Cruise Passenger Assaulted on Holland America Cruise Ship

[Linda&Vern]

http://nydn.us/1ja9txG

This was not a nude cruise. The passenger allegedly sweared at the guy when he knocked on her door for a delivery. He got angry, used a master key to enter her cabin while she was out, waited on her balcony for her to come back, and assaulted her when she entered her cabin. Too bad he didn't jump overboard!

I believe it was a chartered cruise. A nude cruise. Which matters not. What the HAL employee did was unforgivable!

Edited February 19, 2014 by Linda&Vern

[cruisin'girl]

The cruise was a nude charter sold by the group Bare Necessities. We have no idea if this contributed to this guy's belief it was okay to kill her for the words he thought she said to him or not. But it doesn't matter what kind of cruise it was. He belongs in prison the rest of his life.

[serendipity1499]

http://nydn.us/1ja9txG

 

This was not a nude cruise. The passenger allegedly sweared at the guy when he knocked on her door for a delivery. He got angry, used a master key to enter her cabin while she was out, waited on her balcony for her to come back, and assaulted her when she entered her cabin. Too bad he didn't jump overboard!

 

I bolded your statement because it is not entirely true.. You might want to read all the closed threads before making such statements..

 

We've been following this for several days.. The FEB 09 New Amsterdam cruise was a charter for Nudist's.. On one of the threads, another one of the Psgrs who was on board, explains about this group.. The media chose not to divulge this info probably because someone would blame the chartering organization or the Psgr..

 

The Passenger was attacked by a maniac, who claims he was angry at a perceived slight... This can in no way reflect on the Psgr, but understand she will be dragged through the court system unless the Perp. pleads guilty to this horrific crime.. Hopefully, the Psgr will eventually heal & will have a good Attorney to represent her..

 

I sent some of the articles to my Children & grand-children, not to scare them, but to caution them about taking precautions while on their cruises..

 

Betty

[serendipity1499]

http://nydn.us/1ja9txG

 

This was not a nude cruise. The passenger allegedly sweared at the guy when he knocked on her door for a delivery. He got angry, used a master key to enter her cabin while she was out, waited on her balcony for her to come back, and assaulted her when she entered her cabin. Too bad he didn't jump overboard!

 

The thread referring to the Nude cruise is this:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1991229&page=2

 

See post 26 which explained this was a charter for nudists..

 

It gives us a better understanding of this type of group.. Also understand that they all dress up for dinner..

[mollyanne]

Why would a waiter have a master key for rooms? Doesn't make sense to me.

[sail7seas]

Why would a waiter have a master key for rooms? Doesn't make sense to me.

 

 

I'm not convinced it was a Room Service Steward (waiter).

He has been described as 'Room Service Attendant' and we are taking that to mean he delivered food to cabins but I think it could be a language thing.

 

I think he possibly was a cabin steward........ a crew person who 'services rooms..... as in cleans and maintains them.

I still do not think that Room Service Stewards have master keys to enter cabins. Cabin stewards do.

 

[artist47]

I'm not convinced it was a Room Service Steward (waiter).

He has been described as 'Room Service Attendant' and we are taking that to mean he delivered food to cabins but I think it could be a language thing.

 

I think he possibly was a cabin steward........ a crew person who 'services rooms..... as in cleans and maintains them.

I still do not think that Room Service Stewards have master keys to enter cabins. Cabin stewards do.

 

 

 

Agree 100 percent! "Room service" can mean "food delivery" which is what most Americans take it to mean...but in Europe it can also mean people that are in general, assigned to clean the room or service it in any other way. From what I've read, this was a cabin steward. Of course, he might have been pulling double duty in "room service" (as in food delivery) if they were short on staff. That's possible too isn't it?

[cruisin'girl]

I'm not convinced it was a Room Service Steward (waiter).

He has been described as 'Room Service Attendant' and we are taking that to mean he delivered food to cabins but I think it could be a language thing.

 

I think he possibly was a cabin steward........ a crew person who 'services rooms..... as in cleans and maintains them.

I still do not think that Room Service Stewards have master keys to enter cabins. Cabin stewards do.

 

Why would a cabin steward be delivering breakfast from the galley? Didn't another poster say he was their dining room steward? How could one crew member be working as a cabin steward AND a dining room steward?

[artist47]

Why would a cabin steward be delivering breakfast from the galley? Didn't another poster say he was their dining room steward? How could one crew member be working as a cabin steward AND a dining room steward?

 

 

It is possible he was pulling double duty, either by choice (to make more money) or by assignment, if the ship was short staffed. That's the only reason I can come up with for this seeming discrepancy.

[mollyanne]

Why would a cabin steward be delivering breakfast from the galley? Didn't another poster say he was their dining room steward? How could one crew member be working as a cabin steward AND a dining room steward?

 

Yes - someone posted that the assailant was their dining room waiter but didn't say if he was the waiter or assistant.

[cruisin'girl]

It is possible he was pulling double duty, either by choice (to make more money) or by assignment, if the ship was short staffed. That's the only reason I can come up with for this seeming discrepancy.

As short staffed and over worked as the cabin stewards are they take one away in the morning, the busiest time of the day for cabin stewards when there are so many cabins to be cleaned, and have him do room service deliveries? Does that really make sense? Isn't it more likely there would be more dining room stewards available in the morning for room service duty when so many pax eat breakfast in the Lido rather than the MDR? We know for sure he was a dining room steward. And haven't several posters said they have had room service stewards walk into their cabins when they didn't hear them knock on the door, so some if not all must have a key, unless of course there are a lot of cabin stewards pulled into room service duty. I think it's a real stretch to say Room Service Attendant means he was a Cabin Steward. IMO, of course.

[wallyboag]

It is possible he was pulling double duty, either by choice (to make more money) or by assignment, if the ship was short staffed. That's the only reason I can come up with for this seeming discrepancy.

 

He was definitely our waiter back in December. When I read the name I thought "I'm sure there's a lot of people with the same first name..." but when I saw the picture, the hair on the back of my neck stood up, so yes, I'm sure it was him that we saw every night at dinner.

 

He was extremely nice to us and always smiling when he came to our table. I would never in a thousand years imagine him to be homicidal.

 

Anyways, back to the point I have seen waiters working other parts of the ship (lido, water distribution when coming back from port, etc) so it wouldn't be surprising if they have to work room service delivery shifts as well, which would have given him access to her cabin.

 

I guess another question is about "master keys." Does every room service attendant have one of these? Are they able to get into a room whether that person has ordered room service or not? Is there really such a thing as a master key? It seems to me that no single person should ever have access to all rooms on the ship!

[artist47]

He was definitely our waiter back in December. When I read the name I thought "I'm sure there's a lot of people with the same first name..." but when I saw the picture, the hair on the back of my neck stood up, so yes, I'm sure it was him that we saw every night at dinner.

 

He was extremely nice to us and always smiling when he came to our table. I would never in a thousand years imagine him to be homicidal.

 

Anyways, back to the point I have seen waiters working other parts of the ship (lido, water distribution when coming back from port, etc) so it wouldn't be surprising if they have to work room service delivery shifts as well, which would have given him access to her cabin.

 

I guess another question is about "master keys." Does every room service attendant have one of these? Are they able to get into a room whether that person has ordered room service or not? Is there really such a thing as a master key? It seems to me that no single person should ever have access to all rooms on the ship!

 

That would have had me with every hair standing on end too! :eek:

 

Good questions about the keys. When I was a property manager (and I realize it's not the same) for apartments, I was the only person with 24/7 access to keys. If maintenance wanted to do repairs in an apartment, they had to check them out from me and sign for them. The reason is: to maintain the security of the tenants homes and belongings. If I know who signed for the keys, I know who was in there last. (And yes I was bonded, insured to the gills and naturally, in that business, managers are completely vetted with full criminal background checks. Even speeding tickets are highly questionable.) I'm wondering if they have a similar system. It's also entirely possible the guy stole the keys from a supervisor or another attendant. The whole thing has many open questions that are very uncomfortable to ask.

Edited February 19, 2014 by artist47

[rkacruiser]

Just a couple of thoughts:

 

If the man was a Main Dining Room Steward in December and is now a Room Service Steward in February, that sounds like a demotion in job position. Could there have been other issues that this fellow had aboard the ship? If so, that would not excuse what he did, however.

 

Knowing how heavy and hard to open the doors to the veranda are, I am having trouble trying to understand how someone could be fighting with another, open that door, and pull them out onto the veranda in order to try to throw them overboard. The only scenario I can think of for this to be possible is for the poor woman to have been unconscious, or close to it, for the assalient to have done this.

 

I am thankful that this woman survived the ordeal and that she will gain peace at some point in the future. When the legal system finds this man guilty as charged, he should have a seriously long incarceration followed by deportation.

 

I would appreciate reactions to my thoughts on this poisting.

[serendipity1499]

That would have had me with every hair standing on end too! :eek:

 

Good questions about the keys. When I was a property manager (and I realize it's not the same) for apartments, I was the only person with 24/7 access to keys. If maintenance wanted to do repairs in an apartment, they had to check them out from me and sign for them. The reason is: to maintain the security of the tenants homes and belongings. If I know who signed for the keys, I know who was in there last. (And yes I was bonded, insured to the gills and naturally, in that business, managers are completely vetted with full criminal background checks. Even speeding tickets are highly questionable.) I'm wondering if they have a similar system. It's also entirely possible the guy stole the keys from a supervisor or another attendant. The whole thing has many open questions that are very uncomfortable to ask.

 

Bruce Muzz (a senior cruise Officer) kind of answered this question on the other thread..

 

Apparently the deadbolt could stop the use of the Master Key, but the deadbolt could be opened in case of emergency only by Senior Officers..

 

See his post no 89 in this thread:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1992729&page=5

 

I'm sure that HAL who first issued a press release about this horrible incident several days ago would have mentioned if the keys were stolen..Also believe they confirmed this was horrible attack was done by a room service steward..

 

Betty

Edited February 19, 2014 by serendipity1499

[artist47]

Bruce Muzz (a senior cruise Officer) kind of answered this question on the other thread..

 

Apparently the deadbolt could stop the use of the Master Key, but the deadbolt could be opened in case of emergency only by Senior Officers..

 

See his post no 89 in this thread:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1992729&page=5

 

I'm sure that HAL who first issued a press release about this horrible incident several days ago would have mentioned if the keys were stolen..Also believe they confirmed this was horrible attack was done by a room service steward..

 

Betty

 

Thank you very much, Betty, for all this excellent info.

[artist47]

Just a couple of thoughts:

 

If the man was a Main Dining Room Steward in December and is now a Room Service Steward in February, that sounds like a demotion in job position. Could there have been other issues that this fellow had aboard the ship? If so, that would not excuse what he did, however.

 

Knowing how heavy and hard to open the doors to the veranda are, I am having trouble trying to understand how someone could be fighting with another, open that door, and pull them out onto the veranda in order to try to throw them overboard. The only scenario I can think of for this to be possible is for the poor woman to have been unconscious, or close to it, for the assalient to have done this.

 

I am thankful that this woman survived the ordeal and that she will gain peace at some point in the future. When the legal system finds this man guilty as charged, he should have a seriously long incarceration followed by deportation.

 

I would appreciate reactions to my thoughts on this poisting.

 

If he is tried and convicted in Florida, I hope the prosecutors seek the maximum allowable sentence, including and up to, the death penalty if it is permitted. I would be surprised if this dirtbag made it out of any Florida prison alive in any case.

[BeagleOne]

Unless she dies, there will be no capital case, so the death penalty would not apply. But I agree that this guy should go to jail for a very, very long time.

[sail7seas]

Agree 100 percent! "Room service" can mean "food delivery" which is what most Americans take it to mean...but in Europe it can also mean people that are in general, assigned to clean the room or service it in any other way. From what I've read, this was a cabin steward. Of course, he might have been pulling double duty in "room service" (as in food delivery) if they were short on staff. That's possible too isn't it?

 

 

It wouldn't be possible on HAL ships for a steward to be both a dining and a cabin steward. My theory is this steward was not a Room Service (dining) steward. I believe it very possible he was a cabin steward and thus had a pass key.

 

Why would a cabin steward be delivering breakfast from the galley? Didn't another poster say he was their dining room steward? How could one crew member be working as a cabin steward AND a dining room steward?

 

 

Is it possible that person is mistaken thinking this was their dining steward but perhaps not? It is easy to confuse one steward with another and think you know them from the dining room but actually know them from the cabin.... or that person could be correct and my theory is wrong.

Cabin stewards on HAL ships do not deliver Room Service though they used to when we first started cruising HAL ships.

 

[serendipity1499]

If he is tried and convicted in Florida, I hope the prosecutors seek the maximum allowable sentence, including and up to, the death penalty if it is permitted. I would be surprised if this dirtbag made it out of any Florida prison alive in any case.

 

According to Copper10-8 this steward had his first appearance in court already, but have not heard any more about it..

 

Doubt that they could go for the death penalty in this case, but hope he will spend a very very long time in prison!

[sail7seas]

I'm interested if it will be State of Florida vs. Mr whatever his name is or if it will be Federal charges? United States of America vs. Mr. Jerk.

 

Was today's court appearance an arraignment?

[SPacificbound]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/cruise-worker-raped-throw-woman-overboard-fbi-article-1.1619217

 

It states "room service" and "breakfast delivery".

[sail7seas]

Is everything you read in that (or any) newspaper always accurate? :D

How about every news report we hear on TV? :)

 

I have no idea why I have this bug in my bonnet that I don't believe he was a Room Service Steward. It just doesn't 'feel right' to me. I so strongly have an instinct he was a cabin steward. :shrug:

 

Edited February 20, 2014 by sail7seas

[rkacruiser]

Is everything you read in that (or any) newspaper always accurate? :D

How about every news report we hear on TV? :)

 

I have no idea why I have this bug in my bonnet that I don't believe he was a Room Service Steward. It just doesn't 'feel right' to me. I so strongly have an instinct he was a cabin steward. :shrug:

 

 

Sail,

 

Please keep in mind that poster Aquahound stated on another thread that the media was being fairly accurate with the reports.

 

My most recent experience in a Neptune Suite aboard the Westerdam, the Room Service Steward did have a key that allowed him into my suite with afternoon hors d'oerves if I did not answer the door. (I had given permission for that to happen. Maybe that made a difference.)

[peaches from georgia]

If he was a cabin steward why would he say this whole thing started when he delivered the victim's breakfast. Wouldn't he have said he met her somewhere else and she insulted him, but not that it happened when he was doing room service that everyone who works on the ship knows a cabin steward doesn't do?