Dumbing Down & Dressing Down: The New Cunard?

[rj1227]

I was not going to respond again--this thread has already gone too many pages too long, though venting can be healthy. 

 

I disagree largely with, but can appreciate, the argument in favor of more frequent formal-dress nights and a dress-code that requires--requires--men wear ties on nonformal nights. But I also think the notion of theme nights is insipid. Note it doesn't bother me if people want to dress up in some Roaring 20s' apparel, but I am also not impressed. 

 

And--this will trigger responses--I also am not impressed with men wearing kilts on formal nights. Again, I really don't care and am admittedly not Scottish or British, but I am difficulty seeing how kilts match black-tie formality. A personal observation. 

[no1talks]

4 hours ago, rj1227 said:

"Again, I really don't care and am admittedly not Scottish or British, but I am difficulty seeing how kilts match black-tie formality. A personal observation." 

It is the entirety of a kilt-based suit of clothes which dictates whether the standards of black-tie or even white-tie are met. There are even subtle gradations within the two broad categories.

https://www.gentlemansgazette.com/tuxedo-black-tie-guide/advanced/scottish-highland-dress-irish/

[reeves35]

9 hours ago, Lee Jones Jnr said:

WELL...

A factor in why I like and travel with Cunard is that I like the traditional nature including the smarter dress code. 

IMO it does detract from formal nights when people are milling around in casual wear, though I am also perfectly happy with the theme nights being hit over the head and thrown overboard. A ship full of grown adults dressed up for Roaring Twenties is a bit odd.

In many respects, dressing up in penguin suits for no reason other than the Daily Program said to could also be seen as a bit silly but, as a special event, it is a bit of harmless fun.

[e&mcruise]

9 hours ago, Lee Jones Jnr said:

 

IMO it does detract from formal nights when people are milling around in casual wear, 

That is kind of the point. If you don't want to dress up, then choose another cruise line other than Cunard rather than spoiling it for the rest.

 

A swearing rowdy sports team wouldn't be likely to be going on a Disney cruise line. Those of us who don't want to be around other people screaming kids can avoid family based/orientated cruise lines.

 

Cunard is a wonderful niche in the cruise Markey that shouldn't be valued higher or lower than the other options but it shouldn't morph into them either.

[david63]

7 minutes ago, e&mcruise said:

If you don't want to dress up, then choose another cruise line other than Cunard rather than spoiling it for the rest.

There is a significant difference between not dressing up and not conforming to the dress code. Whether any of us like it or not if a passenger is conforming to the dress code then as far as Cunard are concerned there is nothing wrong.

[Victoria2]

3 minutes ago, e&mcruise said:

That is kind of the point. If you don't want to dress up, then choose another cruise line other than Cunard rather than spoiling it for the rest.

 

A swearing rowdy sports team wouldn't be likely to be going on a Disney cruise line. Those of us who don't want to be around other people screaming kids can avoid family based/orientated cruise lines.

 

Cunard is a wonderful niche in the cruise Markey that shouldn't be valued higher or lower than the other options but it shouldn't morph into them either.

I don't know how many Cunard cruises you have done but the Cunard passengers I have encountered over the years do not fit those you describe in para two and I see no reason why it should change.

 

It isn't up to any of us the 'decide' who is Cunard'ish and who isn't and if folk have their holiday diminished by those who 'don't measure up' but follow guidelines then maybe Cunard isn't for them.

 

 

 

 

[King Amo]

2 minutes ago, david63 said:

There is a significant difference between not dressing up and not conforming to the dress code. Whether any of us like it or not if a passenger is conforming to the dress code then as far as Cunard are concerned there is nothing wrong.

As far as anyone is concerned there is nothing wrong. Some may not like it, but it doesn't make it wrong

[e&mcruise]

1 minute ago, Victoria2 said:

I don't know how many Cunard cruises you have done but the Cunard passengers I have encountered over the years do not fit those you describe in para two and I see no reason why it should change.

 

It isn't up to any of us the 'decide' who is Cunard'ish and who isn't and if folk have their holiday diminished by those who 'don't measure up' but follow guidelines then maybe Cunard isn't for them.

 

 

 

 

Victoria2, you missed my point. You don't see this sort of guest on Cunard as it does't suit their requirements which is great.

 

No one is trying to decide who travels on Cunard. It is up to the individual to decide if it is a cruise line that suits their needs. However those that think Cunard is wonderful also shouldn't have their holiday diminished by people that simply don't want to measure up or comply with said guidelines.

[King Amo]

'measure up or comply'?

 

What on earth does one need to do to measure up?

[e&mcruise]

22 minutes ago, Victoria2 said:

It isn't up to any of us the 'decide' who is Cunard'ish and who isn't and if folk have their holiday diminished by those who 'don't measure up' but follow guidelines then maybe Cunard isn't for them.

 

 

 

 

 

8 minutes ago, King Amo said:

'measure up or comply'?

 

What on earth does one need to do to measure up?

Not sure but suggested by Victoria2.......

[exlondoner]

11 minutes ago, King Amo said:

'measure up or comply'?

 

What on earth does one need to do to measure up?

Well one thing I can think of is to keep children under control and stop any teenagers being rowdy. And I am happy to say, in my experience, with one minor exception, that always happens. 
 

In general, behave in such a way that it doesn’t upset other passengers, though I admit some people are upset by strange things. 
 

So, basically, just like every day life.

[Victoria2]

28 minutes ago, e&mcruise said:

Victoria2, you missed my point. You don't see this sort of guest on Cunard as it does't suit their requirements which is great.

 

No one is trying to decide who travels on Cunard. It is up to the individual to decide if it is a cruise line that suits their needs. However those that think Cunard is wonderful also shouldn't have their holiday diminished by people that simply don't want to measure up or comply with said guidelines.

 

9 minutes ago, e&mcruise said:

 

Not sure but suggested by Victoria2.......

Not suggested at all. Anything in quotation marks is in direct reply to the thought some folk don't measure up by 'some' standards.

[King Amo]

1 minute ago, exlondoner said:

Well one thing I can think of is to keep children under control and stop any teenagers being rowdy. And I am happy to say, in my experience, with one minor exception, that always happens. 
 

In general, behave in such a way that it doesn’t upset other passengers, though I admit some people are upset by strange things. 
 

So, basically, just like every day life.

I'd argue that would come under complying with guidelines rather than measuring up, and also given the tiny proportion of families with children or teenagers, this seems a relatively low likelihood issue to be concerned about. 

[DukeBeetle24]

29 minutes ago, e&mcruise said:

Victoria2, you missed my point. You don't see this sort of guest on Cunard as it does't suit their requirements which is great.

 

No one is trying to decide who travels on Cunard. It is up to the individual to decide if it is a cruise line that suits their needs. However those that think Cunard is wonderful also shouldn't have their holiday diminished by people that simply don't want to measure up or comply with said guidelines.

You're assuming people won't "comply". Most people will follow the dress code as it is written on the Cunard website. It's clear enough. As for dressing casually, again that is part of Cunard's dress code. You can dress casually in the evenings in certain venues. There will always be people who don't follow the dress code though, but that's nothing to do with Cunard, that'd happen on any line.

 

I hope that those trying Cunard don't have their holiday diminished by people judging them for following the dress code as it is on the Cunard website, rather than the dress code they think it should be. 

[Victoria2]

2 minutes ago, King Amo said:

I'd argue that would come under complying with guidelines rather than measuring up, and also given the tiny proportion of families with children or teenagers, this seems a relatively low likelihood issue to be concerned about. 

I love seeing  the young children and teens on Cunard having a wonderful time.

 

 

[King Amo]

2 minutes ago, Victoria2 said:

I love seeing  the young children and teens on Cunard having a wonderful time.

 

 

That's great to hear and much appreciated as someone who brings their teenage son on cruises. Sadly there are many who deem children (and even younger passengers generally) as somehow less deserving of seats, positions in queues etc. 

[exlondoner]

4 minutes ago, King Amo said:

I'd argue that would come under complying with guidelines rather than measuring up, and also given the tiny proportion of families with children or teenagers, this seems a relatively low likelihood issue to be concerned about. 

It doesn’t take many: two badly behaved children in a swimming pool can ruin it for quite a lot of people. And, years ago, I was disturbed at night on QE2 by a group of male teenagers shouting and running about outside my cabin. It must be said that, when I finally stuck my head out of the door to remonstrate with them, they were clearly apologetic (probably recognising a teacher!) and disappeared somewhere else.

 

But Cunard children are almost invariably delightful.

[exlondoner]

2 minutes ago, King Amo said:

That's great to hear and much appreciated as someone who brings their teenage son on cruises. Sadly there are many who deem children (and even younger passengers generally) as somehow less deserving of seats, positions in queues etc. 

 

Surely not on Cunard. Most passengers I come across seem delightful at the injection of youth.

[King Amo]

5 minutes ago, exlondoner said:

 

Surely not on Cunard. Most passengers I come across seem delightful at the injection of youth.

Sadly particularly on Cunard. I'm hopeful things will have changed by the time of our trip this summer, but some of the snootiness that rears its head on here has been evident on board (albeit not about dress codes as we've naturally all been completely compliant). 

 

Even before we had kids, as a young couple on the QE2 we had numerous experiences of huffing and puffing that we happened to be sitting in chairs favoured by certain older guests, pushing in front of queues, interrupting drinks waiters when taking our orders etc. 

 

 

[exlondoner]

13 minutes ago, King Amo said:

Sadly particularly on Cunard. I'm hopeful things will have changed by the time of our trip this summer, but some of the snootiness that rears its head on here has been evident on board (albeit not about dress codes as we've naturally all been completely compliant). 

 

Even before we had kids, as a young couple on the QE2 we had numerous experiences of huffing and puffing that we happened to be sitting in chairs favoured by certain older guests, pushing in front of queues, interrupting drinks waiters when taking our orders etc. 

 

 

Is that not offset a little by passengers pleased to see young children, possibly being reminded of their grandchildren, and by the crew, who are missing their own children?

[e&mcruise]

1 minute ago, exlondoner said:

Is that not offset a little by passengers pleased to see young children, possibly being reminded of their grandchildren, and by the crew, who are missing their own children?

Exlonderer, it may seem like I am picking on you tonight (which I am not meaning too) but I do not agree. Some people have not been blessed with children or grandchildren and it maybe a factor in why they choose a non family geared line such as Cunard. For some of the crew as you suggest, it could make missing their kids even worse.

[exlondoner]

1 minute ago, e&mcruise said:

Exlonderer, it may seem like I am picking on you tonight (which I am not meaning too) but I do not agree. Some people have not been blessed with children or grandchildren and it maybe a factor in why they choose a non family geared line such as Cunard. For some of the crew as you suggest, it could make missing their kids even worse.

I am sure that is the case, but it is not the universal truth, there are others who enjoy seeing children. I for instance am blessed, as you put it, not to have children, and, inevitably as a former teacher, my default position towards children is fear and loathing (exaggeration for effect), but I am always charmed to see the well behaved children on Cunard.

 

However, I can appreciate the shock of a friend who found himself on a crossing with about 300 children.

[e&mcruise]

2 minutes ago, exlondoner said:

.....my default position towards children is fear and loathing (exaggeration for effect), but I am always charmed to see the well behaved children on Cunard.

 

Well that we most certainly have in common!!!! 🙂

[King Amo]

9 minutes ago, exlondoner said:

Is that not offset a little by passengers pleased to see young children, possibly being reminded of their grandchildren, and by the crew, who are missing their own children?

To an extent, but it is generally the sour taste from bad experiences that linger. Don't get me wrong, it has never been enough for me to say never again, but it has certainly been more noticeable on Cunard than on the American lines. 

[tacticalbanjo]

My 2 year old has 5 Cunard trips under her belt and I've never had a bad experience. This is not to cast doubt on your experiences as I'm sure we've all read perfectly truthful reviews which are the complete opposite of what we experienced on the same cruise because we were lucky enough to avoid the annoying passenger/poor service/broken toilet etc in question. I'm probably too oblivious to notice any dirty looks or snooty comments!