Is the Vista Class really a derivative of Carnival's Spirit Class?

[CarnivalPride]

I was wondering, I have read on many sites that HAL's Vista Class ships are based on Carnival's Spirit Class.

Is this really true? I know both classes are built to Panamax form factor, and they do look strikingly similar on the outside. However, the Vista Class was built by Fincantieri, while the Spirit Class was built by Kvaerner-Masa Yards. Still, it could be simply been a special design that Carnival came up with and assigned the order to the two manufacturers.

[bepsf]

Yes, the Vistas are based on the Spirit-Class which also includes Costa's Mediterrania and Atlantica.

 

Sure, the Carnival and Costa ships were built in Finland, but CCL owns the designs - so they could take them to be built wherever they wanted, which is now Italy.

[Lurker1]

A few years ago, we were on the Oosterdam, docked next to a Crnival ship. One of the officers told us that both ships had the same hull, but the Carnival ship had 800 more cabins!

[Cruzman]

A few years ago, we were on the Oosterdam, docked next to a Crnival ship. One of the officers told us that both ships had the same hull, but the Carnival ship had 800 more cabins!

 

Methinks that officer was misinformed. Max passenger capacity of the Carnival Spirit Class is 2680; HAL Vista Class, 2400; per cruisedeckplans.com.

[Syran]

Per that site, Vista class ships have ~ 1848pax vs 2124 on the Spirit. But still only a 250 person change, so probably 100-125 more cabins.

[noblepa]

Isn't Cunard's Queen Victoria also a derivative of that same lineage?

 

From what I understand, the hull and machinery are the most important and difficult parts of a ship to design. The hull design, of course, has a big impact on fuel consumption, so once they get a hull with a favorable drag factor, they would keep using it.

 

OTOH, the superstructure is relatively easy to change and has no impact on the ship's performance.

 

Paul

[jtl513]

A few years ago, we were on the Oosterdam, docked next to a Crnival ship. One of the officers told us that both ships had the same hull, but the Carnival ship had 800 more cabins!

 

Per that site, Vista class ships have ~ 1848pax vs 2124 on the Spirit. But still only a 250 person change, so probably 100-125 more cabins.

Maybe he meant to say 80 cabins! :)

[Copper10-8]

The Vista class design (Zuiderdam - 2002, Oosterdam - 2003, Westerdam - 2004 & Noordam - 2006), built by the Fincantieri yard in Marghera, Italy, was originally created for HAL, using the Panamax guidelines to determine their designed size. A fifth hull which was originally intended for Holland America was transferred to Cunard Line in 2003 where it was planned to become their ms Queen Victoria. However, due to restructuring within their parent corporation, Carnival Corporation & plc, as well as a later decision by Cunard that modifications should be made to the design to bring in certain aspects which had proven successful on their RMS Queen Mary 2, the hull was again transferred to become P&O Cruises' ms Arcadia - 2004. The five Vista's share similar exterior dimensions with Carnival Cruise Lines' and Costa Cruises' Spirit class ships. Cunard Line's Queen Victoria - 2007, is an enlarged version of the same design, as is HAL's Signature Class (Eurodam - 2008 and Nieuw Amsterdam - 2010).

The Vista class design has been used in two derivative designs. After the transfer of the original hull to P&O Cruises, Cunard Line ordered a new ms Queen Victoria (delivered in 2007) from the Fincantieri yard in 2004. This modified design extended the hull to 964 feet 6 inches and added an additional deck, as well as redesigning the layout of cabins and all public areas of the ship. In order to meet the requirements of regular trans-Atlantic crossings, she also had key parts of her decks, bulkheads, and hull reinforced. Yet another Curnarder, ms Queen Elizabeth 3, is under construction based on

this same design though slightly larger, at 92,000 grt, and is expected to enter service in 2010.

The Spirit Class is built at the Helsinki New shipyard, Helsinki, Finland for both Carnival Cruise Line and Costa Cruises, both subsidiaries of the Carnival Corporation. The Spirit ships ships (Costa Atlantica - 2000, Carnival Spirit - 2001, Carnival Pride -2001, Carnival Legend - 2002, Costa Mediterranea - 2003 and Carnival Miracle -2004) were all built to the Panamax form factor which allows them to pass through the Panama Canal. They are similar to HAL's, Cunard's and P&O's Vista (Queen Victoria/Queen Elizabeth 3 & Arcadia) class.

Costa Atlantica - 2000

 

Carnival Spirit - 2001

 

Arcadia - 2004

 

Noordam - 2006

Queen Victoria - 2007

[NHBob]

Great set of photos John. I was fairly aware of the histories and relationships among the ships, but the photos really show the similarities and differences.

 

Bob

[Copper10-8]

Great set of photos John. I was fairly aware of the histories and relationships among the ships, but the photos really show the similarities and differences.

 

Bob

 

Good stuff, Bob!;)

[Lurker1]

Maybe he meant to say 80 cabins! :)

 

Maybe, of course we were in the Crow's Nest at the time, memory might be a bit hazy . . .;)

[Koshlong]

I loved those comparing pictures! But that Costa funnel is hard to love!:( It sure ruins a good design.

[larsenbiz]

Neet-O pics. The P&O funnel is pretty yuky looking, too.

[bepsf]

Yet another Cunarder, ms Queen Elizabeth 3...

 

John--

 

She's to be the Queen Elizabeth...

...the "3" is silent.

She'll be nearly identical to the Queen Victoria, however she'll have the Eurodam stern.

 

BTW - Arcadia entered service in 2005, not 2004.

[Copper10-8]

John--

 

She's to be the Queen Elizabeth...

...the "3" is silent.

She'll be nearly identical to the Queen Victoria, however she'll have the Eurodam stern.

 

BTW - Arcadia entered service in 2005, not 2004.

 

Copy that Brian! The interesting part of that name is that the Royal Navy's new aircraft carier will also be named Queen Elizabeth when she joins the fleet in 2016

[jmps]

I am in San Francisco on business and I can see the Carnival Spirit in dry dock from my room. I didn't know this was the same hull design and find this thread really interesting. Thanks for posting the info. It has me very excited about being on the Zuiderdam in June. Telling my daughters about it got them all excited as well. There are some really neat pictures of the dry dock, azipods and interior upgrades in the Carnival area.

[Copper10-8]

The rest of the ships mentioned:

 

 

Carnival Pride

Carnival Legend

 

Carnival Miracle

Zuiderdam

 

Oosterdam

 

Westerdam

[Copper10-8]

 

Costa Mediterranea

Eurodam

 

Nieuw Amsterdam;)

[lettienets]

Do you think the name Queen Elizabeth (not 1, 2 3 ) is because finally, they are going to name the ship and the aircraft carrier after Her Majesty the Queen who has served her country and Commonwealth since 1952? It is about time.

oops, I just looked it up and noticed it is being named after Cunard's first Queen Eliizabeth ship again, which was named after Queen Mother Elizabeth before her coronation with King George VI.

I can't understand why the present Queen doesn't have a ship in her honour, maybe the aircraft carrier will be her name.

[Nutrioso]

Great pics and very interesting thread. Classy looking all of them although I do prefer the dark blue hulls. ----Penny

[navybankerteacher]

Methinks that officer was misinformed. Max passenger capacity of the Carnival Spirit Class is 2680; HAL Vista Class, 2400; per cruisedeckplans.com.

 

Vista ships are reported by Vacations to Go site as carrying betwee 1848 and 1918 passengers in 800 cabins -- the difference being the number of cabins which accomodate more than two. Having sailed Noordamand Zuiderdam twice each, and Oosterdam once, I know they are in tghat range. Carnival Spirit is reported as carrying 2667 passengers in 930 cabins.

 

It is a safe bet that the officer quoted referred to a difference of 800 passengers, not 800 cabins.

[Koshlong]

I'm with you, Lettienetts, I thought the Cunard ship was being named for her. I knew the other 2 were for the Queen Mum. Scary thought........does that mean there could be a "Queen Camilla" in the future?:eek:

[bepsf]

Scary thought........does that mean there could be a "Queen Camilla" in the future?:eek:

 

I sincerely doubt she'll ever see that title...

 

...in any case, should Cunard build a 4th ship (highly doubtful) there a number of other suitable British Queens to name ships after:

 

Queen Anne, Reigned from 1707–1714

Queen Charlotte (Wife of George III)

Queen Alexandra (Wife of Edward VII)

 

...and of course, there's the traditional naming system should Cunard go newbuild-happy.

[navybankerteacher]

I sincerely doubt she'll ever see that title...

 

...in any case, should Cunard build a 4th ship (highly doubtful) there a number of other suitable British Queens to name ships after:

 

Queen Anne, Reigned from 1707–1714

Queen Charlotte (Wife of George III)

Queen Alexandra (Wife of Edward VII)

 

...and of course, there's the traditional naming system should Cunard go newbuild-happy.

 

I would propose one of the earlier, and arguably more authentic, British Queens: Boudicca, who wiped out one Roman legion (the IX), destroyed the temple of Claudius at Camulodum (Colchester), and sacked Londinium (London) before her band was hunted down by three additional legions. Or, for a somewhat less aggressive feminist, Eleanor of Acquitaine - wife of Henry II and mother of Richard I.

[bepsf]

I would propose one of the earlier, and arguably more authentic, British Queens: Boudicca, who wiped out one Roman legion (the IX), destroyed the temple of Claudius at Camulodum (Colchester), and sacked Londinium (London) before her band was hunted down by three additional legions. Or, for a somewhat less aggressive feminist, Eleanor of Acquitaine - wife of Henry II and mother of Richard I.

 

Boudicca is already currently taken as a name by a ship of the Fred Olsen Line - and in any case, she wasn't really English (there was no England back then) but of a Welsh tribe...

 

...and I'd personally rather see another Aquitania than a Queen Eleanor.