CBD Infused Hair Product

[aborgman]

Just now, sparks1093 said:

Don't know about anywhere else but we have several small businesses here in Vermont that manufacture CBD. They are not affiliated with the pharmacies at all. It is these types of businesses that I think of when I think of CBD and the possibility of it being manufactured correctly in order to be legal under federal law. 

 

We're not speaking just about CBD though - we're speaking about the massive number of things (all supplements, CBD, food, compounded drugs, etc., etc.) that aren't "FDA approved".

 

There are a huge number of things that aren't FDA approved. That doesn't mean they are illegal. It doesn't mean they can't/couldn't be tested. They just don't require FDA approval.

 

There are huge number of things are 100% federally legal that the FDA does not have the legal power to test.

[sparks1093]

12 minutes ago, aborgman said:

 

We're not speaking just about CBD though - we're speaking about the massive number of things (all supplements, CBD, food, compounded drugs, etc., etc.) that aren't "FDA approved".

 

There are a huge number of things that aren't FDA approved. That doesn't mean they are illegal. It doesn't mean they can't/couldn't be tested. They just don't require FDA approval.

 

There are huge number of things are 100% federally legal that the FDA does not have the legal power to test.

Right and I was just responding to your comment about pharmacies being made bankrupt. I imagine there are a good number of supplements as well that are also made by small businesses throughout the country. But to stick to the point of the thread given all of the different businesses making CBD and with only some of it possibly passing muster banning all of it is the safest course of action.

[ProgRockCruiser]

2 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

but you claimed Carnival owned the dogs. How can both be correct?

Same way I can say that I checked my luggage for bananas, and my wife checked my luggage for apples.  There's more than one dog.

 

Carnival has dogs they "employ" (utilize) for banned substance detection (e.g. Pot, CBD apparently), and the TSA may have dogs they use for same or other substance detection (bomb-making materials, maybe also drugs).

[BlerkOne]

47 minutes ago, aborgman said:

 

 

The required research, that already exists, would bankrupt compound pharmacies?

 

The required research, which is regularly done by large supplement manufacturers without going bankrupt, would bankrupt the companies?

 

Lots of things which don't require FDA approval - have all the data that would be necessary for FDA approval, and sometimes way more. A number of states have MORE stringent requirements for compounding drugs than the FDA has for mass manufacture drugs.

 

 

 

Everything to do with "port security" - which you claimed TSA had nothing to do with.

 

Turns out that doing security vetting on port workers IS port security.

 

Turns out that creating training for security workers at ports IS port security.

Turns out running explosives dogs through the parking lots at ports IS port security.

Turns out writing regs for X-Ray/millimeter wave scanners to be used in ports IS port security.

 

 

What research has been done in compounded drugs for all conditions? Or any conditions?

 

TSA makes information available to those who ask 

 

Most ports are NOT cruise ports. That port security is irrelevant 

[BlerkOne]

8 minutes ago, ProgRockCruiser said:

Same way I can say that I checked my luggage for bananas, and my wife checked my luggage for apples.  There's more than one dog.

 

I don't know about you, but I have never been screened by more than one dog. So does the dog now have joint (no pun intended), ownership?

[ProgRockCruiser]

7 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

I don't know about you, but I have never been screened by more than one dog. So does the dog now have joint (no pun intended), ownership?

You've never knowingly been screened by more than one dog, perhaps.  You don't know what dog sniffing is going on with your checked luggage or at the car you parked in the terminal parking lot or...

 

As others have mentioned, TSA is not as likely to be involved in dog sniffing the embarking pax in-person for drugs, so you will probably only encounter Carnival's team.  The TSA dogs will be more likely sniffing you and especially your luggage upon return.

Edited 3 hours ago by ProgRockCruiser

[BlerkOne]

56 minutes ago, ProgRockCruiser said:

You've never knowingly been screened by more than one dog, perhaps.  You don't know what dog sniffing is going on with your checked luggage or at the car you parked in the terminal parking lot or...

 

As others have mentioned, TSA is not as likely to be involved in dog sniffing the embarking pax in-person for drugs, so you will probably only encounter Carnival's team.  The TSA dogs will be more likely sniffing you and especially your luggage upon return.

TSA dogs are not trained to detect drugs. 

 

I definitely know I have not been sniffed by more than one dog. I never mentioned luggage. I've also seen dogs running over supplies prior to loading on a ship.

 

My most recent cruises this year I was sniffed by exactly zero dogs. This tells me it is port specific 

 

I doubt TSA has anything to do with returning passengers/luggage. That would be CBP.

Edited 2 hours ago by BlerkOne

[aborgman]

1 hour ago, BlerkOne said:

What research has been done in compounded drugs for all conditions? Or any conditions?

 

 

Umm... compounded drugs are the same as commercially manufactured drugs, just made in compounding pharmacies. What research has been done? All the research that originally got the drug approved.

 

Compounding pharmacy making semaglutide?

All the semaglutide research from Wegovy, Trulicity, Victoza, Ozempic, etc. exists.

 

That is the equivalent of asking what research has been done on generic drugs. The research was done on the compound when it was initially FDA approved.

 

"Most ports are NOT cruise ports. That port security is irrelevant "

TSA is involved with security in EVERY US port. Every cruise port. Every commercial port. Every ferry port. Inland ports on the Great Lakes. Pacific ports. Atlantic ports. Gulf of Mexico ports.

 

 

[aborgman]

1 hour ago, BlerkOne said:

I don't know about you, but I have never been screened by more than one dog. So does the dog now have joint (no pun intended), ownership?

 

I have been screened by more than one dog...

 

I was sniffed by 3 different Carnival dogs during embarkation in February.

There was also a dog out in the surface parking lot sniffing cars - likely TSA VIPR.

There are almost certainly dogs sniffing checked luggage.

There was a produce sniffing dog getting off the ship in Cozumel.

 

...and funny enough - a friend of a friend who came on the same cruise... is a huge pot head. Works in a pot shop. Luggage covered in weed stickers. His luggage was sniffed twice, and he petted the drug sniffing dog.

 

He had a suitcase full of edibles and THC vape pens. Dog did nothing.

.

 

 

[BlerkOne]

Individual drugs are researched. Not combinations compounded together.

 

Of course TSA is a resource available for use, if requested, as I had mentioned.

[BlerkOne]

Just now, aborgman said:

 

I have been screened by more than one dog...

 

I was sniffed by 3 different Carnival dogs during embarkation in February.

There was also a dog out in the surface parking lot sniffing cars - likely TSA VIPR.

There are almost certainly dogs sniffing checked luggage.

There was a produce sniffing dog getting off the ship in Cozumel.

 

...and funny enough - a friend of a friend who came on the same cruise... is a huge pot head. Works in a pot shop. Luggage covered in weed stickers. His luggage was sniffed twice, and he petted the drug sniffing dog.

 

He had a suitcase full of edibles and THC vape pens. Dog did nothing.

.

 

 

YMMV. Were the 3 Carnival dogs wearing Carnival badges? 

 

I still haven't mentioned luggage, but certainly hope it is checked for more than alcohol.

[aborgman]

10 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Individual drugs are researched. Not combinations compounded together.

 

Most drugs made by "compound" pharmacies are individual drugs, not combinations of drugs together.

 

The most commonly made drugs by compound pharmacies?

 

Hydrocortisone.

Amoxicillin

Liothyronine.

Prednisone.

Estrogen.

Progesterone.

Testosterone.

 

 

 

[aborgman]

12 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

YMMV. Were the 3 Carnival dogs wearing Carnival badges?

 

No, their handlers were.

[BlerkOne]

Compound Drugs

Revised: August 23, 2022

 

Overview

A compound drug is not a commercially available final drug that is approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA). A compound drug is the result of a pharmacist combining two or more drugs, or ingredients. Additional information about non-sterile and sterile compound drugs and compounding is available on the US Pharmacopeia website.

[aborgman]

10 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Compound Drugs

Revised: August 23, 2022

 

Overview

A compound drug is not a commercially available final drug that is approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA). A compound drug is the result of a pharmacist combining two or more drugs, or ingredients. Additional information about non-sterile and sterile compound drugs and compounding is available on the US Pharmacopeia website.

 

 

Correct.

 

The great majority of compound drugs are the combination of a drug and an ingredient.

 

Oral amoxicillin instead of pill form - made by compound pharmacy.

Hydrocortison creams above 1% - made by compound pharmacy.

Sublingual semaglutide instead of injected - made by compound pharmacy.

 

By far the most common things made by compound pharmacies aren't combinations of drugs - but different delivery forms (liquid, sublingual), different strengths, or different pill binders due to allergies.

 

 

[BlerkOne]

3 hours ago, aborgman said:

 

No, the reason is that they do not have the power. It wouldn't matter if they could easily determine the safety and efficacy - they legally are not allowed to prevent sale pending approval. For example - compounded drugs would be tested the exact same way as any other pharmeceutical products.. but they aren't.

 

They regularly RECALL supplements - because they can determine safety, but they do not have the legal power to require approval before sale. They can only regulate them after sale.

Drugs, not pharmacies.

[aborgman]

3 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Drugs, not pharmacies.

 

Every drug made by a compounding pharmacy is a compounded drug.

 

If a compounding pharmacy takes 10% hydrocortisone cream, and mixes it 50-50 with petroleum jelly to make 5% hydrocortisone - that is a compounded drug, made by a compounding pharmacy.

 

Take some amoxicillin and mix it into a liquid suspension - that is a compounded drug.

 

Take some lidocaine and mix it with petroleum jelly to get a specific concentration - that is a compounded drug.

 

 

[BlerkOne]

10 minutes ago, aborgman said:

 

Every drug made by a compounding pharmacy is a compounded drug.

 

If a compounding pharmacy takes 10% hydrocortisone cream, and mixes it 50-50 with petroleum jelly to make 5% hydrocortisone - that is a compounded drug, made by a compounding pharmacy.

 

Take some amoxicillin and mix it into a liquid suspension - that is a compounded drug.

 

Take some lidocaine and mix it with petroleum jelly to get a specific concentration - that is a compounded drug.

 

 

Are those tested to the same extent or approved by the FDA?

[aborgman]

8 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Are those tested to the same extent or approved by the FDA?

 

Yes, the hydrocortisone they buy from a commercial manufacturer is approved by the FDA, made in facilities approved and regulated by the FDA.

 

...and all of the original FDA approval of hydrocortisone is applicable to the compound pharmacy. All the testing and data they used to get hydrocortisone approved applies to all hydrocortisone.

[Elaine5715]

6 hours ago, aborgman said:

 

Ummm... you do understand that CBD has no intoxicating effect right?

 

 

It can.  

[BlerkOne]

3 minutes ago, aborgman said:

 

Yes, the hydrocortisone they buy from a commercial manufacturer is approved by the FDA, made in facilities approved and regulated by the FDA.

 

...and all of the original FDA approval of hydrocortisone is applicable to the compound pharmacy. All the testing and data they used to get hydrocortisone approved applies to all hydrocortisone.

The hydrocortizone compounded with anything else is not tested to the same extent or approved.

[aborgman]

4 minutes ago, Elaine5715 said:

It can.  

 

No, CBD cannot.

 

If you have a CBD product contaminated with THC, the THC can be intoxicating - but that is the THC, not CBD.

 

If I pour alcohol into a glass of water, that doesn't make water intoxicating.

[Elaine5715]

5 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

Again, misleading. Not all CBD is derived from hemp and not being regulated, tested or approved by the FDA or other federal agency means you don't really know what is in your product or its source.

Correct and in states like mine, CBD products can be made from marijuana.  Big Weed that is behind the lobbyists to legalize marijuana knew that Delta-8 THC was present in hemp and knew it could be manipulated.  

 

https://www.cannaspecialists.org/intoxicating_hemp_products

"As you recall, hemp is just cannabis that has been bred to produce less that 0.3% THC by dry weight.  However, Congress decided in the Farm Bill of 2018 to treat hemp as its own thing, removing it from the Controlled Substances Act.  The intention, I assume, was to benefit farmers who could grow hemp for industrial use like rope, paper, textile, concrete, and others.  However, a brief paragraph also legalized use of the cannabinoids it produces and any and all derivatives therefrom (page 419 of the 2018 bill).  This was a huge mistake.

Not only did this legalize CBD and many other naturally occurring cannabinoids without adequate safety data or regulation, but it has allowed chemists to start with CBD and produce many other cannabinoids without safety data or regulation.  Immediately we have seen a flood of intoxicating chemicals like delta-8 THC, delta-10 THC, HHC (hexahydrocannabinol), and others.  There are an infinite number of chemicals that can be manufactured so regulating them individually is not feasible."

[aborgman]

5 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

The hydrocortizone compounded with anything else is not tested to the same extent or approved.

 

False.

 

The hydrocortisone if compounded with another drug is not tested to the same extent or approved.

 

...but it usually isn't compounded with another drug. It's usually compounded with a carrier.