This Thread Is To Be Used For All Discussions About HAL's On Board Smoking Policies

[Sow There]

In my opinion it is not going to be any different than what you experienced previously. The difference is here on the HAL Boards non smokers are more vocal about smoking and smokers are almost afraid to admit to it because of what we know will be said about the subject and fear of losing their tempers......

 

Joanie

(Sorry Joanie, but I softened your font a bit. The heavy bolding causes both display problems on my computer and gives my eyes some problems.)

 

We totally agree with everything you said. We've sailed HAL since 1987 and we're both non-smokers. Yes, we do notice whiffs of cigarette smoke on occasion but it's not a problem. The ventilation systems in the MDRs, for example, always did an outstanding job of keeping the air clear of cigarette smoke back when cigarette smoking was permitted there.

 

I recognize that some people can be negatively affected by so-called "second hand smoke" and how they need to be vigilant, but there seem to be far more who have chosen to make it a campaign for some reason or other.

 

Celebrity Corp. just announced its results for last year which showed a remarkable increase in net earnings which suggests that the leisure cruise market is as robust as ever. I seriously doubt that HAL's smoking policies are considered a major part of the line's business strategies.

[taxmantoo]

I seriously doubt that HAL's smoking policies are considered a major part of the line's business strategies.

 

And I seriously doubt that any socially conscious corporation would not be aware of the unavoidable trend in favour of non-smoking and adjust their policies accordingly. Time will tell but I believe we will soon be sailing on smoke-free ships, regardless of who owns them.

[Sow There]

And I seriously doubt that any socially conscious corporation would not be aware of the unavoidable trend in favour of non-smoking and adjust their policies accordingly. Time will tell but I believe we will soon be sailing on smoke-free ships, regardless of who owns them.

Possibly, but that begs the question; why are there no cruise lines at all that sail smoke-free ships right now?

 

One likely answer is that there are no cruise lines out there who are willing to turn their back on the 18% or so of the public who still smoke. If CCL were "smoke-free" last year, and the policy caused that 18% to switch to, say, Celebrity, CCL would have turned a good earnings year into a loss year.

 

CCL's CEO announced in their earnings release that CCL's primary go forward strategy is to broaden the overall demand for cruising through its promotional program for January, which will be culminated by a major advert at the Super Bowl. Clearly they won't initiate a smoking policy that drives away business from smokers.

[sammiedawg]

(Sorry Joanie, but I softened your font a bit. The heavy bolding causes both display problems on my computer and gives my eyes some problems.)

 

We totally agree with everything you said. We've sailed HAL since 1987 and we're both non-smokers. Yes, we do notice whiffs of cigarette smoke on occasion but it's not a problem. The ventilation systems in the MDRs, for example, always did an outstanding job of keeping the air clear of cigarette smoke back when cigarette smoking was permitted there.

 

I recognize that some people can be negatively affected by so-called "second hand smoke" and how they need to be vigilant, but there seem to be far more who have chosen to make it a campaign for some reason or other.

 

Celebrity Corp. just announced its results for last year which showed a remarkable increase in net earnings which suggests that the leisure cruise market is as robust as ever. I seriously doubt that HAL's smoking policies are considered a major part of the line's business strategies.

 

I've seen some author names changed, now I see someone with the power to change another posters font. Alter egos here?

[qsuzi]

I've seen some author names changed, now I see someone with the power to change another posters font. Alter egos here?

 

He explained why the font change and any of us can change font attributes when we quote them for example. I just don't get how that relates to alter egos.

Edited January 5, 2015 by qsuzi

[chrispb]

It's 2015, not 1965. Get with it HAL!

 

Not sure that dates come into it. This has been quoted a number of times in one form or another - get real, some of us smoke and it's legal - yes, in this century.:)

[taxmantoo]

Not sure that dates come into it. This has been quoted a number of times in one form or another - get real, some of us smoke and it's legal - yes, in this century.:)

 

So are guns, but I don't believe they are allowed on any cruise line.

[chrispb]

I smoke. I am cruising soon on the NA to the Caribbean. We booked a verandah. I will be on my balcony for about 10 minutes in the morning with my cup of coffee. I "may" be there once or twice during the day for 5 or 10 minutes. Probably before bedtime, I will be there for maybe 30 minutes with a cocktail, gazing at the stars.

 

The other 23 hours of the day, I will be eating, swimming, going to shows, sunbathing, shopping, reading, napping, people-watching, enjoying a drink, trying to win my fortune in the casino, or off the ship completely in port.

 

I really have a difficult time believing that there are smokers who sit on their balcony every waking hour smoking cigarettes. If you are my verandah neighbor, and would like to use your balcony during one of my smoking times, kindly make a polite request and I will be willing to accommodate you, as long as you are willing to accommodate me.

 

Really, people, we're all adults. It's not that hard.

 

You're right!!! But I think it's the non-smokers who sit on their balconies 24/7 (probably waiting for a smoker to complain about):D

[chrispb]

Not filling so fast and furiously or why are they offering so many low cost upsells to verandahs........ verandahs are the only 'cabin space' where smoking is permitted?

 

There has been upsells for years - including when smoking was still permitted in staterooms.

[sail7seas]

There has been upsells for years - including when smoking was still permitted in staterooms.

 

We're seeing reports far more frequently. I have sailed the "S" cabins from Statendam's Inaugural year when she first introduced "S" cabins with the beautiful verandahs. We used to have to book very far out to get those cabins because they always filled early. Not any more.

[richwmn]

We're seeing reports far more frequently. I have sailed the "S" cabins from Statendam's Inaugural year when she first introduced "S" cabins with the beautiful verandahs. We used to have to book very far out to get those cabins because they always filled early. Not any more.

Could it be possible that the mad influx of verandah cabins and suites has caused this? You stated that the Statendam introduced the "S" cabins, followed fairly quickly by 3 more "S" class and then 4 "R" class.

 

Then the Vista class came out with a heavy emphasis on verandah cabins, followed by the Signature class with a few more.

 

Quite a few more choices, don't you think?

[SteveH2508]

And I seriously doubt that any socially conscious corporation would not be aware of the unavoidable trend in favour of non-smoking and adjust their policies accordingly. Time will tell but I believe we will soon be sailing on smoke-free ships, regardless of who owns them.

 

This might happen in the US in the next decade or so (but I doubt it personally). It will take a lot longer in Europe and even longer in the emerging Asian market. The cruise lines are chasing new business - especially in the largely untapped Asian market - they are not going to p*** off a third or more of that market.

 

Dollars rule - the complaints of a few anti-smokers are small beer in the overall corporate psyche.

[sail7seas]

Could it be possible that the mad influx of verandah cabins and suites has caused this? You stated that the Statendam introduced the "S" cabins, followed fairly quickly by 3 more "S" class and then 4 "R" class.

 

Then the Vista class came out with a heavy emphasis on verandah cabins, followed by the Signature class with a few more.

 

Quite a few more choices, don't you think?

 

 

 

Yes, that is a good point but you also have to factor the increase in population, the increase in the number of people who travel other than in their cars/campers, the increases in the percentage of vacationers who cruise.,

 

Edited January 5, 2015 by sail7seas

[taxmantoo]

This might happen in the US in the next decade or so (but I doubt it personally). It will take a lot longer in Europe and even longer in the emerging Asian market. The cruise lines are chasing new business - especially in the largely untapped Asian market - they are not going to p*** off a third or more of that market.

 

Funny you should say that. I would have always thought so too but we were just on a 17-day Grand Asia cruise on Princess in September where it was announced that approximately 60% of the passengers were of some Asian country or other. AND ... we noticed less smokers than we normally do on HAL and that in any location onboard including the casino!

Edited January 5, 2015 by taxmantoo

[richwmn]

Yes, that is a good point but you also have to factor the increase in population, the increase in the number of people who travel other than in their cars/campers, the increases in the percentage of vacationers who cruise.,

 

Then you can also factor in that the economy has been in a tailspin and in general, people are spending less on things that are not necessary.

[taxmantoo]

Then you can also factor in that the economy has been in a tailspin and in general, people are spending less on things that are not necessary.

 

Maybe many are spending less on cigarettes ??? :rolleyes:

[tip]

Not sure that dates come into it. This has been quoted a number of times in one form or another - get real, some of us smoke and it's legal - yes, in this century.:)

 

Yes, smoking is legal, but it is no longer socially acceptable. And to keep this cruise related, I do not believe that it is socially acceptable to smoke on a cruise ship balcony.

[Sow There]

Yes, that is a good point but you also have to factor the increase in population, the increase in the number of people who travel other than in their cars/campers, the increases in the percentage of vacationers who cruise.,

 

In 1987 when we first sailed on the (old) Nieuw Amsterdam, there were no balcony cabins of any kind. We were upgraded to what was then called a suite which was really just a larger than average cabin on a higher deck amidship.

 

As far as I can remember there were no cruise ships back then that offered balconies of any kind except perhaps the newbuild Princess ship...I think it was the old Royal Princess.

 

When the Statendam was first launched in 1992, the "Veranda" cabins were an immediate hit that sold out quickly, mainly because of the novelty. They were the first balcony cabins ever made available on Holland America. The rest of the later S Class ships had similar designs and the demand established the Veranda cabins as a staple in all HAL ships and, for that matter, most other cruise lines.

 

So the reason the veranda cabins went from a high popularity level to a normal demand booking level was simply that the supply of balcony cabins in the cruise industry increased dramatically and passed the demand like it was standing still. That's one reason why HAL's Veranda cabins are frequently marked down as part of their various price promotions.

 

It has nothing at all to do with HAL's smoking policies.

[Sow There]

Maybe many are spending less on cigarettes ??? :rolleyes:

That's been a continuing question for me. The majority of the price of a cigarette are the various federal, state, and occasional city taxes with the retailer and manufacturer getting what's left. Back in the 1960's a carton of cigarettes (10 packs) could be bought in some jurisdictions for $1.90. Here in CA the price for a single pack of discounted cigarettes is around $5.00.

 

Why anyone would spend as much as 25 cents apiece for a cigarette that once cost less than 1 cent, especially in today's economy, defies imagination.

 

But with respect to smokers on cruise ships, I really doubt that the current cost of cigarettes has any effect whatsoever on considering the cost of a cruise vacation. I also seriously doubt that a cruise line's smoking policy makes much difference to most potential cruisers one way or the other.

[cbr663]

As a non-smoker I wanted feedback regarding is it (on average) going to be that much more of an issue being next to someone who is smoking on their balcony on HAL? . We have sailed Princess, RCL, and Carnival when they allowed balcony smoking and when they changed. We didn't notice that much difference when Princess no longer allowed it and we sailing RCL and Carnival who at that point still allowed it. Seeing remarks like HAL is the ashtray of the seas makes me wonder if this is really worse now and if generally there are more smokers on HAL. Still going to sail on a balcony on HAL.

 

I don't think that it will be an issue for you. My wife and I are both non-smokers and both of us have developed allergies to cigarette smoke. We have had neighbours who smoked on our cruises and it didn't bother us at all. We don't recoil in horror at the mere smell of cigarette smoke. We accept that when we cruise, we are not the only passengers on the ship and accept that others may just want to use their balconies at the same time that we do. Some want to sit quietly, some want to star gaze, some wish to dine, some wish to entertain other passengers on their balconies, some want to listen to music, some want to sleep, and yes, some want to smoke. It's what we expect when we are cruising with 2000 other passengers. :)

[david,Mississauga]

This might happen in the US in the next decade or so (but I doubt it personally). It will take a lot longer in Europe and even longer in the emerging Asian market. ...

 

I have no comment about the Asian market, but I'm not sure about the European market. P&O, probably the most British of cruise lines (despite being owned by Carnival its headquarters are in Southampton) banned smoking on balconies about two years ago. Cunard followed in May of last year.

[Folk Singer]

The back and forth has been interesting and only time will tell exactly what will happen.

[SteveH2508]

I have no comment about the Asian market, but I'm not sure about the European market. P&O, probably the most British of cruise lines (despite being owned by Carnival its headquarters are in Southampton) banned smoking on balconies about two years ago. Cunard followed in May of last year.

 

Yes they did, but that is a world away from banning smoking completely on a cruise ship.

[Lizzie68]

Yes they did, but that is a world away from banning smoking completely on a cruise ship.

 

That's not what anyone is asking for so not not sure why you would make that comment.:confused:

[SteveH2508]

That's not what anyone is asking for so not not sure why you would make that comment.:confused:

 

My reply was to the post quoted below from taxmantoo (#1102)

 

And I seriously doubt that any socially conscious corporation would not be aware of the unavoidable trend in favour of non-smoking and adjust their policies accordingly. Time will tell but I believe we will soon be sailing on smoke-free ships, regardless of who owns them.