NCL For Sale - How would you feel if Carnival bought Star/NCL?

[e.durban]

Selling the four paintings from the Dawn's Le Bistro restaurant (on lone from Mr. Lim's private collection) would almost by itself pay for a newbuild! ;) One can only imagine what hangs on his walls at home...

[shoreguy]

frankly I believe that MSC Cruises is the best bet has the buyer. The Parent company has the second largest container fleet in the world. they have a lot of money to spend even with all the newbuilds that they are building. which could be has many has six in the next couple of years. Both carnival and RCI do not make sense because ncl competes with them directly for passengers. if RCI or carnival did by Star/NCL out most likely NCL would probably be disolved and the ships placed elsewhere in the fleets. However Star would probably continue to exist because neither carnival or RCL have a major presence in Asia. MSC on the otherhand advertises it self as an italian line and would probably want to expand into those areas

 

I look at the situation differently. The reason I even added Carnivor as a potential "partner" is the fact they are not in Asia. At some time you can not continue to grow by purchasing your competetors and competing with yourself. They must find new markets.

 

This would add some interesting Homeport options, Hi, and entry to the Asian market.

 

It is just speculation and interesting to get everyones views.

[kkorman]

Princess and P&O have a significant presence in Asia and Austrailia. HAL is in the process of adding many Asian itineraries. Granted, they are not marketed to get the Asian population onboard like Star is, they still have much more of a presence thatn RCI.

 

I agree with MSC as a potential suitor, but think that NCL is still the best fit with RCI. At this point, it seems NCL and Carnival are more competitiors than either with RCI... at least from my perspective as it seems RCI jumped up a level when NCL jumped down a level.

[newmexicoNita]

Are you inviting a guessing game? Five letters, ending in T? :D

 

 

Too funny: I guess I don't mention the company as I am always suggesting cruisers use this brand before and after their trip and I am already known as being a big, nutty, NCL loyalist: just think how loyal I am to my old company? Let's say, it's a chain 6 letters long, ending in N and beginning with H. LOL

 

NIta

[Michael Ho Ho]

There may be another possibility here.

 

Some very strange things have occurred at NCLs Corporate Offices lately.

The SVP of Marine Operations departed suddenly and wasnt replaced.

The SVP of Hotel Operations departed suddenly and wasnt replaced.

Then they hired a fellow from American President Lines to replace both positions.

APL is a freight shipping line. This fellow has no cruise line experience and no hotel experience. In fact, he doesnt even have a college degree. All very peculiar.

Next we hear that the Mandatory Service Charges that were in place at NCL America will be used in the entire NCL Fleet as of May 2005. That puts the international crew on salary. Industry insiders know that this will not work with international crew.

I also notice at ncl.com that NCL is hiring American staff for ALL the NCL Fleet - not just NCL America. That is very strange.

 

Could there be a new connection coming between APL and NCL? Is NCL planning to have a total American Fleet? I certainly hope not. That would be the end of NCL.

[newmexicoNita]

There may be another possibility here.

 

Some very strange things have occurred at NCLs Corporate Offices lately.

The SVP of Marine Operations departed suddenly and wasnt replaced.

The SVP of Hotel Operations departed suddenly and wasnt replaced.

Then they hired a fellow from American President Lines to replace both positions.

APL is a freight shipping line. This fellow has no cruise line experience and no hotel experience. In fact, he doesnt even have a college degree. All very peculiar.

Next we hear that the Mandatory Service Charges that were in place at NCL America will be used in the entire NCL Fleet as of May 2005. That puts the international crew on salary. Industry insiders know that this will not work with international crew.

I also notice at ncl.com that NCL is hiring American staff for ALL the NCL Fleet - not just NCL America. That is very strange.

 

Could there be a new connection coming between APL and NCL? Is NCL planning to have a total American Fleet? I certainly hope not. That would be the end of NCL.

 

Michael, good points, but I don't think this is the situation at all and just because they hire someone in a top level job without a college degree doesn't really mean much. Some are able to move up in the corporate ladder missing the degree. NMNita

[craven3]

Nita,

 

A hotel chain with a six-lettered name beginning with H and ending in N, which was begun by a man from Socorro, with his first real hotel in El Paso?

 

Charlotte

[Michael Ho Ho]

Nita,

 

The college degree is not the issue.

Why would you hire someone who had never worked on a cruise ship, or in a hotel or restaurant to oversee all the hotel and restaurant operations on your entire fleet of cruise ships?

After seeing all the problems encountered with American Crew on POA, why would you then choose to hire thousands more for the entire NCL fleet?

After seeing all the problems encountered with the mandatory tipping / salaried crew on POA, why would you then expand the program to all the NCL Ships?

 

These details just do not make sense - unless there is much more to the story.

It will be loads of fun trying to unravel the mystery.

[kkorman]

Do you think the hired American crew is just training for the Pride of America and Pride of Hawaii? I know this is how it was done before POA debuted.

[newmexicoNita]

Nita,

 

The college degree is not the issue.

Why would you hire someone who had never worked on a cruise ship, or in a hotel or restaurant to oversee all the hotel and restaurant operations on your entire fleet of cruise ships?

After seeing all the problems encountered with American Crew on POA, why would you then choose to hire thousands more for the entire NCL fleet?

After seeing all the problems encountered with the mandatory tipping / salaried crew on POA, why would you then expand the program to all the NCL Ships?

 

These details just do not make sense - unless there is much more to the story.

It will be loads of fun trying to unravel the mystery.

 

Michael, the lack of experience would be an issue. Glad the lack of education isn't the point. Coming from a familyfrom a fairly well educated family(even if I can't spell) I do recognize the importance of college, I just sometimes think we all put too much emphasis on it.

[newmexicoNita]

Nita,

 

A hotel chain with a six-lettered name beginning with H and ending in N, which was begun by a man from Socorro, with his first real hotel in El Paso?

 

Charlotte

 

What was your first clue? The H, the N, the Socorro? LOL Actually the Socorro part was interesting, but when I worked for Hilton we did not live in Belen (just 45 miles north) nor did we have plans to live here.

[Globaliser]

Actually, I have to admit having been completely thrown by the "always family-owned" part of your description. IIRC, there was a territorial division at one stage between the US-based Hilton company and that which was corporately owned in the UK (by Ladbroke?). Didn't they split the world between them? IIRC that was a driver behind building the Conrad brand, because it allowed the US company to put hotels in places where they were not permitted to locate Hilton-branded hotels. I've lost sight of what happened after that, but maybe the US part has bought back the "rest of the world" part.

[newmexicoNita]

Actually, I have to admit having been completely thrown by the "always family-owned" part of your description. IIRC, there was a territorial division at one stage between the US-based Hilton company and that which was corporately owned in the UK (by Ladbroke?). Didn't they split the world between them? IIRC that was a driver behind building the Conrad brand, because it allowed the US company to put hotels in places where they were not permitted to locate Hilton-branded hotels. I've lost sight of what happened after that, but maybe the US part has bought back the "rest of the world" part.

 

I was referring to the Hilton corp hotels: you are 100% correct about Ladbrook and Conrad. By the way, if you haven't tried a Conrad hotel I suggest you do: they are wonderful. We have stayed at 3 of them, the one in HOng Kong is exceptional or was when we stayed there. When I retired about 5 years ago the US part was still separate from the Ladbrook. There was a time when Ladbrook wanted to buy Hilton Corp and visa versa. Of course the gaming part is totally separate now. That's as much as I know about Hilton unless we are talking about Paris Hilton? She's a different subject altogether. LOL

 

NMNita

[seaventurer]

Carnival may have a hard time acquiring NCL based on trade laws like the competition and industry regulations they encountered with Princess. RCI in my mind would be a great marriage...MSC has too much on their plate as it is (with 2 newbuilds and their introduction into the US market) -

[Globaliser]

That's as much as I know about Hilton unless we are talking about Paris Hilton? She's a different subject altogether. LOL

Thanks, Nita!

 

As for discussing Paris Hilton: That needs a picture essay. :D

[e.durban]

Someone at an online ship society reacted to these stories by pointing out that NCL and Star are incorporated separately, so a takeover or partnership for one need not legally include the other. I suppose this means that Star could be looking only for a partner in its Asian operations, where it has REALLY downgraded its fleet -one after another Star's big new ships have gone to NCL, as have all her newbuildings. I have read that Star was very disappointed in the Asian cruise market, and only too happy to send her best tonnage to shore up NCL and NCL America. At one point, Star planned to have a megaliner in just about every major Asian port, but now what ships they have there are mostly their 2nd rank ones, and, if the reports are true, Star has no plans to send anything better to Asia than NCL misfits like the Sea. If this true, than Star's activities wouldn't necessarily mean 'our' NCL was for sale...

[newmexicoNita]

It will be interesting to see if anything comes of any of this and if so, what? I too, had wondered if a merger or sale would affect both companies. As for Paris Hilton: yes, that would do better as a photo discussion. LOL

[Cruiser Forever]

 

I don't like that idea. Thumbs down for me. No offense to people who like Carnival, but I feel like Canival doesn't measure up to cruise lines like NCL or RCCL or Princess. I'd be disappointed if Carnival took over. :(

[e.durban]

I'm not worried that Carnival will take over NCL. but for the sake of argument, imagine Norwegian Dawn or Jewel with the interiors redone by Farkas! Yowee! Run! Run!

[craven3]

Nita, Many years ago, while in college just a hundred or so miles south of Socorro, I dated his nephew a few times. The nephew was nothing like Paris Hilton; might have been more interesting.

 

Charlotte

[Atlanta]

Have you seen a Carnival ship lately? They look worn out. We were docked next to one for our ports of call in the Western Caribbean (the no-smoking Carnival ship). It was dirty. They have open bottles of ketchup, etc. on the tables, no concern for cleanliness (and Carnival keeps having problems with people getting sick, and their ships not passing inspections!). I hope they never buy NCL....... They just seem like a lower class of cruise lines/ships.

 

Pat

[yazoosail]

Hi All-- Just my two cents worth. Carnival has basically stayed out of the way of it's subsidiary companies; this allows the various brands to maintain identity and focus. RCI has completely consumed celebrity, thus depriving these ships of identity. Rci also does not give a tinker's damn if an individual has a problem, regardless of whether it's a !st timer or one of the "valued past pax". There are several other suitors, such as MSC and surprisingly, several Baltic shipping giants not currently in the cruise industry, including the Kloster family. -- Dennis

[SeaBorne]

From what I gather, to own a piece of NCL, one must own Star Cruises stock. There are close to 5 1/2 billion shares outstanding (available on US OTC), which is an outrageous amount. (Carnival has 845 million, by comparison.) The current price is about $0.26/sh. (Carnival, $54.62.) The company appears to be 87% (or so) controlled by one person, via several entities. Are there any prospects for this stock?

 

We went on our first cruise ever, on the Dawn (10/10/04-10/17/04). We thought it was great, and we loved the freestyle concept.The food was improvable, but the staff was very courteous, and the ship was nice. The only real stress point involved debarkation in NY. Total chaos on the pier. No one knew where to go for taxis, among other confusion. (Taxis were available for hailing on the other side of the West Side Highway.)

 

Because we like to invest in companies from which we make (and plan) repeat purchases and like, we figured it was worth looking into NCL (ie. Star). We are, however, at a loss in finding useful investment information (excluding the Star Cruises web site). Any suggestion?

[JuniorCruiser]

Oh please don't make me sick. Norwegian has class :D Enough Said ;)

 

 

Urns..... Who the heck wants to look at all those urns anyway :(

[smeyer418]

In reading all the above, I think you miss a couple of points. First of all personally I don't think any anti-trust issue would be raised by any purchase of NCL. Given the approval of the Princess acquisition, I don't think you will see this Justice Department opposing this on antitrust grounds. Secondly there is a major reason why someone who owns other cruise lines would want to buy---and pay a premium in fact---for NCL. That is NCL America. No one esle has the right to complete ships over seas and have them American flagged. While the owner of Star is wealthy, it has had to put large amounts of money into NCL and commit to much more. I do think they see the light at the end of that tunnel but money talks and it is a distraction from other businesses. That being said, it doesn't necesarily mean a change from the current NCL strtategy. It depends whether they change the management after the purchase and how the purchase is done...The difference between a merger and a change of ownership is somewhat meaningless. It depends more on what happens to management afterwards. A merged company can still have seperate management and be is a seperate division, whether its seperate corporate legal identity exists is more of a management style issue than a legal one. I wouldn't be that surprised if each ship was owned by a seperate corporation owned by the holding company anyway.