Fred Osen - Braemar - Gratuities

[jantoby]

Next month's my first time with F.Olsen. I prefer to tip what I want to whom I want rather than automatic gratuities. (a) Can I ask Reception to remove automatics from my account? and (b) who gets a share of the automatics? Last time I was on a Royal Carib. I was told that even the Maitres d' get a share of the automatics, which I think is disgraceful.

[Mark_T]

The problem with giving to individuals is that no one person is really responsible for the service you get, they all depend on a chain of people that you never see to enable them to deliver service to you.

 

For that reason we much prefer to give via the automatic system in the knowledge that all involved in the service delivery get a share.

 

If an individual has delivered exceptional service in some way they we would deliver a small additional tip to them personally.

 

If you really do want to just tip those you see then ask at reception for the automatic charge to be removed.

[CRUISIN LINDA]

The problem with giving to individuals is that no one person is really responsible for the service you get, they all depend on a chain of people that you never see to enable them to deliver service to you.

 

But as the OP asks, who actually does get them? We always remove automatic tips, whatever line we are on and pay as we chose.

 

When you board, jantoby, just go to reception and ask to remove the tips and you will just sign a form and say why you wish to remove them.

[Mark_T]

Well, this is always an emotive issue and personal preferences will always differ.

 

When I've asked crew members if they are happier with the new or the old system they have invariably said they prefer the new system.

 

I'm certainly not going to try and tell others how they should tip, I just prefer knowing that the entire chain of people involved in delivering service to us get to benefit rather than just hoping that the person you hand the money to decides to share with those who help them behind the scenes.

 

I don't know exactly who is included and who is not, but at least I do know it is reaching further down the chain than I can do on my own.

[CRUISIN LINDA]

Well, we will agree to differ on that then :D:D

 

Don't want to get in a slanging match as on American boards :rolleyes:

[jantoby]

But as the OP asks, who actually does get them? We always remove automatic tips, whatever line we are on and pay as we chose.

 

When you board, jantoby, just go to reception and ask to remove the tips and you will just sign a form and say why you wish to remove them.

 

 

Thanks, Linda. Good know I can do it.

[LondonTowner]

We have done 4 FO cruises and have normally taken the tip off and given to individuals. In September we did a Baltic cruise on the Balmoral. Everybody seemed to help us so much that this time we left it on.

 

At least FO don't add the extra charges on the drinks like a lot of cruise lines.

[jantoby]

We have done 4 FO cruises and have normally taken the tip off and given to individuals. In September we did a Baltic cruise on the Balmoral. Everybody seemed to help us so much that this time we left it on.

 

At least FO don't add the extra charges on the drinks like a lot of cruise lines.

 

 

Thanks for mentioning the tip-free drinks. That'll make a nice change.

[dsrdsrdsr]

P&O give auto-tips to the stewards and waiters only, because that's who the tips are designed for and their salaries (and theirs alone) are adjusted downwards in the [not always realised] expectation that passengers will pay what they deserve.

 

With companies like Fred Olsen and most others, where auto-tips are distributed to everyone bar the ship's cat, this means that they're paying everyone less than the going rate in salary and topping it up with tips. The tips can't possibly reflect the service you've received, because how could anyone tell if you're not happy with the performance of the second assistant to the assistant second engineer? Let alone how you could go about trying to restrict his tips. If you receive rotten service from your steward and think he's worth no tip at all, by removing the autotip you're costing him about a penny a day - he still gets tips from all the other passengers.

 

Auto-tips to all crew aren't tips at all, in the recognised "rewards for service provided" sense. If the entire ship is staffed by surly unhelpful crew, then you could reasonably deduct autotips; but it won't be,so you're stuck with them. You'd be robbing the underpaid staff otherwise.

 

It's basically a device to make the headline cruise price appear lower than it really is.

[rosiepea]

Reception will remove automatic tipping if you ask. Their charge per night per person gets to your table waiters and your rom hostess.

[Cruzcritik]

The waiters, asst. waiters, celler master ( in charge of dinning room beverages) and stewardess get the pre paid tips and nobody else.

 

The going rate in the UK is £6.31 per hour. Now times that by 10 hours a day x 30 and you get just under £2000 tax free, which equates to a net income equivalent in the Uk of around £1600 pounds. But you are not in the UK, you are in international waters. The going rate in manila, New Dehli, Bangkok, Jakarta, Mexico, Cuba are all different and and tourists who go there do not expect to pay the "going rate" of the UK minimum wage. How many guests walk up to reception and insist that the staff of the hotel are paid the UK "Going Rate" how silly… their tourist industry would collapse and many people would be without a job.

You may very well be surprised how much a waiter can make with an average of 44 guests per day over two sittings being paid £4.00 per person per day .. thats £3500 pounds split 60 - 40.. with his asst. waiter. Not bad when most of the crew come from Asia where £300 quid a month is the average salary. Not bad even if you are from the UK, willing to work 7 days a week and receive all that tax free, and somebody does your washing cooks for you, feeds you as well.. no deductions! If you want that staff are paid the Uk going rate you can substantially increase your fare… and then you wouldn't come.. and then all those lovely staff would be without a job…on FO, you can remove it and this will affect the waiters salary but not his service. Most cruise lines run at 85% compliant or above when it comes to pre paid tips… your waiters generally receives the salary of a GP back in his own country… not bad eh?

 

 

 

P&O give auto-tips to the stewards and waiters only, because that's who the tips are designed for and their salaries (and theirs alone) are adjusted downwards in the [not always realised] expectation that passengers will pay what they deserve.

 

With companies like Fred Olsen and most others, where auto-tips are distributed to everyone bar the ship's cat, this means that they're paying everyone less than the going rate in salary and topping it up with tips. The tips can't possibly reflect the service you've received, because how could anyone tell if you're not happy with the performance of the second assistant to the assistant second engineer? Let alone how you could go about trying to restrict his tips. If you receive rotten service from your steward and think he's worth no tip at all, by removing the autotip you're costing him about a penny a day - he still gets tips from all the other passengers.

 

Auto-tips to all crew aren't tips at all, in the recognised "rewards for service provided" sense. If the entire ship is staffed by surly unhelpful crew, then you could reasonably deduct autotips; but it won't be,so you're stuck with them. You'd be robbing the underpaid staff otherwise.

 

It's basically a device to make the headline cruise price appear lower than it really is.

[Cruising Nomads]

Please explain how you get to £3500.

[jeanlyon]

The automatic tips are for your cabin stewards and waiters, not for the whole crew. We always remove ours and tip personally. We do this on P&O as well. What they do with it after that is up to them.

[dsrdsrdsr]

The waiters, asst. waiters, celler master ( in charge of dinning room beverages) and stewardess get the pre paid tips and nobody else.

I gathered from further up the thread that Fred Olsen followed the less traditional approach of sharing the tips between the entire crew - which makes them not tips at all. If the auto-tips are just a convenient (and optional) way of collecting tips for the people who actually serve you, I'm fine with that. (Which must be load off Mr. Olsen's mind! ;))

[Cruzcritik]

Please explain how you get to £3500.

 

44 guests per day- thats 22 first sitting and 22 second sitting each paying £4 per day = £176 per day and times that by 30 =£5,280 per month split 65% for waiter and 35% for asst. waiter, gives the waiter £3,432 per month in prepaid tips based on 100% compliance. This does not take into account any further tips for outstanding service which may be offered extra, ( ratios of split may differ depending on cruise line)

[Cruzcritik]

I gathered from further up the thread that Fred Olsen followed the less traditional approach of sharing the tips between the entire crew - which makes them not tips at all. If the auto-tips are just a convenient (and optional) way of collecting tips for the people who actually serve you, I'm fine with that. (Which must be load off Mr. Olsen's mind! ;))

 

That is incorrect. The entire crew do not get a cut of the tips as some are salaried and some are dependant on gratuities.

[Willow1686]

44 guests per day- thats 22 first sitting and 22 second sitting each paying £4 per day = £176 per day and times that by 30 =£5,280 per month split 65% for waiter and 35% for asst. waiter, gives the waiter £3,432 per month in prepaid tips based on 100% compliance. This does not take into account any further tips for outstanding service which may be offered extra, ( ratios of split may differ depending on cruise line)

 

You are making certain assumptions which are difficult to support; one is that cruises are always fully booked with no singles travelling in double cabins. Ships are not always fully booked, and I myself am travelling solo in a double cabin on the Braemar. I am by no means unusual; I chose it precisely because there was an excellent deal to be had by singles. I'm not the only solo traveller who will have spotted it.

 

Secondly, the waiters in the various informal restaurants where there are no fixed sittings presumably, on the grounds of fairness, receive a share of the waiters' tips; that again changes the amounts available to the waiters in the MDR...

[Cruising Nomads]

If you are talking about Fred Olsen I think you will find that the amount per day is £2.00 for the waiters.

[papcx]

44 guests per day- thats 22 first sitting and 22 second sitting each paying £4 per day = £176 per day and times that by 30 =£5,280 per month split 65% for waiter and 35% for asst. waiter, gives the waiter £3,432 per month in prepaid tips based on 100% compliance. This does not take into account any further tips for outstanding service which may be offered extra, ( ratios of split may differ depending on cruise line)

 

Hi there.

 

Are they facts or your assumptions?

[Cruzcritik]

Hi there.

 

Are they facts or your assumptions?

 

These are factual statistics as per the website.

 

Gratuities

Gratuities are not included in the cost of your cruise holiday. However we are confident that you’ll wish to reward staff on board for their service, although tipping is entirely at your discretion. As a general rule £2.00 per adult Guest per day for your cabin stewardess and the same amount for your restaurant waiter is always very much appreciated. For our guests convenience this is automatically added to your cruise end account. Please however contact Reception once on board should you wish to vary this amount.

 

Although how they split is up to the company, I am just pointing out that with at least 85% of compliance there is quite a pot of cash to be split between, waiter, asst. waiter and stewardess, before extra gratuities. FO is generally the cheaper of cruise line in pre paid tips. However to assume that staff are in anyway underpaid or disadvantaged is incorrect….

[Cruzcritik]

You are making certain assumptions which are difficult to support; one is that cruises are always fully booked with no singles travelling in double cabins. Ships are not always fully booked, and I myself am travelling solo in a double cabin on the Braemar. I am by no means unusual; I chose it precisely because there was an excellent deal to be had by singles. I'm not the only solo traveller who will have spotted it.

 

Secondly, the waiters in the various informal restaurants where there are no fixed sittings presumably, on the grounds of fairness, receive a share of the waiters' tips; that again changes the amounts available to the waiters in the MDR...

 

Yes, these assumptions are based on the facts from FO website. My initial reply was to dispel the fact that some pax think that tips are shared equally by all, however they are not. All cruise ships aim to sell 100% of cabins and for the most are at least 95% or more full, unless it is certain legs of a world cruise.

[Cruising Nomads]

Cruzcritik are you now saying that you doubled up what the waiters earn in tips over a 30 day period

[Willow1686]

Yes, these assumptions are based on the facts from FO website. My initial reply was to dispel the fact that some pax think that tips are shared equally by all, however they are not. All cruise ships aim to sell 100% of cabins and for the most are at least 95% or more full, unless it is certain legs of a world cruise.

 

But the FO website says nothing at all about their ships being 95% or more full, so you are not basing that assumption on the 'facts' from their website.

 

I am basing my comments on the facts as relayed to me by my travel agent explaining why I have been able to get a superior outside twin cabin for my sole use at a very good price.

 

Earlier this year I sailed with Azamara as a solo in a twin balcony cabin, with no single supplement and a double upgrade, and then with Voyages to Antiquity as a solo in a twin balcony cabin, at a greatly reduced price and with no single supplement. Neither ship was remotely close to 95% full, and both of them have dropped tipping so potential passengers were clearly not being put off by worrying about tipping.

 

Given the number of similar offers from other cruise lines filling my mailbox it is clear that there are a lot of companies chasing too few passengers; the days when ships sailed full are long gone...

[Cruzcritik]

Cruzcritik are you now saying that you doubled up what the waiters earn in tips over a 30 day period

 

with this particular cruise line if they only allocate £2.00 to split between waiter and asst. waiter that is their choice. However my statement were in regards to staff not being paid 'the going Rate". At 100% occupancy they would receive £2,650 before any extra tips they earn or commission on sales - if they have that too. There are of course certain cruises which can be difficult to sell because of length or repositioning.

 

For example Celebrity pay in dollars

Waiter $3.65 per day

Assistant waiter $2.10 per day

 

 

My point is - the going rate on these reputable cruise lines is lucrative.

[Mark_T]

My point is - the going rate on these reputable cruise lines is lucrative.

 

That rather ignores the fact that staff are working 7 days a week for the duration of their contract with little or no time off, then have breaks between contracts when they earn nothing at all.

 

Not sure I'd regard that as 'lucrative' but I'm sure it is worth more than they could easily get at home in most cases or they would not choose to work such unsocial hours and such long periods away from their families.