Norway/France sold for scrap

[etoile]

I had no idea. Thank you for sharing that with me.

[Freckles67]

My first ever cruise was on the FRANCE, NYC to Cherbourg. It was the second to last sailing before she was sold and renamed NORWAY. It was in Aug. 1974. Our departure from NYC was delayed, and on a TV in the lounge Richard Nixon was giving his resignation speech. I felt a slight vibration and realized we were underway. Out on deck the beautiful New York skyline was gliding by. But history was on the TV... what to do??? When Nixon said, "I have never been a quitter..." I decided I'd had enough history and went out on deck to enjoy spectacular view, which is still vivid in my mind.

 

The next day I listened to Gerald Ford being sworn in via the news on the telephone! (No TVs in the cabins!) I was also treated to a special tour below decks by a first class waiter, and had a date with an officer who kissed me in front of the huge FRANCE sign on one of the open air decks. Ah memories!!!

 

I recently found my FRANCE daily newspapers and the menus given to me by my waiter. Is there anywhere on this website that I can upload scans of them?

[PennyAgain]

Sad story, but good information for history.

[lineboat]

very reliable sites reporting { maritime matters and India news sites} that Indian Govt. has approved the beaching today.

[lineboat]

According to the "ssmaritime" site another ownership transfer took place yesterday thereby perhaps slowing this long,long,long process.If you are at all interested in this famous and most likely doomed piece of maritime history visit "www.ssmaritime.com" for an in depth look at the recent events.

[lineboat]

Two sites are now reporting that the end is at hand, Maritime Matters and SSMaritime.It is now reported that a tug was hired for the tow to Alang from anchor. This is to be done at 1900 on 14 August or 7:00PM (not sure which time zone). And further it is belived the tow has begun.

Now the vultures attack a most elegant and grand lady.

THE next item on NCL's hit list is the SS United States. Our visionary elected officials turned her over as part of a deal that can only go bad.NCL,STAR CRUISES and its casino parent have not shown good faith dealings with NORWAY so why would they be any different with the UNITED STATES.

I for one will not sail on NCL.

[JotWorld]

:( :( :( :( Our 1st Five Cruises on that Lovely Old Lady!

We will miss her!

"Via La France"

Bill & Irene

[dougnewmanatsea]

According to the "ssmaritime" site another ownership transfer took place yesterday thereby perhaps slowing this long,long,long process.If you are at all interested in this famous and most likely doomed piece of maritime history visit "www.ssmaritime.com" for an in depth look at the recent events.

I do not have much faith in "Project Dubai" or Reuben Goossens.

 

It is worth noting that Mr Goossens has been involved with a rather large number of failed ventures in the past, especially pertaining to the Australian cruise business. His web site has gotten people's hopes up about a number of different projects - for example, one to use THE BIG RED BOAT III (ex TRANSVAAL CASTLE, FESTIVALE, ISLANDBREEZE) on cruises from Australia. As far as I know, not one of these has ever come to fruition. He seems to lend out his web site to any dubious venture that comes along involving an old ship. I'm all for saving old ships, but it doesn't give me much confidence.

 

What I must take issue with is Mr Goossens' ridiculous vendetta against Star Cruises and NCL. It seems that he has constructed a conspiracy theory which basically says that Star Cruises, for some unknown but malicious reason, have forced NORWAY to be scrapped despite the apparent presence of parties who were willing and able to use NORWAY in some other way in the future, were it not for Star Cruises' blocking of them. I do not find this claim to be in the least bit plausible.

 

First, all evidence suggests that Star Cruises did everything they could to find some alternative use for NORWAY, and that it was not until it was absolutely clear to them that there was no alternative to scrapping that they did in fact sell her for scrap. It seems rather odd to me that if Star were so determined to scrap her as Mr Goossens and others claim, they did not simply sell her for scrap in the first place rather than hold on to her for several years while trying to find a buyer. Keeping her doubtless cost them a lot of money, and I cannot imagine that they'd have spent it if they were determined to scrap her anyway.

 

Second, if the Dubai group are for real, why did they not appear until after the ship was already sold for scrap? Why didn't they buy her when Star Cruises were ready and willing to sell her to anyone that had the money?

 

Third, Mr Goossens puts forward other companies as good examples, which are really quite silly. For example, he mentions P&O as a good example, as they sold ORIANA for further static use. Surely he is also aware that Premier Cruises were ready to buy CANBERRA, but that P&O elected to scrap her instead? This is just as bad as what he is accusing Star Cruises of!

 

He makes much of the apparent clause in the sale contract of BLUE LADY preventing her from being used commercially in the future. However, it seems he is not aware that this is standard practice when selling ships for scrap, for many reasons. No doubt many will remember that CGT included such a clause when selling LIBERTÉ for scrap, having seen ÎLE DE FRANCE used in "The Last Voyage". I guess it is a good thing Mr Goossens' web site was not around in 1962, or he would have called for boycotting CGT!

 

In reality, what Mr Goossens makes so much fuss about is a clause in the contract saying that if she is to be used for further commercial use, the new owners will have to pay $2m to Star. Now, Mr Goossens claims that the Dubai people have very large sums of money to spend on her, in which case I do not understand why, if they are genuinely willing and able to buy the ship, they do not simply abide by the contract and pay Star the $2m! This "fine" is not any kind of effort on Star's part to stop the ship from being used in the future; rather it is purely there because the ship's value for further use is higher than her scrap value, and it is designed to prevent someone from buying the ship for scrap and then selling her on for further use at a higher price, thus cheating Star out of money. It is only fair that if she is sold for scrap and then resold for further use, that Star ought to get some sort of compensation. Otherwise, nobody would ever be able to sell a ship for less than scrap value!

 

At any rate, if these Dubai people can afford the money necessary to turn the ship into a floating hotel or whatever it is they want to do, then surely they can afford this $2m fee. However, Mr Goossens neglects to mention this fact and seems instead to suggest that Star will not allow the ship to be sold for further use. They will do that; they just want their $2m. Seems fair to me... And yet instead Mr Goossens calls for boycotting Star and says all sorts of very nasty things about them.

 

Indeed, if we are to boycott Star, no doubt we must also boycott Carnival because P&O sold CANBERRA for scrap, Royal Caribbean because Celebrity sold BRITANIS and AMERIKANIS for scrap, and so on! Indeed, since the clause that so provokes the ire of Mr Goossens is standard practice in the shipping business, I suppose we ought to boycott the whole industry! But he does not suggest that, making me wonder why he has it in for Star in particular...

 

In the end, I do not think that "Project Dubai" had any greater chance of succeeding than any of the the other pie-in-the-sky ventures with which Mr Goossens has been affiliated over the years. Unfortunately, he seems to have a vendetta against Star Cruises and is convinced that they are responsible for her scrapping. Whether you want to believe this is up to you. I will not, and I will not have any trouble sailing in their ships in the future.

 

As for NORWAY, may she rest in peace. She had a very long and illustrious career under two flags but she is now an old lady and her time has come.

[Post Captain]

I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but the BBC News website has just reported that the inevitable has finally happened: The "Blue Lady" has been run aground at Alang:

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4796221.stm

 

Not surprisingly, the BBC gets a number of facts wrong, starting with the rather benign and certainly misleading headline 'Toxic ship' docks in Indian port. Alas, we know she didn't "dock," and Alang isn't a "port." And of course, for those of us who care about great ships and about maritime history, the focus shouldn't be on the charge that she's a "toxic ship" but on the fact that she was the France/Norway, one of the last great ocean liners.

 

But through all the errors of reporting, it is clear that this is the end of the France/Norway. And that's all that matters.

 

A sad day.

[etoile]

Funny that the headline emphasizes "toxic" but the article barely references it. At least there is a link to Greenpeace India, although that does not have a link to the Greenpeace pages about why shipbreaking is so toxic to the workers that perform it.

 

So is this it, now? Has there ever been an 11th-hour save after a ship has been beached? The BBC article says she has a month before she is ready...is there any hope?

[Vesna]

The end of an era....very sad. I never got a chance to sail on her but I know she is an amazing ship.

 

I sailed on her several times in the late 1980's, early 1990's and she was a great ship, the largest out there at that time, old but with character, did NOT have those horrible cookie cutter rooms/hallways that the modern ships have, but had all sorts of sizes and nooks and crannies for rooms (including several small rooms for a single person only) and winding corridors. I just hate those "all rooms look alike" ships of today. Glad my cruising days are mostly over I guess, kind of like the old Norway :(

[dougnewmanatsea]

is there any hope?

No. It's over. :(

[bepsf]

Heres a pic of her taken yesterday being beached:

 

[JotWorld]

Heres a pic of her taken yesterday being beached:

 

 

We'll Miss You!

Thanks for the Good Times!:)

Bill & Irene

[ryndam]

Maritime Matters has posted two pictures of the Norway on the beach at Alang.

 

http://www.maritimematters.com/shipnewspics.html

[JotWorld]

 

A very Sad Day Indeed!

[bh2359]

She was born in France on May 11, 1960 at 4:15 in the afternoon. It was apparent at the beginning that she didn't posess the great number of stacks some others had but she had enough. After all, there was no other lady in the sea longer than her. She had a stately run for the French Line.

 

At the age of nineteen, she was adopted by the Norwegian Cruise Line and adopted their family name "Norway". As she was now an adult, she received a facelift and some nice new blue skin.

 

She spent her adult life in the Caribbean and made many many friends there. Those who saw her immediately recognized her as the class of society among her other friends at each port.

 

She WAS the class of the lot, and because of her international group of working friends (crew), she was the only one allowed to fly the United Nations Flag.

 

Because of her unusually long legs, she could not dock as her other friends did, and was left to anchor out in the water, for all who saw here out there to admire. Because of her long legs (draft), she was not allowed to go through the Panama Canal so had to stay in her neighborhood.

 

As she got older, her reputation spread, and most people who met her, liked her and had good words to say about her. Sadly, as she approached old age, her adopted parents got rid of her and she has now been left high asnd dry in a new neighborhood to rot away as the vultures tear away at her flesh.

 

She died, so to speak, on August 15, 2006, a day that will live in infamy ... no wait, that's another speech!

 

Long Live the France - Norway - Blue Lady.

 

##########

 

At sailaway, we all knew we were on the lady of the seas. We saw all the people in the other boxes, I mean ships, leaning on their railings watching us go by. Yes, we certainly stood out from the rest. A blue Lady surrounded by all that virginal white.

 

I fondly remember walking down the enclosed promanade on the International Deck, looking out the great expanse of windows. Sometimes, I'd idle to the forward end to Svens Ice Cream parlor for a dish of good ice cream. There were chairs and tables there, never crowded, as a matter of fact, I never found the International deck crowded in all my cruises on her.

 

I'd go up a deck and walk on the outside promanade on Olympic Deck and feel the air rushing by as she sailed on. I walked under the lifeboats, always wondering what would happen if one of them fell on me! I also remember during lifeboat drill thinkng that if there was a problem, and lifeboats were lowered to get in, no one would want to leave this great ship. Sorta like what happened on the Titanic.

 

I'd then go up one more deck to Fiord where my cabin usually was. I knew where to find the "secret place" where I could look into the aft pool and watch people swim, from my underwater advantage. I also knew about the four inside cabins that had outside windows (figure that one out!). We stayed in one of these on our last voyage with her, the second to last voyage she ever made.

 

You could go up to the top, Sky Deck, and stand beside her huge funnels. If you were there when she "spoke", you knew her horn was one of the loudest between her and her friends. She also kept her figure and trim lines and didn't get so "boxey" as all of her friends did.

 

For some strange reason, there never was many people up on Sky Deck, probably because of the sun shining down and the strong breeze that occurred. I liked it there, looking down over her many decks at the water and not feeling a thing. Very seldom did she shudder or sway to a large wave.

 

Really, the only place that seemed to be eternally crowded was the Great Outdoor Restaurant at the stern of the International Deck. Perhaps that was the fun of it, getting your food and looking for a place to sit and eat. IF you made friends on the voyage, and that was easy to do, you could always find someone at a table yelling to you, "Over Here, we've got seats". The cooks there gave you many treats, some cooked in some of the largest barbeques I've ever seen.

 

Dinner time always found us in second class. We preferred the Leeward Dining Room. The Windward, the old first class dining room, was beautiful with its stairway and all, but to us, it was always much too noisy. We always picked the Leeward, and we always got a table on the balcony looking down on the others. We made a lot of friends up there. I remember our very first cruise on her. As we ate, a string quartet strolled by. Gracious me, it reminded me of the grand old days ... and she WAS a grand old lady.

[Philly Steve]

She lives in vivid memory.

[Senor Pagell]

:) Check with Maritime Matters.com

[Almagetty]

Beautiful tribute, BH, thank you. I'll admit that reading your post made me choke up just a bit! I also preferred the Leeward to the Windward because of the noise level. What a Grand Lady she was! I am so glad I was able to spend so much time aboard!

[cruizinrican]

I am sorry but I do not understand the term "beached"? I can see she is stuck in mud but what happens to her now? What is the process that takes place when a ship is sold for scrap? And is she "scrapped" where she lays? Also, is she sitting there with crew? And has she been empty of any contents yet or is she still as she was after the last pax left her?

 

To bad articles could not have been removed for a museum!

 

Sorry I am not up to date on these terms?

 

PS- Hubby and I snooped around and found those "secret cabins" corridor and the secret windows to the above deck pool! Memories of these and of our bunk bed rooms, I will never forget! And eating every night in the Bistro bc we hated the Windward Dining room and to me, that was the best $20 made to order meal we had ever eaten! So we ate there the rest of the week!

 

Damn, I am going to miss her!

[etoile]

Greenpeace has some information about shipbreaking, you can read it here:

http://www.greenpeaceweb.org/shipbreak/whatis.asp

[intrepid_guy]

I am sorry but I do not understand the term "beached"? I can see she is stuck in mud but what happens to her now? What is the process that takes place when a ship is sold for scrap? And is she "scrapped" where she lays? Also, is she sitting there with crew? And has she been empty of any contents yet or is she still as she was after the last pax left her?

 

Damn, I am going to miss her!

 

Let's see if I can help...

 

Beached = the ship is run aground on to the (or very near to) the shore, in this case in India. The ship is sitting on the ground instead of floating in the water.

 

Scrapping or breaking the ship = the ship is literally cut down into small chunks and then recycled for her steel. Indian workers risk life and limb (literally) for very little money to cut the ship up. The ship is scrapped where it sits.

 

There is no crew aboard not (at least most likely not) the cruise crew left the ship ages ago, there was probably only a skeleton crew aboard to get her to India safely in one piece.

 

Some of the interior fittings have been removed, but a large portion of the interiors are still there. The remaining "stuff" onboard is now owned by the scrapyard and can be sold off for more money. So she is very much like she was 3 years ago when the accident occured.

 

I hope this clears up some of your confusion... and... Damn, I am going to miss her... too.

 

~Intrepid

[cruizinrican]

Let's see if I can help...

 

Beached = the ship is run aground on to the (or very near to) the shore, in this case in India. The ship is sitting on the ground instead of floating in the water.

 

Scrapping or breaking the ship = the ship is literally cut down into small chunks and then recycled for her steel. Indian workers risk life and limb (literally) for very little money to cut the ship up. The ship is scrapped where it sits.

 

There is no crew aboard not (at least most likely not) the cruise crew left the ship ages ago, there was probably only a skeleton crew aboard to get her to India safely in one piece.

 

Some of the interior fittings have been removed, but a large portion of the interiors are still there. The remaining "stuff" onboard is now owned by the scrapyard and can be sold off for more money. So she is very much like she was 3 years ago when the accident occured.

 

I hope this clears up some of your confusion... and... Damn, I am going to miss her... too.

 

~Intrepid

 

You did help me to understand and I thank you!

 

I am still in disbelief over her doomed departure! I just don't even know what to say?? This is a terrible way for such a historical ship to die! It is so sad to me and I am so glad that we do not live off the coast there of India to watch them dismantle her like pure junk/trash!!

[Mandarine Bleue]

Hi. I just joined this site, and I hope my message goes through.

 

I was on Norway in the late 90s. She showed her age then, but she still had quite a bit of style. My parents had sailed her between France and NYC in the late 60s and 70s, when she was still called France, and they had extraordinary memories of life on board this great ship.

 

It is sad to see her beached for breaking, but I suppose it is life. I hate the idea of rich nations sending safety hazards for poor countries to deal with. In my opinion, that is the real tragedy here.

 

Someone mentioned that some of her inside fittings had been removed. Would that be the art work, such as the huge marble sculptures of greek gods in one of the lounges\bars? I wonder if this stuff will ever surface again, perhaps on another ship (although I don't think this type of art work would be much in demand on modern ships!) or just preserved somewhere.