Is it time carnival goes mega ship?

[Cyber Kat]

Choice is good for consumers, but providing the full spectrum of choices is not necessarily good for suppliers. The American mainstream mass-market Cruise passenger is so diverse that if cruise lines were to design products that appeal to each identifiable choice that a consumer would make they would be making a million ships. The mass Market works because you find critical mass in the market and appeal to that smaller set of preferences.

 

You are right that there are Cruise Lines that are building and filling smaller ships. So why is it then that some passengers of several Cruise Lines are posting these "strange" messages, messages that seem to have gotten past your viewing, messages criticizing the decisions that have these several Cruise lines building larger ships? After all like you said there are other cruise lines that are offering these smaller ship experiences. You say you're moving on. Why is that not the right answer for others who feel the same way you do?

 

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Because unlike some, I speak only for myself. I have no idea what is in the mind of others, nor what motivates them.

 

I still have not seen these "strange messages" of which you speak. I have seen some people calling other people rude while being equally rude.

 

As for the "mass Market," frankly I could care less. I'm not interested in what the mass market wants. Apparently you have made a study of this, so I'll defer to your expertise.

 

I'm only on the Carnival board because we have one more cruise booked and I'm not ruling out sailing on the Pride again. I have found a niche more suitable for my own sailing needs and perhaps that might be the solution for others, but I don't feel it is my place to dictate what others should do.

 

 

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[bUU]

As for the "mass Market," frankly I could care less.

Fair enough. Carnival is a mass market cruise line and if you're uninterested in how and why they do what they do then discussions about that aren't going to interest you.

[Cyber Kat]

Fair enough. Carnival is a mass market cruise line and if you're uninterested in how and why they do what they do then discussions about that aren't going to interest you.

 

 

 

Oh you'd be surprised what interests me.

 

Just because I'm moving away from mass market/main stream cruise lines doesn't mean I'm disinterested in watching others have a slug fest. It's a bit like wreck, and I have to see what's happening.

 

 

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[bUU]

Oh you'd be surprised what interests me.

I'm confused. What did you mean by, "frankly I could care less".

[sparks1093]

But you like what you like and that's ok.

 

You say that but then make belittling remarks because of what people like (and I realize you may not mean your remarks to be belittling but they do come across that way). I just priced Oasis versus the Dream for 4/2019 and with RCI's 50% off the second passenger special Oasis is within $500 of the Dream (and that difference could be erased with a different cabin choice). If I were to actually be booking a cruise for that time frame it would be a very tough choice indeed. I know that we've had this discussion before and it might surprise you but if I were to sail on a mega ship it would likely be Oasis class. (And as for mega ships there is a saturation point for them and it will be reached one day, probably when the economy tanks again as someone else mentioned.)

[BoDidly]

I still remember John Heald making fun of Royals MEGA ships posting pictures on (Fistbook ) and saying Carnival will never go this route . :rolleyes:

[FLSteve11]

I feel most of Carnival's ships for a long time have been iterations of the Destiny class. A few new improvements and features are introduced with each new class, but the overall design of each class has been pretty similar. It will be interesting to see what a new shipyard has to offer with the upcoming 180k ton class ships. Will they stray far from the current formula that has seemed to work for Carnival? I love Carnival as it is, but it would be interesting to have the Carnival experience in a new, different setting.

 

They've mentioned a few times during the future cruise sales events that one of the things they're proud of is the ships have a similar layout across the fleet. This way someone who doesn't cruise often will have a familiarity to the cruise ship and will make it easier to orient themselves on a new ship. I'm glad they're supposed to be doing a new plan for the new larger ships, one of the things I like about trying out ships in different fleets is getting a new experience. It's one of the reasons we don't stick to one line (they all have their plus's and minus's after all).

[Lerin]

No, I wish they'd make a smaller ship for a more intimate experience.

[FLSteve11]

They do have decisions to make....and selling the Fantasy class does not appear to be in the cards.

 

I think you're right. At some point the fleet will be to where it doesn't make sense to keep the older ships. Particularly with the large number of mega ships coming in on mass market lines, the number of staterooms available is going to already climb a lot over the next 7-8 years. RCL is doing the same, slowly getting rid of their older Vision class ships. They'll probably "sell" them into a different brand in the company, P&O for example could be where some of them end up. Otherwise they get sold to a lesser cruise line overseas.

[bUU]

They'll probably "sell" them into a different brand in the company, P&O for example could be where some of them end up. Otherwise they get sold to a lesser cruise line overseas.

Good point. Given that the more intimate experience of smaller ships is part of what the luxury brands like Seabourn offer, I doubt they'd transfer them in that direction. As you suggest, these transfers will invariably be to other markets where customer perceived value is not so strongly aligned with newer ships.

[FLSteve11]

Seems like a good idea to me. They might not need to bring on new things like flow rider just more acces to things that they already have. I so wanted to do thrill theater but it was always full. Or biger specialty restaurants. I do think people woulf use and enjoy rock climbing i definatly would.

 

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They will bring on new things, that's the trend. There are so many ships coming out, you need something to make it stand out to some extent. Plus, the simple thing is most people expect it now. Certainly those with families (which Carnival is obviously heavily catering to) want to have an assortment of things to keep all members of the family happy. Not only are multiple generations sailing in those cases, but even within generations people like different things. Some are highly active, some like to sit and read, others love live entertainment, and even more like crafts and trivia. The bigger the ship, the easier it is to give a wider variety of things to do, so the easier it is to make a wider variety of people happy. (And when one person in a family is vocally unhappy, they all are). It's what made the Oasis class such a big hit, and really started this trend of mega ships with multiple venues and activities for families. For an older couple on their own, that's no big deal. For larger groups and families, it can make a big difference.

[FLSteve11]

You might want to reword that first line ... how about "For me, Oasis is a slam dunk."

 

 

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For the cruising industry in general, Oasis really was a slam dunk. I don't think even Royal thought it would be as popular as it was. As they only ordered 2 initially, then changed their minds and started making more after they were the big hits.

[skywalkr2]

All I can say is I want my cruise to feel like a cruise. If I wanted an all inclusive resort... I would go to an all inclusive resort. I want it to be a boat, and feel like a boat.

[FLSteve11]

Good point. Given that the more intimate experience of smaller ships is part of what the luxury brands like Seabourn offer, I doubt they'd transfer them in that direction. As you suggest, these transfers will invariably be to other markets where customer perceived value is not so strongly aligned with newer ships.

 

No, it probably won't be to a luxury line. Most people there are not interested in sailing on a Fantasy class styled ship even if it was redecorated (not even sure they can do that, most of the walls and such are prefabbed). It would be a "more minor line" for lack of a better word coming to mind. P&O is the closest that comes to mind in the Carnival fleet. It's where they got, and then moved back, the Adonia to make Fathom (for that short period of time).

[evandbob]

I knew you would not dessert me in times if need....

 

 

Warm chocolate melting cake or Bitter n Blanc?

[BNBR]

No thanks. I'm looking for lines with smaller ships and less people. I don't need floating theme park/mega mall monstrosities. I want a ship to be a ship. That's what I'm passionate about - the actual sailing experience. I don't need all the rest.

 

For those who do enjoy!

 

 

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Then why do you sail Carnival? Lol. What exactly do you think the Carnival ships are?

[BNBR]

I go on a cruise to get to the destination. Why would I want to do all of those rock climbing, flowrider on a ship when I can do them in port? Just not a fan of these large behemoths of the seas looking like floating barges with condos plopped on top!

 

 

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Why not just fly to the destination? You must really hate Carnival then. Why would you want to play basketball, mini golf, watch a movie, visit a bar/restaurant, comedy show, swim in a pool or anything else on a ship that you can do in port? If it's all about just getting to the destination and not the ship, I couldn't think of a worse way to travel than a big slow cruise ship that offers nothing you want to do to pass the time. You can get to Nassau in 35 minutes on JetBlue. Why would you sail overnight and all that nonsense?

[evandbob]

Seaside looks like a hotel sitting on a barge.

 

 

 

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Very close. In its advertising blurbs for the Seaside, it says the design evokes a Miami condo on a ship. I was intrigued enough to price it and found I could get a mid ship balcony for two under $2K. Free specialty meal, free 1 hr spa treatment and free loyalty status match for Carnival Diamond to MSC Black Card, their highest.

 

The MSC laundry perk is only 30% off pricing, rather than unlimited free, but I think I can adjust. For me, I stopped sailing the little ships 10 or more years ago because I thought they were old back then. Now I sail Carnival's newer ships, like Magic, Vista and Horizon, as well as trying other lines. I do like the idea of LNG powered ships; that change from diesel might be more revolutionary than the size of the ship.

 

I like diversity, others like familiarity, there's enough choices out in the market to satisfy both.

[bUU]

Then why do you sail Carnival?

That's the question that rarely gets answered. Maybe, for some, within the answer are hard truths that they don't want to acknowledge. Who knows?

 

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[Jimmy Geegitz]

Carnival are building 2 mega ships. LNG class on order. First one due in 2022. Larger than oasis class.

 

 

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[skywalkr2]

One thing I have learned by reading this thread. It's just BNBR telling everyone else their opinions don't matter.

 

Some people just like Carnival's layouts. They like the lower prices. Easy answers. Not everyone is the same. Opinions are a personal choice.

 

Can we please stop with trying to convince everyone that only one person's opinion is allowable?

[BNBR]

You say that but then make belittling remarks because of what people like (and I realize you may not mean your remarks to be belittling but they do come across that way). I just priced Oasis versus the Dream for 4/2019 and with RCI's 50% off the second passenger special Oasis is within $500 of the Dream (and that difference could be erased with a different cabin choice). If I were to actually be booking a cruise for that time frame it would be a very tough choice indeed. I know that we've had this discussion before and it might surprise you but if I were to sail on a mega ship it would likely be Oasis class. (And as for mega ships there is a saturation point for them and it will be reached one day, probably when the economy tanks again as someone else mentioned.)

 

I think if you look at my comments, my supposed "belittling remarks" are very much geared towards people who make snotty, ridiculous comments to begin with. And you will notice that these same people have never actually been on these ships but have obnoxious comments that come off as totally irrational. And I just chime in accordingly :)

 

I think you should give Oasis class a try. Only sad and miserable people that want attention on the forum don't have a good time on Oasis class. (don't confuse that with simply preferring something else).

[skywalkr2]

I think if you look at my comments, my supposed "belittling remarks" are very much geared towards people who make snotty, ridiculous comments to begin with. And you will notice that these same people have never actually been on these ships but have obnoxious comments that come off as totally irrational. And I just chime in accordingly :)

 

I think you should give Oasis class a try. Only sad and miserable people that want attention on the forum don't have a good time on Oasis class. (don't confuse that with simply preferring something else).

 

This post just proved his point. Good lord man, chill out.

[BNBR]

Very close. In its advertising blurbs for the Seaside, it says the design evokes a Miami condo on a ship. I was intrigued enough to price it and found I could get a mid ship balcony for two under $2K. Free specialty meal, free 1 hr spa treatment and free loyalty status match for Carnival Diamond to MSC Black Card, their highest.

 

The MSC laundry perk is only 30% off pricing, rather than unlimited free, but I think I can adjust. For me, I stopped sailing the little ships 10 or more years ago because I thought they were old back then. Now I sail Carnival's newer ships, like Magic, Vista and Horizon, as well as trying other lines. I do like the idea of LNG powered ships; that change from diesel might be more revolutionary than the size of the ship.

 

I like diversity, others like familiarity, there's enough choices out in the market to satisfy both.

 

We priced out Seaside for next year as well. But I decided I really would rather wait until we get some feed back, ship tours, etc before committing to it. Kind of like Vista - glad we didn't end up booking it.

[Warm Breezes]

They've mentioned a few times during the future cruise sales events that one of the things they're proud of is the ships have a similar layout across the fleet. This way someone who doesn't cruise often will have a familiarity to the cruise ship and will make it easier to orient themselves on a new ship. I'm glad they're supposed to be doing a new plan for the new larger ships, one of the things I like about trying out ships in different fleets is getting a new experience. It's one of the reasons we don't stick to one line (they all have their plus's and minus's after all).

 

Carnival's similar layout is one of the things that appeals most to my DH about Carnival. He prefers the smaller to mid-size ships where he knows his way around without getting lost. I prefer the mid-size, large, and mega-size ships. I like exploring new areas and getting new venues. Both of our opinions are valid as they relate to us and our cruise choices reflect a willingness on both of our parts to compromise with each other. The problem on this thread is that no one has to compromise with any one else, your vacation choices are your own, thus posters are throwing out their opinions as being the most valid. But in fact all the opinions are valid to the person making them. We are not alike. Our opinions will vary based on our own individual preferences.

 

Having said that I see Carnival moving on and pushing the size barrier for themselves, albeit at a slower pace than NCL and Royal and possible other cruise lines. But I also don't see the smaller, mid-size ships disappearing overnight on any of the lines. They will slowly phase out but I really don't see that phase out being completed in my life time. IMHO the choice will remain for us small, mid-size, large or mega ship until the day we make our final sail hopefully in 20-30 years. Anything beyond that....really doesn't matter to me. Probably shouldn't matter to most of you either ;).