Is Vantage Adventures guarantee worthless?

Quotng from the Vantage Adventures website:

"Small Groups — No more than 18-24 travelers, guaranteed!"

I am currently in Hanoi commencing the Mekong portion of Vantage Adventures' Grand Asian Journey: Exploring the Mekong & Irrawaddy Rivers. There are 62 travelers present. There are two groups. According to the Group Leaders there was never any plan to have more than two group leaders on the land portion of the trip. There is no way to split 62 travelers into two groups of the "No more than 18-24 travelers, guaranteed!"

I have written to the only email address I know in Boston (salesinquiries@vantagrtravel.com) asking how they intend to rectify this issue, and have gotten an automatic reply that they will get back to me in 24-48 hours. After one business day I have heard nothing, and when I had a different issue several years ago they never responded until I phoned them (but phoning from Hanoi is difficult).

Does anyone have an email for a Resolutions Department or similar? I'd like to believe that Vantage Adventures guarantee means something, but currently I feeling that it is just marketing fluff. I hope they prove that cynicism wrong.

Thom

If you have internet access here is the link for their customer service contact form

http://www.vantageadventures.com/forms/contactcs.aspx

Hi Thom!

We encountered the same problem/question on our Sept 26 Indochina Cruise. All I can say is that you will be split into 3 groups once you board the river ship.

We did not do the extended Myanmar this time. We so enjoyed the Mekong river trip that we have done it twice. Myanmar we did in 2014. You will enjoy all and the river ship is awesome!

Please give big hug and hello to Han.

Enjoy and if you have questions please let me know.

Cindy Cornell:):)

I did receive a response from Vantage in a reasonably timely manner (10 Nov), but I consider the response to be disingenuous at best:

Please note the note of group size on the website, is in error. The true total passenger capacity is 34 as that is how many cabins are on board the ship. This has been sent to our marketing team for review and correction…

We are sorry for all of the confusion, and any inconveniences it has caused.

Best regards,

Courtney Velez

Email Correspondent

Vantage Deluxe World Travel

Either this is a Vantage Adventure trip which was advertised as "no more than 18-24 passengers guaranteed" or it is not. I have in hand a Vantage Adventures 2017 catalog dated 11 Nov 2016. The Irrawaddy and Mekong cruise trips are in this catalog, although the descriptive words have been changed to “18 to 26 travelers” (up from 24, and the word guaranteed removed). Vantage needs to decide if these trips are Vantage Adventures and treat them as promised, or they need to remove them from the Vantage Adventures list.

To be honest it was a good trip (I’ll review elsewhere), but paying for a smaller group and getting a larger one changes the cost evaluation considerably. I am not a fan of Bait and Switch.

Thom

I did receive a response from Vantage in a reasonably timely manner (10 Nov), but I consider the response to be disingenuous at best:

 

Please note the note of group size on the website, is in error. The true total passenger capacity is 34 as that is how many cabins are on board the ship. This has been sent to our marketing team for review and correction…

 

We are sorry for all of the confusion, and any inconveniences it has caused.

 

Best regards,

Courtney Velez

Email Correspondent

Vantage Deluxe World Travel

 

Either this is a Vantage Adventure trip which was advertised as "no more than 18-24 passengers guaranteed" or it is not. I have in hand a Vantage Adventures 2017 catalog dated 11 Nov 2016. The Irrawaddy and Mekong cruise trips are in this catalog, although the descriptive words have been changed to “18 to 26 travelers” (up from 24, and the word guaranteed removed). Vantage needs to decide if these trips are Vantage Adventures and treat them as promised, or they need to remove them from the Vantage Adventures list.

 

To be honest it was a good trip (I’ll review elsewhere), but paying for a smaller group and getting a larger one changes the cost evaluation considerably. I am not a fan of Bait and Switch.

 

Thom

You do know that making a mistake is OK. They gave you good answer that they will correct the information.

I guess you can take them to small claims court but what is your monetary lose?

You do know that making a mistake is OK. They gave you good answer that they will correct the information.

 

I guess you can take them to small claims court but what is your monetary lose?

In my mind it is not a loss question, it is a trust question. I purchase from vendors that I trust. From what Thom said they first stated that 18 to 24 was guaranteed. Then when they were called on it they changed the text to 18-26 and then removed the word guaranteed. They should indicate for that trip that on the land tour portion of that trip the size of the groups may be as high as 34.

Since it was guaranteed they should honor that guarantee, even if they say that it is a mistake. That mean that they should prorate the fee for that portion of the trip. The fact that for a portion of his trip the group size was well over 26 implies to me that one cannot really trust their web site. Based upon the nature of their correction the only mistake was that they guaranteed something that they really were not delivering.

If I want larger group sizes I can select a less expensive tour from other providers. When I pay for a small group I would expect the tour company to deliver.

In my mind it is not a loss question, it is a trust question. I purchase from vendors that I trust. From what Thom said they first stated that 18 to 24 was guaranteed. Then when they were called on it they changed the text to 18-26 and then removed the word guaranteed. They should indicate for that trip that on the land tour portion of that trip the size of the groups may be as high as 34.

 

Since it was guaranteed they should honor that guarantee, even if they say that it is a mistake. That mean that they should prorate the fee for that portion of the trip. The fact that for a portion of his trip the group size was well over 26 implies to me that one cannot really trust their web site. Based upon the nature of their correction the only mistake was that they guaranteed something that they really were not delivering.

 

If I want larger group sizes I can select a less expensive tour from other providers. When I pay for a small group I would expect the tour company to deliver.

Well said. I agree.

This issue is not the first/only bait and switch Vantage has pulled in the past year.

They advertised (in print and on their web site) and sold a special culinary cruise on the Rhone. Later they changed the date. Then shortly before final payment, they switched it to just a regular cruise.

So yes, it is a matter of trust. They have not earned mine and an offer of a "good faith" future cruise credit in exchange for a confidentiality/non-disclosure agreement is worthless.

This is not the Vantage that we sailed on so happily trip after trip after trip....I think they're trying too hard to appeal to a younger crowd and are spreading themselves to thin. too bad....it was a great company and we had 8 really great trips with them.

You do know that making a mistake is OK. They gave you good answer that they will correct the information.

I guess you can take them to small claims court but what is your monetary lose?

Honest mistakes I can accept. Unforseen circumstances (our third guide had a heart attack today and we can't find another on short notice) I can accept. But this trip has many months of being advertised as a Vantage Adventure , which by their definition means small group size. As far as I can tell they never had any intent of providing the advertised small groups in Hanoi or Saigon ( there were groups of 20-22 on the Mekong Navigator and in Siem Reap; both locations apparently under contract with Lotus Cruises, owner of the boat). A tour company can sell any product they wish, but I am old fashioned enough to expect them to have an honest intent to deliver the advertised product.

I don't know what you would consider an appropriate amount of time to correct "mistakes" on a website but over three weeks later there has been no "correction" and I am not holding my breath expecting one. It is significantly cheaper to purchase larger group tours versus smaller group tours. Overall it was a good tour which I am glad I took, but slightly marred by false advertising (which continues).

It is not worth my time, effort and expense to sue them, but it looks to me that might be the only way to get them to advertise honestly. Buyer be warned:mad:

Thom

I assume that the only way to deal with Vantage is directly with them? :( Which really doesn't give the customer someone to deal with who might help with these kinds of issues.

Cole

In my mind it is not a loss question, it is a trust question. I purchase from vendors that I trust. From what Thom said they first stated that 18 to 24 was guaranteed. Then when they were called on it they changed the text to 18-26 and then removed the word guaranteed. They should indicate for that trip that on the land tour portion of that trip the size of the groups may be as high as 34.

 

Since it was guaranteed they should honor that guarantee, even if they say that it is a mistake. That mean that they should prorate the fee for that portion of the trip. The fact that for a portion of his trip the group size was well over 26 implies to me that one cannot really trust their web site. Based upon the nature of their correction the only mistake was that they guaranteed something that they really were not delivering.

 

If I want larger group sizes I can select a less expensive tour from other providers. When I pay for a small group I would expect the tour company to deliver.

I take it you never made a mistake? You had no monetary loss and they said would fix it when you brought it to there attention.

Don't do business with them again is the solution to your problem.

I take it you never made a mistake? You had no monetary loss and they said would fix it when you brought it to there attention.

 

Don't do business with them again is the solution to your problem.

I have made plenty of mistakes, however I have alays stood by my word and honored what was stated. I have corrected advertising to make such mistakes were not repeated.

The issue here is that counter to what the customer relations person said, it was not really a mistake because they have not corrected it several weeks after.

Based upon your comments I assumed that you would be happy to sign up with a small group tour that stated that you would be staying in the Waldorf in NYC, only to find that the actual hotel was the Holiday Inn Express. After all they did provide a room and you suffered no economic loss.

The issue with travel suppliers is trust. You need to be able to trust what they tell you about the trip you are buying.

I am not the OP. It was not my trip that was impacted. But his post and the Vendors lack of proper correction on their Web site has certainly impacted my planned future use of Vantage.

When the "vantage adventures" first started to be advertised I asked about our 2015 Amazon trip....was told.......well the small groups are not going to start until next year ( and yes they now have a smaller ship doing that trip).

I asked about our Mekong Trip and was told NOT all adventure trips would be the small advertised size. NO TRUTH in advertising...I have learned with Vantage I MUST asked many questions....they have reviewed "taped" conversations and given me what was discussed. Their publications are out of date before they arrive in my mailbox and I am always told prices on the website are current.

We enjoyed our Mekong trip but the groups were too big! Even with quiet boxes. Our half of the larger group was very fortunate, for the most part there were very few complainers and everyone was always on time. I do know that we would not enjoy a large group touring experience. Trying to keep track of 34 people is like herding cats and group meals are LONG and cumbersome. Large buses had difficulty navigating small streets, one time a guide was on another bus and we heard the commentary through a speaker....obviously our group could not ask any questions!!!

Our time on the ship was wonderful and at that time we were also in smaller groups.

We will probably look at Vantage for another trip but with their changes to the repeat customer "President's Club" we have no strong incentive or loyalty.

I went to a Mercedes dealer a few months ago and paid in full for a 2017 AMG S65. I got a great deal - they knocked $5,000 off the MSRP, so it was only $221,900. I finally took delivery a month ago. There was some confusion and they delivered a 1985 Yugo GV, but hey everybody makes mistakes, so no big deal. The dealer did admit an advertising mistake, and promised to fix their advertising. Still the same advertising a month later, but these things take time. Since I did get a car that is still running, I suffered no monetary loss, so I'm not going to worry about it.:)

Is there more than one person out there dumb enough to buy this story?

I went to a Mercedes dealer a few months ago and paid in full for a 2017 AMG S65. I got a great deal - they knocked $5,000 off the MSRP, so it was only $221,900. I finally took delivery a month ago. There was some confusion and they delivered a 1985 Yugo GV, but hey everybody makes mistakes, so no big deal. The dealer did admit an advertising mistake, and promised to fix their advertising. Still the same advertising a month later, but these things take time. Since I did get a car that is still running, I suffered no monetary loss, so I'm not going to worry about it.:)

 

Is there more than one person out there dumb enough to buy this story?

You did suffer a money loss unless you think a $100 car is the same value as a $300,000 car.

Explain how there is no monetary loss? Are you saying that the two cars have in identical value upon receiving the car? Sort of a stupid example.

You did suffer a money loss unless you think a $100 car is the same value as a $300,000 car.

... a bit like suggesting that there is no loss when you paid for a small group tour and didn't get it... :)

You did suffer a money loss unless you think a $100 car is the same value as a $300,000 car.

 

Explain how there is no monetary loss? Are you saying that the two cars have in identical value upon receiving the car? Sort of a stupid example.

I also think it is just as stupid to say there is no monetary loss in paying for a small group tour and receiving a large group tour.

Any questions?

This thread has convinced me not to book with Vantage. Had similar experience on a recent tour in Scotland. Turned out not to be a small group but a larger group jammed into a very uncomfortable vehicle. Won't recommend that company either.

Perhaps Vantages continues to give a quality product on the River Cruises in Europe. For us,it is the shortfall of what they consider "Small Group Experience" for the vantage adventures. 34 people, and often over 60 in a given spot...two schools, dining at a local restaurant, a local dance school, palaces, museums all were too crowded for the group to really appreciate the venue.