zackiedawg Posted August 6, 2018 #201 Share Posted August 6, 2018 With photography there are a lot of general settings ideas that can help, but also a lot of situations where a certain method might just be better than what will work for most other use-cases. Your hummingbird attempts are an example of where a simpler solution probably would have helped make that a little easier. Rather than trying to focus on the small hummingbird as it comes up to the feeder, which can be difficult, especially with a well-lit and contrasty tree right behind that the focus system can be too easily drawn to - you might instead switch your camera to AF-S (single focus mode), keep the spot focus area selected, and before the hummingbird arrives, focus on that nice, bright red feeder. Once you've got the feeder in focus, you can even switch the camera to manual focus (or lens if you have a focus switch on the lens) and don't move it - as long as the feeder stays the same distance and you don't move your position, any bird approaching the feeder from left or right will be at the same focus distance, and therefore be in focus - you won't even need to move the focus or use autofocus for that type of situation. As for why your camera missed focus - could be a few things. First, the center of the frame doesn't appear to be on the feeder, or the bird - unless you cropped it afterwards...if that's the case, that narrow focus area you selected might have been centered right on the tree behind. You need to make sure you're using a smaller focus area, then make sure that focus point or spot is only on the subject you're trying to shoot. If you find the hummingbird is just too small or not contrasty enough where the camera can't seem to find it, try putting the AF point at the feeder and seeing if you can focus on that - then back to the bird. Cameras and lenses will sometimes have an easier time 'finding' the small subject if you get the lens a little closer to the right focus plane - once it 'finds' that tree in the background, 200 attempts to refocus are probably going to go right back to that tree. But get that tree to be way out of focus and blurry, and the focus on the feeder, you'll be much closer to the correct focus on the bird and easier for the camera's focus system to recognize the bird as the subject and focus on it. Sometimes with really tiny subjects like a dragonfly 10 feet away on the tip of a reed - if I were to try to focus on that dragonfly, with a bunch of well lit reeds and leaves behind him, the camera would probably try to focus on those reeds every time, and ignore the tiny dragonfly that's only 5% of the frame. BUT, if I first find a big, bright flower that's about 10 feet away from the camera, I can first autofocus on that flower...then when I point back at the dragonfly, the lens is already focused for a subject 10 feet away - and the dragonfly is almost focused already in the screen - when I half-press to autofocus again, the lens only has to move its focus a few millimeters and it 'sees' that dragonfly and locks on, ignoring those bright background leaves and reeds which were all out of focus and blurry to start. Anytime your subject is a small part of your frame, or has low contrast and doesn't stand out, find something else to focus on that's about the same distance away to give the camera and lens a head-start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT Sean Posted August 6, 2018 #202 Share Posted August 6, 2018 I’m sorry to keep bothering everybody but I really don’t understand what I’m doing wrong. I have ISO set to auto, focus mode is AF-A Auto-servo, AF-area mode is single point AF and shutter was set to 1/800 #1 - are you doing the half-click to acquire focus before taking the picture? If so you should be able to tell what you are focused on. #2 with AF-A and single point AF, you're gonna have to get the bird focused in the focus point (the one highlighted in the viewfinder) and then keep the focus point on the bird (while keeping the button half-clicked), otherwise the camera will focus on something else. I don't know what other modes the D3400 supports but if possible you might want to try one that will allow you to lock focus on the bird (with the half-click), then the camera will track the bird if it "moves" to other focus points. What might be easier than that is to set the camera to AF-S, prefocus on the feeder itself (with the half click) and then take the picture when the bird takes a little sip. The key with all of this is the half-click. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 7, 2018 #203 Share Posted August 7, 2018 Thanks again for the input. I have more things to try. Part of the problem is that the hummingbird doesn't stay there very long and I'm trying to hurry to get it in focus. I have tried focusing on something else then bringing it back to the bird, sometimes it works. I don't intentionally take a blurry photo, sometimes I have the bird in focus and when I go to take the picture the camera focuses on the tree, other times I accidently press the shutter button too hard when trying to focus and it takes the picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Turtles06 Posted August 7, 2018 #204 Share Posted August 7, 2018 Thanks again for the input. I have more things to try. Part of the problem is that the hummingbird doesn't stay there very long and I'm trying to hurry to get it in focus. I have tried focusing on something else then bringing it back to the bird, sometimes it works. I don't intentionally take a blurry photo, sometimes I have the bird in focus and when I go to take the picture the camera focuses on the tree, other times I accidently press the shutter button too hard when trying to focus and it takes the picture. I don't know how much practicing you have been doing with focus points, exposure modes (P, A, S), using the focus/shutter button, etc. on stationary subjects, and preferably not through windows, but if you haven't really gotten a good comfort with the camera settings on such "easier" subjects, I would suggest doing so. And in terms of birds, try starting with larger, slower birds (sea gulls, for example, if you are near any), or even some sleeping dogs or cats, rather than small, flitty birds. (I've found that a zoo is great place to practice with a new camera or lens.) Way back when I bought my first DSLR, and took it to a basketball game, I could not figure out why so many of my photos were not focused on the players but on spectators behind them. There's a learning curve to all this, no need to jump in at the deep end. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 8, 2018 #205 Share Posted August 8, 2018 I don't know how much practicing you have been doing with focus points, exposure modes (P, A, S), using the focus/shutter button, etc. on stationary subjects, and preferably not through windows, but if you haven't really gotten a good comfort with the camera settings on such "easier" subjects, I would suggest doing so. And in terms of birds, try starting with larger, slower birds (sea gulls, for example, if you are near any), or even some sleeping dogs or cats, rather than small, flitty birds. (I've found that a zoo is great place to practice with a new camera or lens.) Way back when I bought my first DSLR, and took it to a basketball game, I could not figure out why so many of my photos were not focused on the players but on spectators behind them. There's a learning curve to all this, no need to jump in at the deep end. Good luck! Almost all the pictures I've taken so far have been using the Auto or Sports settings. When I mentioned my focusing problem a week or so ago several people mentioned trying S mode. So not much practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Turtles06 Posted August 8, 2018 #206 Share Posted August 8, 2018 Almost all the pictures I've taken so far have been using the Auto or Sports settings. When I mentioned my focusing problem a week or so ago several people mentioned trying S mode. So not much practice. People suggested S mode because you were trying to photograph a possibly moving bird, and to get you out of sports mode where you had less control over the focus. You might not want to drive yourself crazy trying to photograph a small flitty bird through a window right now and instead spend more time learning the basics of your camera, and then move up to more difficult subjects. Just a suggestion. :D Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT Sean Posted August 10, 2018 #207 Share Posted August 10, 2018 Thanks again for the input. I have more things to try. Part of the problem is that the hummingbird doesn't stay there very long and I'm trying to hurry to get it in focus. I have tried focusing on something else then bringing it back to the bird, sometimes it works. I don't intentionally take a blurry photo, sometimes I have the bird in focus and when I go to take the picture the camera focuses on the tree, other times I accidently press the shutter button too hard when trying to focus and it takes the picture. At least some of the focusing issues are probably related to using AF-A mode. The camera is basically deciding for itself whether you are trying to take a pic of a static scene or a scene with movement in it, and not always getting it right. You might want to read about the different focus modes here, starting on page 69: http://download.nikonimglib.com/archive3/mDRtb00yLNm4030fA0354NqSi012/D3400RM_(En)03.pdf If you want to pre-focus on the feeder and take the pic when the bird comes in - use AF-S. If you want to attempt to track the movement of the bird itself - use AF-C and use an "AF Area mode" (page 74) of dynamic area or 3D tracking. Either approach requires locking focus with the half-click and holding it until ready to take the picture. Focusing on the bird in AF-C requires locking focus on the bird with the half click in the first place, then keeping the shutter release half-clicked while keeping the bird within the other focus points in the viewfinder until your ready to take the picture. for AF-C it might be a good idea to practice on other birds (any anything else that moves) that aren't quite as erratic as hummingbirds to get some subject-tracking practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 13, 2018 #208 Share Posted August 13, 2018 One of my better attempts. Still having a hard time focusing. Will keep trying. Does everyone focus immediately after half clicking or does it take a little time? Sent from my iPad using Forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 13, 2018 #209 Share Posted August 13, 2018 People suggested S mode because you were trying to photograph a possibly moving bird, and to get you out of sports mode where you had less control over the focus. You might not want to drive yourself crazy trying to photograph a small flitty bird through a window right now and instead spend more time learning the basics of your camera, and then move up to more difficult subjects. Just a suggestion. :D Enjoy! Thanks. I do have a lot to learn (not just my camera but basic photography). At least some of the focusing issues are probably related to using AF-A mode. The camera is basically deciding for itself whether you are trying to take a pic of a static scene or a scene with movement in it, and not always getting it right. You might want to read about the different focus modes here, starting on page 69: http://download.nikonimglib.com/archive3/mDRtb00yLNm4030fA0354NqSi012/D3400RM_(En)03.pdf If you want to pre-focus on the feeder and take the pic when the bird comes in - use AF-S. If you want to attempt to track the movement of the bird itself - use AF-C and use an "AF Area mode" (page 74) of dynamic area or 3D tracking. Either approach requires locking focus with the half-click and holding it until ready to take the picture. Focusing on the bird in AF-C requires locking focus on the bird with the half click in the first place, then keeping the shutter release half-clicked while keeping the bird within the other focus points in the viewfinder until your ready to take the picture. for AF-C it might be a good idea to practice on other birds (any anything else that moves) that aren't quite as erratic as hummingbirds to get some subject-tracking practice. Thanks for all the information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Marvy Mare Posted August 13, 2018 #210 Share Posted August 13, 2018 One of my better attempts. Still having a hard time focusing. Will keep trying. Does everyone focus immediately after half clicking or does it take a little time? Sent from my iPad using Forums What settings did you use for this? Increase the ISO so you can still use a fairly large aperture but have a higher shutter speed. As someone else mentioned getting a photo like this in focus takes lots of practice. Quality (expensive) telephoto lenses also help with bird photos so you don’t have to do too much cropping. Learn back button focus. You can find instructions for your specific camera (3400 right?) on line. I had a 3300 for a couple of years. Great beginner dslr. You can purchase guides for your camera that are very helpful. Also check out Moose Winnans. He has cheat sheets for specific camera & lens combinations that I used a lot while I was learning. Maris Sent from my iPad using Forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 14, 2018 #211 Share Posted August 14, 2018 What settings did you use for this? Increase the ISO so you can still use a fairly large aperture but have a higher shutter speed. As someone else mentioned getting a photo like this in focus takes lots of practice. Quality (expensive) telephoto lenses also help with bird photos so you don’t have to do too much cropping. Learn back button focus. You can find instructions for your specific camera (3400 right?) on line. I had a 3300 for a couple of years. Great beginner dslr. You can purchase guides for your camera that are very helpful. Also check out Moose Winnans. He has cheat sheets for specific camera & lens combinations that I used a lot while I was learning. Maris Sent from my iPad using Forums Yes, I have the 3400. I was using S mode, shutter 1250, 70-300mm lens zoomed in all the way then in-camera cropping. Also part of my problem is I can't keep the camera very still. I have never heard of back button focus, I'll have to look it up. Thanks for the information. I might have to get those cheat sheets, the price seems pretty reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike2018 Posted August 14, 2018 #212 Share Posted August 14, 2018 This is a great guide. Goes in to very detailed explanations on absolutely everything your D3400 can do. https://www.amazon.com/David-Buschs-Nikon-Digital-Photography/dp/1681982307 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 15, 2018 #213 Share Posted August 15, 2018 This is a great guide. Goes in to very detailed explanations on absolutely everything your D3400 can do. https://www.amazon.com/David-Buschs-Nikon-Digital-Photography/dp/1681982307 Thanks for the information. Have you heard anything about the Nikon D3400 for Dummies book? That's the one I have. I also have Digital Photography for dummies. I really should be reading that first but I wanted to start taking photos as soon as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike2018 Posted August 15, 2018 #214 Share Posted August 15, 2018 Thanks for the information. Have you heard anything about the Nikon D3400 for Dummies book? That's the one I have. I also have Digital Photography for dummies. I really should be reading that first but I wanted to start taking photos as soon as possible. Both of those are good, but I prefer Davud Busch's books. They literally cover everything If you prefer watching videos I recommend the "Fundamentals of Photography" course available through Ultimate Courses Plus. It's an educational video streaming service online tht costs about $20 a month and they have a free trial period to try them out. The course is not camera specific but covers a lot of the techniques and art of photography. https://www.thegreatcoursesplus.com/fundamentals-of-photography Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gambit57 Posted August 15, 2018 #215 Share Posted August 15, 2018 Still having a hard time focusing. Will keep trying. Does everyone focus immediately after half clicking or does it take a little time? Keep at it. Try changing settings to enable back button focusing. It can help with action shots like this where you need quick reactions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommui987 Posted August 15, 2018 #216 Share Posted August 15, 2018 If you prefer watching videos I recommend the "Fundamentals of Photography" course available through Ultimate Courses Plus. It's an educational video streaming service online tht costs about $20 a month and they have a free trial period to try them out. The course is not camera specific but covers a lot of the techniques and art of photography. https://www.thegreatcoursesplus.com/fundamentals-of-photography It's The Great Courses Plus and has a great abundance of courses which you can stream. If you prefer DVDs, they may be purchased from The Great Courses - the "Plus" is its streaming service. They have an abundance of courses from Antropology to Zoology which you can view (and review) on their streaming service for about $200 a year. Fundamentals of Photography is a great course - but you should also see the course on Travel Photography. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 16, 2018 #217 Share Posted August 16, 2018 Thanks again! I do get the Great Courses catalog and have seen the Photography course. I wasn't sure if it would help me, but now I'll have to give it a look. Just started watching a YouTube video on back button focusing (Realworld). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike2018 Posted August 16, 2018 #218 Share Posted August 16, 2018 It's The Great Courses Plus Thanks for the correction...I couldn't remember off the top of my head...happens sometimes after 40 :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 14, 2019 #219 Share Posted August 14, 2019 Today I received A Nikon D500 (as an anniversary present). I've been using a Nikon D3400 for just over a year and still pretty much use auto features. I also take a lot of bird photos (still and moving) and even using my Tamron 18-400mm I don't have enough zoom. I zoom and crop in camera on my D3400 but I can't seem to find out if I can on my D500. Does anyone know? It's pretty important to me since I do it a lot. Also do you think a beginner can handle the D500? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzydog Posted August 14, 2019 #220 Share Posted August 14, 2019 Your Tamron should give you enough zoom for most things. Cropping - I would reserve that for in computer not in camera. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommui987 Posted August 14, 2019 #221 Share Posted August 14, 2019 14 hours ago, Ozzydog said: Impressive shot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenevenpar Posted August 14, 2019 #222 Share Posted August 14, 2019 (edited) The first two are Costa's Hummingbirds shot in May in Palm Desert, CA and the third is an Anna's in Scottsdale, AZ last week. Here is what I have learned about Hummingbirds, and birds in general. FYI, all were taken with a Nikon D5oo and a 70-200 F/2.8E (a most amazing lens). I shot these all in aperture mode, with ISO as low as the light would allow, and keeping my shutter speed up. Autofocus C - Single spot (I use AF - C and group 4 for birds in flight; I know that the first two are in flight, but it is more like a stationary bird when hovering. You would have to be exceptionally lucky getting one at full speed in flight). FYI, I sometimes back button focus, but for my photography, I find using the shutter release easier. Like any other wildlife, you need to learn their habits and anticipate. The flowering plant in the first two pictures was a favorite, and I spent hours there over two days, knowing that the odds were good if I saw them there once that they, or others, would be back. In the third picture, the Anna's liked to perch on the same branch, only a few feet away from me. You can do the same with your 3400 and 70-300, and a whole lot of patience. Any questions, just ask. Edited August 14, 2019 by kenevenpar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 17, 2019 #223 Share Posted August 17, 2019 (edited) On 8/13/2019 at 10:56 PM, Ozzydog said: Your Tamron should give you enough zoom for most things. Cropping - I would reserve that for in computer not in camera. It really doesn't give me the zoom I want. This was taken about 30 feet away from the birds at 400mm zoom. I'd like photos close up like the one you have here. I would say a lot of the time the birds I'm photographing are maybe 80-100 feet away. I also don't seem to get clear pictures, I'm not exactly sure why. Does cropping on the computer make the photos better looking than cropping in camera? Edited August 17, 2019 by cruises42 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruises42 Posted August 17, 2019 #224 Share Posted August 17, 2019 On 8/14/2019 at 1:22 PM, kenevenpar said: The first two are Costa's Hummingbirds shot in May in Palm Desert, CA and the third is an Anna's in Scottsdale, AZ last week. Here is what I have learned about Hummingbirds, and birds in general. FYI, all were taken with a Nikon D5oo and a 70-200 F/2.8E (a most amazing lens). I shot these all in aperture mode, with ISO as low as the light would allow, and keeping my shutter speed up. Autofocus C - Single spot (I use AF - C and group 4 for birds in flight; I know that the first two are in flight, but it is more like a stationary bird when hovering. You would have to be exceptionally lucky getting one at full speed in flight). FYI, I sometimes back button focus, but for my photography, I find using the shutter release easier. Like any other wildlife, you need to learn their habits and anticipate. The flowering plant in the first two pictures was a favorite, and I spent hours there over two days, knowing that the odds were good if I saw them there once that they, or others, would be back. In the third picture, the Anna's liked to perch on the same branch, only a few feet away from me. You can do the same with your 3400 and 70-300, and a whole lot of patience. Any questions, just ask. Gorgeous photos! Since you have a D500 any help you can give me will be appreciated. I'm not used to changing settings and don't really know where to start (mostly for wildlife and some landscape). We'll be cruising to Alaska in less than 2 weeks and I hope I can use this new camera without disastrous results. I'm just taking the Nikon D500 and Tamron 18-400mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzydog Posted August 17, 2019 #225 Share Posted August 17, 2019 One of the responders gave you the advice that pre-focusing (in Auto mode) on the feeder (and switching to manual mode) is what I do for Hummers. I shoot in S mode - for Hummers about 1/3000th/sec. Many shots will be out of focus but some will be fine. Also Burst mode 10 frames/sec. Usually, I'm on my tripod with a cable release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now