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When Is Hal Going To...

usha

By usha,
in Holland America Line

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cherrypop

cherrypop

Posted
Posted

Here in B.C. it is against the law to smoke in any public place and you cannot smoke in an outdoor patio anymore either. No smoking in restaurants, pubs, casino's any public places and you cant smoke outside of any door of an establishment within 30 feet of the door. I would hope that the majority of people in this world dont smoke anymore. Why should I have to inhale or smell anyone else's smoke. Last I knew second hand smoke does kill. I say do whatever you want to yourself just dont include me, I have chosen to live a healthy life.

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heavenly

heavenly

Posted
Posted
What is the issue with "Crocs"?? I have not seen that one. Care to elaborate? Perhaps we could expand the thread to an anti-smoking/anti-crocs thread! :eek:

 

Rut Roh, I know someone who does cruise on HAL at least twice a year that smokes, drinks and wears FAKE crocs!!!!!

 

Seriously though, I have a hard time understanding the posts that go on and on about free speech but then go on right away about someone elses comment and how it shouldn't be allowed in the discussion.... :confused:

 

Count me in as one of those who suffer much more from heavy perfume vapors (they honestly give me a migrane) than anything else, can we ban that also????:rolleyes:

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nckvilledudes

nckvilledudes

Posted
Posted
God. Is this still going. Let's face it. A certain group of people believe they are the majority and the world goes their way or else...........I am a non-smoker and bit my tongue far too long. I live with a smoker and I tolerate it. We all know the health issues. We all know that some are more sensitive than others. But the militancy of do-gooders is what offends me more than the message they try to convey. The world revolves around no one..... I think most smokers are considerate of others and vice-versa. HAL will eventually make its own rules as to smoking and most of us will obey but until then I don't think what anyone do on their balconies is anyone else's business if its within the rules.

 

I am also concerned that someone here wrote that this was the 4th message posted by the same person in 4 months. What is this accomplishing? We seem to be chasing our tails and I silly enough to be participating. Hope that this thread gets removed.

 

We do seem to constantly beat dead horses on Cruise Critic.

 

David

A non-smoker finding himself defending smokers and most "minorities"?

David,

Nice post. We agree with all you said. One smokes here and the other doesnt. I was wondering the same thing about all the posts the OP has made on the subject. The horse has many lives.

 

Dan and Miguel

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Oceans&Rivers

Oceans&Rivers

Posted
Posted
Non-smokers are a majority and that is why the smoking is confined to such small spaces on board.

 

Let me rephrase that so that your statement is accurate: Non-smokers are a majority and that is why smoking should be confined to such small spaces on board.

 

Unfortunately, with HAL that is not the case. There are no non-smoking cabins and no balconies on which it is forbidden to smoke. Therefore, non-smokers are forced to endure the smoke of those who smoke on nearby balconies.

 

Do you think that is fair to non-smokers?

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Felizcruiser08

Felizcruiser08

Posted
Posted

I see your concern, but why are you worried about something that has not happened yet? You may be next to non smokers, so all of this worrying is for naught.

 

The odor of Strong perfume as mentioned earlier - sets off a blinding migraine for me, but I do not feel compelled to ban wearing perfume. It is their personal choice, I simply step away from the person doused in perfume.

I would rather the smoking be on the balcony, with the air moving it out to sea, than in the actual room. I truly believe - if you do end up next to a smoker, they would be as respectful as possible and refrain if you are on your verandah.

 

I do wish you a pleasant cruise. C.

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ON cruiser

ON cruiser

Posted
Posted

Compromise is part of life. I am a non-smoker as is my wife. But, we try to allow others to enjoy their space, for which they paid, as we did. But, let me state that for the smaller balcony verandhas, if you have a smoker next to you and the smoke is blowing your way, it does not vanish but rather wafts right to you--impeding your use of the balcony if you are a non-smoker.

 

We have never asked the folks next door when this has occurred-at least three cruises--to stop smoking or to refrain from using their balcony. Rather, we have just put up with it. Would we prefer that the rules change to allow us not to worry about this? Yes.

 

But, can the rules change so to let those who smoke do so, and let us use the balcony? To that end I like the other poster's suggestion that smokers smoke in their cabin and not on the balcony. While smoke may waft a bit in the hallway outside a smokers' cabin, depending on how much those folks smoke, I have never had it in my room, even when next to a heavy smoker. I have had the smoke-eater machine for the first few days of a cruise, and have had the carpets and drapes cleaned--all of which got rid of the smoke from the prior guest. But, we could enjoy the outdoor space which, for us, is important.

 

If HAL did change the rules that way, that may be a reasonable compromise, at least from my perspective. Smokers can smoke in their own space, which should not bother anyone else. Non-smokers can enjoy the outdoor space. As those who may have read some of my other posts, I am a strong proponent of doing whatever is legal behind your own closed cabin doors. Smoking, while banned in most public spaces in most Canadian provinces, is still a legal product for adults to purchase and use.

 

What do the smokers think of this compromise? Is this viable? If so, then to achieve change, all who have an interest should email HAL customer service with their own respective viewpoints. Otherwise, and in any case, change may be imposed on all of us and some may like it more than others.

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richwmn "Live from...." Rare

richwmn

Posted
Posted

I usually read these threads and don't comment. For the record I have never smoked but have worked several jobs where I sold cigarettes, cigars and pipe supplies for several years.

 

Several things keep popping up in these threads that I would like to comment on.

 

1. To those non smokers (or anti-smokers) who use the excuse that they paid "big bucks" and should be able to enjoy their balcony (casino, bar etc). You seem to forget that the smoker paid similar "big bucks" to enjoy the ship. In addition, the smoker paid his bucks knowing that the ships policy specified where s/he could smoke and chose to sail with those restrictions.

 

2. To those who spout statistics and studies, I refer you to wikipedia --

“Lies, damned lies, and statistics” is part of a phrase attributed to Benjamin Disraeli and popularized in the United States by Mark Twain: “There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.” The semi-ironic statement refers to the persuasive power of numbers, and succinctly describes how even accurate statistics can be used to bolster inaccurate arguments.

Many studies have their outcome predetermined by the funding source or the mindset of the person or group doing the study.

 

3. To those who say that because non-smokers are the majority no one should smoke, your attitude could be extended to any facet of life. Although by quoted studies only 20% of the population currently smokes, the largest majority really just does not give a sh*t one way or the other. They are content to let smokers smoke, socialize with them under circumstances that both can enjoy, and stay away from situations that bother them.

 

As the saying goes, why can't we all live and let live?

 

Just my $.02, now back to our sponsor.

 

Rich

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usha

usha

Posted
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Posted
I agree with you, Usha. It is most unfortunate that this topic, which is really a very important one to be discussed, is attacked by what appears to be a gang of immature people who fear that even the discussion of this issue is going to harm them in some way. All they need to do is pass on by and go to another topic, and if they cannot, then each of their inane cartoons, etc. ought to be eradicated by Cruise Critic hosts and let everyone discuss the issue pro and con. I want to hear thoughtful comments by smokers as well as non-smokers.

 

The disruptive antics of the rabid smoking gang here really smacks of censorship, and the attempt to drive away discussion does not help their cause in the long run, though in the short run they often get threads closed down. More people read these smoking threads than post to them, some out of fear they will be flamed. I know that the numbers are with non-smokers and we will prevail. Unfortunately, for some cruiselines, their lack of providing smoke-free environments in a timely manner will drive non-smokers to other lines. And there are so many more of us.

 

Brave people will start new threads and others will support them. I hope that my small support of what you have posted helps in some way to assuage the discomfort others are targeting in your direction and in the direction of others who post wanting similar changes to smoking policies.

Thanks, Oceans&Rivers.

Most non-smokers are not going to say anything.

They're used to not saying anything.

They have pretty much been conditioned to suffer in silence.

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norcal2

norcal2

Posted
Posted

Since everyone is an adult and able to communicate seems to me that the best remedy for "what is" would be for smokers and non-smokers to work out a solution where out of respect each is aware of the others needs. In the case of a balcony I think ideally each can let the other know with any sound or pre-planned sign that they are on their balcony. I think most smokers are pretty conscientious so would likely be grateful to have that understanding. I wouldn't hesitate to work out something with a neighbor. I suspect you'd know in 30 seconds whether someone is open to negotiations or not. Just a thought.

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mikjr

mikjr

Posted
Posted
Not true or at least not true on my last three cruises. I have overheard a number of people complain about the smoke on each of these cruises. I have also observed people seated in non-smoking areas and moving because of the quantity of smoke coming from the smoking area. On at least a couple of occasions, smokers sat in the smoking area and blew smoke rings into the non-smoking portions of the Crows Nest. Both times the Crows Nest was crowded or fairly crowded.

 

You have hit the problem... there are those that are just plain inconsiderate!

 

I too have been on cruises where people are smoking in "non smoking" areas... and since the cruise staff does not enforce the rules, the non smoker is left to fend for themselves. that's when the resentment sets in leaving the non smoker no other avenue than to voice their displeasure... and that's what the OP has done...

 

I am highly allergic to cigarette smoke... and can understand the OPs issue... unfortunately, I am the one that usually winds up moving to another area...

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