HAL value overall

[kelleherdl]

This is not a cheerleader post.

 

We had a conversation after T-day dinner yesterday over travel value. We were discussing both land vacations and cruising. We value luxury accommodations and seeing as many new places as we can. So for us cruising gives us the biggest value for our travel dollar. Cruising includes the nice room, predictably good food and intercity travel; all for about $700/day for a 10 day cruise. We then discussed our loyalty to HAL. We will soon be 4-star. It caused me to think realistically about sticking with HAL for most cruises or trying others like NCL.

 

To start, we do sail Neptune Suites for either 1 or 2 week cruises. So I have been looking around and was trying to cost compare itineraries and accommodations between specifically HAL and NCL as an example. Maybe I am really missing something but I can't see where HAL is beaten by NCL. HAL has more port calls and the NS's are cheaper that NCL full suites. Number of ports per week is important to us. It is our most important reason to travel.

 

The NS's on HAL are very comfortable and to us are comparable to a low-end luxury hotel. A comparably priced cruise on NCL only gives us a balcony 'mini suite'. The NCL cruise will have 1 or 2 fewer ports. I know more experienced cruisers on this board have noted that they are 'switching'. But it seems to me until we run out of itineraries we haven't done on HAL yet we will be sticking.

 

...... very open to comments on what I might be missing.

 

Dennis

[POA1]

What's the low end luxury hotel you're using for comparison? I'm not arguing, jut trying to gain a frame of reference. Thanks.

[knittinggirl]

Next year, we're going on our second HAL cruise in a Vista

suite.

 

But we've sailed in several Junior or Mini Suites.

 

On Princess, their Mini suites charge suite gratuity rates, but we don't get double loyalty credit. But on Royal Caribbean, we pay non-suite gratuity, and get double loyalty credit!

 

HAL's Vista suites give us double loyalty credit and I don't know about their hotel service charge.

 

On Royal Caribbean, most of their JS have a sofa and either two stuffed chairs or one stuffed chair w/ a foot rest. They're between 250 and 300 sq for the room, plus the balcony.

 

Princess gave us one tube of lotion and one bar of soap plus the dispensers of mystery body wash and shampoo in the tub/shower. And I had to move the bar of soap back and forth between the sink and the shower. On Royal Caribbean, we get for small tubes of toiletries plus the bar of soap.

[Tom O.]

$700 per day seemed very high, then I noticed you stay in a suite. I also assume that price is per couple.

Our daily expenses are much less. We take a regular balcony room which is about $375 per day per couple (including taxes). Our shipboard expenses are usually around $100 per day per couple.

So for a total of $475 per day (plus airfare) we have an all inclusive vacation for two.

Hard to beat that price on any land vacation.

And we find that the regular balcony room is as luxurious as we need.

As for other cruise lines, Princess, NCL, Royal Caribbean, and Carnival, are all priced about the same as HAL. Comparing them is more a matter of service than price.

By the way, I found NCL to be inferior to HAL and Princess in nearly every aspect. But, NCL has its own cheerleaders. I have never cruised with Carnival or Royal Caribbean.

[qsuzi]

To start, we do sail Neptune Suites for either 1 or 2 week cruises. So I have been looking around and was trying to cost compare itineraries and accommodations between specifically HAL and NCL as an example. Maybe I am really missing something but I can't see where HAL is beaten by NCL. HAL has more port calls and the NS's are cheaper that NCL full suites. Number of ports per week is important to us. It is our most important reason to travel.

 

The NS's on HAL are very comfortable and to us are comparable to a low-end luxury hotel. A comparably priced cruise on NCL only gives us a balcony 'mini suite'. The NCL cruise will have 1 or 2 fewer ports. I know more experienced cruisers on this board have noted that they are 'switching'. But it seems to me until we run out of itineraries we haven't done on HAL yet we will be sticking.

Dennis

 

When I cost compared itineraries and accommodations between NCL and HAL I found the same thing; HAL had more ports or more of interest and better prices comparing signature suite category SY prices with NCL mini suites which were about the same price somewhat higher. One thing that I liked about NCL was more dining options but overall not worth cancelling our HAL cruises to try NCL. We do compare every time we want to book a cruise.

Edited November 27, 2015 by qsuzi

[PatsyAnne]

Cost comparisons are nice, but I find that there are so many variables. Someone might not like the quality of oysters, and I don't like oysters so to me, not a problem. Someone else may find the greatest joy in a deck chair all day, but I get restless so I'm not as affected by the number of chairs. I can't drink much without falling asleep, so unlimited drinks doesn't help me much. But I do like the libraries and coffee shops, where those may not matter to someone else.

 

Short answer, HAL is a great value for me because it fits what I like to do and how I like to do it. When I stepped on the Prinsendam for the first time last year and saw so many happy people, my first thought (unfortunately, expressed aloud) was "this is my country and these are my people." Because of that, I can see why different people like different travel experiences from different vendors. Life is good.

Edited November 27, 2015 by PatsyAnne

[kelleherdl]

What's the low end luxury hotel you're using for comparison? I'm not arguing, jut trying to gain a frame of reference. Thanks.

 

Sorry... reference is always good. A JW Marriott, concierge type suite. Not necessarily Ritz-Carlton.

 

Dennis

[POA1]

Sorry... reference is always good. A JW Marriott, concierge type suite. Not necessarily Ritz-Carlton.

 

Dennis

Thanks. I was just curious for a frame of reference.

[iancal]

It is a matter of where, when, and how you travel. We always do verandah gty.

 

HAL was not close on our last three cruises-an Australian and 2 Meds. Itineraries were all similar. HAL lost out, based on our value proposition, by as much as 33 percent against an equiv. Celebrity cruise (Noordam, Silhouette, and a Princess). The Australian was similar-RCI won out by a wide enough margin to make it very worthwhile.

 

This past fall we did five/six weeks of land travel-Greek Islands and a weekend in Paris on the way home. This time independent land travel was less expensive and gave us much more travel value.

 

Cannot comment on five star hotels. Did them for business travel but seldom do them for personal travel. BUT, we cherry pick and book mostly inside the final payment window. Plus we shop our foreign cruises in different countries since the prices can and do vary by where you book.

 

We are not married to any line. If HAL offers the best overall value for our preferences then we will book it. That is the only criteria for us.

Edited November 28, 2015 by iancal

[albingirl]

I think you get a great value for your money on Holland America. If you can get past the booking early garbage of paying through the nose for something that others get for far less money for booking later on. Really a pain to deal with and one hand doesn't seem to talk to the other concerning this issue. And, I'm far from the only one to mention this.:(

[WeLoveCruising]

This is an interesting thread, my DH and I have been talking about this, as it relates to our upcoming cruise on the Ooosterdam.

 

I think when you compare the daily rate of a Neptune suite around $700 per day, you are in a different category of comparison to other types of vacations. In addition to cruising, we also do land vacations. Our favorite place to go for that is an all-inclusive in Mexico (this is a AAA 5-diamond property, very comprable to a Four Seasons, not a typical all inclusive you might picture). We pay $700+ a night there and it is well worth it.

 

For our upcoming Oosterdam cruise we are in a Verandah, and discussed upgrading to a Neptune suite. We both agreed that for the same price as what we could have on land, the value wasn't there for us. Our land vacations at that rate include significantly better food and service (as well as all beverages), and much more space, luxury pool, etc. That got us discussing if we should just cancel the cruise and do the land vacation, since we were talking about how good the quality was in comparison - and we decided no - we enjoy cruising too. We like being at sea, we like the whole cruise experience. And we think what we are paying for the verandah is an equally good value for what we expect.

 

Comparing HAL to other cruises - that's a tough call for me. My DH worked for HAL for many years, so we have spent lots of time onboard. I've also sailed almost all the lines in the Carnival Corporation. Other than Seabourn and Windstar (which was since sold off), HAL is by far our favorite. It is also significantly cheaper than the other two I mentioned, so it comes back to value. We know if all things are equal that we prefer Seabourn - but we dont find the differential in premium to be worth it to us.

 

It's been 10+ years since I've been on NCL, so it's I can't comment on that, although I really doubt it's improved that much to make me consider switching. But I also think it comes down to as others have said, what each person values. Entertainment isn't high on my list of importance, neither is an active night life. Good service, and personal space is (I hate how some ships stack people in deck chairs by the pool). Overall cruise "personality" matters to me - I like to feel like I'm on a ship sailing, not at a Vegas resort. I picture some of the interiors of the RCI ships, with the pizza parlors, Johnny Rockets, carousels, and know that is not for me.

 

For us, a HAL cruise doesnt offer the "best" quality of what we want when we vacation. Truthfully if we had our way we'd prefer better food, the level of service we used to have, etc. But it still represents a lot of what we do like, as well as a good value for our dollar. Plus we're somewhat creatures of habit, and HAL ships feel comfortable to us, like coming home. We still know some of the officers and crew. My husband once called the Maasdam "an old shoe" and meant it fondly. Since everyone values and prioritizes whats important to them a little differently, I expect a wide variety of answers here, and look forward to reading them.

Edited November 28, 2015 by WeLoveCruising

[albingirl]

This is an interesting thread, my DH and I have been talking about this, as it relates to our upcoming cruise on the Ooosterdam.

 

I think when you compare the daily rate of a Neptune suite around $700 per day, you are in a different category of comparison to other types of vacations. In addition to cruising, we also do land vacations. Our favorite place to go for that is an all-inclusive in Mexico (this is a AAA 5-diamond property, very comprable to a Four Seasons, not a typical all inclusive you might picture). We pay $700+ a night there and it is well worth it.

 

For our upcoming Oosterdam cruise we are in a Verandah, and discussed upgrading to a Neptune suite. We both agreed that for the same price as what we could have on land, the value wasn't there for us. Our land vacations at that rate include significantly better food and service (as well as all beverages), and much more space, luxury pool, etc. That got us discussing if we should just cancel the cruise and do the land vacation, since we were talking about how good the quality was in comparison - and we decided no - we enjoy cruising too. We like being at sea, we like the whole cruise experience. And we think what we are paying for the verandah is an equally good value for what we expect.

 

Comparing HAL to other cruises - that's a tough call for me. My DH worked for HAL for many years, so we have spent lots of time onboard. I've also sailed almost all the lines in the Carnival Corporation. Other than Seabourn and Windstar (which was since sold off), HAL is by far our favorite. It is also significantly cheaper than the other two I mentioned, so it comes back to value. We know if all things are equal that we prefer Seabourn - but we dont find the differential in premium to be worth it to us.

 

It's been 10+ years since I've been on NCL, so it's I can't comment on that, although I really doubt it's improved that much to make me consider switching. But I also think it comes down to as others have said, what each person values. Entertainment isn't high on my list of importance, neither is an active night life. Good service, and personal space is (I hate how some ships stack people in deck chairs by the pool). Overall cruise "personality" matters to me - I like to feel like I'm on a ship sailing, not at a Vegas resort. I picture some of the interiors of the RCI ships, with the pizza parlors, Johnny Rockets, carousels, and know that is not for me.

 

For us, a HAL cruise doesnt offer the "best" quality of what we want when we vacation. Truthfully if we had our way we'd prefer better food, the level of service we used to have, etc. But it still represents a lot of what we do like, as well as a good value for our dollar. Plus we're somewhat creatures of habit, and HAL ships feel comfortable to us, like coming home. We still know some of the officers and crew. My husband once called the Maasdam "an old shoe" and meant it fondly. Since everyone values and prioritizes whats important to them a little differently, I expect a wide variety of answers here, and look forward to reading them.

 

Well, I'm not in the arena of $700 per night for any vacation, and I'd hardly call Maasdam "an old shoe", since I really love that ship, but "best" is in the eye of the beholder. I have repeatedly said that Holland America does not treat repeating cruisers that well, and I believe that is important. For instance, I have a Norwegian cruise planned, and since they are having a Black Friday sale, I called today to ask if we could receive some of the benefits. Answer was YES! Many hundreds of dollars received just for asking. This is what I mean. We've sailed for years (and years) with HAL and are just tired of the old story of, "oh sorry, too bad". It certainly comes down to value. You bet.

[cruz chic]

Well, I'm not in the arena of $700 per night for any vacation, and I'd hardly call Maasdam "an old shoe", since I really love that ship, but "best" is in the eye of the beholder. I have repeatedly said that Holland America does not treat repeating cruisers that well, and I believe that is important. For instance, I have a Norwegian cruise planned, and since they are having a Black Friday sale, I called today to ask if we could receive some of the benefits. Answer was YES! Many hundreds of dollars received just for asking. This is what I mean. We've sailed for years (and years) with HAL and are just tired of the old story of, "oh sorry, too bad". It certainly comes down to value. You bet.

 

I'm glad you got those perks. It's too bad Hal doesn't see benefit in their long time cruisers.

 

I don't think cruising is that great of a deal. I can get a very nice all inclusive for a fair bit less than a cruise. I don't do it because I get bored with being the same place every day.

[sammiedawg]

I personally would not pay $700 per day to sail on Holland America based on the food and ship condition. I would move that money to a premium line, non suite.

HAL can be a great value booking less expensive cabins, ocean view. Until HAL changes its smoking policy we avoid verandah cabins on this line.

Prinsendam is not a good value for the money, food, menus, service seemed standard for the line. We were not on a world cruise or grand cruise, nothing special was offered.

Edited November 28, 2015 by sammiedawg

[Lottie Linda]

Wow! 700 bucks a day!!! I can only imagine what some of my most recent vacations would be like if I had spent $700 a day.

 

First, I don't think spending six hours in a city is seeing that city, I consider it a layover. And I seldom leave the airport during a layover, just too much trouble.

 

My last few vacations I can not think how one could spend $700 a day. The Black Hills of South Dakota it would be impossible, as far as I know. One would have to look very hard for a suite that cost more than $200. And the best dinners can be had for less than twenty.

 

Olympic National Park would too be impossible to spend $700 unless one was flying in live Maine lobsters three times daily.

 

Seattle can be done for less and still seem luxurious. San Francisco could possibly test the $700 limit, but it wouldn't be low end luxury, either. Disney, either Land or World, can be fully experienced for less than $700 and that would include the whole Princess experience.

 

I recently did a Denver tour. Much less than $700 and not once did I feel I was roughing it (now I know why they call it The Mile High City).

 

I suppose that some people like cruising enough to think $700 a day is value. I just wish I could be their travel agent and plan a week for them in the Pacific Northwest. I could take that five grand, book a luxurious week and still have enough left over to take a modest vacation myself.

[WeLoveCruising]

Well, I'm not in the arena of $700 per night for any vacation, and I'd hardly call Maasdam "an old shoe", since I really love that ship, but "best" is in the eye of the beholder. I have repeatedly said that Holland America does not treat repeating cruisers that well, and I believe that is important. For instance, I have a Norwegian cruise planned, and since they are having a Black Friday sale, I called today to ask if we could receive some of the benefits. Answer was YES! Many hundreds of dollars received just for asking. This is what I mean. We've sailed for years (and years) with HAL and are just tired of the old story of, "oh sorry, too bad". It certainly comes down to value. You bet.

 

Maybe you're not familiar with a cliche of the old shoe. It's a term of endearment. An item that isn't shiny and new, but you love it for it's comfort and familarity. We love that ship as well, and in fact chose it for a burial at sea of a close family member.

 

Value, as well as beautiy, is in the eye of the beholder, and I'm glad you're happy with NCL's policies.

[AlexandNessa]

We are 3* Mariners on HAL who will never get to 4. Maybe never is too hyperbolic. My husband says maybe 25 years from now, we'll consider them again and get there. HAL is fine, just fine. However, we no longer cruise for "fine."

 

We love the Norwegian Haven. The Norwegian Haven perks far outvalue anything HAL has to offer for us. We're cruising on a 9-night Eastern Caribbean out of NYC in April on NCL for about 760$ pd (for 2 of us). That is booked on a newly refurbished Gem in an H2 suite, with our own hot tub on our balcony (bigger than an S, smaller than PH on HAL). And a butler, who God willing, we'll have for the third time (this particular butler has become a friend). It includes an ultimate beverage package, ultimate dining package, 300$ OBC, and prepaid gratuities. These perks, for us, easily outweigh anything HAL has to offer us.

 

HAL has a beverage program where, last we checked, is more on par with Carnival than a "premium" cruise line. HAL had some serious accounting discrepancies with their abysmal signature beverage program which they did not address in a carefully worded, succinct post-cruise comment in the comment card and follow up email.

 

We absolutely did not purchase a future cruise certificate on HAL on our last cruise. Right now, NCL Haven is our line of choice. Things change everyday, but HAL will have to do a lot more than the previous suite enhancement announcement to earn our business again.

 

For the best price on the Haven, book early and find a TA who can discount. Booking the Haven several months after cruise itinerary releases are not a bargain, which is what you may be comparing.

[ellieanne]

Value, like taste is extremely subjective.

 

I find HAL to be a very good vacation value. I don't drink that often -- either alcoholic or non-alcoholic beverages, so I'm perfectly happy with the included offerings. And spending money on an all-inclusive beverage package would be a waste for me.

 

I like that HAL has quiet ships. That's important for me. I like that there is not much to do on board. I vacation for the quiet and lack of anything to do. I don't need to be entertained all my waking hours. HAL goes to the ports I want to see, and it's a lovely journey getting there. I like that I can walk around the promenade deck, outside with the opportunity to change my view by just walking around. I don't sit in deck chairs; I'm too restless for that. I prefer to do my reading inside and HAL offers quiet lounges (most of the time) for that. I like HALs selection of ocean view cabins, and the size of those cabins. I do not want or need a balcony, so the extra money would be wasted.

 

I take ship-based shore excursions because the work has been done for me, and if there are any problems it's not my responsibility to solve them or figure out a way to get back to the ship. I find the ease of mind and lack of work on my part to be a good value. Others do not.

 

HAL offers the best vacation value for me. It may not for others. But by the same token, even though other cruise lines may have cheaper fares or more inclusive packages does not mean that those choices would be a better value for me.

[kelleherdl]

 

We love the Norwegian Haven. The Norwegian Haven perks far outvalue anything HAL has to offer for us. We're cruising on a 9-night Eastern Caribbean out of NYC in April on NCL for about 760$ pd (for 2 of us). That is booked on a newly refurbished Gem in an H2 suite, with our own hot tub on our balcony (bigger than an S, smaller than PH on HAL). And a butler, who God willing, we'll have for the third time (this particular butler has become a friend). It includes an ultimate beverage package, ultimate dining package, 300$ OBC, and prepaid gratuities. These perks, for us, easily outweigh anything HAL has to offer us.

 

 

For the best price on the Haven, book early and find a TA who can discount. Booking the Haven several months after cruise itinerary releases are not a bargain, which is what you may be comparing.

 

If I could find pricing like that I would certainly consider a Haven suite. That appears to be a 'very' significant discount from what I can see, approximately $400/day/2. Still 5 ports on a 9 or 10 day cruise would be a low priority itinerary for us.

 

Dennis

[albingirl]

Maybe you're not familiar with a cliche of the old shoe. It's a term of endearment. An item that isn't shiny and new, but you love it for it's comfort and familarity. We love that ship as well, and in fact chose it for a burial at sea of a close family member.

 

Value, as well as beautiy, is in the eye of the beholder, and I'm glad you're happy with NCL's policies.

 

I'm actually very familiar with the "old shoe" remark. And personally, since I grew up with the hand me down clothing and thrice leftover meatloaf, it doesn't quite resonate with the charm that you may associate it with. To each his/her own.

[Jade13]

 

 

 

HAL has a beverage program where, last we checked, is more on par with Carnival than a "premium" cruise line. HAL had some serious accounting discrepancies with their abysmal signature beverage program which they did not address in a carefully worded, succinct post-cruise comment in the comment card and follow up email.

 

 

 

.

 

 

Can you explain?

[iancal]

I cannot say that HAL is good value overall. For us it is based on the time of booking. Sometimes HAL is good value, sometimes it is not-depending on the ship and the price.

 

We certainly do not view HAL as a premium line. They may have been yesterday but today they are on a par with about four or five others in the pack. In fact, for our preferences, HAL is lacking in some very basic hospitality attributes such as their complete lack of any on line, on board passenger information windows-either inside the cabin or lobby self service terminals. Dark age.

Edited November 29, 2015 by iancal

[cruz chic]

HAL is lacking in some very basic hospitality attributes such as their complete lack of any on line, on board passenger information windows-either inside the cabin or lobby self service terminals. Dark age.

 

I'm not quite sure what this means but I'm going to respond to what I think you are trying to say. On the eurodam you could access a number of things on a mobile device. I could view my reservations, the itinerary, book specialty restaurants and view my online bill. You could print your bill yourself as well.

[albingirl]

It's the internet.

[AlexandNessa]

Can you explain?

 

 

We had the Signature Beverage Package. On several occasions, the computers were down and they insisted they would charge us, then the changes would be reversed once the computers were back up. The charges were not reversed. I had to go to concierge on two occasions to get the charges straightened out. 1. I had to surrender our SBP cards to get the charges reversed. This did not take a few minutes but several hours. This meant we did not have our cards to buy drinks on our package while the cards were surrendered to correct their mistakes. 2. When they finally credited our drinks, they charged the drinks to the current day that they corrected the charges, not the day we drank them. Since HAL has a 15 drink a day limit, this meant we maxed out on drinks on two days, making our SBP cards invalid by about 9:30p, as it looked like we hit our 15 drink limit. This was some pretty poor accounting, in our opinion, and we gave HAL three opportunities to address it (onboard, post cruise survey, follow up email). They chose not to.