Transferring Reservations from Celebrity to a Travel Agent - New Rules

[scf1270]

I think the amounts will be lower the further from the sailing. More time to sailing = more work (time with customer) for the agency = lower profit = lower OBC. Keeps the price closer to what the cruise line is selling it for themselves.

j

 

Nothing new there -TAs have always had to compete against the cruise line.

 

Pax abuse is responsible for killing this goose that laid the golden egg. Pax book through the cruise line to maintain control over their bookings, using the cruise line's reservation services to the max for as long as possible until such time as they switch those reservations to TAs to get the max out of those TAs in the form of added amenities, all the time expecting the cruise line to foot the bill not only for the reservation services it renders to those pax but also for payment of commission to their TAs who only enter the equation shortly before final payment. Until now pax have had the best of both worlds and still will under the new policy, but only for 60 days following booking. I think that's a pretty generous compromise on the part of the cruise line.

 

Those benefits exist because the TA is handling it.

 

Doing it the other way is effectively double dipping, and RCL/Celebrity need to employ more support staff for something that they are paying a TA to do.

 

The above are all valid points, but I have a thought that hasn't been addressed... When we call our TAs to ask (most) questions, or to make a booking change, they call X anyway. So, aren't X's CSRs doing about the same amount of work either way? How is this change any more cost effective if X A) isn't saving many man-hours, and B) is losing early bookings?

 

We switched our 2 upcoming bookings to a large, on-line TA just before final payment. Waited until then on the advice of TA as they charge $25 per change.

 

Not sure how we'll handle our bookings in the future. Leaning towards the benefits of a good, large TA vs. X. With X we are just one customer of many. A good TA should have better contacts, more clout. The recent cancellation of the Century cruise is a good example. I'd rather make one call to a TA than try to get X on the phone.

 

Thoughts?

Sara

[lysolqn]

The above are all valid points, but I have a thought that hasn't been addressed... When we call our TAs to ask (most) questions, or to make a booking change, they call X anyway. So, aren't X's CSRs doing about the same amount of work either way? How is this change any more cost effective if X A) isn't saving many man-hours, and B) is losing early bookings?

 

If a booking stays in-house, X has the expense of paying the salary of its in-house reps but does not have the added expense of paying a TA commission. If that same booking stays in-house until just prior to final payment when the pax moves the booking to a TA, X is not only paying its in-house reps (who have already done most, if not all of the work), but it also has the added expense of paying a commission to the TA (who, by virtue of getting the booking at such a late date, has done little if any of the work).

 

Pax will still be able to book through X, control their reservations and search for a better deal, the only difference being that under the new policy the window of opportunity will be 60 days rather than the months and in some cases, years pax have come to expect. How much more fair can one expect a for-profit business to be? Why should a cruise line be on the hook for a TA's commission when in effect, the only benefit the TA provided to the pax amounts to the gifting of amenities?

[Jade13]

The above are all valid points, but I have a thought that hasn't been addressed... When we call our TAs to ask (most) questions, or to make a booking change, they call X anyway. So, aren't X's CSRs doing about the same amount of work either way? How is this change any more cost effective if X A) isn't saving many man-hours, and B) is losing early bookings?

 

We switched our 2 upcoming bookings to a large, on-line TA just before final payment. Waited until then on the advice of TA as they charge $25 per change.

 

Not sure how we'll handle our bookings in the future. Leaning towards the benefits of a good, large TA vs. X. With X we are just one customer of many. A good TA should have better contacts, more clout. The recent cancellation of the Century cruise is a good example. I'd rather make one call to a TA than try to get X on the phone.

 

Thoughts?

Sara

 

Sara, I'm with you. I do not think it costs X more to manage my booking. And, yes, the TA's just call X anyway.

 

And, I have used TA's who have also told us to wait to transfer because with some each change cost a fee.

 

I think X is both trying to cut out the TA's and also change to a model where people book and the price is set, which for many will mean waiting to book until after the final payment date.

[cruzmaven]

Those benefits exist because the TA is handling it.

 

Doing it the other way is effectively double dipping, and RCL/Celebrity need to employ more support staff for something that they are paying a TA to do.

 

So when I call my TA to change my cabin or take advantage of reduced pricing, don't they then call Celebrity and talk to the same support staff I would have called if I was handling the reservation myself? Why is it different or less expensive for Celebrity to have the TA in the loop?

[Frankie Sue]

Nothing new there -TAs have always had to compete against the cruise line.

 

Pax abuse is responsible for killing this goose that laid the golden egg. Pax book through the cruise line to maintain control over their bookings, using the cruise line's reservation services to the max for as long as possible until such time as they switch those reservations to TAs to get the max out of those TAs in the form of added amenities, all the time expecting the cruise line to foot the bill not only for the reservation services it renders to those pax but also for payment of commission to their TAs who only enter the equation shortly before final payment. Until now pax have had the best of both worlds and still will under the new policy, but only for 60 days following booking. I think that's a pretty generous compromise on the part of the cruise line.

 

Geez.. thanks for the info. Up to now I had not realized that we should actually be thankful to Celebrity for letting book a cruise on their ships in the first place. I always thought that businesss was business and that the cruiselines were competing for MY business and not the other way around........

[scf1270]

If a booking stays in-house, X has the expense of paying the salary of its in-house reps but does not have the added expense of paying a TA commission. If that same booking stays in-house until just prior to final payment when the pax moves the booking to a TA, X is not only paying its in-house reps (who have already done most, if not all of the work), but it also has the added expense of paying a commission to the TA (who, by virtue of getting the booking at such a late date, has done little if any of the work).

 

Pax will still be able to book through X, control their reservations and search for a better deal, the only difference being that under the new policy the window of opportunity will be 60 days rather than the months and in some cases, years pax have come to expect. How much more fair can one expect a for-profit business to be? Why should a cruise line be on the hook for a TA's commission when in effect, the only benefit the TA provided to the pax amounts to the gifting of amenities?

 

Very good points! I agree with you! We all want the best cruising experience for the least amount of money. As a former purchasing agent, it's an important fact that the best value isn't always the same as the lowest price. It's been great to take advantage of price drops and OBC credits - but not surprising to see more restrictive booking policies.

 

We started cruising when we realized that a five night cruise cost less than just the hotel portion forfive nights at a nice, mid-range hotel. And the hotel wasn't including meals or activities :eek: !

 

There are many factors in choosing a vacation: Budget, transportation costs, schedule. A retiree in Florida has a lot more flexibility for jumping on last minute cruise than, say, a teacher in Kanasas who has to deal with high season cruise dates and airfares. Until we are planning a European cruise (please, please, please!!!) we'll probably stick with booking not more than 2-3 months out.

 

Has anyone found out how this will affect the Onboard Future Bookings program?

 

Sara

[Richiebaseball]

Celebrity has made their choice. I can even understand it. I've also made mine. I will only book after final payment. Celebrity won't have my money a year ahead of time and my TA won't get the commission. And I'll get a great deal. (I won't book unless it do.) I'll miss the planning in advance, but will probably make out better financially.

Cynthia

 

So it sounds like you typically book direct and then transfer to a TA just before final to get a perk. Now you'll only book within final payment but will not book with your TA. I'm curious as to why you're cutting your TA out. Since there is no more price protection after final payment you will not have the need to "control" your reservation for price drops, the OBC or whatever perk you're getting is still there if that is something your TA usually does.

[Richiebaseball]

I think many of you are missing the point.

 

If you control the booking and Celebrity has to maintain the staff to process the booking, they pay the staff.

 

If the TA handles the booking and then Celebrity pays the TA. I would guess that this is pretty much a toss up.

 

Actually, since Celebrity has to maintain the staff to handle all of the requests from the TA's, I would guess that it actually costs them more for a TA controlled reservation than for one that is directly controlled by the guest.

 

My TA company believes that this is another attempt by a travel company to reduce or eliminate the cost of commissions to the TA, much like what happened with the airline industry, no airline (to my knowledge) pays travel agent commissions today.

 

We live in a connected society, with each passing day more and more people become accustomed to booking their own travel, online banking and bill payment, communication by texting or talking with computers.

 

We on Cruise Critic are, for the most part, very knowledgeable about cruising, pricing, and how to book and plan a cruise. I realize that there is a need for Travel Agencies to handle the needs of the first timers or those new to cruising, but that number is diminishing.

 

Our local Travel Agency, with whom we have done business with, for over thirty years, just recently closed their doors. They have consolidated all of their offices into one in Little Rock, 90 miles away.

 

Now our small city of over 30,000 does not have a brick and mortar travel agency. It is a sign of the times.

 

Good observations. With regard to brick and mortar locations, those with a retail office, margins have become so thin over the years that those models are disappearing. There are still a few but less and less each year.

It should be no secret that a cruise line would like to have more direct bookings. But they also realize that unlike the airlines, a cruise is entirely discretionary income and they count on a sales force of travel agents to recommend, sell, advertise, etc., cruises.

A good agency should be able to answer most questions and make most changes without contacting the cruise line directly. The cruise lines are continuing to push agencies to use automation, in some cases paying more for automated bookings and in some cases not supporting certain types of rates. So they realize that agencies should make less calls than the consumers and for the most part they do.

[Richiebaseball]

So when I call my TA to change my cabin or take advantage of reduced pricing, don't they then call Celebrity and talk to the same support staff I would have called if I was handling the reservation myself? Why is it different or less expensive for Celebrity to have the TA in the loop?

 

There are some changes that only the cruise lines can do however many, if not most, can be handled automatically.

[lysolqn]

Geez.. thanks for the info. Up to now I had not realized that we should actually be thankful to Celebrity for letting book a cruise on their ships in the first place. I always thought that businesss was business and that the cruiselines were competing for MY business and not the other way around........

 

Snarkiness excused, no one is suggesting you owe X a debt of gratitude for anything, least of all allowing you to book a cruise. I don't blame pax for trying to get the best deal out there, but neither do I blame Celebrity for not wanting to continue to pay commissions to TAs whose sole last minute involvement in the booking process amounts to nothing more than luring away opportunistic pax with promises of freebies. Why should pax get the best use of the cruise line's reservations service, toss it aside when it suits them and then expect the cruise line to pay for them to do business with someone else? Notwithstanding, pax will continue to retain that option for sixty days from booking which should be long enough to see what other offers are out there.

[Cuizer2]

Nothing new there -TAs have always had to compete against the cruise line.

 

Since when have the TA been in competition against the cruise lines?

[LunaSeaRetreat]

So it sounds like you typically book direct and then transfer to a TA just before final to get a perk. Now you'll only book within final payment but will not book with your TA. I'm curious as to why you're cutting your TA out. Since there is no more price protection after final payment you will not have the need to "control" your reservation for price drops, the OBC or whatever perk you're getting is still there if that is something your TA usually does.

 

That's correct. My online TA has even expressed his thanks to me many times for doing all the work before final payment. However, I'm sure he can't beat many of the deals I receive from other online agents. For instance, I recently received and offer for air, hotel 2 nights, balcony, and $500 on Azamara. I'm sure he couldn't beat it. Because of my old policy of booking very early and transferring I already had a cruise booked and paid for so I couldn't do it. With my new policy, I'll go with best deal. If I book a Tuesday deal with Celebrity and they let me transfer I'll go with my present TA.

 

I'm not changing my policy because I'm angry. I'm just reevaluating how I do business in light of the changes taking place.

Cynthia

[Jade13]

That's correct. My online TA has even expressed his thanks to me many times for doing all the work before final payment. However, I'm sure he can't beat many of the deals I receive from other online agents. For instance, I recently received and offer for air, hotel 2 nights, balcony, and $500 on Azamara. I'm sure he couldn't beat it. Because of my old policy of booking very early and transferring I already had a cruise booked and paid for so I couldn't do it. With my new policy, I'll go with best deal. If I book a Tuesday deal with Celebrity and they let me transfer I'll go with my present TA.

 

I'm not changing my policy because I'm angry. I'm just reevaluating how I do business in light of the changes taking place.

Cynthia

 

Which Azamara cruise? Just fyi, many if not most currently have $500.00 OBC from Azamara, and many sailing have a Choice Air credit, and/or open bar (Caribbean sailings). I have not heard of the hotel deal though.

[lysolqn]

Since when have the TA been in competition against the cruise lines?

 

Huh? TAs have always been in competition with the cruise lines because pax have always had the choice between booking through an agent or booking directly with the cruise line!

[PartyAllDaTyme]

We booked onboard our last cruise. I was so anxious to take advantage of transferring the booking to gain a TA's OBC that I transferred the booking within a month. Somehow, I was under the impression that OBC offers would dry up the closer we got to the sail date, similar to how airline prices tend to rise as you get closer to the flight date. Silly me.

 

So far, I've been satisfied with the dealings I've had with the TA I went with. She's been quick to respond to cabin change requests (two in one day, would have been four, but I called to cancel one change before she had a chance to play the voicemail message I left her) and for information about the big 70 day/75 day deadline for final payment drama. No charges ever for changes. I do have to look for price drops myself, but I enjoy doing that myself anyway. So for me, control of the booking is not a factor. The moral of the story-- find yourself a good TA, one that's quick to respond and doesn't charge for changes, and the new policy will be a non-issue.

 

I don't see how the addition of a middleman in handling the booking will cut down on the workload for X-- they're either talking to me or to my TA. My take on this is it's to discourage people from transferring the booking to a TA in the first place so they don't have to dole out the commission. Booked with X, but lost track of time? Aww, too bad. If you want to cancel and rebook, you'll lose the perks you received for your onboard booking, and you may not get that great cabin back. I'm just glad that transferring the booking to a TA does not negate the onboard booking benefits, and that they allow transferring the booking in the first place.

[lysolqn]

I don't see how the addition of a middleman in handling the booking will cut down on the workload for X-- they're either talking to me or to my TA. My take on this is it's to discourage people from transferring the booking to a TA in the first place so they don't have to dole out the commission. Booked with X, but lost track of time? Aww, too bad. If you want to cancel and rebook, you'll lose the perks you received for your onboard booking, and you may not get that great cabin back. I'm just glad that transferring the booking to a TA does not negate the onboard booking benefits, and that they allow transferring the booking in the first place.

 

I'm guessing from this point forward, onboard bookings will be subject to the same 60-day transfer window. However, I'm curious to know how X will handle the purchase of open-ended onboard Celebrity Passport purchases which by definition aren't linked to a specific cruise. Guessing again, I'm thinking the clock won't start ticking until that purchase is linked to a particular cruise some time in the future.

[Cuizer2]

Huh? TAs have always been in competition with the cruise lines because pax have always had the choice between booking through an agent or booking directly with the cruise line!

 

Service wise yes. But when I was referring to cutting the legs out I meant price wise. If the cruise line discounts because it is not paying a commission, then the cruise line is competing with the TA based on price. That is not good for the cruise line.

[lysolqn]

Service wise yes. But when I was referring to cutting the legs out I meant price wise. If the cruise line discounts because it is not paying a commission, then the cruise line is competing with the TA based on price. That is not good for the cruise line.

 

No mention has been made of the cruise line discounting. Not only does the cruse line not discount (commission or otherwise), it doesn't permit agents to discount either - although we all know agents get around that restriction by offering gifts of onboard credit, free gratuities, insurance, specialty dinners, etc. Thus price wise, if anyone has had the competitive edge until now, it's been the TAs - which is more than likely why going forward, that edge is going to be dulled a bit and pax will have only 60 days in which to transfer bookings from the cruise line to a TA.

[Cuizer2]

Or...how about giving me a fare reduction for not transferring the booking to a TA, since they won't have to pay a commission. :rolleyes:

 

How about they just cut the TA's legs out from under them. Your suggestion would mean that the TA now has to compete against the cruise line.

 

Nothing new there -TAs have always had to compete against the cruise line.

 

No mention has been made of the cruise line discounting. Not only does the cruse line not discount (commission or otherwise), it doesn't permit agents to discount either...

 

My original post that you replied to quoted the the person to said they were looking for a discount from the cruise line because the cruise line would not have to pay a commission. So it has been mentioned, and that is what I was referring to.

 

Why don't you go back and read the ENTIRE thread.

[lysolqn]

My original post that you replied to quoted the the person to said they were looking for a discount from the cruise line because the cruise line would not have to pay a commission. So it has been mentioned, and that is what I was referring to.

 

Why don't you go back and read the ENTIRE thread.

 

I have read the entire thread, thank you very much. What appears in print is often misunderstood due to lack of inflection and difficulty in communicating specific intent which is otherwise obvious in normal conversation. Case in point, when I said no discounting has been mentioned, I was referring to the new transfer policy and not to what you assumed was a post in which someone suggested discounting if the cruise line wasn't going to be paying commissions. So, you misread my intent just as I misread yours. Hardly a reason to get one's knickers in a knot, wouldn't you agree? Happy cruising.

[webecruzn2]

I'm guessing from this point forward, onboard bookings will be subject to the same 60-day transfer window. However, I'm curious to know how X will handle the purchase of open-ended onboard Celebrity Passport purchases which by definition aren't linked to a specific cruise. Guessing again, I'm thinking the clock won't start ticking until that purchase is linked to a particular cruise some time in the future.

Any booking made after 10/18/10 is under new policy according to resolutions department at RCL. On board bookings have a creation date even if no specific cruise is booked.

[jagoffee]

Any booking made after 10/18/10 is under new policy according to resolutions department at RCL. On board bookings have a creation date even if no specific cruise is booked.

 

If no specific cruise is booked then it is a FCC which is really the deposit for a future booking, so you may have misunderstood? Are you saying that someone at RCL told your or implied that it would not be 60 days from the date that you applied your FCC to an actual booking, but 60 days from the date that you purchased the FCC?

[scf1270]

Snarkiness excused, no one is suggesting you owe X a debt of gratitude for anything, least of all allowing you to book a cruise. I don't blame pax for trying to get the best deal out there, but neither do I blame Celebrity for not wanting to continue to pay commissions to TAs whose sole last minute involvement in the booking process amounts to nothing more than luring away opportunistic pax with promises of freebies. Why should pax get the best use of the cruise line's reservations service, toss it aside when it suits them and then expect the cruise line to pay for them to do business with someone else? Notwithstanding, pax will continue to retain that option for sixty days from booking which should be long enough to see what other offers are out there.

 

What she said :D!! While I have enjoyed the benefits of being an "opportunistic pax lured away with promises of freebies" :rolleyes:, this new move makes good business sense and is much more in line with other travel providers business models.

 

If no specific cruise is booked then it is a FCC which is really the deposit for a future booking, so you may have misunderstood? Are you saying that someone at RCL told your or implied that it would not be 60 days from the date that you applied your FCC to an actual booking, but 60 days from the date that you purchased the FCC?

 

Inquiring minds want to know!! We'll have the opportunity to do Future Bookings on 2 upcoming cruises. If it is 60 days after booking the actual cruise, okay. But if it is 60 days from the time of Future Booking deposit we'll probably skip it.

 

Sara

[Cuizer2]

I have read the entire thread, thank you very much. What appears in print is often misunderstood due to lack of inflection and difficulty in communicating specific intent which is otherwise obvious in normal conversation. Case in point, when I said no discounting has been mentioned, I was referring to the new transfer policy and not to what you assumed was a post in which someone suggested discounting if the cruise line wasn't going to be paying commissions. So, you misread my intent just as I misread yours. Hardly a reason to get one's knickers in a knot, wouldn't you agree? Happy cruising.

 

I'm not wearing any knickers.

[lysolqn]

I'm not wearing any knickers.

 

Deflect, deflect, deflect...lol!