10/22 Oosterdam Dining Change - No, I'm not kidding...

[heavenly]

I'm talking to my TA right now. She just got off the phone with HAL and the rep she talked to said that she had never heard of such a thing. The HAL rep said that their ships aren't configured for freestyle dining and that their customer base is not interested in having the traditional dining changed. So, according to my TA and the HAL person she talked to, the dining is NOT changing on the Oosterdam.

 

Nothing like conflicting information.

 

Welll....

 

A) I'm a TA

B) We have a group going out on Saturday on that sailing.

C) I got it directly from the horses mouth today.

D) As I said, Ship Services just found out today and our Sales Rep didn't even know about it yet. I would be surprised if most of HAL DID know.

 

E) Why would I even try to stear someone wrong on this???? I figured I could at least warn the passengers sailing with us on the ship so they didn't fall into something like what just happened on that same ship! Oh well...

[RevNeal]

Those of us who want a fixed seating where everyone shows up at (roughly) the same time and who don't want to eat insanely early would be in a bit of a sticky spot, but open seating it isn't.

 

Yeah ... it means that people like me will end up eating alone ... unless I'm part of a group. :(

 

One of the nice things about assigned seats at big tables is that it HELPS the conversation flow. Christopher is a TERRIBLE conversationalist. If it were he and I at a table for two dinner would take about 40 minutes ... mostly in silence or with me babbling and he answering me with one and two-word responses, like "yes" and "no" and "fine." That's how most dinners for us go anyway.

 

"How was your day today?"

 

"Fine."

 

"What did you do?"

 

"Made patterns."

 

"What kind of patterns?"

 

"Good ones."

 

"What do you have planned for tomorrow?"

 

"Nothing."

 

And so on. :(

 

At least with other people around Christopher is forced to speak more than two-word replies ... and there are other people to talk with.

 

With this new arrangement, it'll be like dining on land.

 

Dam.

 

This will be the deal-breaker. If HAL goes to this, the "Voyage of the Spammed" will be my last HAL cruise.

[heavenly]

Whoa...talk about stirring the dining times issues even more!!! Ugh!

This "test run" eliminates the two most popular times:6:15 and 8:00 to make the most unpopular time--5:45--even earlier and do away with 8:00--the most popular time with cruising traditionists.

Perhaps HAL could really streamline things even more...

Eliminate dinner times and just have "Dunch" ....start around 3:00 and for those who prefer a later time...well, why not bring back the midnight buffet!

Obviously HAL doesn't understand that many HAL cruisers truly value cruising tradition--that's WHY they come back again and again to HAL.

I understand HAL is out to broaden their pax demographics, but some things just down't make sense.

I do have a question: given this new idea, do passengers need to make nightly dining reservations or just show up , hope for the best (table location, size, wait for an opening)? To borrow a phrase, this get "curiouser and curiouser"

 

The way she read it (she just received a email on this TODAY, is that crazy or what???) it was open, but there could very well be reservations available, she just didn't know. The way the email was written, it sure didn't sound like it though...

[Iggipolka]

Heavenly, I'm not accusing you of anything. I'm simply reporting what my TA told me. In addition, she said that the dining change hadn't been posted on any of the TA's inner websites or message boards either.

 

It may be a good idea for other people to check with their TA's about this and, if you don't like the possible change, voice your objections to your TA who can communicate this back to HAL.

[heavenly]

Couldn’t have said it better! Is there a new CEO at HAL? What’s going on? HAL has one of the biggest return customer rates and it should be evident that the reason is because they like it the way it is. The Lido, room service, and Pinnacle Grill are all personal choices. Oh – and how are they going to satisfy large groups like Princess House’s desire to dine together? They all have to eat at 5:30 or take away the late personal choice from everyone else. It seems to me that X is HAL’s biggest competitor and that is where I guess a lot of HAL’s customer’s will go. Dumb, dumb, dumb!

 

My guess is the large group would "get" the dining room like this last one did. For our small group, they are honoring our 8:30 confirmation, but this will not be the norm from here out according to Ship Services...

[RevNeal]

Welll....

 

A) I'm a TA

B) We have a group going out on Saturday on that sailing.

C) I got it directly from the horses mouth today.

D) As I said, Ship Services just found out today and our Sales Rep didn't even know about it yet. I would be surprised if most of HAL DID know.

 

E) Why would I even try to stear someone wrong on this???? I figured I could at least warn the passengers sailing with us on the ship so they didn't fall into something like what just happened on that same ship! Oh well...

 

Put your feathers down.

There's a reason why someone might think you're trying to stir the poop. As of right now you only have 19 posts. Given the recent fracas, someone might suspect you of being a poop stirrer.

 

I'm not saying you ARE ... just that some people might not believe it. Me ... I'll believe that any idiotic corporate bureaucracy will screw the pooch like this. Especially HAL's. They've been particularly inept as of late. Someone is passing out stupid pills in Seattle.

[heavenly]

Well' date=' this is an interesting turn of events! I am on this sailing and have a confirmed 8:30 dinner time. I have a table for 8 with friends I chose to sit with. I am hoping that will still be possible even if the time has to change. I'll be sure to let you know how HAL handles all of this.[/size']

 

Janice, good luck, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you. Are you going to try and call and get this set up beforehand???

[heavenly]

The people who are going to really suffer are those that want or need to eat before 7:30, but certainly not as early as 5:30. 5:30 is ludicrous. The 6:15 diner is at a loss here.

 

But for those who want to dine 7:30 or later I agree with Brian. The tables are not going to turn twice between 7:30 and closing, so each table is going to seat only one group of 2, 4, etc. I see no reason the Maitre d' therefore would not reserve a particular table for you at whatever time after 7:30 that you wish. You still could have 8 PM at your favorite table for 2 and also have the ability to sit with friends at a larger table some nights, also.

 

This is not all bad for the late diner; for the 6-6:30 diner it is horrendous. I can't imagine any cruiseline turning over 2 main dining rooms to a time as ridiculous as 5:30.

 

They might not be able to do it if due to one specific problem... The number of people that might need the tables can highly fluctuate. The 5:30 people are not locked into that time frame, should they choose to eat at the later time they can choose to do so. I wouldn't be surprised if many of the people originally dining at 6:15 decided to eat from 7:30 onward... 5:30 is just too early!

[RevNeal]

One thought ... HAL will need to change their "Know Before You Go" booklets and their Website ... or they will quickly be hit with false advertising lawsuits.

 

http://www.hollandamerica.com/onboard/dining.do

 

Holland America Line ships offer open seating for breakfast and lunch. There are four sittings for dinner on our ships. Dinner times are 5:45 pm (First Upper), 6:15 pm (First Lower), 8:00 pm (Main Upper) and 8:30 pm (Main Lower). For all Alaska cruises, dinner times are 5:30 pm (Early Upper), 6:00 pm (Early Lower), 7:45 pm (Main Upper) and 8:15 pm (Main Lower).* You may request any sitting time, table size and with whom you wish to sit. All such requests should be made through your travel agent in advance of sailing. Requests will be confirmed or waitlisted at the time of booking. Table numbers and table size are on request only and will be assigned by the Maître d' on board.

 

*The ms Prinsendam has two sittings; 6:00 pm (First) and 8:15 pm (Main).

 

The status of your seating request is listed on your Cruise Contract. A confirmation card with seating assignment and table numbers will be waiting for you in your stateroom upon boarding. If for some reason your dining request was not submitted before your cruise date, the Maître d' will assign you to the sitting that is available.

 

That bit about the 4 dining times will need to be changed FAST if this sticks and spreads.

 

Quick ... someone call a Psychiatrist!! Herr Kruse has gone stark raving MAD!

[Arubalisa]

My 93 year old grandmother enjoys sailing HAL and even SHE does not eat THAT early. 5:30 pm for dinner is only geared towards one group of people and you know who you are...:cool:

 

Early to bed and early to rise makes us all healthy, wise and wealthy so we can take more cruises. Too bad the cruise line wants us to keep the same hours while on vacation...or it is just some diabolical plot to get rid of that darned Baked Alaska parade. :eek:

[heavenly]

What does not seem clear to me is whether table assignments will still exist or if they are trying truly "open" seating (sit where and with whom you want).

 

It seems to me that it is possible that what they are trying for second seating is something like what Cunard have in their single-seating Grills (and Caronia on QE2)... Those restaurants have assigned tables, but one can arrive any time between 7:00 and 9:00.

 

This is very different from Personal Choice-style "open seating" in that one does have the same tablemates, stewards, etc. every night... However I still do not like the idea as it must be odd for some people to arrive at, say, 8:30 when others at the table are already 1.5 hours into dinner!

 

Those of us who want a fixed seating where everyone shows up at (roughly) the same time and who don't want to eat insanely early would be in a bit of a sticky spot, but open seating it isn't.

 

As for true "open seating", that would be a real mess I think... At least, if the only fixed seating is at 5:30. However, it would make no sense to have fixed seating at 5:30 and open seating only after 7:30... If they wanted to do the Personal Choice thing it would seem simple enough just to make the lower level have two fixed seatings (probably 6:15 and 8:30) and then make the upper level "open". And that would keep the traditional people relatively happy, I suppose. Certainly happier than forcing them all to eat at 5:30.

 

So my guess is that this is really a 7:30-??? seating that is fixed in terms of table assignments but flexible in terms of time - which is something nobody seems to be considering.

 

According the Ship Services, it is truly open. If I were to get on the ship Saturday and find out I have a 5:30 seating, I could choose daily whether I want to eat at 5:30 or wait until 7:30 and go on in then. In the worst possible scenario, you could have the entire ship show up at 7:30 for dinner.

[RevNeal]

According the Ship Services, it is truly open. If I were to get on the ship Saturday and find out I have a 5:30 seating, I could choose daily whether I want to eat at 5:30 or wait until 7:30 and go on in then. In the worst possible scenario, you could have the entire ship show up at 7:30 for dinner.

 

Is there anyway to get ahold of everybody boarding the Oosterdam and urge them to all show up at 7:30 and turn the place into a mad house??? That way, HAL will realize how Asinine this is and dump it mid-cruise?

[c-cruise]

I think this is an interesting experiment. Personally I wouldn't mind if they decided to "split" the dining room and go personal choice on one level and traditional on the other. When we travel with friends we enjoy having a reserved table with a set time. However, when it is just my wife and me we like to sit by ourselves and have the flexibility of not having to go to dinner at a set time.

 

What I really don't like are the current 4 dining times. Having our dinner interupted half way through by the baked alaska parade is quite annoying. I would rather they just got rid of it.

 

I think they could get away with doing two fixed seating times (6:00 and 8:00 or whatever) on one level and then have the other level be some varient of personal choice.

[heavenly]

Heavenly, I'm not accusing you of anything. I'm simply reporting what my TA told me. In addition, she said that the dining change hadn't been posted on any of the TA's inner websites or message boards either.

 

It may be a good idea for other people to check with their TA's about this and, if you don't like the possible change, voice your objections to your TA who can communicate this back to HAL.

 

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

As to the rest, that's part of my point here... Ship Services JUST found out about this today, a few days before this happens, it's nuts! We informed our Sales Rep about it, he was floored! I would suggest if you are going to make a call and are sailing soon, call Ship Services first, in this case forget the TA, it's a waste of time, I wouldn't have known if we didn't have a group on the sailing. Call Ship Services and try to save your confirmed table if at all possible. I'm sure the news will filter down after a while, but remember, it's not line wide, it's one ship so it might filter slow... We are still confirmed for 8:30 because of our group, but I hate what happens to individual passengers during this kind of thing...

[heavenly]

I'll believe that any idiotic corporate bureaucracy will screw the pooch like this. Especially HAL's. They've been particularly inept as of late. Someone is passing out stupid pills in Seattle.

 

Lord, is this true or what????

 

Debbie<----Hoping to see the Frogs and the Cowboys on board the ship...

[heavenly]

Is there anyway to get ahold of everybody boarding the Oosterdam and urge them to all show up at 7:30 and turn the place into a mad house??? That way, HAL will realize how Asinine this is and dump it mid-cruise?

 

LOL I would go along with this and give up my confirmed table!:D

[Iggipolka]

Taken from Ziggy's excellent list:

stanford's girl Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Renorita Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

huntram Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

BP617 Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

n2hvgfun Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Nasmas Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Nautical Wheeler Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Wandering Wino's" Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

WillK o Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

 

Would any of you let us know if the dining changes that Heavenly has posted about, do occur on your upcoming cruise? I know I'd be interested in hearing and I'm sure that other people would as well.

[heavenly]

Taken from Ziggy's excellent list:

stanford's girl Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Renorita Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

huntram Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

BP617 Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

n2hvgfun Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Nasmas Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Nautical Wheeler Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

Wandering Wino's" Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

WillK o Oosterdam 10/22/05 Mexican Riviera

 

Would any of you let us know if the dining changes that Heavenly has posted about, do occur on your upcoming cruise? I know I'd be interested in hearing and I'm sure that other people would as well.

 

Iggi,

 

I will be on that sailing and will report back while on the ship. If anyone else want me to report what has been happening with them during that period just slip a note to 7133 or give me a call on board.

 

I hope to be at the CC meet on Sunday and will report what I find there if I make it.

 

Debbie

[Guest Celestia]

Don't Crystal, Radisson, Silversea, and Oceania- the cruiselines I consider in the luxury class- all have open seating dining. For those of you who cruise these lines, how does it work on those ships? Why should HAL have more of a problem than these lines, expecially if the early diners have eaten and are out of the way.

 

Just asking the question to see what the options are and how they work elsewhere. I just haven't heard friends who cruise Radisson and Oceania complaining about not having assigned tables and times.

 

I've not been on the above lines, but have experienced open seating dining on the Queen Odyssey. Queen Odyssey was 'Yacht-Class Cruising' and very definitely 'upscale' (very similar to SilverSea).

 

One enters the dining room, the MD asks if you want a table for X (X being however many of you there are together), you say yes or no, if no, he disappears looking for a table that will allow you to join.

 

We finally met a couple on the next to last day that did ask us to join them for one meal. That was only because the lady was convinced my companion was Robert DeNiro (he does look a bit like him) and the Captain had led her along a bit, saying he could neither confirm nor deny if RDN was aboard.

 

It was a bit lonely, honestly. It was obvious when the MD would return to us and say all the tables were full, he would start another with us, and yet usually we weren't joined or if we were, the other couple did not usually care to converse, and there were tables that weren't full, but hadn't wanted us. There certainly wasn't any getting to know ones' tablemates like there was on Statendam last fall.

 

And we can, and do, eat dinner regularly just the two of us. But we don't really want to do this on a cruise. My companion went on a NCL cruise the year before without me, and ended up eating alone nearly every night. NCL is, of course, Freestyle Dining. Not always great if you're not the outgoing types....which was what lead to our trying HAL.

 

FW&FS,

 

Celestia

[cruzbums]

I sure don't like all these changes.

 

I hope they get this out of the way before May as we sail on the Oosterdam May 13.

[Iggipolka]

One thought ... HAL will need to change their "Know Before You Go" booklets and their Website ... or they will quickly be hit with false advertising lawsuits.

 

http://www.hollandamerica.com/onboard/dining.do

 

That's a very, very good point. HAL just updated their website last week too. It's interesting that if the dining times are changing on the Oosterdam, even if just for a short time, that the change isn't reflected on the website.

[stanford's girl]

Janice, good luck, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you. Are you going to try and call and get this set up beforehand???

Debbie, All 8 of us have already set this up with our TA's months ago. HAL has confirmed that all of our booking numbers have been crossed referenced and we would be at the same table. But it looks like all bets are off on that now. I will be calling Ship's Services tomorrow to see what they have to say about it.

This is my first HAL cruise and I will not be happy if they change the game rules at this late date.

I'll see you on Sunday at 11 am in the Crow's Nest. If this dining change does happen, I'm sure we will all have a lot to talk about.;) LOL

[TheHappyWanderer]

We have yet to cruise HAL, but we are looking. We have however expereinced Personal Choice on Princess. On the Star PC had just come into being, and we elected to do trditional fixed......and sat in a nearly empty dining room each evening. The servers didn't have more than one table to serve! So when we booked the brand new Sapphire's 3rd voyagle we chose PC. What a disaster.....we didn't book all 7 nights on the first night.....we were told we could dine where and when we wanted to. But each and every night we had to fight tooth and nail for a reservation anywhere. We were told over and over if we would just come at 5:30 there would be no problem.

 

I see by recent posts anfd Princess literature that PC onboard the Sapphire has changed.....the small PC dining rooms have all been changed to the same menu,,,,si what is the choice there? So they didn't get it right the first time, and from what I've read recently they havn'et got it right yet.

 

We have a booking on the Oosterdam in March and will be watching this thread closely to see what transpires.

[Krazy Kruizers]

Wow - we went out for dinner last night - got home late - and didn't bother to log.

Come here this morning - and now I don't like what I am reading. This is sounding just likePrincess and NCL - and why we stopped cruising with them!

Now we have always chosen 5:45 because of DH's many medications. We figure that by the time our steward takes our order, etc., we aren't really dining until 6:30 - which is great for us.

But now dining at 5:30 - Ykes - we don't even do that at home!!!! And in order for them to get the tables cleared for the 7:30 casual dinners, you know they are going to rush you through your meal - no more leisurely dining!!!

[Krazy Kruizers]

DH got home a while ago and we were talking about this situation and a couple of other thoughts came to mind.

It was mentioned that the Baked Alaska would probably be done away with.

What about the Captain's Welcome Party? Will that be held at 4:30 for those who dine at 5:30? And the second one at 6:30 for the 7:30 diners? Or will that be eliminated?

Happy hour at 4:30 for the 5:30 diners with free appetizers (6:30 for the later crowd)? Or will that be eliminated?

And the extra tips that some of the waiters expect to get beyond the portion of the auto tip that they get - since you won't have the same waiter each evening at the 7:30 dinner time, then I doubt if any of you are going to tip anything extra. So that means the waiters can expect to get nothing extra at the end of a cruise.