do you? The $12 pppd service charge is DISCRETIONARY. Fact ! If the terms and conditions of booking said that the service charge was MANDATORY, then a different story. I will also not be walking around with a fist full of dollars. Euros maybe !

 

The crew relies on the service charge for their livlihood whether you like it or not because it represents the lion's share of their income. Adjusting the service charge without a service related reason and leaving nothing is wrong and I don't care how discretionary it is.

[LMaxwell]

That $500 "real money" is going to be paid anyway. So what do you lose paying it 75 days early? 25 cents. If that breaks the bank, well, what can I say that hasn't already been said.

 

You're right, it is going to get paid anyways. But since it is EXACTLY a fee for services, it should be charged after service is rendered. Of course I expect a hotel, cruise line, air line, etc. to charge me a deposit at the time of reservation and to make a final payment. However cruising is one of the few areas that separates out service charges. When hotels separate out service fees they are charged in arrears.

 

That said, I should be the one that controls my money when it comes to paying for services. If I had a need for that $500 in those 75 days before receiving any service, I should be able to choose to access it. It's not about earning 25 cents interest on the money.

 

It is simply better for me to be billed afterwards than to proactively pay 75 days+ ahead for the service portion.

 

The cruise line should be giving us the option to pre-pay or post pay. You have a different personal value system when it comes to managing your finances. I respect that. If you prefer to pre-pay go right ahead. I prefer to be billed after wards. It works better for how I manage my finances. I have no intent or interest taking money away from hard working people.

 

I think somehwere in here you and I have an agreement but there are a lot of layers where we don't so it may appear that we are on opposite ends here but I don't think that's the case.

[hpecorari]

You just don't get it do you? The $12 pppd service charge is DISCRETIONARY. Fact ! If the terms and conditions of booking said that the service charge was MANDATORY, then a different story. I will also not be walking around with a fist full of dollars. Euros maybe !

 

First of all, maybe it you that just doesn't get it. The UK website is different than the US website and since you are from the UK....

 

However, on BOTH websites it states:

 

If there is a service issue can the service charge be adjusted on board?

 

Guest satisfaction is the highest priority at Norwegian Cruise Line. We have structured a guest satisfaction programme designed to handle any concerns about service or on-board product quickly and efficiently. However, in the event a service issue should arise during your cruise please let our on-board reception desk staff know right away, so that we can address it in a timely manner. It is our goal to reach a satisfactory solution to any issue when it happens and make sure our guests can focus on enjoying their cruise. Should your concerns not be met with satisfaction you can adjust the charges

 

The UK site also says:

 

What about tipping?

You will have either pre-paid the service charge on your holiday invoice or it will be charged to your on-board account. In addition, a suggested gratuity of 15% on drink bills and 18% on spa and salon bills will be added automatically and charged to your on-board account.

 

I am wondering, however, if you also have the 15% gratuity removed from your drink bills and if you use the spa and/or salon have the 18% gratuity removed? BTW, the reason they add the 15% and 18% gratuity is because they are not included in the DSC.

 

Harriet

[Ewoodspark]

You will have either pre-paid the service charge on your holiday invoice or it will be charged to your on-board account.

The current UK Bribery Act is very specific about offering bribes up front to try and influence service. It is certainly not recommended to pre-pay any discretionary charge.

[hpecorari]

The current UK Bribery Act is very specific about offering bribes up front to try and influence service. It is certainly not recommended to pre-pay any discretionary charge.

 

Those were the words on your UK site. Better notify NCL that they're breaking the law with their statement.

 

Funny, that's the only thing you got from my post.

 

Harriet

Edited April 11, 2014 by hpecorari

[meltingmoments]

Adjusting the service charge without a service related reason and leaving nothing is wrong and I don't care how discretionary it is.

 

Absolutely THIS!!

[meltingmoments]

The current UK Bribery Act is very specific about offering bribes up front to try and influence service. It is certainly not recommended to pre-pay any discretionary charge.[/quote

 

How is the DSC *a bribe*? :confused:

[meltingmoments]

The current UK Bribery Act is very specific about offering bribes up front to try and influence service. It is certainly not recommended to pre-pay any discretionary charge.

 

How is the DSC *a bribe*? :confused:

[Ewoodspark]

How is the DSC *a bribe*? :confused:

Saying that you asked:

 

Offences of bribing another personE+W+S+N.I.

This sectionnoteType=Explanatory Notes has no associated

(1)A person (“P”) is guilty of an offence if either of the following cases applies.

(2)Case 1 is where—

(a)P offers, promises or gives a financial or other advantage to another person, and

(b)P intends the advantage—

(i)to induce a person to perform improperly a relevant function or activity, or

(ii)to reward a person for the improper performance of such a function or activity.

(3)Case 2 is where—

(a)P offers, promises or gives a financial or other advantage to another person, and

(b)P knows or believes that the acceptance of the advantage would itself constitute the improper performance of a relevant function or activity.

(4)In case 1 it does not matter whether the person to whom the advantage is offered, promised or given is the same person as the person who is to perform, or has performed, the function or activity concerned.

(5)In cases 1 and 2 it does not matter whether the advantage is offered, promised or given by P directly or through a third party.