Why no home ship for NY port

[mgasparro1]

I started cruising in Sept 2001 (my first cruise was on Sept 9th and we were docking in Bermuda that morning of Sept 11th) I was on the RCCL's Nordic Empress. I have done all of my 10 cruises out of NY. 3 out of Bayonne with RCCL and 7 with Carnival. I LOVE going out of NY and would also love to have them cruise year round. It makes it so much easier, being that I can load up my bags, drive my car to the pier (I live 60 miles north of NYC), unload, hop on the ship and sail away!!! No losing bags, delayed/missed flights, rental cars, etc....I have done all of the itineraries..Canada, Bermuda and the Caribbean. I am going to Bahamas on the Carnival Dream on 23 November!!! I am so excited!! But, please, Carnival...go out of NYC year round!!! :)

[SoFetch]

I would love to take a cruise from NY/NJ, but everytime I look at prices, it is always much cheaper to fly to Florida and cruise from there than to cruise from NY. It's frustrating....besides convienence, I thought the draw of "homeports" was that you don't have spend so much money on airfare.

[LemurCat]

Associated costs and Political Elections now coming are the perfect time for all of us Cruisers to Voice what we would like...

 

 

Even to US Sen. (d-NJ) Roberto Menedez and Gov. (d-NJ) (( up for re-election )) Jon Corzine.

 

Both by the way live in the same building in the City of Hoboken, Hudson County, NJ there...

 

They may, finally, get off there duffs and do something for us American and Garden State Cruisers ..finally if asked.:mad:

 

What else have the done for us? Well raise taxes the highest ever, not fulfill there promises, etc...

 

The Bermudian Islands which also carry the actual name of Somers Isles too where Admiral Somers was at the Helm in 1609 going to re-supply Jamestown in VA with Captain Newport aboard her as well.

 

To me those islands are some of the nicest in the world!

 

Again why doesn't NJ and Gov. (d-NJ) Jon Corzine do something to bring back Cruising to New Jersey and the City he resides in ? :eek:

 

Oh eeee gast that would mean more revenues for NJ ...;)

 

Sorry I do so hate to see such waste of wonderful Cruising resources!

 

 

 

1. I'll not get political in this thread, as I'm sure the vast majority of posters don't really care about Jersey politics, other than to say where exactly would you like the Hoboken cruise port to go? :rolleyes:

 

2. Who the heck wants to go to Bermuda in January? It's not a Caribbean island. It's not particularly warm in January (not like Mexico or the Caymans), and the only docking facilities available are to Carnival is King's Wharf.

[LemurCat]

I would love to take a cruise from NY/NJ, but everytime I look at prices, it is always much cheaper to fly to Florida and cruise from there than to cruise from NY. It's frustrating....besides convienence, I thought the draw of "homeports" was that you don't have spend so much money on airfare.

 

Consider if you will the Economies of Scale involved. Everything is more expensive in NYC -- hotels, food, transportation, port fees, etc. I agree, it kind of sucks, but the truth of the matter is that NYC is greatly hindered by it's geographic location. It takes a long time to get to anywhere worth going to.

[LemurCat]

Still think the issue is Bermuda and whether Bermuda wants another ship (especially on a full time basis).

 

The issue with Bermuda is that Carnival's ships can only dock at King's Wharf (Royal Dockyard), and except for the couple of times a year CCL puts in there, RCL and NCL pretty much have a lock on the contracts there.

 

The other issue with Bermuda is geography. As I've said before, it's not Caribbean. It's an island in the Atlantic Ocean. It's not particularly close to the Equator compared to some other locations. Going to Bermuda in the winter is like going to the Carolinas. Warmer than NYC, yes, but not exactly a tropical wonderland.

[Crusin6]

I would love to take a cruise from NY/NJ, but everytime I look at prices, it is always much cheaper to fly to Florida and cruise from there than to cruise from NY. It's frustrating....besides convienence, I thought the draw of "homeports" was that you don't have spend so much money on airfare.

My feeling is that they gouge us because so many Tri Staters let themselves be gouged. I would like to see all the cruise lines start to have trouble filling up the NYC ships and then see how fast they drop there prices......again they keep the prices high because too many of us are willing to pay them. The port charge for NYC should probably be lowered as well.....prices go down with demand...all around. Less pax....lower prices....lower charges......lower taxi rates (when people start walking from the train station)....you get the idea......just my 2 cents...not meant to start a major discussion.

[bluelghttr]

crusin6

 

your missing the point here my friend.

 

The main reason carnival puts any ship into new york is PROFIT, and maximum profit at that. If the ships at any port either stop sailing fully booked, or are sailing fully booked, but at a discounted price, carnival will pull the ship from that market, and send it to another where the profit margin is better. ( the customer has noting to hold over Carnival to force them to drop rates)

 

But hey customers i encourage you to boycott Carnival in new york, maybe they will move the miracle, and or the glory to Philadelphia, that would work out great for me

 

to this end i cite the recent move by carnival to pull the Elation from San diego

the ship wasn't selling well, and those cabins that were selling, were at a discount.

so the Elation is off to Mobile AL, and Charleston SC gets the Fantasy and i will bet you $100 to $1 if the Fantasy doesn't sell well, and at the rates carnival wants, Charleston SC can kiss the Fantasy BUH BYE

 

and as far as expensive flights to Florida, anybody living in Bayonne NJ that can't find a flight out of Newark for $100 (or less) each way just isn't looking.

[nycruise]

Carnival is the largest and by far the most profitable cruise line in the world.

 

As such Carnival places its' ships where it is most profitable for them. The tri-state area is the most expensive to operate in and therefore they have to charge a substantially higher prices for cruises out of New York/Brooklyn/New Jersey. I'm sure Carnival determines the cost versus the demand and places ships where it is most advantageous to them from a profitability standpoint. Don't forget they are a public company and profits are the top priority.

 

Since they own Princess, Cunard and Holland America, they can and do put their higher priced ship in this expensive market and the clientele for those lines can and will pay more for the pleasure of cruising from a convenient location.

 

Having sailed out of New York many times, once you expand your horizons, it's generally worth flying to other ports for the opportunity of seeing destinations other than the Carribbean, Bermuda and New England/Nova Scotia/Canada.

 

Having said that, we are taking the Dream out of NY next month. Couldn't resist the draw of the newest and largest Carnival ship, a taxi ride away.:)

[jimbo5544]

The issue with Bermuda is that Carnival's ships can only dock at King's Wharf (Royal Dockyard), and except for the couple of times a year CCL puts in there, RCL and NCL pretty much have a lock on the contracts there.

 

The other issue with Bermuda is geography. As I've said before, it's not Caribbean. It's an island in the Atlantic Ocean. It's not particularly close to the Equator compared to some other locations. Going to Bermuda in the winter is like going to the Carolinas. Warmer than NYC, yes, but not exactly a tropical wonderland.

I would agree with your comments regarding going to Bermuda in the winter. Not sure it is quite like the Carolina's but I get it. That is why I mentioned somewhat of a rolling schedule (more seasonal I guess). Also agree to the comments about King's Wharf. All of these are more speed bumps than road blocks

[jimbo5544]

Carnival is the largest and by far the most profitable cruise line in the world.

 

As such Carnival places its' ships where it is most profitable for them. The tri-state area is the most expensive to operate in and therefore they have to charge a substantially higher prices for cruises out of New York/Brooklyn/New Jersey. I'm sure Carnival determines the cost versus the demand and places ships where it is most advantageous to them from a profitability standpoint. Don't forget they are a public company and profits are the top priority.

 

Since they own Princess, Cunard and Holland America, they can and do put their higher priced ship in this expensive market and the clientele for those lines can and will pay more for the pleasure of cruising from a convenient location.

 

Having sailed out of New York many times, once you expand your horizons, it's generally worth flying to other ports for the opportunity of seeing destinations other than the Carribbean, Bermuda and New England/Nova Scotia/Canada.

 

Having said that, we are taking the Dream out of NY next month. Couldn't resist the draw of the newest and largest Carnival ship, a taxi ride away.:)

Think you hit all points on the compass on this reply...lol. Does CCL own HAL, Princess and Cunard...yes. Are they all more expensive to sail than Carnival...yes again. Is there more profit in this...don't know. Would adding a Carnival year round sailing out of New York be cheaper (and possibly drive down the cost) than these and be more competitive (price wise) to RCCL and NCL yes again. From an economics point of view, I think it is a win win. Doubt many Carnival customers (% wise that is) sail on HAL, Cunard, Princess...just different beasts.

[Maraprince]

If the weather is bad in NY, chances are you will not get out of the airport to catch the ship in Florida or San Juan. However, getting to the pier is NY is more promising.

 

Carnival could do a sailing down to Florida, Bahamas, St. Thomas, San Juan, Grand Cayman in the winter months and NYers would love it!

 

What's the point of fixing up the port in NYC and not using it all year long? The port has been dreged to allow ships with deeper (can't think of the word -- draft?) to be able to enter and leave the harbor.

 

With Carnival not sailing out of Europe next year, this is certainly the time to consider having one or more ships sailing out of NYC all year round.

 

MARAPRINCE

[jimbo5544]

If the weather is bad in NY, chances are you will not get out of the airport to catch the ship in Florida or San Juan. However, getting to the pier is NY is more promising.

 

Carnival could do a sailing down to Florida, Bahamas, St. Thomas, San Juan, Grand Cayman in the winter months and NYers would love it!

 

What's the point of fixing up the port in NYC and not using it all year long? The port has been dreged to allow ships with deeper (can't think of the word -- draft?) to be able to enter and leave the harbor.

 

With Carnival not sailing out of Europe next year, this is certainly the time to consider having one or more ships sailing out of NYC all year round.

 

MARAPRINCE

 

I agree, and remember they (CCL) are adding a new ship to the mix in 2011 in the Magic. Wouldn't it be nice....

[LemurCat]

Carnival could do a sailing down to Florida, Bahamas, St. Thomas, San Juan, Grand Cayman in the winter months and NYers would love it!

 

 

I can't speak for all Tri-State folks (and wouldn't dare to presume to), but having done an 8-dayer out of NYC to San Juan, St. Thomas, and Tortolla, I found that would be the absolute limit for how long I could go. Any cruise that would bleed into another business week would be simply too long. And I am by no means a workaholic. ;)

[jimbo5544]

I can't speak for all Tri-State folks (and wouldn't dare to presume to), but having done an 8-dayer out of NYC to San Juan, St. Thomas, and Tortolla, I found that would be the absolute limit for how long I could go. Any cruise that would bleed into another business week would be simply too long. And I am by no means a workaholic. ;)

So are you saying a 8 day would or would not work for you (understand the longer than 8 days part of it)?

[LemurCat]

So are you saying a 8 day would or would not work for you (understand the longer than 8 days part of it)?

 

8 days was too long. It didn't help that Ronald Reagan died during the middle of it, effectively killing any decent TV watching.

[Crusin6]

crusin6

 

your missing the point here my friend.

 

The main reason carnival puts any ship into new york is PROFIT, and maximum profit at that. If the ships at any port either stop sailing fully booked, or are sailing fully booked, but at a discounted price, carnival will pull the ship from that market, and send it to another where the profit margin is better. ( the customer has noting to hold over Carnival to force them to drop rates)

 

But hey customers i encourage you to boycott Carnival in new york, maybe they will move the miracle, and or the glory to Philadelphia, that would work out great for me

 

to this end i cite the recent move by carnival to pull the Elation from San diego

the ship wasn't selling well, and those cabins that were selling, were at a discount.

so the Elation is off to Mobile AL, and Charleston SC gets the Fantasy and i will bet you $100 to $1 if the Fantasy doesn't sell well, and at the rates carnival wants, Charleston SC can kiss the Fantasy BUH BYE

 

and as far as expensive flights to Florida, anybody living in Bayonne NJ that can't find a flight out of Newark for $100 (or less) each way just isn't looking.

No, I understand profit margin perfectly.....I am just getting disturbed by the willingness of so many to pay so much more so.....regardless of the median income of the tri state area.....if less people spend....the prices go down. And this would apply to those living in Philly, D.C. and the Baltimore areas. So, if a company thinks you will pay too much for something...then they will charge you that....if they think you will not pay it....they will lower their prices. As evidenced by the fall of rents, housing prices...etc. What Carnival is doing is raising demand for their product by not offerring much selection out of NYC. It's a moot point anyway because there are many many other bargains out there...and I like to fly anyway. I would only cruise out of NYC if the price was right...it isn't....so no skin off my back...i'll survive...and probably have more interesting non-cruise vacations to boot.

 

Now, I like cruising but not at the expense of giving up other trips in order to cruise. However, to each his own.

[jimbo5544]

8 days was too long. It didn't help that Ronald Reagan died during the middle of it, effectively killing any decent TV watching.

Watching all that Reagan stuff (all the specials, the funeral etc) would make me be the next jumper....lol:D

Think most crusies out of NYC would have to be 8 days tho....logistically speaking if it were to be anything other than Bermuda and Bahamas.

[jimbo5544]

Watching all that Reagan stuff (all the specials, the funeral etc) would make me be the next jumper....lol:D

Think most crusies out of NYC would have to be 8 days tho....logistically speaking if it were to be anything other than Bermuda and Bahamas.

Although I do not do a lot of TV watching on a cruise.....

[jimbo5544]

No, I understand profit margin perfectly.....I am just getting disturbed by the willingness of so many to pay so much more so.....regardless of the median income of the tri state area.....if less people spend....the prices go down. And this would apply to those living in Philly, D.C. and the Baltimore areas. So, if a company thinks you will pay too much for something...then they will charge you that....if they think you will not pay it....they will lower their prices. As evidenced by the fall of rents, housing prices...etc. What Carnival is doing is raising demand for their product by not offerring much selection out of NYC. It's a moot point anyway because there are many many other bargains out there...and I like to fly anyway. I would only cruise out of NYC if the price was right...it isn't....so no skin off my back...i'll survive...and probably have more interesting non-cruise vacations to boot.

 

Now, I like cruising but not at the expense of giving up other trips in order to cruise. However, to each his own.

I agree with what you say (the supply and demand thing) and I also agree that it is limited demand that keeps the small number of cruises they DO offer at a premium (in a lot of cases more than adding in the comparable airfare to the cruise price). I would just like to see them add more options (number of cruises from the NYC area) which will give more options and drive the price down. Maybe somewhat wishful thinking but think it would work for everyone that way....

[LemurCat]

Although I do not do a lot of TV watching on a cruise.....

 

Neither do I, but I'd already gone bust at the casino, could only listen to the two-man band play the "Cocktail" soundtrack so many times and was quite frankly, sick of drinking. :D So, yeah, it was reading Jack Aubrey novels with the Reagan coverage in the background.

[jimbo5544]

Neither do I, but I'd already gone bust at the casino, could only listen to the two-man band play the "Cocktail" soundtrack so many times and was quite frankly, sick of drinking. :D So, yeah, it was reading Jack Aubrey novels with the Reagan coverage in the background.

 

 

Come on....you mean hearing "Aruba, Jamaica, come on I want to take you to Bermuda...." does not keep you entertained???:rolleyes:

[jimbo5544]

Neither do I, but I'd already gone bust at the casino, could only listen to the two-man band play the "Cocktail" soundtrack so many times and was quite frankly, sick of drinking. :D So, yeah, it was reading Jack Aubrey novels with the Reagan coverage in the background.

On a serious note, depending on the time of year and the weather, it could stretch the patience of people (being cooped up, kind of a different kind of cabin fever) ....

[LemurCat]

Come on....you mean hearing "Aruba, Jamaica, come on I want to take you to Bermuda...." does not keep you entertained???:rolleyes:

 

I have a very vivid memory of standing on the Lido deck with a cigarette in hand and my sister begging me to stick it in her ear to make the music stop. ;)

[jimbo5544]

I have a very vivid memory of standing on the Lido deck with a cigarette in hand and my sister begging me to stick it in her ear to make the music stop. ;)

That was the first time I laughed all day!!! Thanks

[LemurCat]

On a serious note, depending on the time of year and the weather, it could stretch the patience of people (being cooped up, kind of a different kind of cabin fever) ....

 

Let me tell you about that .... we did a seven day to Bermuda on NCL this summer in July. It rained a good bit of the time and people were cooped up on the ship. It wasn't a happy cruise, especially not after we put into Bermuda and didn't pull back into international waters for two and a half days. People were pissed. A lot of folks didn't realize that the casino wasn't open when the ship was in port and that there wasn't a whole going on onboard. So that different kind of cabin fever ... yeah, totally agree.