A cautionary credit card story

[rool]

Hi everyone on CC, I have a little situation between my credit card company and RCI and wondered if anyone had experienced it before.

 

Are you sitting comfortably :)

 

Last Sunday I settled my bill online for our upcoming 30/3 Eastern Med cruise.

 

All went smoothly with no apparent glitches and my account with RCI was reduced to Zero.

 

I just happened to check my credit card account online Tuesday only to spot that I had uncleared transactions that equated to approximately double my settlement. This was doubly annoying because I was going away the next day and my credit limit was wiped out by the pending transactions.

 

Last Tuesday on discovery of the duplication:-

Call 1 - My first port of call was to the credit card company who confirmed that RCI had indeed requested payment twice and that I would have to call them to cancel the second request.

 

Call 2 - To RCI where I was put through to finance and had to leave a message on voicemail. To their credit my call was returned within 10 minutes and was told that this is a regular banking glitch and that I will have to ask the credit card company to cancel the payment.

 

Call 3 - To the credit card company,which was unfortunately after 5pm so disputes had gone home, where I was told that RCI had put in the first request on the Sunday and then again on the tuesday. So rather than a glitch was a genuine second request. The credit card company therefore have no authority to delete the transaction.

 

I now have to go away next day with virtually zero credit on my card account because of this.

 

Call 4 - Call back to RCI, voicemail again and message left.

 

Next day.

 

RCI call me whilst I am waiting at the airport, very sorry nothing we can do about it but I should ring back the credit card company to see if there is an authorisation number attached to the second transaction, if not I can demand the item is deleted.

 

I was then away and unable to do anything until yesterday (Friday).

Call 4 - Credit card company to enquire whether there was an authorisation code with the transaction. Yes there was, which is why they cannot delete it, I have to go back to RCI and get them to delete it.

 

Call 5 - To RCI to explain the above, 'Oh that is strange we will definitely look into it and get back to you within two weeks'. I am also told that if it the transaction doesn't complete it will just drop of the system in a week to 10 days (Oh that's ok then) but other than that there is nothing we can do.

 

As a final comment I said that this was the first time this has ever happened to me and, as it happens, my first experience with RCI and would quite probably be my last.

 

'Very sorry sir there is nothing we can do was the last' comment.

 

So does anyone have any experience in this situation?

 

Many thanks

[robbinsca]

As a banker I occasionally hear similar stories. With the time frames you are talking about there may be an (unfortunate) explanation.

 

When a credit card transaction is posted there are two steps to the process. One is the authorization, the second is the actual posting of the charge to the account.

 

Before you have to start paying interest the 2nd charge may fall off. If the 2nd one doesn't fall off you can simply "dispute" the 2nd charge and the bank will do the background work for you. You let them know you did not authorize both charges and they will, after some investigation, credit your account back. That is the rule about credit cards.

 

To let you know you are not alone. I got a call from my bank that my Internet VISA card account is being used by someone else. They caught it after just a couple of quick charges and I won't lose anything as they can charge it back. I always hold on to one credit card account that is used ONLY for Internet activity.

[As the ship sails]

RCI is wrong.....there is something that they can do. I would arrange a conference call between the correct dept at RCI and your CC company. If RCI balks at this then TELL them that only THEY can remove a pending charge with your CC company. Once your CC company talks to RCI then they will remove the pending charge. You have to do this via conference call though as you will need to confirm some details with your CC company and then they will need ID info from the RCI rep to delete the pending charge.

 

robbinsca- You cannot dispute a pending charge.....only an actual charge.

[Desert Cruizers]

We have never experience what you have gone thru, however, our Bank did call us one morning due to a transaction attemting to be made and wanted to verify if we knew about the said person & amount. It was ok, but they immediately noticed it wasn't one of our regular transactions or business we deal with.

[rool]

Thanks for the replies.

 

Luckily my account is paid by dd every month so interest isn't an issue as I had just waited for the statement date to pass before making the payment to RCI.

 

I therefore have almost two months to get this situation sorted. However there was a lot of stress and inconvenience as I had no credit card facility whilst travelling this week.

 

I am used to credit card companies letting me down but my biggest disappointment is, especially in my first cruise and experience with RCI, in RCI being totally unwilling to take any responsibility or give any assistance whatsoever.

[ivycruise]

As a banker I occasionally hear similar stories. With the time frames you are talking about there may be an (unfortunate) explanation.

 

When a credit card transaction is posted there are two steps to the process. One is the authorization, the second is the actual posting of the charge to the account.

 

Before you have to start paying interest the 2nd charge may fall off. If the 2nd one doesn't fall off you can simply "dispute" the 2nd charge and the bank will do the background work for you. You let them know you did not authorize both charges and they will, after some investigation, credit your account back. That is the rule about credit cards.

 

To let you know you are not alone. I got a call from my bank that my Internet VISA card account is being used by someone else. They caught it after just a couple of quick charges and I won't lose anything as they can charge it back. I always hold on to one credit card account that is used ONLY for Internet activity.

I've had rare but simliar situations over the years of using credit cards. As noted above by the previous poster, I just find it easier now to use the online "dispute" feature that all credit cards seem to have available. As you noted, this places the credit card company on point to investigate and resolve for you after you provide the facts in the initial online form. The disputed amount will not be charged interest while the investigation continues but I'm not clear on whether that would count towards your credit line as that wasn't an issue when I had the problems. They should be able to tell you if it counts against you during the disputed period. It can take awhile as I recall a couple of times it wasn't resolved for 4-6 weeks. Once it took 3 months.

 

This has always worked well for me and all disputed funds were returned/credit given.

[setsail]

The account was settled on line. Did you click twice thinking it did not take?

Lots of sights have warnings about NOT clicking twice as it could result in double charges.

 

Just a thought.

[dutchess43]

Luckily I have never had this problem, but when I make my deposit or final payment I call RCI & do it over the phone. Therefore when the rep tells me the amount that is being charged I then give her/him the okay to charge me. I have called my cc with problems with charges & have put them into disputes before I have received the statement. Hope all works out for you.

[RoyalCruiser2007]

Very interesting post. The same thing has already happened to me twice in recent weeks. The first time I saw a duplicate pending payment I called RCCL and they knew nothing about it. Whenever I pay online they put a $1 pending transaction hold on my card. In both cases a few days after I paid online another hold appeared with the total that I paid minus $1. It appears to be a computer glitch at RCCL that is causing this. In both cases the hold disappeared after a couple of days.

[ivycruise]

I've had rare but simliar situations over the years of using credit cards. As noted above by the previous poster, I just find it easier now to use the online "dispute" feature that all credit cards seem to have available. As you noted, this places the credit card company on point to investigate and resolve for you after you provide the facts in the initial online form. The disputed amount will not be charged interest while the investigation continues but I'm not clear on whether that would count towards your credit line as that wasn't an issue when I had the problems. They should be able to tell you if it counts against you during the disputed period. It can take awhile as I recall a couple of times it wasn't resolved for 4-6 weeks. Once it took 3 months.

 

This has always worked well for me and all disputed funds were returned/credit given.

I should also have added that while the item/charge is in dispute, you are not obligated to pay it nor does interest accrue. You could also place it in dispute with a credit card phone rep if that's your preference. Either way, much easier than you getting bounced back and forth and put's the CC company in position to resolve.

[owl61]

Okay, so in a prior life I was a litigation lawyer for a bank. Don't hold it against me. Of necessity I got involved in credit card problems and the various fed and state statutes governing their use. The statutes pretty much preempt the common law, but its been so long that I don't remember whether this fact pattern is actually covered by any of the applicable statutes. Before advising anyone I would have to check the statutes to see if there are provisons governing these facts and what remedies are specified. I have not done so.

 

If I understand the facts here they are: RCL unauthorizedly charged your card twice and despite notice of that refuses to institute a reversal of the second improper charge thereby effectively preventing you from using the card because the unauthorized charge has consumed almost all your available credit. Hmmm. Frankly, I don't recall if this kind of fact pattern was covered by the applicable statutes.

 

I say "sue the bastards." Well, at least consult a lawyer if RCL doesnt immediately do all it can to right the wrong. Hey, what would you expect from someone like me? Absent an applicable statutory remedy my free unreliable legal opinion is that RCL has interferred in the contractual relations between you and the card issuer, be it your bank or Amex or whoever. That conduct is "actionable" if it has caused you to suffer damages. Whether other than actual damages, economic or non-economic, are available as a result of the commission of this tort may depend on unspecified circumstances (could you have reasonably avoided the damages). You should consider consulting a lawyer if you were seriously inconvenienced. Even if your economic damages or inconvenience was minor a properly worded letter would probably be worth a nice upgrade on your March cruise, assuming RCL is still operating then.

 

You know what they say about free legal advice. It's worth exactly what you paid for it.

[As the ship sails]

You guys are all missing the point. If it is a PENDING transaction than it is not yet a charge. You CANNOT dispute a pending transaction....only.....an ACTUAL charge. Only thing that you can do is either wait for the transaction to fall off (about 3-10 days) or have RCI remove the hold.

[owl61]

You guys are all missing the point. If it is a PENDING transaction than it is not yet a charge. You CANNOT dispute a pending transaction....only.....an ACTUAL charge. Only thing that you can do is either wait for the transaction to fall off (about 3-10 days) or have RCI remove the hold.

 

Gee, I m going to go out on a limb and disagree. It is not a matter of disputing the pending charge with the card issuer. It is a matter of RCL taking steps to have the unauthorized transaction removed asap. If you are saying that no matter what RCL does in conjunction with the card issuer that the pending charge (which impedes further credit) must necessarily continue to exist for between 3-10 days (and continue to impede further credit), then I would be very surprised.

[GMoney]

Gee, I m going to go out on a limb and disagree. It is not a matter of disputing the pending charge with the card issuer. It is a matter of RCL taking steps to have the unauthorized transaction removed asap. If you are saying that no matter what RCL does in conjunction with the card issuer that the pending charge (which impedes further credit) must necessarily continue to exist for between 3-10 days (and continue to impede further credit), then I would be very surprised.

 

I used to work for a major credit card issuer. As The Ship Sails is correct that you cannot dispute a pending transaction. It is rare for transactions to pend the full 10 days though.

 

You are correct in that with some teamwork between RCI and the credit card issue and the OP, the pending auth could have been removed, but the poor OP would've had to fight the battle. The idea suggested here earlier of a conference call was a great thought. One other possible solution would've been to ask the bank for a temporary credit line increase until the matter was resolved.

[NewarkCC]

This happens more than many people realize, and its RCI's fault! They periodically submit authorizations for your account against your credit card while the cruise is in progress. Then, on the last day, they charge your account for the full amount, while the authorizations are STILL POSTED on your account. The authorizations WILL drop off, but until they do, they take up a portion of your available credit.

 

For instance, if you have a card with a $500 limit, and you spend $300 on the first day of your cruise, then RCI authorizes that amount on the 3rd day of a 7 day cruise - then they try to charge the $300 again on the 7th day. If the first authorization hasn't dropped off, the "real" charge won't be approved and you'll be called down to the Purser's desk.

 

In the OP's situation, RCI authorizes an amount half way through a cruise(say $400 on a $1000 limit card), then charges the final bill (say $600 for a 7 day cruise) - essentially taking up the entire limit of the OP's card, though he should have only been charged $600 TOTAL. Now he needs that $400 which should be available on his credit card the day after he gets off of the cruise, but it won't be available until the authorization expires.

 

The only way around this is to stipulate "cash" as your onboard method, then make payments every couple of days at the purser's desk.

 

It shouldn't be that way, and it screws the customer, but hey, it's the nation of why not!

[BillOh]

So does anyone have any experience in this situation?

 

Many thanks

 

 

I use the Crown and Anchor help line, which unforunately for you, if for people who have cruised before. They put their better people there. I have found on their main public line that some people will make up answers to get rid of you, with them I escalate up, telling them I don't think they are right, let me speak to their supervisor. I hope it isn't your last RCI cruise. This is one case where dealing with a travel agent might be helpful.

[BillOh]

I would arrange a conference call between the correct dept at RCI and your CC company.

 

 

Have you ever actually done that? I can't see that actually happening.

[GMoney]

Have you ever actually done that? I can't see that actually happening.

 

It's not a hard thing to do. You'd start by getting the bank on the phone, and then asking them to conference in RCI. You may have to play rep roulette or escalate to a supervisor at the bank just to find someone willing to help, but it's not an uncommon practice. :)

[long4theocean]

I have had several issues with RCI in the last few months. They have some major problems in their accounting department that need addressed. I have a group going and when I made final payment on one customers booking it brought it to a 0 balance. Then I payed anothers balance with their cc a few days later. Somehow the customer's card that was charged a few days before ended up with the balance of 3 cabins totals on it. Makes no sense to me. They got it refunded but it took almost 5 days for that to happen. I have had a ton of poblems with this group, charges added to the invoices for no apparent reason, air prices changing after invoice is a 0 balance. The insurance price tripled, on and on. I have had to watch every move. They have been good to work with on fixing all of the problems but the problems whould never have happened.

[morgan1312]

This is one case where dealing with a travel agent might be helpful.

 

This happened to me a few years ago and I do use a travel agent, she told me when she did it that she mistakenly charged my card twice but put in the cancel for one of the charges immediately, it still took 3-7 business days for the second charge to be removed from pending.

 

This happens with all sorts of businesses, hotels, resorts, etc...like someone else said anytime they put an authorization thru to make sure you have enough available credit it sucks up that much of your available credit until the real charge clears.

[KelJ]

This happens more than many people realize, and its RCI's fault! They periodically submit authorizations for your account against your credit card while the cruise is in progress. Then, on the last day, they charge your account for the full amount, while the authorizations are STILL POSTED on your account. The authorizations WILL drop off, but until they do, they take up a portion of your available credit.

 

For instance, if you have a card with a $500 limit, and you spend $300 on the first day of your cruise, then RCI authorizes that amount on the 3rd day of a 7 day cruise - then they try to charge the $300 again on the 7th day. If the first authorization hasn't dropped off, the "real" charge won't be approved and you'll be called down to the Purser's desk.

 

In the OP's situation, RCI authorizes an amount half way through a cruise(say $400 on a $1000 limit card), then charges the final bill (say $600 for a 7 day cruise) - essentially taking up the entire limit of the OP's card, though he should have only been charged $600 TOTAL. Now he needs that $400 which should be available on his credit card the day after he gets off of the cruise, but it won't be available until the authorization expires.

 

The only way around this is to stipulate "cash" as your onboard method, then make payments every couple of days at the purser's desk.

 

It shouldn't be that way, and it screws the customer, but hey, it's the nation of why not!

 

There very recently was a post describing this exact situation occurring. While the poster insisted that he was repeatedly charged in error, it was apparent that there were authorizations placed on his credit card during his cruise which in turn used up his credit line, making it impossible for him to use this card on the days immediately following his cruise. The authorizations eventually trickled away, but it took a while.

This is important information for people who are very close to exhausting their credit limit on their credit card.

[gigguy]

Very interesting post. The same thing has already happened to me twice in recent weeks. The first time I saw a duplicate pending payment I called RCCL and they knew nothing about it. Whenever I pay online they put a $1 pending transaction hold on my card. In both cases a few days after I paid online another hold appeared with the total that I paid minus $1. It appears to be a computer glitch at RCCL that is causing this. In both cases the hold disappeared after a couple of days.

 

 

Something very similar happened to me 3 months ago with Alaska Airlines. I "resolved itself" in about 5 days.

[sandune]

It's not a hard thing to do. You'd start by getting the bank on the phone, and then asking them to conference in RCI. You may have to play rep roulette or escalate to a supervisor at the bank just to find someone willing to help, but it's not an uncommon practice. :)

Hello Patrick- haven't seen your name on here for awhile...I just wanted to thank-you for all your help when we went to Alaska last year (remember we wanted you to be on our cruise ) . Hope all is well and you are staying warm in the sunny south as we are all freezing our tushies off up here in the north!!! Happy cruising, wherever you go!!!! Susie AKA Sandune

[isles1]

You guys are all missing the point. If it is a PENDING transaction than it is not yet a charge. You CANNOT dispute a pending transaction....only.....an ACTUAL charge. Only thing that you can do is either wait for the transaction to fall off (about 3-10 days) or have RCI remove the hold.

From someone who (unfortunately) worked as a CS rep for various banks in a prior life to pay for college, I agree with this statement.

 

You cannot dispute a authorization (pending transaction). However, you can ask the merchant to call your bank or conference call your bank with you, confirm some information, and have the hold released at the merchant's request.

 

Of course, bank policy may be different from bank to bank, but you cannot dispute something that has not been billed yet.

[Luv4dacruise]

You guys are all missing the point. If it is a PENDING transaction than it is not yet a charge. You CANNOT dispute a pending transaction....only.....an ACTUAL charge. Only thing that you can do is either wait for the transaction to fall off (about 3-10 days) or have RCI remove the hold.

 

Thats the thing though, RCI will tell the OP that they cannot remove a "pending charge".

 

Have been there with a few companies recenly after an identity theft. The excuse i was given was when it is pending transaction, they have no control over it, they cannot release the hold, it is all comnputerized.

 

Now, they maybe were just feeding me a line, but, im sure that this is the same thing they will say to the OP.