daily service charge

[ColinIllinois]

[KeithJenner]

Actually, the kids club staff are specifically excluded from the DSC.

 

 

I should point out that I haven't been able to find where it states that they are excluded. Oops. :)

 

However, I'm certain I have seen it somewhere, and this has been discussed elsewhere on a number of occasions.

[dna529]

I should point out that I haven't been able to find where it states that they are excluded. Oops. :)

 

However, I'm certain I have seen it somewhere, and this has been discussed elsewhere on a number of occasions.

 

They are definitely excluded. If we utilize the kids club we tip them in cash.

 

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Forums mobile app

[NLH Arizona]

Can you, or can you not, at your discretion ask that this service charge modified? NCL says you may do so.

I would call NCL, if I were you. You can ask them the question and get the answer. Here is their number: 1-866-234-7350.

[PDIDDYwife]

Just as I thought, incapable to carry on a conversation. This is a discussion forum. I'm all about discussing my opinions and ideas. If the best you can do is click on smiley faces and be nasty to people I guess, really, I just pity you.

 

Ummmmm...how exactly is THIS statement not MORE nasty than a smiley face and a giggle?

 

 

 

My regards to Thurston the Third.

 

 

 

Ps

Perhaps your CC name is very telling of why you have the attitude that you do towards the employees of NCL? Guess they are just a bunch of Gilligans.

[LoveyHowell]

Ummmmm...how exactly is THIS statement not MORE nasty than a smiley face and a giggle?

 

 

 

My regards to Thurston the Third.

 

 

 

Ps

Perhaps your CC name is very telling of why you have the attitude that you do towards the employees of NCL? Guess they are just a bunch of Gilligans.

giggle:rolleyes:

[hpecorari]

 

My regards to Thurston the Third.

 

 

Off topic but I loved that show as a kid! He, also, was from NY.

 

Harriet

[triptolemus]

A psychology major could write their dissertation on this thread...

 

Wowsers.

[ColinIllinois]

A psychology major could write their dissertation on this thread...

 

Wowsers.

 

 

Yep, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder is rampant.

[sjbdtz]

I will gladly tell guest services as well as crew members why - The company gives me the option to pay how I wish. I am utilizing one of the provided options. I believe in the time honored way of tipping; guest to service provider. That way I have no qualms about the company delaying payments or keeping some of it. I am not doing anything underhanded, against the rules, and certainly nothing to be ashamed of. I'm selecting a choice amongst many and doing what I believe is best. It is probably also a fact that some people never discuss this topic, remove DSC, and pay nothing at all.

 

Until such time as I see proof that workers get to keep ALL of the DSC I consider all conversations where people "claim" to know one way or the other to just be opinions.

 

And for those who wish to berate me and be negative, I ask you, on your last cruise how much extra did you leave in tips? I always find it amusing to be scolded about tipping and then finding out those doing the scolding don't tip anywhere near the level we do.

 

My reasoning is that I want to make sure that those that provide service to me receive the tips they have earned/deserve without interference from the company. I do not believe it is my obligation to tip some of those other positions. I believe it is the companies obligation to pay them for their work. Why shoulda dishwasher, cook, or laundry person have to rely on a tip when they never interact with a guest and a tip is a thank you for services received? NCL has given me the option to leave a gratuity in the manner which I want to. I hope this has answered your question.

 

 

 

I owned a restaurant, with 50 staff. I have a bit of knowledge about how it operated.

 

The tips you gave to the server were later partitioned among back-of-house people (busboy, dishwasher, etc) based on the server's honesty, and an agreed-upon percentage ratio.

 

With Freestyle service, the rotations make it difficult for the server (who you propose to tip in cash) to keep track of who those back-of-house people ARE, who facilitate their job performance.

 

Because of this, a new practice was established where the service was designated as "included" - no tipping required - and the service charge which allows this, was then apportioned according to an agreed-upon percentage ratio.

 

The end result is the exact same thing, with the sole exception being that behind-the-scenes staff are compensated in an environment where the server is unable to apportion to them, themselves.

 

 

If I accept your proposition that you intend to tip at the same rate or higher than $12/pp/pd, then the only difference would be WHO gets the cash.

 

All of the employees involved, both the server and their support team have agreed to these processes and ratios. How is it that you get to second-guess all of them?

 

Your contention that service should be included in your cruise fare is a non-starter. It isn't. But it's required. In the same way port fees, and taxes SHOULD be included in the cruise fare, but aren't.

 

Why? Because there are agreements with travel agencies which allocate a percentage commission rate based on their sales. In addition, if the DSC were accrued into general revenues (in order for a 'living wage' to be paid), then it would become taxable in the corporation's hands as well.

 

So you would have to gross-up the cruise fare sufficiently not only to integrate the $12pp/pd, but also to offset the commission, and the tax implications.

 

Not only would you STILL pay the amount, but then you'd pay MORE than the amount, AND you'd probably still feel like you SHOULD tip some.... the way it stands, tipping is removed from the equation, the staff are compensated in a way they consider fair.... what is SO wrong about that?

 

 

 

Stephen

 

.

[triptolemus]

^^ Your logic is getting in the way of the insanity...

[LoveyHowell]

I owned a restaurant, with 50 staff. I have a bit of knowledge about how it operated.

 

The tips you gave to the server were later partitioned among back-of-house people (busboy, dishwasher, etc) based on the server's honesty, and an agreed-upon percentage ratio.

 

With Freestyle service, the rotations make it difficult for the server (who you propose to tip in cash) to keep track of who those back-of-house people ARE, who facilitate their job performance.

 

Because of this, a new practice was established where the service was designated as "included" - no tipping required - and the service charge which allows this, was then apportioned according to an agreed-upon percentage ratio.

 

The end result is the exact same thing, with the sole exception being that behind-the-scenes staff are compensated in an environment where the server is unable to apportion to them, themselves.

 

 

If I accept your proposition that you intend to tip at the same rate or higher than $12/pp/pd, then the only difference would be WHO gets the cash.

 

All of the employees involved, both the server and their support team have agreed to these processes and ratios. How is it that you get to second-guess all of them?

 

Your contention that service should be included in your cruise fare is a non-starter. It isn't. But it's required. In the same way port fees, and taxes SHOULD be included in the cruise fare, but aren't.

 

Why? Because there are agreements with travel agencies which allocate a percentage commission rate based on their sales. In addition, if the DSC were accrued into general revenues (in order for a 'living wage' to be paid), then it would become taxable in the corporation's hands as well.

 

So you would have to gross-up the cruise fare sufficiently not only to integrate the $12pp/pd, but also to offset the commission, and the tax implications.

 

Not only would you STILL pay the amount, but then you'd pay MORE than the amount, AND you'd probably still feel like you SHOULD tip some.... the way it stands, tipping is removed from the equation, the staff are compensated in a way they consider fair.... what is SO wrong about that?

 

 

 

Stephen

 

.

 

Thank you for your explanation, I appreciate it, but since you were the owner of a restaurant you may have some bias here along with your expertise. I am sure your dishwasher would have preferred that you pay a living wage rather than making their salary variable as to the tips a service person received. Am I incorrect in stating that regardless of how much tip a server did or did not earn it did not impact you, as the owner, financially? (Unless something were so grossly wrong that the server did not earn enough to satisfy minimum wage laws in your area).

[sjbdtz]

Thank you for your explanation, I appreciate it, but since you were the owner of a restaurant you may have some bias here along with your expertise. I am sure your dishwasher would have preferred that you pay a living wage rather than making their salary variable as to the tips a service person received. Am I incorrect in stating that regardless of how much tip a server did or did not earn it did not impact you, as the owner, financially? (Unless something were so grossly wrong that the server did not earn enough to satisfy minimum wage laws in your area).

 

I paid the dishwasher minimum wage. After tip-outs, he made about $8/hr (instead of the $5.65 I paid him).

 

The amounts received by the server (or the dishwasher) had no bearing on me whatsoever.

 

In NCL's case, they have no bearing on NCL either. NCL has previously stated they do not retain any portion of the DSC for their own corporate purposes. In fact, they lose money because they absorb the 1.5 - 3% credit card fees they have to pay to Visa & Amex, etc. when they collect the $12.

 

The reason they do this, is that it's essentially the only reasonable way to ensure that the staff make a fair wage, without having to unreasonably increase cruise fares.

 

 

I hope that helps.

 

Stephen

 

 

.

[academytim]

Thank you for your explanation, I appreciate it, but since you were the owner of a restaurant you may have some bias here along with your expertise. I am sure your dishwasher would have preferred that you pay a living wage rather than making their salary variable as to the tips a service person received. Am I incorrect in stating that regardless of how much tip a server did or did not earn it did not impact you, as the owner, financially? (Unless something were so grossly wrong that the server did not earn enough to satisfy minimum wage laws in your area).

 

I'm asking an honest question here. No animosity. I'm honestly trying to understand your reasoning and thought process.

 

So you think that the dishwashers, etc, should be paid a living wage that isn't based on the DSC. You understand that they aren't, and know that some of their pay comes from the DSC. However, because you think that "shouldn't" be the case, you are going to stand up for them by....taking away some of their pay?

 

Honestly, you seem like you are championing them just being paid more and not having to get a cut of the DSC. But you have to know, that isn't how it is. So you are fighting for them by taking money away from them?

 

I honestly do not understand.

[emcelh]

Ok - I'm confused. I've cruised several times before but this is my first on NCL. We will have 2 rooms for hubby, myself and kids ages 9, 6 and 3. And as context, I spent MANY years as first a hostess, then a waitress in HS and college - - so I certainly get living on tips.

 

On past cruises (RC, Carnival), I always did my own tipping - no auto charge for service fee. We often put a DND sign on the room so it not usually cleaned each day. Breakfast is a buffet, lunch is a buffet or the hamburger stand and so the main reason I'm tipping is dinner service. So for my family of 5, $65 seems very excessive.

 

Guess you haven't cruised in awhile because Carnival has had an auto charge for gratuities for at least 3 years and RC started doing it a year or two ago. There are very few cruise lines that don't anymore.

[nfglory1]

You are so consistently not answering the question asked that the only conclusion we can draw is that you are unable to.

 

I will try one last time. The question is simple. Have a look at it a few times if you still can't grasp it.

 

Can you please show is one place where NCL state that you can remove the DSC IN ORDER TO TIP PEOPLE INDIVIDUALLY?

 

Did you notice that last bit? That means that just pointing out that you can remove the DSC is not an answer to that question, as NCL's FAQs specifically state that you can remove them if you have an unresolved service issue. That isn't the same thing.

 

I won't hold my breath waiting for you to provide the proof.

 

She must be mistakenly missing your post. Couldn't she solve this by calling NCL and specifically asking if she can remove the DSC for no reason other than that she wants to tip individually and then post the response here? Simple, problem solved! When I first started cruising with NCL I read the explanation of removal of the DSC when service complaints could not be resolved and I've never had an issue with service so it has always stayed in place. Now I guess I could have read it wrong but I'd have to go back and ask one of my Master's professors what I'm missing in my analysis of their explanation...

[LoveyHowell]

She must be mistakenly missing your post. Couldn't she solve this by calling NCL and specifically asking if she can remove the DSC for no reason other than that she wants to tip individually and then post the response here? Simple, problem solved! When I first started cruising with NCL I read the explanation of removal of the DSC when service complaints could not be resolved and I've never had an issue with service so it has always stayed in place. Now I guess I could have read it wrong but I'd have to go back and ask one of my Master's professors what I'm missing in my analysis of their explanation...

 

I will call and ask during my lunch time. You are right, NCL is the source for the answer.

[KeithJenner]

I will call and ask during my lunch time. You are right, NCL is the source for the answer.

 

 

Remember to get the answer in writing. If you just come back and report what you were told by NCL then I think that would fail your own proof test. :)

[LoveyHowell]

Remember to get the answer in writing. If you just come back and report what you were told by NCL then I think that would fail your own proof test. :)

It is already shown on the website that you can adjust the DSC. You are right, it doesn't specifically say "so that you can tip in cash". Some people remove DSC and give nothing. I am not in that crowd whether you wish to believe that or not. But like I said, I will call later today and post the answers I get from NCL. Whether you want to accept them or not I have no control over other than to suggest for you to call NCL yourself and ask 'Can DSC be removed?'

[KeithJenner]

It is already shown on the website that you can adjust the DSC. You are right, it doesn't specifically say "so that you can tip in cash". Some people remove DSC and give nothing. I am not in that crowd whether you wish to believe that or not. But like I said, I will call later today and post the answers I get from NCL. Whether you want to accept them or not I have no control over other than to suggest for you to call NCL yourself and ask 'Can DSC be removed?'

 

 

Thanks for informing me what it says on the website. Considering I've posted the wording myself, we can probably take it as read that I knew that already.

 

As for me accepting the answer if you post what they tell you on the phone, I'd just say that you are the one who said that people aren't providing proof when reporting similar things. Personally, I couldn't care less as I have no intention of removing the charge.

[newmexicoNita]

Thank you for your explanation, I appreciate it, but since you were the owner of a restaurant you may have some bias here along with your expertise. I am sure your dishwasher would have preferred that you pay a living wage rather than making their salary variable as to the tips a service person received. Am I incorrect in stating that regardless of how much tip a server did or did not earn it did not impact you, as the owner, financially? (Unless something were so grossly wrong that the server did not earn enough to satisfy minimum wage laws in your area).

 

Stephen makes some very rational statements. 1-if the service charge is included the cruise line pays a larger commission thus hurting. 2- rarely do those who receive tips have to report or do retport all they receive on their taxes. This is money in their pocket and may I add one more thing: you mention the dishwasher and living wage: the salary these types of jobs pay were never meant to be a wage that can support a person. Min wage and living wage are 2 totally different things.

[ladylonghorn]

Absolutely not !. It is just another weary tale from another American trying to get the rest of the World to accept the fact that they just love to tip anything that moves. OK if you actually wish to live your lifes like that but for those people who think that tipping is optional or discretionary, just leave it at that.

 

Not all Americans think that everyone should be tipped. I do NOT. Tipping is and has always been optional to show gratitude for a service. Hence why I say...I will tip what I think is appropriate, not what some corproation tells me. Don't care if people call me cheap ( I already hear that from my hubby when he wants to tip 20% at every restaurant even when the service is poor).

[titangas]

Not all Americans think that everyone should be tipped. I do NOT. Tipping is and has always been optional to show gratitude for a service. Hence why I say...I will tip what I think is appropriate, not what some corproation tells me. Don't care if people call me cheap ( I already hear that from my hubby when he wants to tip 20% at every restaurant even when the service is poor).

 

Just to be clear the DSC is not a tip, it is a service charge.

[LoveyHowell]

Thanks for informing me what it says on the website. Considering I've posted the wording myself, we can probably take it as read that I knew that already.

 

As for me accepting the answer if you post what they tell you on the phone, I'd just say that you are the one who said that people aren't providing proof when reporting similar things. Personally, I couldn't care less as I have no intention of removing the charge.

 

I did call NCL and just got off the phone. I asked if the DSC charge can be stopped, they said yes. I asked under what circumstances can DSC be turned off, they replied it is at the discretion of the guest. I simply called the phone number provided here. If you do not believe me, which you don't, you can call for yourself. If you couldn't care less you'd stop badgering me.

 

I am removing the DSC and paying all cash my next trip. If you don't like it, don't do it that way.

[academytim]

Only evidence that you do not understand why a tipped staff, and tipping out behind the scenes workers, is a benefit to the owner of the restaurant and not the staff. The owner can have more workers for less money (an overstaff situation) in which not everyone benefits because there are more people to share the money, but the owner doesn't have the higher overhead of paying a higher direct wage they can have more staff at lower wage. So they pay workers the bare minimum and make the share tips. Even the ones that do the behind the scenes work like cook and wash dishes, which ostensibly is what you are paying for in the menu price, and the gratuity should be for services received. The fact that tip out exists and that a server can "lose money" on a table that has tipped (but not tipped well) just goes to show it is the server that loses out here, never the restaurant owner. Makes no difference to them. Read up more on the subject before bashing me. If that's how you "rest your case" you're in for a big loss here.

 

Ok...now I understand. You don't agree with NCL using the DSC to assist with the wages of the behind the scenes workers. So you are going to stick it to NCL...by removing some of the pay of the behind the scenes workers.

 

Got it.

 

/sarcasm