Do you think NCL owes them anything?

[Ask4Jay]

Forgive me, but I look at the situation differently.

I think most of us agree that NCL does not owe anybody any refund or OCB, yes? However, it would be nice if they did something.

 

On the other hand, should they collect 1/7th of the fare from those passengers who are occupying their cabins an extra day beyond the agreed-upon time? Never mind that they couldn't vacate their cabins, even if they wanted to. But they did have an extra day of shipboard life well fed and entertained.

 

For NCL that would mean that they would lose one day of income for every cabin on the ship from the "old" cruisers and refund another day's income to the "new" cruisers. And in this scenario it does not matter whether it's a cash refund or OBC. After all, a loss is a loss. And since nobody would be real happy with something in the range of $75 to $100, it would have to be one day's fare, yes? Everybody happy?

 

I sure hope NCL is covered for this.

 

How about we leave NCL out of this and have the "old" pax pay the "new" pax directly? I know; just dreaming.

 

I am lucky, we just came back on the Jewel last Saturday, one week before Irene.

 

However, in fairness we should give NCL some time to decide and not expect an immediate decision.

 

 

Juergen (and Helen)

Via Tapatalk & iPod touch.

[smeyer418]

In general when a trip is shortened for any reason, a credit is given for the missed day. Whether they will do this as an OBC or a refund you will have to wait and see. Would insurance cover it? not necessarily as the ship sailed. They would cover if you couldn't make it because of the storm, if you reason for not making it is a covered event.

 

It has nothing to do with whose fault it is. It is simply how many days you contracted for and how many you got....

No one says that NCL can't make the change that is wholly within their unfettered discretion, its an issue as to what you contracted for and what you got...

wait and see....

 

the people who get the extra day get a freebee....except they may be charged the DSC...wait until we hear people complaining about THAT...

[Flair3000]

Just the facts.. Celebrity Summit updated there customers way ahead of NCL. Celebrity also are telling there customers they will received a letter at check in telling there customers how much credit they will receive. Those facts will help me make my next years choice. :confused:

[QueenofEverything]

It is pretty simple, really. It is in your cruise contract that they are not responsible for weather related events.

 

However, how each cruiseline handles these situations might tell you whether you want to cruise with them again, It is not about obligation, it is all about PR.

 

What happened in Puerto Rico with RCCL and Carnival shows how two different cruiselines handled the same problem. Obviously, one handled it better PR-wise than the other.

 

Last year, we were supposed to go on a Disney cruise, when the ship got stuck at Castaway Cay due to weather. It came in a day late, so we missed a day of our trip, which was St Maartin. Unfortunately, that was the port we were looking forward to the most. Our 7 day cruise became a 6 day cruise. What did they owe us? Nothing, it was a weather event.

 

Although they owed us nothing, they told everyone to go to Epcot, where they had set up a special pavillion to handle the cruiseline passengers. They had free snacks, ice cream, movies set up for the kids and several characters including Mickey and Minnie. They were lining up passengers with free hotel rooms and free transportation (the line took a long time, but they were doing the best they could!) Because it was President's Day weekend and also the Daytona 500, they did not have enough rooms on property for everyone. They put us up at a very nice hotel near the convention center, gave us free park hopper passes for the day and $15 per person on a Disney Gift card for lunch. They provided continental breakfast the next day and free transportation to the port. They also gave us $125.00 per cabin OBC.

 

Did they have to do this? No. Were we happy with Disney? Oh, yes.

[emcelh]

Just the facts.. Celebrity Summit updated there customers way ahead of NCL. Celebrity also are telling there customers they will received a letter at check in telling there customers how much credit they will receive. Those facts will help me make my next years choice. :confused:

 

 

I'm not sure that waiting to make a decision was the wrong thing to do. There was always a possibility (and still is) that the storm could change course and weaken. Perhaps they didn't want to commit too soon. As to whether or not there shouuld be a credit for the lost day.....that's another issue.

[njhorseman]

In general when a trip is shortened for any reason, a credit is given for the missed day. Whether they will do this as an OBC or a refund you will have to wait and see. Would insurance cover it? not necessarily as the ship sailed. They would cover if you couldn't make it because of the storm, if you reason for not making it is a covered event.

 

It has nothing to do with whose fault it is. It is simply how many days you contracted for and how many you got....

No one says that NCL can't make the change that is wholly within their unfettered discretion, its an issue as to what you contracted for and what you got...

wait and see....

 

the people who get the extra day get a freebee....except they may be charged the DSC...wait until we hear people complaining about THAT...

 

I assume it won't surprise you that the Guest Ticket Contract says otherwise...and if you want to claim it's an unenforceable provision, it will be up to you, the passenger, to pursue that claim.

 

6. Vessel and Voyage:

(a) Risk of Travel: The Guest admits and acknowledges that travel by ocean-going vessel occasionally

presents risks and circumstances that may be beyond the ability of the Carrier to reasonably control or

mitigate. The Guest's understanding includes all risks of travel, transportation, and handling of Guests

and baggage. The Guest therefore assumes the risk of and releases the Carrier from any injury, loss, or

damage whatsoever arising from, caused by, or in the judgment of the Carrier or Master rendered

necessary or advisable by reason of: any act of God or public enemies; force majeure; arrest; restraints of

governments or their departments or under color of law; piracy; war; revolution; extortion; terrorist actions

or threats; hijacking; bombing; threatened or actual rebellion, insurrection, or civil strife; fire, explosion,

collision, stranding or grounding; weather conditions; docking or anchoring difficulty; congestion; perils of

the sea, rivers, canals, locks or other waters; perils of navigation of any kind; lack of water or passageway

in canals; theft; accident to or from machinery, boilers, or latent defects (even though existing at

embarkation or commencement of voyages); barratry; desertion or revolt of the crew; seizure of ship by

legal process; strike, lockout or labor disturbance (regardless whether such strike, lockout or labor

disturbance results from a dispute between the Carrier and its employees or any other parties); or from

losses of any kind beyond the Carrier's control. Under any such circumstances the voyage may be

altered, shortened, lengthened, or cancelled in whole or part without liability to the Carrier for a refund or

otherwise

[smeyer418]

I assume it won't surprise you that the Guest Ticket Contract says otherwise...and if you want to claim it's an unenforceable provision, it will be up to you, the passenger, to pursue that claim.

 

6. Vessel and Voyage:

(a) Risk of Travel: The Guest admits and acknowledges that travel by ocean-going vessel occasionally

presents risks and circumstances that may be beyond the ability of the Carrier to reasonably control or

mitigate. The Guest's understanding includes all risks of travel, transportation, and handling of Guests

and baggage. The Guest therefore assumes the risk of and releases the Carrier from any injury, loss, or

damage whatsoever arising from, caused by, or in the judgment of the Carrier or Master rendered

necessary or advisable by reason of: any act of God or public enemies; force majeure; arrest; restraints of

governments or their departments or under color of law; piracy; war; revolution; extortion; terrorist actions

or threats; hijacking; bombing; threatened or actual rebellion, insurrection, or civil strife; fire, explosion,

collision, stranding or grounding; weather conditions; docking or anchoring difficulty; congestion; perils of

the sea, rivers, canals, locks or other waters; perils of navigation of any kind; lack of water or passageway

in canals; theft; accident to or from machinery, boilers, or latent defects (even though existing at

embarkation or commencement of voyages); barratry; desertion or revolt of the crew; seizure of ship by

legal process; strike, lockout or labor disturbance (regardless whether such strike, lockout or labor

disturbance results from a dispute between the Carrier and its employees or any other parties); or from

losses of any kind beyond the Carrier's control. Under any such circumstances the voyage may be

altered, shortened, lengthened, or cancelled in whole or part without liability to the Carrier for a refund or

otherwise

 

 

they can write what they want but the courts will not enforce this and they know it. primarily because they have not embarked yet.

[Hikini]

It's a no-win situation. I feel sorry for everyone involved. Including NCL.

[dongordon]

If I were NCL, for good public relations and for good business sense, I would offer the shortened cruise passengers a $200 cruise onboard credit per cabin that would not come close to costing them that amount considering what their profits are and also a $200 onboard credit per passenger on their next cruise on NCL. On the NCL documentary on the Discovery Channel, it was indicated that their profits come largely from onboard spending than from the actual cruise itself.

It is a "win/win" situation if they were to do this and keeps those loyal to NCL coming back to cruise on their ships again!

 

I would certainly be satisfied with that arrangement if I were a passenger on that cruise.

[debt]

I know this is a cruise message board, but am I the only one a little disgusted by this conversation? It's highly likely that hundreds, maybe thousands of people will have to deal with more then a missed port over the weekend. Seems to me the ammount of obc we "deserve" for the inconvience of having a cruise delayed is a little insensitive under the circumstances.

[njhorseman]

they can write what they want but the courts will not enforce this and they know it. primarily because they have not embarked yet.

 

But that's my point...the courts won't enforce it, but unless you, as the passenger, wants to spend the money take this through the legal system, NCL could just point to the contract and tell you "too bad". Why would a corporation knowingly put an unenforceable clause in a contract? Simply because they can just cite the contract and impose its conditions if they wish...and then look like good corporate citizens by offering you compensation that is actually less than the value you've lost, knowing there's almost no chance of having their feet held to the fire in court. You lose 1/7th of a cruise for which you paid $2800, and they should refund $400...but instead they don't give you a refund at all, they give you an on board credit, and it's not a $400 credit either, it's $200. Don't like it? Sue them in the Florida courts.

[njhorseman]

I know this is a cruise message board, but am I the only one a little disgusted by this conversation? It's highly likely that hundreds, maybe thousands of people will have to deal with more then a missed port over the weekend. Seems to me the ammount of obc we "deserve" for the inconvience of having a cruise delayed is a little insensitive under the circumstances.

 

So, just because someone is suffering from the storm, that's license for the cruise lines to unjustly enrich themselves at the expense of its passengers? By the way...I'm not on any of this weekend's cruises, I'm one of those who stands to suffer from the storm. Just because I have a potentially worse problem doesn't mean someone else doesn't deserve to be treated fairly.

[bob brown]

I agree that the contract 'lets them off the hook', so to speak. But as others have pointed out, passengers will see the way the Celebrity customers were handled, and choose their next cruise accordingly.

 

Less than a year ago, I was on the Gem, on her first cruise after her 'emergency' drydocking to repair her azipod thrust bearing. Due to a complication in repairing the Jewel the week before for the same problem, that caused it to start her cruise a day late, we were delayed several hours. The Jewel passengers did receive 1/7 refund and I believe some other OBC compensation. Also some out of town passengers were given room and board at local hotels. We had to cut out one of our ports as a result of leaving late, so we were given an OBC as well.

 

While a mechanical delay is not the same as a weather delay, contractually, I would think in the interest of good PR, NCL would follow the same policy anyway......

[rikatine]

A whole day cut off your 7 day vacation, warrants some compensation. 1/7th refund is not unreasonable. Many will incur additional expense not being able to embark on time. It would be different if you were still able to get on the ship on time. But this is not the case.

[TB007]

IMHO, compensation in the realm of 1/7th of the cost kind of seems like a no-brainer.

 

Bad weather affects a lot of various consumer-based businesses, and to the extent that the weather results in a cancellation (which, in a very real sense, this is, since its a cancellation of 1 day of a 7-day event), I can't think of any other consumer-based business venture that would not compensate the consumer for the loss. If I buy a ticket to a baseball game and it get's rained out, I get a ticket to another game or a refund...if I book a hotel for a 7-day stay and I show up and find out that my room is not available for the first day because of flooding caused by a storm, I don't have to pay for the night that I'm unable to stay the hotel...if I book a plane that is cancelled due to a hurricane, I get my money back...etc., etc., etc.

 

I'm not really sure why a cruise line should act any differently. Remember, this isn't an instance where the bad weather resulted in the consumer being unable to accept the pre-agreed upon services (such as where a traveller is unable to fly to a destination and thus loses a hotel deposit - which, by the way, is really the more appropriate analogy for those that argue that "its really you own fault for booking a cruise during hurricane season"), but rather an instance where the cruise line simply cannot perform services (i.e., a full 7-day cruise) that it already agree to provide. Plus, a cruise line is insured against these types of events. Not to pass at least a portion of the insurance proceeds on to the consumer would result in a windfall to the cruise line (they would (i) get a full day of onboard spending from the group that ends up with an additional day, (ii) not reimburse the group that paid for 7 days and only gets 6, and (iii) pocket the insurance proceeds from the event).

 

Thus, something in the realm of a 1/7 compensation seems right. In any event, our hearts and prayers go out to everyone affected by Irene.

[che5904]

Well I seriously hope that all you posters that believe NCL should pay and pay and pay everytime something just doesn't go the way it should regardless to the reason. Enjoy paying your higher cost on your next cruise.

 

Keep in mind folks this money has to come from somewhere. Anybody ever sit down and do the math on a ship of over 2000 getting 1/7th of their cruise fare back. Anyone that claims that NCL has insurance to cover this doesn't understand company insurance. Considering I've seen this wanted 3 times in just this last 2 weeks for issues, trying to claim that often they'd be dropped by the insurance company like a hotcake.

[sparks1093]

It is very clear that they are under no obligation, that is what your travel insurance is for!!!

 

If all they lose is one day of the cruise I doubt that their insurance would pay anything. If however they have to spend extra money for food and lodging that would probably be covered.

 

they can write what they want but the courts will not enforce this and they know it. primarily because they have not embarked yet.

 

It's all about preventing nuisance suits, or at least that's the way this layperson understands it.

 

Well I seriously hope that all you posters that believe NCL should pay and pay and pay everytime something just doesn't go the way it should regardless to the reason. Enjoy paying your higher cost on your next cruise.

 

Keep in mind folks this money has to come from somewhere. Anybody ever sit down and do the math on a ship of over 2000 getting 1/7th of their cruise fare back. Anyone that claims that NCL has insurance to cover this doesn't understand company insurance. Considering I've seen this wanted 3 times in just this last 2 weeks for issues, trying to claim that often they'd be dropped by the insurance company like a hotcake.

 

"Should" from a PR point of view is different than "should" from a legal point of view. And this isn't just PR affecting those sailing on the affected itinerary- it's PR for anyone thinking about cruising in general. Look at the two cruise lines in Puerto Rico and how they handled the same situation. If you were deciding to take a cruise which one would you chose- the line that went out of its way to help the passengers or the line that left the passengers to fend for themselves?

 

The one thing that NCL needs to improve on is customer communications. In my time here on CC that's the one constant that I've seen.

[che5904]

"Should" from a PR point of view is different than "should" from a legal point of view. And this isn't just PR affecting those sailing on the affected itinerary- it's PR for anyone thinking about cruising in general. Look at the two cruise lines in Puerto Rico and how they handled the same situation. If you were deciding to take a cruise which one would you chose- the line that went out of its way to help the passengers or the line that left the passengers to fend for themselves?

 

The one thing that NCL needs to improve on is customer communications. In my time here on CC that's the one constant that I've seen.

 

Whatever they did they would have bad PR anyway, since as you know from these boards, that nothing they offer is every good enough. This is more than just about what they give the ones that are missing a day, then there is the compensation to those who are getting to port a day late. I was just reminding everyone that this cost is going to have to come from somewhere, so be prepared to pay more.

 

As for NCL and communication, you are probably very right. There are always going to be areas of a company that need improvement. Hence the reason things are always changing in large corporations to hopefully improve things.

[newmexicoNita]

Well, I'm on the cruise, so obviously biased, but I would feel this way about any sailing, honestly.

 

I KNOW they owe us nothing, I KNOW it's in the contract, I KNOW the weather is out of NCL's control, I KNOW they make decisions to keep us all safe, and truthfully, I am happy to lose the day in order to keep everyone safe and also still get 6 days of our trip.

 

All that said, and especially given that Celebrity has already announced a credit for the SAME EXACT situation and with the bad press RCCL is getting this week for leaving pax and not offering any help.....I really believe they should throw us an OBC. It doesn't even have to be 1/7 of what we paid. Throw $50 or $100pp OBC to everyone. It wouldn't cost them much in the big picture and would go a LONG way to better my (and i'm sure others') opinion of NCL right now.

 

I'm very disappointed at the lack of communication thru all this. I GET that they have to wait and the storm could change at a moment's notice. But I would've just appreciated them updating their website with "hey we dont have any news yet, but we are still monitoring, etc etc"...instead of looking at that SAME update on their site from 8/24 til 8/26 at 2:50pm. They also updated their Facebook page well before their website. Just poor customer service.

 

Obviously you can see from my sig I'm an NCL fan. We had issues on our last 2 cruises as well so my feelings aren't all based on this one trip. I think maybe it's finally time for a break when we book our next cruise. An OBC wouldn't totally change my mind...but when recommending NCL in the future, you can believe it will factor in.

 

Oh and our group is 40 ppl, who plan to spend a great deal of money on the ship. We are spending almost $100pp just on the specialty dining. That is not counting the casino, shops, drinks, etc. We have no problem spending the money and still plan to have a great time.

 

I'm just saying throwing us a bone would go a long way for them. Hopefully they change their mind.

 

after all of you travel let us know if NCL does anything for you. My guess is, they will, but who knows?

[sparks1093]

Whatever they did they would have bad PR anyway, since as you know from these boards, that nothing they offer is every good enough. This is more than just about what they give the ones that are missing a day, then there is the compensation to those who are getting to port a day late. I was just reminding everyone that this cost is going to have to come from somewhere, so be prepared to pay more.

 

As for NCL and communication, you are probably very right. There are always going to be areas of a company that need improvement. Hence the reason things are always changing in large corporations to hopefully improve things.

 

Yep, there are always a few people that feel they are entitled to more than what the cruise line offers but they don't need to have 100% satisfaction to benefit from good PR.

 

As for the cost it would be/will be written off on their taxes so I doubt it would affect pricing in anyway (and it wouldn't surprise me if the cruise lines bean counters factor this in to the fares anyway).

[H82seaUgo]

Knowing the havoc IRENE has caused thus far, delay and extensions for others, but do you feel those whose cruise is shortened by (1) day should receive something from NCL?? (OBC etc.???)

 

Afterall it is chance you take sailing during Hurricane season.....

 

What are your thoughts???

 

carnival is doing it. why wouldn't ncl?

 

1/7th of a hurricane fare is still money collected by the line, and should be refunded.

 

good pr, as well.

[Davechipp74]

has anyone read the ticket contract?

or do you just blindly agree to it?

[che5904]

has anyone read the ticket contract?

or do you just blindly agree to it?

 

I'm sure over 75% don't but that really isn't what most are arguing. Most feel that they should do this for PR, since apparently other lines have had "spokespeople" say they were compensating. Which I believe they probably will anyway.

[tigerlilycruiser12]

What if you lost 2 days...3 days...

NCL gets away with it because it's a hurricane???

 

Sorry...I don't buy it.

BUT I have enough faith IN NCL to feel that they will compensate the passengers somehow.

 

Yes....last year we were on the spirit out of Boston when Igor hit Bermuda. We hadto go to the Florida route. Yes we all got some onboard credit.

[castagnola68]

Which ship had the 1 day short - Gem, Jewel or Sky?

How much time was really lost?

My sister is leaving on the Jewel this morning, she is pretty happy cause she gets 3 hours extra vacay time due to the early embarkment :)

 

But, the folks on the Jewel that just got off, what did they lose? Did they still have last nights events? Or did they have to get off the ship last night? From what I read, it sounded like they had to get off the boat at 6am, which is early (obviously).

 

From the reports, it sounds like Gem got an extra day unless I am not reading them correctly.

 

IMO, whoever got the trip should get cut short, should get OBC for their next cruise.. Everyone wants to go on another cruise anyway & then NCL gets you back. Or, maybe they can make it a fun reimbursement & give people a choice (go freestyle) maybe a spa treatment, a night at cagneys or the OBC. that would work for me (but i'm easygoing :)

 

-Stacey