Cheapest price per person / per night for a Seabourn Cruise

[Able Seaman H]

Carnival has owned Seabourn outright since 1999.

 

Henry :)

[RustyRollock]

Right. So what's the explanation for the increasingly obvious dilution of the SB product?

[ab21au]

Right. So what's the explanation for the increasingly obvious dilution of the SB product?

 

Mustn't be Carnival unless they have changed their policy. My cruise in 2015 was actually better than the one in 2013 but I loved them both. I will find out if the 2017 cruise is better or worse in a couple of months.

[Able Seaman H]

Right. So what's the explanation for the increasingly obvious dilution of the SB product?

 

When you say "obvious dilution of the SB product", I must have missed the memo when we cruised Encore.

 

TK restaurant introduced as an inclusive dining venue. Had several excellent meals.

 

Sushi restaurant introduced as an inclusive restaurant. Some lovely food on offer as well as great fun staff to guide people through a potentially unfamiliar menu.

 

Shows have stepped up a notch in terms of technical hardware and artistic content.

 

Still addressed by name throughout the ship with a number of staff who went out of their way to ensure we felt welcome.

 

TK bar an additional pre-dinner or apres dinner gathering place. Bobby & Katie aided by Johnathan's impromptu contributions were a stand out memory.

 

Entertainment staff still go above and beyond to ensure inclusivity and happiness.

 

Senior staff regularly seen out and about right up to and including the captain.

 

Gym has been expanded to include a more thorough collection of torture tools.

 

A much enjoyed arts and crafts programme.

 

I challenged the bridge tutors to see if they could teach me the game. In the second fortnight there were times where we cried with laughter. I know - who ever would have though, happiness and bridge in the same sentence.

 

Still the same great cabin when compared to industry standards.

 

Concierge staff still efficient and with a can do attitude.

 

Where do I stop?

 

Housekeeping staff weren't as perfect as we have previously experienced but that was largely addressed by a change of staff (without our asking).

 

I do think in life you get out of it what you put in. If you can't enjoy yourself on a Seabourn Cruise then I suspect you have given up on life.

 

Like everything else, if you look for fault and reasons to complain you will find them though the phrase "first world problem" will be ringing in some people's ears as you open your heart to them.

 

Henry :)

[lincslady]

Henry - sadly not everybody who has been on Encore has been as enthusiastic as you, and I can't believe that they are all natural born complainers or miseries. Unfortunately the latest report on the Cruise Critic reports site sounds really bad - it could well be that they are exaggerating, in fact I can hardly believe that recently on Encore there were only three types of fruit for breakfast, one being apples!

 

I think you have to admit that several problems due, IMO, to design failures, have occurred, notably the lack of a laundry, the Retreat, the fact that the Club bartender has to leave the bar to make drinks and the lack of a proper use for the outdoor area behind the TK grill. It does sound as if Seabourn have taken some of this on board, and will be changing things on the Encore and in particular on the Ovation. Time will tell.

 

However, having said all that, I still feel that for me Seabourn beats the other small 'luxury' lines hands down, and I would still recommend the line to anyone, in particular the OP here.

[wripro]

Right. So what's the explanation for the increasingly obvious dilution of the SB product?

The times! Same reason as the dissolution of service and quality on Crystal, Silversea, Regent and everything else in general.

[RustyRollock]

We have tried all the major luxury lines over the years - SB, Regent, Silversea, Crystal - and as Wipro says, all have been affected by "the times" one way or another. It's inevitable, and sometimes the changes are actual improvements, but not always as discussed many times here already. We were on Encore for 26 nights and so I think can give a reasonably objective view and overall it just wasn't the SB experience we'd come to know and love. Other SB regulars we consulted agreed.

 

Not just the sometimes pitiful breakfast fruit selection which absolutely happened (eg, no bananas on several days) but other problems like very limited and infrequent lectures, no bridge instructors at all on the second leg of the trip, shortages of popular wines and spirits, the list goes on. It all screamed petty "cost cutting" and/or disorganised management.

 

I believe several experienced SB managers at head office have recently moved on to pastures new (interesting in itself) and Carnival personnel have been promoted to replace them. Standards seem to be slipping at the same time. Not a coincidence IMO.

 

Anyway, we're on the Odyssey transatlantic in October so it will be interesting to compare our overall experiences and whether it's "the Encore effect" or a more general problem.

 

Either way, SB is still our preferred cruiseline, warts and all!

[Able Seaman H]

The lack of laundry was because the designers incorrectly read their guests. They assumed they were up market travellers used to the finer things in life who wouldn't want to waste their holiday in the laundry. They would send washing out. They hadn't realised how penny pinching the guests were :)

 

Regular cruisers will get free laundry. This has now been addressed ironically at a higher cost than including it from day 1.

 

The Retreat is a concept. Lots of people don't like it so temper their comments on Encore accordingly. I don't see it as a sign of falling standards, rather a choice offered to guests.

 

The Club was designed as a table service venue. The bar wasn't designed by a barman but again it isn't falling standards, just a different concept and bar staff work around the design failings.

 

Fruit, particularly bananas, doesn't store that long and there will be supply issues particularly when cruising on a world itinerary off the beaten path. Much easier when cruising a repeated track in the Med.

 

I travel the world and adapt to my surroundings. If prune juice isn't available I befriend the kitchen and see what they do have. I have discovered some great tastes along the way and taken advantage of the diverse talents met along the journey. Life isn't a rigid formula. Again, not a sign of falling standards but a more diverse range of changing offerings.

 

We had bridge instructors on both legs of our cruise. As a novice learning the game could I suggest any lack,of opportunity to play lies firmly with the attitude of many of the players. Some of the rudest people I have ever come across were in the card room to the point where I havent pursued the game so I have been lost as a potential partner. Again, nothing to do with falling standards on Seabourn's part.

 

I managed to find a bottle of wine to drink when needed on Encore without venturing into the charged for selection. Unlike mainstream cruises you can still summon a meeting with the hotel director who, together with the food and beverage manager / somellier will do what they can to accommodate your needs.

 

I find the NF house champagne very acidic but then again I'm not a huge champagne drinker.

 

I'm sure efforts are constantly afoot to save money and those who cruised the 3 sisters will never again experience that level of intimacy but I much prefer the more diverse experiences a larger ship offers. For me Seabourn has the size / service / facilities mix pretty much spot on.

 

Worth saying that on a transatlantic crossing you are going to be at sea without the ability to provision so do keep that in mind. You are also benefitting from some of the cheapest fares offered and that can attract a certain type of clientele possibly with a false sense of expectation regards price paid for service expected. Yourself excluded of course :)

 

 

Henry :)

Edited May 15, 2017 by Able Seaman H

[2SailingNomads]

"Worth saying that on a transatlantic crossing you are going to be at sea without the ability to provision so do keep that in mind. You are also benefitting from some of the cheapest fares offered and that can attract a certain type of clientele possibly with a false sense of expectation regards price paid for service expected."

 

WOW what a totally arrogant & pompous comment. Having done many crossings - and there are many folks I know who have sailed with Seabourn for 15+ years that regularly do crossings and many have hundreds of days on Seabourn, as we do (we see many of the same people each time) - I can assure YOU the level of service on a TA is often better than on some port intensive cruises. Plus you really can get to know the crew and your fellow pax better than when on port intensive cruise. Just maybe you should try one before you critique it.

[frantic36]

I have to agree, Henry you are sounding pompous, and rather arrogantly dismissive of other guests opinion.

 

I get free laundry but that doesn't mean I would discount the opinion of those who would prefer to do their own laundry. Have you ever thought that some may have allergy issues to the normal products used by the ships laundry. My husband has various jackets and one is a linen blend which on Encore he couldn't just quickly run down to the laundry for a quick press prior to wear.

 

The Retreat is an issue because it reduces accessible outside space that is available on the Odyssey class ship. Just because you don't use the walking space doesn't mean that people who do should be dismissed as complainers. I use the treadmills but my husband and other friends noticed the reduced space on board.

 

The Club was always one of our favourite pre-dinner drink places and after dinner to dance. Long time bar staff and other senior staff discussed that it was a design concept that wasn't working. If anyone here can tell me a bar they go to that has the bartenders disappearing behind closed doors to mix drinks I would be curious to know. Also the table service you mentioned wasn't readily available. I have waited 20 minutes for a first drink and I know of others who gave up waiting later in the evening after the show.

 

You're right the service at TK Bar was great but this also made it very popular and hard to find a seat some nights.

 

I will be trying Encore again next year and Nomads I know you will be trying it soon, so we aren't dismissing the ship out of hand. We are willing to see how Seabourn deals with these common issues that keep cropping up. I know they are looking at and changing things as we speak.

 

One thing we can all agree on is that the Seabourn crew still work hard to try to make the cruise enjoyable.

 

Julie

Edited May 15, 2017 by frantic36

[RustyRollock]

You are making some presumptions here, many of them amusingly wide of the mark. I'm wasn't planning on bickering about bananas but having none available while sailing off the coast of Queensland, home of Australia's banana industry, was rather puzzling, especially as we stopped in Townsville where this apparently elusive fruit is both cheap and plentiful.

 

I am aware of the logistical limitations of transatlantic crossings, having already done a few (both directions). All those sea days are a major draw for us. It has very little to do with getting a bargain.

 

I think the lowering of standards is due the shift in management philosophy rather than simple cost cutting. Carnival has built its brand on offering budget cruising and they do it very well. But SB customers may have different requirements which the new management doesn't always appear to grasp. Rather than make sweeping changes - no doubt introduced as "improvements" by head office - they are trying the death by a thousand cuts approach. It will end in tears.

[lincslady]

Sorry, Henry, but that last paragraph of yours was just insultingly pompous.

[Able Seaman H]

Sounds like I should be in politics. One or two openings here in the UK at the moment :)

 

I am trying to address the direct claim that Seabourn is declining, specifically under Carnival ownership (who have had 100% ownership since 1999).

 

I am commenting as I observe. The first 2 weeks on Encore were cheap, in effect it was a repositioning cruise. The second 2 weeks were peak season Christmas / New Year fares. I found it really interesting to see the guest demographic change. In general terms. Hey, we were onboard for both weeks so unless I see myself in a poor light clearly not everyone fits the bill. It's fair to say people on the first cruise had done lots of days between them so possibly there was also a correlation to familiarity.

 

Those first cruisers sought out the cheapest fares (let us not forget the title of the thread), did lots of days on board and were very demanding, much more so than guests in the second fortnight who just got on and enjoyed themselves.

 

I saw instances where guests were greeted by staff as long lost friends and before they had even drawn breath they were negative towards the staff bemoaning changes they believed had happened. In one instance they were told the item in question hadn't changed for 7 years and the person offered to give them a vastly superior product for free. I won't say what it was for fear of embarrassing anyone on here.

 

I saw people demanding tea bags used in the Spa in a restaurant and when they were brought dismissed them because they had already been placed in the hot water. It was a clear pot and the water was all but transparent, they hadn't been stewed but a new tea bag and water was demanded.

 

Ultimately I do struggle when I see what I think is a really good service torn apart by people focussing on 2 or 3 design changes some of which have already been addressed. If 90% of the product is excellent I'll take that and work around the 10%. Sometimes in life it's very easy to see things out of proportion.

 

If I've offended anyone I apologise - except to the particularly nasty bridge playing gentleman !

 

Henry :)

[Chairsin]

I think as with so many threads this one has gone veering way off course. Legitimate concerns have been diluted with uncalled for personal insults and erroneous information is repeatedly posted as if the more you say it the more it must be true.

 

So back to the OP's question about finding the cheapest cruise per person :

 

1) often the Caribbean cruises and the transatlantics or (other cruises with a significant number of sea days) are the least expensive. These just so happen to be my least favorite cruises but that does not translate into my being a superior class of cruiser. As stated here many select these cruises not because of the low cost but because for them the ship is the destination.

 

2) often closer to sailing prices are discounted if a cruise has not been selling well. The downside of course is it may be more difficult/expensive to find flights. It is a trade off that must be reviewed on a case by case basis.

 

3) a good TA can often help you unlock some very good deals. My TA recently secured a very good price for me for the 36 day CapeTown to Singapore cruise next February. Though I must say my TA is just as much about great service as they are about good pricing. And this can often be worth much more when there is an issue.

 

4)cruise at off times. Many people do not want to cruise between Thanksgiving and Christmas so some cruises are priced lower due to the decreased demand.

 

5)BTB's are priced lower. A 14 day is less per day than a 7 day cruise and a 21 one usually less than a 14 day.

 

All of this other nonsense about quality going down is truly ridiculous. I do wish the antagonists on this thread would learn to distinguish between "changes" and "lower standards." There have been changes on the Encore over the Odyssey class just as you would expect because it is a much bigger ship. This is no different than the fact there were many changes when the Odyssey class came out vis a vis the Yachts. A change you don't like is not necessarily a lower standard. And as to the constant put forth presumption that the longstanding Carnival connection has driven these perceived lower standards I don't see any evidence of that.To my mind, (back to the topic at hand) the only thing the long time Carnival ownership has resulted in is solid financial backing which has allowed Seabourn the economy of scale to keep prices low. I paid the same per diem rate for my Med cruise last June as I did for the one in 2008 without any reduction in service and overall quality.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums

[wripro]

I think the issue of a decline in service is a relative one. Are we talking about a decline since Seabourn started sailing in 1988 and through the 90s? Absolutely. There is a distinct difference, partly due to economics and mostly due imo to the fact that you simply cannot duplicate the level of service we had on the triplets with the newer, larger ships. And remember back then everyone, expect the few large suites, paid the same price no matter which suite you were in. But are we talking about a decline in the past couple of years? Perhaps a bit but not so much as the first example. All in all, I still find for the most part SB is an excellent value for the total experience.

[ab21au]

Well said, Chairsin.

[lincslady]

To go back to this thread - if the OP has not yet booked a Seabourn cruise, there are some good offers on Odyssey in the Caribbean in October and November. (At least in the UK). Not my cup of tea, but could be a good trial run for them?