Smoking on the Prinsendam

[Krazy Kruizers]

u4ea

 

Since we are going to be on the Prinsendam in 2008, I studied the area around the aft pool on the Upper Promenade Deck and I could not find any bar there. It appears that only the Lido Pool has a bar on that ship.

[sail7seas]

Many cruise lines have even fewer smoking sections. Some do not permit smoking in cabins or on verandas.

 

It seems pretty obvious the cruise lines are following the rest of society.......Please the 80% of the people who do not smoke and the make moderate accomodations for the 20% who do smoke. I think HAL has made reasonable choices.

[peaches from georgia]

The Lido smoking area was a very enjoyable part of cruising on a HAL ship for those that enjoy a cigarette after a meal, when reading/relaxing and ordering a drink (especially those with no cabin balcony), and on and on. A good % of the officers and crew feel the same way, I know. They use this tables when on breaks all day. It is not the same at aft pool.

 

It just seems quite selfish for non-smokers to be complaining about allowing smokers this small area to enjoy during the day. More than 3/4 of the pool area was non-smoking and there is no reason any non-smoker had to sit near the smoking area or even pass by it. Wanting 100% is not compromising so that others can enjoy their cruise, too.

 

There are many HAL cruisers rethinking their cruising plans, especially because of the way this has been implemented. And are we sure all bars and lounges will have a smoking area (other than Dolphin Bar which we know now does not). I didn't read that explicitly in the policy that someone printed here; in fact some posters were praising the fact they could now have a drink in the bars before dinner without there being a smoking area anymore.

[sail7seas]

I see your point, Peaches. We live in a state where there is no smoking permitted in any work place. No bars, no restaurants, no offices....just about everywhere you go is a work place for someone. We are so used to living in a smoke free environment that we never see anyone having a cigarette after a meal or with a drink. I suppose some are still standing outside in the freezing cold or rain but there is no one indoors anywhere except private homes smoking at a dining table.

 

Some hotels are going totally smoke free and won't permit smoking anywhere on their property. Hospitals have started that as well. It's just what is happening in a world where there are fewer and fewer smokers.

 

I have no gripe with anyone who wishes to smoke. It rarely bothers me but I will always vote for more and more limiting of where it is permitted.

[arzz]

That is correct -- only the Lido pool has a bar. There is an outside eating area on the Prinsendam that has a canvas cover to shelter from the sun on the stern, just aft of the Lido restaurant. I cannot remember is smoking is allowed there or not but it is well sheltered and truly a lovely place to sit and eat when the weather is right.

[DrTee]

Does anyone know of a cruise line that disallows smoking 100%? I would definitely go with them if so.

 

Smoke drifts. If I'm in a restaurant or bar that has a smoking section that isn't completely partitioned, I can smell the smoke, it gets in my lungs, and I can have an asthma attack.

[u4ea]

KK and arzz, thanks. I guess the canvas covered area will be one of my new "spots". I heard one of those aft decks is private, but it doesn't look like it with all the accessable stairways.

Mark..

[arzz]

I do not think that anyone enforces the "private" on the aft deck that you refer to. It is true, however, that it is intimate as not many people ever choose to be there at one time.

[earl_m]

It wouldn't blother me if they ban smoking everywhere on the ship..

[gooselace]

The Lido smoking area was a very enjoyable part of cruising on a HAL ship for those that enjoy a cigarette after a meal, when reading/relaxing and ordering a drink (especially those with no cabin balcony), and on and on. A good % of the officers and crew feel the same way, I know. They use this tables when on breaks all day. It is not the same at aft pool.

 

It just seems quite selfish for non-smokers to be complaining about allowing smokers this small area to enjoy during the day. More than 3/4 of the pool area was non-smoking and there is no reason any non-smoker had to sit near the smoking area or even pass by it. Wanting 100% is not compromising so that others can enjoy their cruise, too.

 

There are many HAL cruisers rethinking their cruising plans, especially because of the way this has been implemented. And are we sure all bars and lounges will have a smoking area (other than Dolphin Bar which we know now does not). I didn't read that explicitly in the policy that someone printed here; in fact some posters were praising the fact they could now have a drink in the bars before dinner without there being a smoking area anymore.

 

Apparently TAs weren't informed of this change either. My cruisin' buddy has been on some 30 cruises, all booked through the same TA, who knows she is a smoker. Right after we booked a Caribbean cruise for this Dec. on the Westerdam, I read about these changes. My friend was very upset and called the TA, who knew nothing of the policy change until she called HAL.

 

The Lido smoking area is my buddy's favorite place on any HAL ship. Because she has been to so many of the ports, some several times, my friend often stays on the ship. I never felt guilty about going on an excursion, because she was happy to take a book and her cigs to Lido. She always met people - it seemed that the smokers were more friendly and willing to share those few tables. She can't take too much direct sun, so the aft area really isn't an option. Sure, she can still smoke in our cabin and on the veranda, but she could stay home and do that, minus the ocean, of course.

 

She would really like to cancel, but can't afford to lose the deposit and, obviously, can't apply it to another HAL cruise. She doesn't smoke heavily but at nearly 80 the vaunted health benefits of quitting don't impress her.

 

I smoke more, but it doesn't matter as much to me. Last year I went on a trip with a different friend who can't tolerate smoking at all, so I didn't smoke for those two weeks, even when she wasn't around.

 

Have to admit I was anticipating this cruise with an occasional drink and smoke on Lido. :(

[HeatherInFlorida]

I do not think that anyone enforces the "private" on the aft deck that you refer to. It is true, however, that it is intimate as not many people ever choose to be there at one time.

 

This deck (a well kept secret) has not been private for some times. We were in Cabin #197 which looks out on that deck. It's a wonderful retreat. In December people smoked on that deck, but with the new rules I don't know if it's still allowed.

 

I've read all recent posts about the new smoking policy and I have to admit I'm confused. I don't smoke, but DH smokes a pipe sometimes. He used to be able to smoke his pipe on open decks (though he wouldn't on the Lido with the dome).

 

If this is no longer allowed of course he won't do it, but I'm unclear about it. Does anyone knowfor sure what the policy is?

[Jemima]

The wording in the Veendam 4/1 "Welcome Aboard" Daily Program was:

"Smoking is permitted only in designated areas of lounges as well as on outside decks. Smoking is NOT permited in dining areas, under the macrodome on Lida Deck, corridors, common areas or in the Rubens Lounge. Cigar and pipe smoking permitted on outside decks ONLY."

(Capitalized NOT & ONLY are their emphasis, not mine.)

[kakalina]

Smoking in the Lido was a very great part of our cruise. As we are up and about around 5am it was the only place we could go and have our morning coffee and tea. The aft pool area is being hosed down at that time and one can not go out there until the sun comes up and drys it out.

 

I guess we will have to "liberate" a few coffee carafes from room service, fill them up and take them to the crows nest.

 

We will miss sitting with new friends every morning and watching the ship come alive.

[IheartHAL]

That is correct -- only the Lido pool has a bar. There is an outside eating area on the Prinsendam that has a canvas cover to shelter from the sun on the stern, just aft of the Lido restaurant. I cannot remember is smoking is allowed there or not but it is well sheltered and truly a lovely place to sit and eat when the weather is right.

 

On the Lido Terrace, a few of the most forward tables, both port and starboard, are available for use by smokers. These tables are also the most sheltered from the wind, so they are somtimes occupied by non-smokers.

[gooselace]

On the Lido Terrace, a few of the most forward tables, both port and starboard, are available for use by smokers. These tables are also the most sheltered from the wind, so they are somtimes occupied by non-smokers.

 

It's my understanding that this desirable area is one of those being designated as "non-smoking" much to the dismay of many who enjoy a cigarette and coffee or a drink on Lido.

[Hondu]

[quote name='sail7seas'][B]I see your point, Peaches. We live in a state where there is no smoking permitted in any work place. No bars, no restaurants, no offices....just about everywhere you go is a work place for someone. We are so used to living in a smoke free environment that we never see anyone having a cigarette after a meal or with a drink. I suppose some are still standing outside in the freezing cold or rain but there is no one indoors anywhere except private homes smoking at a dining table.

Some hotels are going totally smoke free and won't permit smoking anywhere on their property. Hospitals have started that as well. It's just what is happening in a world where there are fewer and fewer smokers.

I have no gripe with anyone who wishes to smoke. It rarely bothers me but I will always vote for more and more limiting of where it is permitted.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Just yesterday, Disney made a smoking announcement for its properties. I bet the Wonder and Magic will be next as customers demand smoke free environments. Even on the balconies, yeah!
################
"In what company officials are calling the largest single-site resort complex to institute such smoking restrictions, Walt Disney World announced today it will ban smoking in all guest rooms, indoor public areas, balconies and other locations at all company-owned and -operated hotels, and all Disney Vacation Club resorts at Disney World. That is 20 properties altogether.

Smoking will be allowed in designated, outdoor smoking areas only.

"We make adjustments to our operations based on guest demand," Senior Vice President Erin Wallace said. "This policy complements our efforts to provide our guests with the healthy living options they are requesting."
[url]http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/custom/tourism/orl-biznews-disney050107,0,1051211.story?coll=orl-home-headlines[/url]

[HeatherInFlorida]

[quote name='kakalina']................
I guess we will have to "liberate" a few coffee carafes from room service, fill them up and take them to the crows nest.

We will miss sitting with new friends every morning and watching the ship come alive.[/quote]

:confused: Confused, Kakalina. Do they allow smoking (cigarettes) in the Crows Nest?

Also I hate to be so stupid, but I'm still confused about "outside decks" in terms of pipe smoking. Does this mean he can smoke on outside decks [B][I]except[/I][/B] for the Lido deck? I realize that under the macrodome was always off limits for pipes.

Jemima's quote from the Daily Program would make it appear that other outside decks are okay for pipes and cigars. Any input is much appreciated!

[Odd Ball]

[quote name='sail7seas'][B]What is the drastic change they made that is so upsetting to these couples? So far as I know, the only change is they eliminated smoking at abou 4 tables at aft pool outside Lido. Some Casinos have smoking/non-smoking experiments on-going but what other changes are there that are so troublesome to your friends that they cancelled?[/B]

[B]Over 4 or 5 tables outside Lido? I have to be missing something. :confused:[/B]

[/quote]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3][/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3]I believe it was a number of things that made them cancel. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3][/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3]Hal has not announced or published the fact that the smoking policy has changed in some areas. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3][/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3]I have cruised with these people and they met early every morning to have coffee in the smoking section of the lido pool area. They also spent time there in the afternoons playing cards. The handful of tables being eliminated is a big deal to them. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3][/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3]One ship has no smoking in the casino or Sports Bar. A couple of them are big gamblers. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3][/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3]From what I gathered they don't like surprises and feel Hal is not handling this properly. They would be very uncomfortable taking the cruise worrying what the policy would be when they boarded. The manner in which this is being handled did not give them a warm fuzzy feeling. They don't trust Hal. They felt it was better to cancel while they could still get all their money back. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3][/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3]They feel changes should be announced with a future date when the change would go into effect. It is clear as a bell, this is not happening. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=3][/SIZE][/FONT]

[sail7seas]

[B]Too bad they are unhappy about this. I suppose it is inevitable there will be a handful who will find it necessary to cancel. Hope they find something that can meet their needs.

[/B]

[hammybee]

[quote name='gooselace'] Right after we booked a Caribbean cruise for this Dec. on the Westerdam, I read about these changes.

She would really like to cancel, but can't afford to lose the deposit and, obviously, can't apply it to another HAL cruise. She doesn't smoke heavily but at nearly 80 the vaunted health benefits of quitting don't impress her.

:([/QUOTE]

Your friend is 7 months away from her cruise. She could easily get her deposit back up to the point of final payment. Or is trip insurance the issue?

[kryos]

[quote name='arzz']I am not a smoker -- but I believe that I do recall there was smoking allowed in the Crow's Nest -- possibly on one side-- during January and February.[/QUOTE]
It is also allowed in one section of the Ocean Bar. But that's about it. The casino during our Veendam cruise of 4/1 was non-smoking for five of the total number of sea days, though I would imagine the purpose of these alternating days is to "test the waters." If HAL sees that casino revenue is about the same, or even higher on the non-smoking nights, my guess is that the casinos will probably become entirely smoke-free at some point. The only other place you can smoke now on HAL ships is on one side of the aft deck ... an area that is entirely open to the elements.

Sadly, things are changing for us smokers, and my prediction is that at some point the cabins will go non-smoking too. If that's the case, then I guess I'll have a decision to make ... and it will probably be to cruise another line that is more smoker-friendly. Cunard comes to mind.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[gooselace]

Not sure what her issue is with the money - but I suspect it's more that she doesn't want to make me change plans also. And it's not likely she can find another ship with a liberal smoking policy. She remembers fondly when one whole side of Lido allowed smoking and there some smoking tables on the upper level of HAL's dining room.

Older seniors often have to give up so much, and it just seems that this is one last pleasure that is being taken away. It's also harder for he to walk to the far corners of the ship to find a smoking lounge.

I'm just glad we can still afford a vernanda cabin and hope that we'll be able to smoke on it without offending anyone.

[kryos]

[quote name='hammybee']Your friend is 7 months away from her cruise. She could easily get her deposit back up to the point of final payment. Or is trip insurance the issue?[/QUOTE]
Also, if HAL implemented truly restrictive smoking policies ... like no smoking in cabins or on balconies ... they would have no choice but to make an exception to their cancellation policies for people who wanted to cancel due to not being allowed to smoke on the ship. But, the way the smoking policies have thus far been changed, they really aren't so restrictive as to warrant someone cancelling their cruise. After all, there are still plenty of places where smoking is still allowed, most importantly in one's own cabin and on their balcony.

I'm sure HAL will give plenty of notice if they are going to further tighten these policies. They would have to.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[kryos]

[quote name='sail7seas'][B]What is the drastic change they made that is so upsetting to these couples? So far as I know, the only change is they eliminated smoking at abou 4 tables at aft pool outside Lido. Some Casinos have smoking/non-smoking experiments on-going but what other changes are there that are so troublesome to your friends that they cancelled?

Over 4 or 5 tables outside Lido? I have to be missing something. :confused:

[/B][/QUOTE]
What you are missing is that those few tables outside the Lido were very important to us. They were a place one could enjoy a cigarette with lunch or breakfast or even just with a cup of coffee. The area was protected from the elements by the magronome (sp?). Since this area has been totally taken away from us, we have been relegated to the aft deck ... where there is absolutely no protection from the elements other than perhaps a large umbrella. If it is cold, windy, rainy or even overly hot, that's the only place we have now.

In the past, those few tables outside the Lido under the magronome served as a general meeting place for smokers. We always knew we could find each other in that area and it became a social place as well as a haven for smokers.

As for the other HAL restrictions, I honestly have no problem with them. Making the casino smoking/non-smoking on alternating nights seems fair ... and I am sure any decisions regarding a change in the current policy for that area will be driven solely by revenue numbers. If HAL sees that revenues are far higher on the non-smoking nights, then I would not be surprised to see the casinos on HAL ships go entirely smoke-free. If revenue numbers go way down on non-smoking nights, I also wouldn't be surprised to see HAL lift the smoking restrictions in the casino entirely.

As their policies regarding smoking stand now, I can live with them. It's what HAL will do in the future that worries me ... and could determine whether I will ever be onboard another HAL ship in the coming years.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[gooselace]

[COLOR=blue]What you are missing is that those few tables outside the Lido were very important to us. They were a place one could enjoy a cigarette with lunch or breakfast or even just with a cup of coffee. The area was protected from the elements by the magronome (sp?). Since this area has been totally taken away from us, we have been relegated to the aft deck ... where there is absolutely no protection from the elements other than perhaps a large umbrella. If it is cold, windy, rainy or even overly hot, that's the only place we have now.

[/COLOR][COLOR=blue]In the past, those few tables outside the Lido under the magronome served as a general meeting place for smokers. We always knew we could find each other in that area and it became a social place as well as a haven for smokers.[/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue][/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue][COLOR=black]Rita, that's exactly what my friend is objecting to, as she often spends port days on the ship, especially in the Caribbean, where she has been to all the ports, and can't tolerate too much driect sun, which is likely to be the case in the uncovered aft area.[/COLOR][/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue][COLOR=#000000]This policy essentially changes the cruise experience of socializing and enjoying the Lido ambience, and I can understand why she is upset. If we are basically limited to smoking in our cabin we could stay home and watch videos of the islands. I can set out a buffet luncheon and some margaritas, and my DH can spray us with the hose when we go out on our deck. For the $4,000 plus we'll probably spend on HAL, he might even set up a wading pool and serve those drinks. [/COLOR]

[/COLOR]