P&O Cruises to withhold passengers' tips unless crew hit performance targets

[tom_uk]

Precisely how will staff pressurise customers? I guess the questionnaire will be filled in whilst in the privacy of your cabin. How will they know what rating you give?

 

Brian

 

Basically as Marylizcat has described above. Lots of messages from the waiters towards the end of the cruise such as "we aim to give excellent service, if you have problems please speak to us, don't just give us a bad mark", then "we need to have good marks!" and finally "I hope everyone is going to give us an EXCELLENT mark!!".

[dorsetlad]

We've just returned from Oceana, and I must say never experienced anything like that. Our waiters were excellent. There again, you can either accept the pressure, or turn it around in your favour. If I was bombarded with such comments, I would probably say something like

" You're doing OK up to now, and may even rate an excellent rating. However, if you keep harking on about what rating we should give you, you will certainly be marked down for being pushy & overbearing. So just continue giving us good service, and not continually telling us how good you are." I think you will find the pressure dropping away. Just my opinion, but you don't need to submit to pressure, and there is no excuse for it.

 

Brian

[Mooloo]

So if the cabin staff/restaurant staff/bar staff fail to reach the designated 96% customer satisfaction rating then they do not get their 'bonus' (share of the gratuity/tips). Which begs the question WHO DOES GET THE auto gratuity MONEY?

 

Answers on a post card: Is it a) It is returned to the customer, b) Carnival Corporate and they declare it as UK earnings and pay their fair share of UK tax, or is it c) Carnival Corporate and they declare it off-shore earnings and don't pay any tax.

 

Oh and what's the betting the CC remove posts from this thread as they could upset one of their sponsors!

This.

[jocap]

Originally, I thought the auto tips were a good idea, saving a lot of hassle with packets of sterling sitting in the safe until the last day. We've used auto tipping on American ships, and were aware that NCL staff were supposed to hand their tips in- though, looking back, that knowledge only came from posters on sites such as this.:confused:

Reading the pathetic publicity which has come out this week, I shall now remove auto tips.....I don't want Carnival telling me that my tips will be used for bonuses. It's back to the bundles of sterling in the safe, I'm afraid.:rolleyes:

Jo.

[Bobbyjean]

But if we give the staff cash, and the staff are then told they must hand the tips in anyway, what has been gained?

[jeanlyon]

Just found this on Crows Nest Forum - email direct from P&O to a customer

 

1) If gratuities are paid by auto gratuities they are administered by P&O but will be paid to the staff you intended them for.

 

2) If you pay directly to the staff then they do not have to pay them into the "pot" but get to keep the money.

 

3) Gratuities are separate from any bonus fund and are not dependant on the results of passenger questionnaires.

[marylizcat]

'Gratuities are separate from any bonus fund and are not dependant on the results of passenger questionnaires'

 

Aha! Now that wasn't the impression we had. If so, that is all OK then, if the bonus thing is entirely separate from the gratuities!

[bazzaw]

I regard myself to be an "undemanding" passenger - and require nothing from staff other than that they do their basic job. In fact, I prefer to be left alone - rather than be fussed over:)

 

My problem with "automatic - but not compulsory" gratuity systems is that I feel somewhat pressured to give additional cash tips. I may do so IF someone was to do something above and beyond the call of duty for me - but I have asked them to scrub my back in the bath and they won't!! :D So, I would prefer the old system of giving cash gratuities to staff - and and don't really want to line up in a queue and go through a 3rd degree interrogation at the reception desk to have the automatic gratuities removed. This is all starting to interfere with my enjoyment of cruising. Curse those Americans who have caused this - in Australia, P&O and Princess have removed all automatic tipping from their ships, so why the differences between Carnival lines??

 

Barry

[jeanlyon]

Well it's quite simple to me. I shall be taking off the auto-tips on Day 1 and paying mine in cash as I always do.

[Bob & Carol]

We have recently returned from a P&O cruise. This was our first cruise where gratuities have been added automatically to our accounts. Based on previous experience, we felt that this was probably a good idea as we had heard tales of passengers who didn’t show up for dinner on the last night so as to avoid tipping or, worse, handed over empty envelopes in order to save face.

However, as we had made extensive use of the alternative dining venues on board, tipping in each restaurant as we went along (didn’t use main restaurant at all during the cruise) we decided to have the auto-gratuities removed. Very straightforward process – handed completed form back to reception and auto-gratuities were removed from our accounts.

As a courtesy, we told our cabin steward that we had done this as we didn’t want him to be told of our decision by his supervisor and perhaps be left wondering if he wasn’t going to receive a tip from us at all. What he told us about the new tipping system made us glad that we acted as we had. He said that of the gratuities collected from passengers, the stewards received 50% for personal performance and 50% for team performance, both payments being dependent on achieving more than 96% ‘Excellent’ on the end-of-cruise Customer Feedback questionnaires. What this meant was that if two of his eighteen or twenty cabins ticked ‘Good’ rather than ‘Excellent’, his performance would fall below the 96% level, he would lose his 50% personal performance payment and ALL THE CABIN STEWARDS would also lose their 50% team performance payment. What is “fair and consistent”, to quote Carol Marlowe, about this? Does the withheld money get returned to the passengers who have paid it?

Based on what our steward told us, we ticked ‘Excellent’ for everything on our questionnaire as we don’t want to be responsible for crew members having their tips withheld. A downside of this, of course, is that P&O will think that they are delivering an ‘Excellent’ service, which we think they do, in the vast majority of cases.

Our steward was excellent and we rewarded him accordingly. However, it would be fair to say that he was very stressed by the demands placed upon him by the new system. It doesn’t look as though staff welfare and morale feature very highly in P&O management circles which is a great pity as the staff are, in our opinion, the company’s best asset.

[marylizcat]

We have recently returned from a P&O cruise. This was our first cruise where gratuities have been added automatically to our accounts. Based on previous experience, we felt that this was probably a good idea as we had heard tales of passengers who didn’t show up for dinner on the last night so as to avoid tipping or, worse, handed over empty envelopes in order to save face.

However, as we had made extensive use of the alternative dining venues on board, tipping in each restaurant as we went along (didn’t use main restaurant at all during the cruise) we decided to have the auto-gratuities removed. Very straightforward process – handed completed form back to reception and auto-gratuities were removed from our accounts.

As a courtesy, we told our cabin steward that we had done this as we didn’t want him to be told of our decision by his supervisor and perhaps be left wondering if he wasn’t going to receive a tip from us at all. What he told us about the new tipping system made us glad that we acted as we had. He said that of the gratuities collected from passengers, the stewards received 50% for personal performance and 50% for team performance, both payments being dependent on achieving more than 96% ‘Excellent’ on the end-of-cruise Customer Feedback questionnaires. What this meant was that if two of his eighteen or twenty cabins ticked ‘Good’ rather than ‘Excellent’, his performance would fall below the 96% level, he would lose his 50% personal performance payment and ALL THE CABIN STEWARDS would also lose their 50% team performance payment. What is “fair and consistent”, to quote Carol Marlowe, about this? Does the withheld money get returned to the passengers who have paid it?

Based on what our steward told us, we ticked ‘Excellent’ for everything on our questionnaire as we don’t want to be responsible for crew members having their tips withheld. A downside of this, of course, is that P&O will think that they are delivering an ‘Excellent’ service, which we think they do, in the vast majority of cases.

Our steward was excellent and we rewarded him accordingly. However, it would be fair to say that he was very stressed by the demands placed upon him by the new system. It doesn’t look as though staff welfare and morale feature very highly in P&O management circles which is a great pity as the staff are, in our opinion, the company’s best asset.

This is, of course, directly opposite to the ''Gratuities are separate from any bonus fund and are not dependant on the results of passenger questionnaires" so what on earth are we to think!? Do P & O actually know what is happening?

[dorsetlad]

It would seem that either P&O are giving misleading information, or the member of crew has misunderstood exactly what is happening. Whichever one it is, it's causing a lot of bad feeling it seems.

 

Brian

[Bob & Carol]

Our steward knew exactly what was happening. P&O asked staff members to participate in a working party to discuss the new set-up. Staff gave their input and management ignored it all and did what they wanted anyway.

 

He was very upset when he told us about it and, the following day, was even more worried that we would get him into trouble for discussing a taboo subject with passengers. He re-iterated that staff have been told not to discuss the tipping system with passengers. We have no reason to disbelieve what we were told and were left feeling greatly saddened at the injustice of it all.

[trfccruiser]

If anyone seriously believes that ,in the recent climate of cutting every cost possible to the bone,that P&O have created a bonus fund not made up of the autotipping fund,I'd be very surprised.I can accept the premise that staff get to keep their own tips (which they should) but I can't see any way that P& O (and carnival) have created a new bonus pot it must come from the autotips.Which, as has been said already,begs the question what happens to the money not paid to staff who don't meet the satisfaction rating?

If this is a mechanism for denying staff money when their basic wage is so low anyway,it is nothing short of shameful.

However,we have to go back to the fact that whilst cruise lines have clearly become devious about autotips(remember certain restaurant chains got into trouble a few years back for turning tips into salary?),the reason autotips came into play was that some tightfisted cruisers never tipped and have spoilt it for the rest of us.

I alwys tipped the "suggested" rate for average service below for poor service (rare but not unheard of) and above the suggested rate for good or better service (more the norm in my experience).

I have only experienced autotips once before on NCL and removed it and tipped above the rate for my waiter who was very good and below for my cabin steward who was a bit surly.I wasn't going to remove the autotip on my next cruise on P&O and possibly pay extra for good service,but if autotips are going to be hoovered by Carnival I'm not so sure now.

[Jenna109]

First cruise coming up with P&O and really didn't understand how all staff were tipped. I understood that the recommended amount was £1.50/£1.60 to cabin steward and waiter. This is very low by the charges made on Cunard, Celebrity and Princess. However, they stated that it would be shared between all staff on board (except drinks waiters who had their own 15% pot).

So under the old system of P&O how did background staff get a share of the tips unless waiters and stewards handed in their tips to be shared out between all staff?

Earlier posts mentioned the lowest member of staff on board would receive £250 per month which would rise to £400 with full bonus. I am sure passengers very rarely see the 'lowest member of staff' as these will work below decks so how do these get their bonus unless we agree to pay tips automatically?

I agree with the concern regarding 'where does the money go if staff do not reach their required standard' but if they do not then surely the management should be doing some retraining or moving staff to other more suitable positions.

On one cruise I paid my tips upfront but I really didn't like the waiter. If I had stopped them then all the other very hardworking background staff would have got nothing as you cannot go round tipping everyone.

[jeanlyon]

The Auto-tips are definitely for waiters and cabin stewards, not for background staff. That is made quite clear.

[capasamari]

Wherever we holiday there are always comment cards and my husband rarely if ever ticks the "excellent" box as he says there is always some room for improvement however good the staff have been.

 

Based on what people have reported on this thread might we be better not to complete the comment card at all but just tip the staff ourselves?

 

Carol x

[marylizcat]

We hardly ever fill in the comment cards as we are too busy enjoying our holiday or packing up to leave! So I hope that won't count as a zero per cent rating!

 

As has been said, if we all feel obliged to now put 'excellent', even if it was only good, there is definitely no point at all in completing them! A complete waste of time since they will tell P & O nothing useful.