A La Carte Cruising

[Overtyme]

The movement by Royal Caribbean (and other cruise lines) towards A La Carte cruising means that I may consider exploring the all-inclusive vacation alternatives or simply consider fly and stay traditional vacations over cruising.

The value that has historically been pitched is slowly going away.

The pitch used to be that cruising was value priced when you consider that your cost includes hotel, dining and entertainment.

Then, specialty restaurants came in, decreasing the value proposition previously pitched. While they didn't entirely remove free dining, they did make it a lot less desirable than the for-fee dining restaurants. Additionally, the food quality in the Main Dining Room went down. And while I can't prove it, it does make you wonder if it was a calculated move in order to drive people to the specialty restaurants.

If they're going to charge for some of the entertainment as well, the value proposition is even less attractive.

Don't talk out of both sides of your mouth and suggest that the prices for cruises are higher because of all of the new entertainment and features that are available on our new class, and then say that you have to charge for the entertainment and features so that we can provide the best entertainment and dining experiences.

Either build these things into your price or lower the base price and offer everything A La Carte.

The movement towards an A La Carte model shifts the paradigm of cruising from an great value to simply a mode of transportation.:mad::rolleyes:

[Cigar King]

I prefer to pay only for those services I use, so I actually hope the trend continues. I guess time will tell.

[crookedhalo]

The movement by Royal Caribbean (and other cruise lines) towards A La Carte cruising means that I may consider exploring the all-inclusive vacation alternatives or simply consider fly and stay traditional vacations over cruising.

The value that has historically been pitched is slowly going away.

The pitch used to be that cruising was value priced when you consider that your cost includes hotel, dining and entertainment.

Then, specialty restaurants came in, decreasing the value proposition previously pitched. While they didn't entirely remove free dining, they did make it a lot less desirable than the for-fee dining restaurants. Additionally, the food quality in the Main Dining Room went down. And while I can't prove it, it does make you wonder if it was a calculated move in order to drive people to the specialty restaurants.

If they're going to charge for some of the entertainment as well, the value proposition is even less attractive.

Don't talk out of both sides of your mouth and suggest that the prices for cruises are higher because of all of the new entertainment and features that are available on our new class, and then say that you have to charge for the entertainment and features so that we can provide the best entertainment and dining experiences.

Either build these things into your price or lower the base price and offer everything A La Carte.

The movement towards an A La Carte model shifts the paradigm of cruising from an great value to simply a mode of transportation.:mad::rolleyes:

 

The value remains unchanged. In fact, I think it is increased because you can pick and choose what you want. Try going out to dinner at a very high end restaurant for $30-$40 per person - not gonna happen:p.

 

I still think cruising is a great value. I'm just very proactive in my pricing so I'm always happy with what I get and if I choose to add on drink packages or specialty dinners, I've budgeted for it and it's not an impulse purchase (most of the time;)).

 

But based on your assertions, maybe cruising isn't for you anymore. Try an AI - you may find yourself bored (I know I was - after three days I was ready to strangle everyone). JMHO

[Overtyme]

I prefer to pay only for those services I use, so I actually hope the trend continues. I guess time will tell.

 

I agree with you.

I too would rather pick and choose and customize my vacation, and am willing to pay for meals, entertainment, etc.

But the point is that the base price of my cruise should not continue to go up year over year, as they roll out more pay to play features.

[Biker19]

And while I can't prove it, it does make you wonder if it was a calculated move in order to drive people to the specialty restaurants.

Of course it was, so what? Marketeers do this all the time - lure you in with a low base price but when you walk out you've paid for all the extras. They bank on the fact that you are too weak to simply say no to those extras. Marketing 101.

[Overtyme]

You probably won't find many people that don't like the idea of the freedom of choices and the ability to customize their vacation experience.

 

But how many are willing to pay more year over year for their cabin knowing that everything that they do on board will be additional?

 

I may be in the minority, but my feeling is that they should simply calculate what it would take to hit their target revenues per cruise, and then build it all into the price of the cruise.

 

Some of what makes vacation enjoyable is not paying for things at every stop onboard.

[Cigar King]

From my point of view, it seems like I pay more for everything. Prices go up, and I try not to let them get me down. ;-) Do I wish they didn't, or went down, you bet I do, but it just doesn't seem to happen.

[fred30]

I must be missing something here.

What activities are we paying for now that were free before. From what I see as the ships get larger there is more included venues of entertainment. They have cut back on other items but entertainment is not one of them. Good free entertainment is what keeps people happy and coming back. That is also were they sell a lot of drinks.

 

As far as the Specialty restaurants go, this is in response to the many request for more options. As they put the different restaurants on the newer ships a lot of people wanted them added to the older ships. The other change a lot of people would like is to be able to go and eat when they get hungry and not at a preset time without having to go to the buffet. I have spoken to people that don't cruise with RCL because of this.

[tlatrice]

 

But how many are willing to pay more year over year for their cabin knowing that everything that they do on board will be additional?

 

Name one thing that DOESN'T go up year over year? Cell phone service, cable, utility bills, even FOOD! The price of everything is going up all the time. I didn't even look at the whole 'everything's included' aspect of cruising when I went on my first cruise. Neither did the new cruisers I brought with me on my 2nd. We were just excited to be going on a cruise! And I'm sure a lot NEW cruisers feel the same way. It seems to be experienced cruisers who are having a hard time with the changes.

 

I still think that if I wanted to see three cities in one week, a cruise is the a very economical AND FUN way to do it (followed by a train trip, which is on my bucket list). Unpacking only once, no checking in and out of airports or hotels, (how much time would THAT ALONE eat up?), no renting cars and driving, the OPTION to pay for activities OR just relax at a bar or the pool or your room. I still see it as a great way to travel.

[nelblu]

I agree with you.

I too would rather pick and choose and customize my vacation, and am willing to pay for meals, entertainment, etc.

But the point is that the base price of my cruise should not continue to go up year over year, as they roll out more pay to play features.

 

Ditto! I wish they would do the same for cable as there's a lot of garbage that I'm paying for.

[tlatrice]

Ditto! I wish they would do the same for cable as there's a lot of garbage that I'm paying for.

 

OMG! Don't get me started on CABLE! I have to pay for the sports package so my son can have the Military History Channel??? That doesn't even make sense!!! And neither of us watch the sports channels! :mad:

[Cigar King]

Well, there are options like Hulu and Roku. I keep wanting to give that option a try, but at the moment, the cable prices haven't reached a high enough pain point to really force me to switch. I'd love if they offer cafeteria style pricing though.

[gkbiiii]

You probably won't find many people that don't like the idea of the freedom of choices and the ability to customize their vacation experience.

 

But how many are willing to pay more year over year for their cabin knowing that everything that they do on board will be additional?

 

I may be in the minority, but my feeling is that they should simply calculate what it would take to hit their target revenues per cruise, and then build it all into the price of the cruise.

 

Some of what makes vacation enjoyable is not paying for things at every stop onboard.

 

 

I did the math, put pen to paper, and then booked my December 2015 Transatlantic cruise on the Crystal Serenity; for this very reason. When you add on, all the optional costs (which you want, such as the drink package) the pricing for a luxury line is very competitive.

 

The 2 X 1 Crystal sale, made the 14 night cruise, less money than Royal/Celebrity with all the excess options/gratuities included!!

[Tyler80]

I would rather pay for things I want on a cruise than have everything included and be paying for things I don't want.

[rjrpar]

I would rather pay for things I want on a cruise than have everything included and be paying for things I don't want.

 

Agree, that's why we avoid the AIs; we drink very little.

[negc]

Name one thing that DOESN'T go up year over year? Cell phone service, cable, utility bills, even FOOD! The price of everything is going up all the time. I didn't even look at the whole 'everything's included' aspect of cruising when I went on my first cruise. Neither did the new cruisers I brought with me on my 2nd. We were just excited to be going on a cruise! And I'm sure a lot NEW cruisers feel the same way. It seems to be experienced cruisers who are having a hard time with the changes.

 

I still think that if I wanted to see three cities in one week, a cruise is the a very economical AND FUN way to do it (followed by a train trip, which is on my bucket list). Unpacking only once, no checking in and out of airports or hotels, (how much time would THAT ALONE eat up?), no renting cars and driving, the OPTION to pay for activities OR just relax at a bar or the pool or your room. I still see it as a great way to travel.

 

Overall, in our experience the basic cruise price, especially after adjusting for inflation, has not increased and by being able to choose whether or not to pay for extras such as specialty dining, drink packages etc. it is still a bargain. When you add in the value of all of the many bells and whistles that have been added to the newest ships, it is an even greater value than it was when we started cruising decades ago. As the economy continues to improve and more people decide to resume cruising after deferring their vacation plans for some time, we can expect to see cruise fares increase. It is simply a matter of supply and demand.

Edited June 20, 2014 by negc

[Overtyme]

Overall, in our experience the basic cruise price, especially after adjusting for inflation, has not increased and by being able to choose whether or not to pay for extras such as specialty dining, drink packages etc. it is still a bargain. When you add in the value of all of the many bells and whistles that have been added to the newest ships, it is an even greater value than it was when we started cruising decades ago. As the economy continues to improve and more people decide to resume cruising after deferring their vacation plans for some time, we can expect to see cruise fares increase. It is simply a matter of supply and demand.

 

The things that you're terming 'Extras' were included in the base prices that you're comparing current pricing to.

So, to compare apples to apples, you would have to add in the costs for the things that are now optional, and then compare your prices.

You could argue that there are more dining choices than there were and it would be hard to disagree.

But listen to the posts across the boards and you'll see that most people feel that the quality of the food back when all meals and entertainment were included, was better than it is today if you're sticking with the included meals.

In order to get that same quality (or more accurately, maintain the same level of quality that you had back then in the MDR), you have to go to the specialty restaurants.

[rjrpar]

The things that you're terming 'Extras' were included in the base prices that you're comparing current pricing to.

So, to compare apples to apples, you would have to add in the costs for the things that are now optional, and then compare your prices.

You could argue that there are more dining choices than there were and it would be hard to disagree.

But listen to the posts across the boards and you'll see that most people feel that the quality of the food back when all meals and entertainment were included, was better than it is today if you're sticking with the included meals.

In order to get that same quality (or more accurately, maintain the same level of quality that you had back then in the MDR), you have to go to the specialty restaurants.[/quote

 

You're wrong. The food in the MDR 15 years ago was nowhere near the quality of the specialty resataurants. Drinks and soda were never included and entertainment was and still is in the base price. So what are all those optional things you refer to??

[Overtyme]

The things that you're terming 'Extras' were included in the base prices that you're comparing current pricing to.

So, to compare apples to apples, you would have to add in the costs for the things that are now optional, and then compare your prices.

You could argue that there are more dining choices than there were and it would be hard to disagree.

But listen to the posts across the boards and you'll see that most people feel that the quality of the food back when all meals and entertainment were included, was better than it is today if you're sticking with the included meals.

In order to get that same quality (or more accurately, maintain the same level of quality that you had back then in the MDR), you have to go to the specialty restaurants.[/quote

 

You're wrong. The food in the MDR 15 years ago was nowhere near the quality of the specialty resataurants. Drinks and soda were never included and entertainment was and still is in the base price. So what are all those optional things you refer to??

 

I think this is a matter of perception. The palette has changed and people now appreciate a wider variety of flavors than they had back then.

You're entitled to your opinion, but please don't try to pass that off as fact.

You shouldn't take my word for it. Read the posts about the quality of the food in the MDR going down from what it used to be.

RC has made some improvements by offering new menus over the recent years, and I believe that they've done a pretty good job.

There are a lot of people that feel that they have to go to the specialty restaurants to get better quality.

I'll reiterate my position, which is that I don't have an issue paying for the restaurants, and in a lot of ways, like the idea that I can completely customize my cruise experience.

My issue is that the base price is still going up and up, but then we're also paying food and drinks and it's been hinted (not yet confirmed) that entertainment may have some pay options. Even if it doesn't require additional fees today, you have to admit that this is the general trend across all aspects of cruising. Soon enough, you will pay for your entertainment.

I have to admit, if they bring on big name performers for concerts and other events, I wouldn't mind paying for those either.

I just don't know what the ever inflating base price is for anymore.

Here are a few examples of things that are different from 15 years ago, which have allowed the cruise line to save money. I don't believe that they've passed any of these savings on to the customer:

1 - ALL meals included

2 - 3rd and 4th passenger used to be 1/2 price (at least on RCCL)

3 - There used to be a midnight buffet. NOTE: I didn't really feel like it was necessary, or in fact, it was a bit too much after eating our way through each day, but it was a cost that's now gone, nonetheless.

4 - Soda was included back in the 80's.

 

I don't believe that this debate is so much about a lot of this noise, as much as the idea that people are now paying a lot more for less.

Additionally, it is my OPINION that the cruise line should either raise the base rate enough to include specialty dining, drink packages, entertainment, etc. OR they should lower their base rate and let people pick and choose and pay for their experience.

Right now I believe that they are raising their base rates AND charging for food (and soon to be entertainment) as well.