Dream problems?!?

[NightOne]

While I have no facts, based on the e-mails others have reported, I suspect that one of the propulsion motors has a winding that has failed, or nearly failed, so that the one propeller cannot produce full power and the ship cannot make full speed, so itineraries with longer passages that require higher transit speeds would be affected, while those with shorter passages are not.

 

 

 

I base this on the statements reported from Carnival about problems reaching full speed, and other statements from those who have cruised saying they were told the problem wouldn't be fixed until drydock. The propulsion motors have two sets of windings, each powered from a different set of generators, so that if one winding fails, the motor can produce half power. Replacing these windings requires removal of the propulsion motor, which requires cutting a large hole in the side of the ship, hence no repair until drydock.

 

 

Sounds like a solid theory.

 

I am guessing this takes too long to do in a port?

 

Seems like I remember them cutting a whole in the side of Carnival Liberty in Galveston recently.

[Micahs Grandad]

So Dream seems to basically do three different 7 day itineraries:

 

1. Belize, Roatan, Cozumel

2. Jamaica, Grand Cayman, Cozumel

3. Key West, Freeport, Nassau

 

Not sure which of those is the most nautical miles and/or is the being delayed more than others.

 

Anyone?

 

We did itinerary 2 and hours at last two ports shortened and we made it back in time in May.

Would think itinerary 1 returning from same port would be same.

[chengkp75]

Sounds like a solid theory.

 

I am guessing this takes too long to do in a port?

 

Seems like I remember them cutting a whole in the side of Carnival Liberty in Galveston recently.

 

Liberty needed an extra day to accomplish this for two thruster motors. And then two more weeks to get the thrusters running, and the thrusters didn't impact the itinerary, just a requirement for tugs in port.

 

To get a propulsion motor out would require a hole 8-10 times larger. More importantly, this would take the shaft completely out of service for a week, minimum, while they disconnected it from the shaft and its electrical connections, and got it ready to remove, further reducing speed not only from the total loss of power from that motor but also the drag from a stationary propeller, since it could not be allowed to free-wheel. I would say minimum 3-4 days to cut the access, get the motor out, renew the winding, put the motor back in, and weld the hull closed. So, that's a full cruise lost. Then another week, minimum, getting the motor aligned again and connected, without use of the propeller. And that's without any complications caused by ancillary equipment that is in the way between the motor and the side of the ship. Even in drydock, this job will take 8-10 days working three shifts.

[NightOne]

Liberty needed an extra day to accomplish this for two thruster motors. And then two more weeks to get the thrusters running, and the thrusters didn't impact the itinerary, just a requirement for tugs in port.

 

 

 

To get a propulsion motor out would require a hole 8-10 times larger. More importantly, this would take the shaft completely out of service for a week, minimum, while they disconnected it from the shaft and its electrical connections, and got it ready to remove, further reducing speed not only from the total loss of power from that motor but also the drag from a stationary propeller, since it could not be allowed to free-wheel. I would say minimum 3-4 days to cut the access, get the motor out, renew the winding, put the motor back in, and weld the hull closed. So, that's a full cruise lost. Then another week, minimum, getting the motor aligned again and connected, without use of the propeller. And that's without any complications caused by ancillary equipment that is in the way between the motor and the side of the ship. Even in drydock, this job will take 8-10 days working three shifts.

 

 

Gotcha. So this definitely is not happening until the January drydock based on that timeline.

[Micahs Grandad]

Gotcha. So this definitely is not happening until the January drydock based on that timeline.

 

And that is what someone high up on the ship told us in May at the Diamond party.

[NightOne]

We did itinerary 2 and hours at last two ports shortened and we made it back in time in May.

 

Would think itinerary 1 returning from same port would be same.

 

 

That makes for an interesting dilema for us as we are on a #2 itinerary coming up. In fact, I literally chose our particular cruise by searching for cruises that go to Ocho Rios instead of Montego Bay. (This appears to be pretty rare)

 

So our ports and hours are:

 

Ocho Rios 8-4

Grand Cayman 7-4

Cozumel 10-6

 

The absolute worst case scenario for me would be as follows:

 

Ocho Rios gets changed to Montego Bay

Grand Cayman changes to 7-2

Cozumel changes to 10-4

 

In that scenario I would seriously consider cancelling a choosing another cruise. :(

[bohica81]

Depends upon itinerary but this has been a problem for months now.

 

Our itinerary was Jamaica' date=' GC and Cozumel and ship couldnt go fast enough to keep it with original port times.[/quote']

 

Great! these are my stops in October and i have a large group of first timers that i finally convinced to go on a cruise.

[asalligo]

So if you have a check in time of 11:00 and you get this email, will they still check you in at 11 or have they officially moved my check in time to 1? Because frankly I still plan on being there at 11.

 

I would much rather sit in the terminal than at my hotel.

[loubetti]

Here is sort of what we're talking about. This electric motor is going on a British aircraft carrier.

 

Not exactly small.

 

Hey, Chief (chengkp75), I see at least 3, probably 4 small electric motors at the top left and right sides. Would these be used for cooling fans?

 

[kublaieod]

I sailed on the Dream July 3-10 on the key west Itinerary and our ports were not changed but granted it is the shortest itinerary. Also they extended our Freeport stay form 8-4 to 8-7 (ugh right) so they could do some maintenance. Rumor was it was the thrusters but definitely not confirmed.

 

We also had an 11 hour port in Nassau for Carnival Live (trace adkins). I would guess if you are on the Key West itinerary it is not an issue but if you are going down to Roatan you will see a change until it is corrected.

[Micahs Grandad]

That makes for an interesting dilema for us as we are on a #2 itinerary coming up. In fact, I literally chose our particular cruise by searching for cruises that go to Ocho Rios instead of Montego Bay. (This appears to be pretty rare)

 

So our ports and hours are:

 

Ocho Rios 8-4

Grand Cayman 7-4

Cozumel 10-6

 

The absolute worst case scenario for me would be as follows:

 

Ocho Rios gets changed to Montego Bay

Grand Cayman changes to 7-2

Cozumel changes to 10-4

 

In that scenario I would seriously consider cancelling a choosing another cruise. :(

 

First time for us at Montego Bay and Dr Coble (sp) beach was fine. GC gave us enough time at 7 miles beach.

 

We decided that going to an AI at Cozumel (had planned Mr Sanchos) was not worth the money for a limited number of hours so that was kind of wasted day.

 

First time for us sailing down the Mississippi so even with shortened times in two ports had a great cruise.

[ch27088]

So if the Dream is scheduled for dry dock in January 2017, do you think they will add more of the 2.0 upgrades like Guys Burgers???? Just wondering if they will add any more upgrades to her.

[chengkp75]

Here is sort of what we're talking about. This electric motor is going on a British aircraft carrier.

 

Not exactly small.

 

Hey, Chief (chengkp75), I see at least 3, probably 4 small electric motors at the top left and right sides. Would these be used for cooling fans?

 

 

Hey, Lou. Yes, those are cooling fans, but the air system is closed loop. If you look below the access panels on the side, you will see a couple of flanges, and these are for the fresh water cooling of the motor air. So, the fan blows the air over a cooling radiator, into the motor, and back to the fan. I know what you're going to say, "water and high voltage?", but there are mist catchers and leakage alarms.

 

And you'll notice that they are lifting the motor from above, while on the Dream they will have to build skids to move it by hydraulic jacks sideways to the side of the ship where a crane can get hold of it.

[Razor_Poke]

We did the Roatan / Belize / Coz itin on July 17-24 and had no issues.

 

We about 45 minutes leaving NOLA but all other times were spot on.

[loubetti]

Hey, Lou. Yes, those are cooling fans, but the air system is closed loop. If you look below the access panels on the side, you will see a couple of flanges, and these are for the fresh water cooling of the motor air. So, the fan blows the air over a cooling radiator, into the motor, and back to the fan. I know what you're going to say, "water and high voltage?", but there are mist catchers and leakage alarms.

 

And you'll notice that they are lifting the motor from above, while on the Dream they will have to build skids to move it by hydraulic jacks sideways to the side of the ship where a crane can get hold of it.

 

Hi Chief, thanks and, no, I wasn't going to say that about electricity and water!

 

It is essentially a form of a water cooled air conditioning system. Makes perfect sense!

 

Don't sell me short, my good man, I'm not one of the "Jiffy Lube" folks! :D

 

Hope all is well, and all the best to you.:)

[BeakerR]

A concern for me would be if there is a propulsion issue, and bad weather was approaching, how quickly can they move the ship out of the area? I would hate to be stuck in bad weather due to mechanical issues with the ship! I realize that they continuously monitor the weather but sudden changes can occur that may require a quick change of plans by the crew. If they can't navigate at full speed it could be an issue!

[chengkp75]

A concern for me would be if there is a propulsion issue, and bad weather was approaching, how quickly can they move the ship out of the area? I would hate to be stuck in bad weather due to mechanical issues with the ship! I realize that they continuously monitor the weather but sudden changes can occur that may require a quick change of plans by the crew. If they can't navigate at full speed it could be an issue!

 

Do you mean if there is a further issue? Because there is currently a failure that is preventing full speed. Even on one propeller, the ship will do 12-14 knots, maybe more. Right now, she should be able to make 16-18 knots.

[Micahs Grandad]

Do you mean if there is a further issue? Because there is currently a failure that is preventing full speed. Even on one propeller, the ship will do 12-14 knots, maybe more. Right now, she should be able to make 16-18 knots.

 

On the May cruise we were on she was usually doing 17 knots.

[NightOne]

First time for us at Montego Bay and Dr Coble (sp) beach was fine. GC gave us enough time at 7 miles beach.

 

We decided that going to an AI at Cozumel (had planned Mr Sanchos) was not worth the money for a limited number of hours so that was kind of wasted day.

 

First time for us sailing down the Mississippi so even with shortened times in two ports had a great cruise.

 

Most of the "big" shore excursions/attractions (Dunn River Falls, Blue Hole, Mystic Mountain, etc.) are close to Ocho Rios. To get to them from Falmouth is about a 1 hour drive and from Montego Bay it is a 1 1/2 hour drive.

 

I am guessing you went here: http://www.doctorscavebathingclub.com/

 

I'm scheduled for a catamaran sailing in Grand Cayman and Nachi Cocom in Cozumel so I want the longest hours possible. :)

 

I agree that sailing down the river is a great experience.

[NightOne]

So if the Dream is scheduled for dry dock in January 2017, do you think they will add more of the 2.0 upgrades like Guys Burgers???? Just wondering if they will add any more upgrades to her.

 

I don't think they officially announced what they are doing but I would bet a million dollars that they will be adding Guys Burgers and possibly other 2.0 upgrades.

[cruiser fanatic]

So Dream seems to basically do three different 7 day itineraries:

 

1. Belize, Roatan, Cozumel

2. Jamaica, Grand Cayman, Cozumel

3. Key West, Freeport, Nassau

 

Not sure which of those is the most nautical miles and/or is the being delayed more than others.

 

Anyone?

 

Roatan, Belize, Cozumel itinerary is 1,962.62 nautical miles

Jamaica, Grand Cayman, Cozumel itinerary is 2,281.67 nautical miles

Key West, Freeport, Nassau itinerary is 1,962.05 nautical miles

 

So, Key West, Freeport, Nassau and Roatan, Belize, Cozumel aren't being delayed and Jamaica, Grand Cayman, Cozumel is having more delays.

Edited August 1, 2016 by cruiser fanatic

[NightOne]

Do you mean if there is a further issue? Because there is currently a failure that is preventing full speed. Even on one propeller, the ship will do 12-14 knots, maybe more. Right now, she should be able to make 16-18 knots.

 

I am reading specs about here being able to do 22.5 knots. Is that normal cruising speed, top speed, or both?

[NightOne]

Roatan, Belize, Cozumel itinerary is 1,962.62 nautical miles

Jamaica, Grand Cayman, Cozumel itinerary is 2,281.67 nautical miles

Key West, Freeport, Nassau itinerary is 1,962.05 nautical miles

 

So, Key West, Freeport, Nassau and Roatan, Belize, Cozumel aren't being delayed and Jamaica, Grand Cayman, Cozumel is having more delays.

 

Grrrrrr! :)

 

Thanks for the info!

[chengkp75]

I am reading specs about here being able to do 22.5 knots. Is that normal cruising speed, top speed, or both?

 

Grrrrrr! :)

 

Thanks for the info!

 

22.5 is top speed, full power, clean hull, light wind, no current.

 

More important than the total mileage is the distances between ports:

 

Roatan, Belize, Cozumel: 878, 124, 217, 639

Jamaica, Cayman, Cozumel: 1138, 256, 321, 639

Key West, Freeport, Nassau: 617, 242, 88, 987

 

I don't have the itineraries but you can do the math to see if 17 knots will get you between ports in time.

[NightOne]

22.5 is top speed, full power, clean hull, light wind, no current.

 

More important than the total mileage is the distances between ports:

 

Roatan, Belize, Cozumel: 878, 124, 217, 639

Jamaica, Cayman, Cozumel: 1138, 256, 321, 639

Key West, Freeport, Nassau: 617, 242, 88, 987

 

I don't have the itineraries but you can do the math to see if 17 knots will get you between ports in time.

 

With my port hours there is 15 hours between Jamaica and Grand Cayman and 18 hours between Grand Cayman and Cozumel.

 

So doing the math with the distances you provided at 17 knots:

 

15.06 and 18.88 hours

 

As you can see one is a little short and the other is almost an hour short. And this counts on the ship leaving on time and not having to wait on excursions, etc.

 

Finally, looks like there is 38 hours of time back to NOLA and at 17 knots 37.59 hours is needed.

 

In a nutshell, there is no slack time at all given 17 knots. (actually a shortage going to Cozumel)

 

Yikes!!!

Edited August 1, 2016 by NightOne