If only it were only Nickles and dimes.

[cruiseny4life]

2 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

Exactly. And the corollary is "you can't please everyone all of the time." If NCL or other lines were to introduce no-nonsense, fully inclusive pricing, people would complain "why should I have to pay for things I don't want?" I 100% guarantee there would be howls of protest. The cruise lines can't win: people complain about being nickled and dimed, and then complain that they can't opt out of things to save money. 🤷‍♂️🤦‍♂️ Personally, I like NCL's model, but I admit that I ALWAYS look at the TOTAL price of the cruise including all fees and gratuities. Yes, it takes a bit more work to compare lines, but it's worth it in the end for me.

I have a feeling I have complained about NCL's "nickel and diming" on these boards...and, I probably will in the future. But...in this moment I'm with you. I do appreciate selecting (or not) the drink package, specialty dining, whether I'm going to get laundry done (nope, not happening, btw), going to the speedway, or whatever else is the latest nickel and dime. 

But, it could be tomorrow even, I'll complain about the nickel and diming, because I'm a ridiculous consumer. 

[DCGuy64]

I probably spend way too much time reading these boards, but 2 of my constant sources of unintended hilarity are these:

1. The poster who claims that some line is "nickel and diming" him by adding on $200 in gratuities for a 7-night cruise and would rather sail with "insert high priced luxury line here" even though they charge $20,000 more for the "all-inclusive." Yessiree, that's some savings right there! LOL

2. The poster who complains about paying $4.95 for room service but you see under his CC signature that he has 5 20-day cruises booked in the next year with Crystal cruises or Seabourn. I mean, really? You're that loaded and you b*tch about a lousy $5 fee? Again, LOL.

 

 

[wolft927]

On 4/28/2023 at 8:41 AM, cruiseny4life said:

Absolutely! Last year I took my first cruise, in April to Bermuda on NCL. While booking, I thought to myself having free specialty dining every night of the cruise is just too good to be true. And, I could really have all the free drinks I wanted? Then we booked and saw the gratuities added. And, then I came to Cruise Critic and discovered I would only receive two free meals. I was absolutely and completely ticked! 

 

People on here talk about doing due diligence, but I'd like to know how many folks actually review the terms and conditions for everything they buy. I'm a much more savvy cruise consumer now, but I still have a very sour taste in my mouth for NCL's business practices. Luckily for them (not that they care), the onboard experience, in the Haven, is worth dealing with their shady business. But, posters on here are far too quick to blame the inexperienced cruiser while giving the cruise lines a pass on being unethical. 

So what your saying it is NCL's fault that you did not read the cruise contract or pricing information and what it included before paying? Carnival has a cheers package, but if you dont read the fine print you will not know that it is capped at 15 drinks, also they dont tell you that even without the cheers package you are also capped at 15 drinks per day. 

Also you say NCL has Shady business practices? Well if that is your thoughts on the matter why would you ever do business with a company like that? 

[cruiseny4life]

39 minutes ago, wolft927 said:

So what your saying it is NCL's fault that you did not read the cruise contract or pricing information and what it included before paying? Carnival has a cheers package, but if you dont read the fine print you will not know that it is capped at 15 drinks, also they dont tell you that even without the cheers package you are also capped at 15 drinks per day. 

Also you say NCL has Shady business practices? Well if that is your thoughts on the matter why would you ever do business with a company like that? 

Hmm...nope, I never said it was NCL's fault. Hence, "I'm a much more savvy cruise consumer now..."

 

Shady business practices...yep...yet my bank is Chase (I'm not a fan), I go to FL and spend money (where my husband and I aren't exactly welcomed), I've eaten at chains which disrupt small mom and pop restaurants, I eat GMO's (are they really ok?) ...so yea...count NCL as one of hundreds of businesses my dollars support that have shady business practices. This just isn't a forum about those other businesses. 

 

The intent of my message (and I know you know this - you're not one of the dull posters on CC) is the acceptance of shady business practices by consumers, including me. 

[corman-cruise]

On 5/3/2023 at 5:05 PM, ChiefMateJRK said:

We enjoyed it almost daily on the Bliss the last two weeks.

You've missed it brother!!  We had groups of two and sometimes four!  The pastry girls were singing their rendition of the ABBA classic dancing queen, modified to "we are the pastry queens, young and...).  The coffee girls weren't singing but it was "wakey wakey, coffee for you, ....." (I can't remember exactly other than 90% of the passengers really were having fun.  Then, there are always the other 10% who 💩 on fun.)

I seem to remember it on most NCL cruises.  Certainly the Joy last September and the Encore a couple times before that.  It may be that the smaller ships don't do it because the buffets are more crowded/limited.

Not on this encore ship going through the Panama canal. 

But there was a fellow singing his washie washie hands giggle at the entrance to the buffet. 

[graphicguy]

Have wandered in and out of these waters way too many times.  So, what do I do?  I wander in deeper!!!!

 

I always look at total out of pocket.  I mean, that's the bottom line, right?  How much you spend in total?

 

You may find this charge or that charge different on some ships, even some cruise companies.  At the end of the day, how much IN TOTAL will the cruise cost.  All things being equal (and they rarely are in the cruise world), similar itinerary, similar ship type, similar ship services, they are all going to be close in total out of pocket.  Always going to be some outliers in that statement.  But, overall they are competing with each other.  So, they have to stay pretty close as far as perks, fares, amenities, etc.

 

Generally, NCL is right there with the rest with competitive pricing.  Right after the restart, I took a couple of Celebrity cruises.  Nice ships, good service, good food, typical itineraries (Caribbean).  They were touting their version of "EVERYTHING INCLUDED".  Tips, drinks, internet included (no specialty dining however) and they gave some nice OBC, too.  Great!

 

But, to get that, you had to pay more in base fare compared to NCL.  Some like that.  They don't want to have to do the compare/contrast of all charges.  Celebrity alleviates that.  But, their fare and out of pocket were higher.

 

That's just one example.  If you only look at one sailing, on a newer ship, going to popular destinations, during the "high season", it's going to be more expensive than taking an older ship, during low season, etc.

 

So, whoever I see a thread talking about nickel and diming, or someone state NCL's fares are too high, or they can't get what they want for cheap, I just chuckle.  Shop a little and you'll find something you'll like that will probably fit your budget.

[corman-cruise]

2 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

I probably spend way too much time reading these boards, but 2 of my constant sources of unintended hilarity are these:

1. The poster who claims that some line is "nickel and diming" him by adding on $200 in gratuities for a 7-night cruise and would rather sail with "insert high priced luxury line here" even though they charge $20,000 more for the "all-inclusive." Yessiree, that's some savings right there! LOL

 

 

 

I mentioned the $20, 000 to illustrate its not that we aren't willing to spend money, it's the principle. Princess and other ships, we were given a drink package but never had to pay a 20% on top of a over inflated price. We won't go there, that has been beaten to death. 

 

The post was if only it  Nickle and dime. 

We and other fellow cruisers on THIS PARTICULAR sailing loved the ship but did notice a number of issues. Many mention the additional fees and water not included in a drink package, things like that were talking points. 

I am convinced they were understaffed. 

The excursions were awful, they were poorly organized, resulting in us leaving the dock 30 to 40 minutes late. 

Disembarking was a gong show. It took 2 hours in a huge line to clear the customs officer. 

There was no organization there, no visible signs indicating where the line should start, people cutting inline. 

People were openly discussing their dissatisfaction towards ncl, a majority claimed they would never sail with them again. These people instigated those sentiments, not me. I told them I was wondering if it was only I who saw the issues. 

I know there are many who do not like to hear this, but these are real people saying this openly. 

 

[DCGuy64]

I'm a big believer in the phrase "vote with your feet." If people have a poor experience onboard a particular ship or a particular line, then there are plenty of others out there for them to try. What I find amusing from time to time are people who complain to high heaven about the terrible experience they have, and then proceed to book even more cruises with the same awful line. There are some people over on the MSC boards who come to mind: 1/2 the time they're decrying the poor website performance and the awful cruises, and the other 1/2 they're boasting about the other cruises they've booked with the same company. I don't get it, but attention seeker comes to mind. I also take "never going to sail with them again" with a grain of salt. People often say things in the moment that they don't really mean, at least not in the long run. But again, I look at the total cost of the cruise, not the nickels and dimes. I wouldn't pay double the cost at a fancier line just to "stick it to NCL" over their extra fees because that'd be a textbook example of cutting off my nose to spite my face. Also, FWIW, customs procedures aren't the purview of the cruise line, that's good old fashioned government "efficiency" at work. Same with 3rd party excursion companies, they're not owned by the cruise line. But like I said, if you're unhappy, vote with your feet.

[graphicguy]

A little insight……..

 

-Customs/immigration is run by the country you’re entering/learning.

-Disembarkation at the end of the cruise (or embarking on a cruise) can and is chaotic.  Just imagine you were in a high rise hotel and everyone staying in the hotel decided to check out/check in….all at the same time.  That’s what’s happening on a cruise ship, with up to 4,000+ passengers.

 

They try to stagger dis/embarkation.  But, cruise people (that includes me) want what they want right now.  That doesn’t lend itself to cooperation to have things run smoothly.  I will say that you can affect you dis/embarkation by not trying to do it all at the same time as everyone else.

 

For example…The vast majority (but not all) of people who embark, insist on getting to the pier as early as possible.  Problem there is, you have the previous guests disembarking the same time as you’re trying to embark.  Result?  Chaos.  Try waiting until early afternoon to embark. Disembarking guests are all off, and the big surge to embark has passed. Much easier and smoother to do it later.

 

Some people drag ½ their wardrobe with them.  That makes for an uncomfortable dis/embarkation.  Try packing lighter (much lighter)

 

NCL excursions are booked through contractors.  So, they are dependent on them.  The assurances NCL offers are they will wait for you if your excursion operator somehow is running late.  So, being late do sail after an excursion is NCL holding to their promise to wait for you if your excursion runs late.  It costs more, but they provide some assurances as a result.

 

This is true of all cruise lines, though.

 

A little planning and some common sense will make your “I’m not sailing ‘XYZ’ cruise line again” into “we rolled with the punches and had a grand time”!

[wolft927]

1 hour ago, corman-cruise said:

I mentioned the $20, 000 to illustrate its not that we aren't willing to spend money, it's the principle. Princess and other ships, we were given a drink package but never had to pay a 20% on top of a over inflated price. We won't go there, that has been beaten to death. 

 

The post was if only it  Nickle and dime. 

We and other fellow cruisers on THIS PARTICULAR sailing loved the ship but did notice a number of issues. Many mention the additional fees and water not included in a drink package, things like that were talking points. 

I am convinced they were understaffed. 

The excursions were awful, they were poorly organized, resulting in us leaving the dock 30 to 40 minutes late. 

Disembarking was a gong show. It took 2 hours in a huge line to clear the customs officer. 

There was no organization there, no visible signs indicating where the line should start, people cutting inline. 

People were openly discussing their dissatisfaction towards ncl, a majority claimed they would never sail with them again. These people instigated those sentiments, not me. I told them I was wondering if it was only I who saw the issues. 

I know there are many who do not like to hear this, but these are real people saying this openly. 

 

I get the drink package point with Princess, but some of your other points

 

Water has NEVER been included in the Drink package that comes with the FAS...so not sure why that would be a shock

 

Understaffed...I am sure they were...just like every other business on sea and on land. 

 

Excursions: NCL does not own the tour operators that do the excursions...but to your point if they are that bad they need to be brought to the attention of the ship as they will and do suspend tours of there is enough complaints about them.

 

Disembarkation: This again can go smoothly or horrible: A lot of this depends on the staffing levels of CBP. I have had good and bad disembarkations on every Cruise Line

 

As far as people saying they will never sail again on NCL....that is their option where to spend there hard earned money. I will never say I will never sail a certain cruise line, but i do have preferences. We were on the Joy in April during Spring Break week, ship was absolutely slammed packed, but we expected that. Was some service a little slower, sure, but had an amazing vacation.   

[corman-cruise]

23 minutes ago, wolft927 said:

I get the drink package point with Princess, but some of your other points

 

Water has NEVER been included in the Drink package that comes with the FAS...so not sure why that would be a shock

 

Understaffed...I am sure they were...just like every other business on sea and on land. 

 

Excursions: NCL does not own the tour operators that do the excursions...but to your point if they are that bad they need to be brought to the attention of the ship as they will and do suspend tours of there is enough complaints about them.

 

Disembarkation: This again can go smoothly or horrible: A lot of this depends on the staffing levels of CBP. I have had good and bad disembarkations on every Cruise Line

 

As far as people saying they will never sail again on NCL....that is their option where to spend there hard earned money. I will never say I will never sail a certain cruise line, but i do have preferences. We were on the Joy in April during Spring Break week, ship was absolutely slammed packed, but we expected that. Was some service a little slower, sure, but had an amazing vacation.   

The ship was amazing. 

[RB9643]

I'm trying to keep up.

 

I book a cruise, I research everything, I know what to expect. I know the price I'm paying, and exactly what I'm getting for that price. 

 

I know actually reading the cruse contract is hard, but it's not rocket science.

[graphicguy]

Speaking of customs lines, there must be different implementations of the face recognition stations.  I’ve had some that you just boogie right through.  Just went through the one in Seattle, and it was very slow in face recognition.  Same face.  Different implementations.  

 

I would have thought the Federal Gov’t would have contracted with the same facial recognition company for ALL of those cameras.   Maybe some are newer than others.  I just know the ones in MIA and FLL are way faster than the ones Customs uses for Seattle Pier 66.

[graphicguy]

Never say never, but Princess has been the one line I can’t really find good deals on.  And, I shop a lot.

 

I know it appeals, because they have quite a few ships.  They’ve just never compelled me to sail them.

 

Just shows, one person’s perfect cruise line is another’s “meh”!

[poppy jalopy]

Just a quick response. 13 day tour of Italy with some meals $13,000.00

8 day river cruise all inclusive $13;000.00. 7 days in southern Caribbean, all food all drinks, shows and air on NCL $3,800.00

 

[RocketMan275]

2 hours ago, graphicguy said:

I would have thought the Federal Gov’t would have contracted with the same facial recognition company for ALL of those cameras.   Maybe some are newer than others.  I just know the ones in MIA and FLL are way faster than the ones Customs uses for Seattle Pier 66.

Federal acquisition regulations require (with exceptions) procuring hardware/services through a competiive process (low bidder wins).  Depending upon how the contract or contracts are structured, there could be different winners for different locations.  The processing time might depend upon how busy the airport is.

[Sailing12Away]

14 minutes ago, poppy jalopy said:

Just a quick response. 13 day tour of Italy with some meals $13,000.00

8 day river cruise all inclusive $13;000.00. 7 days in southern Caribbean, all food all drinks, shows and air on NCL $3,800.00

 

Not sure what point you're trying to make there... you're comparing apples to polka dots to June 2nd. 

 

If you had said a 7 day land tour of Italy with some meals was 13K vs an all inclusive luxury hotel in Italy for 7 days is 8K vs a the 7 day Mediterranean NCL cruise is 4K - that I can follow.

 

And anyone dropping 13K on a land tour needs to come talk to me and give me that money instead. Our first NCL cruise was the Mediterranean one with 2 days pre in Rome and 7 days post in Venice/Florence. For 3 people with flights and everything all in we didn't come anywhere close to that price. It was closer to 7-8K for the group.

[wolft927]

9 minutes ago, Sailing12Away said:

Not sure what point you're trying to make there... you're comparing apples to polka dots to June 2nd. 

 

If you had said a 7 day land tour of Italy with some meals was 13K vs an all inclusive luxury hotel in Italy for 7 days is 8K vs a the 7 day Mediterranean NCL cruise is 4K - that I can follow.

 

And anyone dropping 13K on a land tour needs to come talk to me and give me that money instead. Our first NCL cruise was the Mediterranean one with 2 days pre in Rome and 7 days post in Venice/Florence. For 3 people with flights and everything all in we didn't come anywhere close to that price. It was closer to 7-8K for the group.

Nobody needs to talk to you lol… how other spend their money is up to them. I have spent $1200 for a cruise also have spent upwards of $10k. I have also traveled the world every continent excluding Australia. Yes cruises berse land based is not the same… have done both but honestly I am happy with either 

[The Traveling Man]

Nickel and diming.  I don't object (in fact I really prefer) to pay only for those products and services which I find useful, interesting, or desirable.  I'm not a big fan of "one size fits all" pricing.  I'll probably never take a turn on the go carts, don't care to spend $20 for a game of darts, and there probably are at least a dozen other things that some folks truly enjoy while cruising that I can live without and would prefer not to financially subsidize those who do wish to indulge in them.  There likely are a number of things on board which I do enjoy, which cost extra, and for which many other passengers have no interest at all.  I rather enjoy shopping around, finding the best price (or at least a reasonable one) for a cruise that looks interesting, adding in those extras that pique my interest, and skipping those that don't.  Once so selected and recorded, however, I'd like to think that I'm all set, that I won't be hit up at every turn for a little bit for this, a bit more for that, and "Oh, you should have read the fine print more carefully to see that there's an extra charge for that."  I'll pause briefly so you can get the Innkeeper's song from Les Miserables out of your head.

 

I do wish that NCL, as well as many other companies which follow similar marketing policies, would be a bit more straightforward in presenting the costs and benefits of purchasing their products and services.  "Free" means free.  If they want to offer something at a discounted price, then advertise it as "discounted," not "free."  It's misleading and no amount of fine print on page 17 of a 23 page contract (full disclosure - exaggeration for effect) will leave their customers happy in the long run if they feel they have been duped by a misleading advertising offer.  The price of most everything else we buy has gone up significantly in the last couple of years.  It's reasonable to think that the total cost of a cruise should be greater, as well.  My one request for NCL is that they not cheapen the quality of their product at the same time they are raising the price.  When I'm on vacation, I want to enjoy myself, to find my smile.  That can be difficult when memories of wonderful meals, great entertainment, and excellent service in days gone by are overshadowed by the shortcomings which many on this and other threads have reported about recent cruises.  My two cents worth.

[RB9643]

3 hours ago, The Traveling Man said:

My one request for NCL is that they not cheapen the quality of their product at the same time they are raising the price.  

 

I think this is one sentence that no one can disagree with, although there's always going to be one out there.

 

True that the old days are gone. Now we just have to wait and see. This is true for any of the mass-market cruise lines who are constantly expanding, trying to pack 4000-7000 people on a ship, and trying to give investors a return on investment.  Something has to give, and I hope it's not the experience.

[ChiefMateJRK]

26 minutes ago, RB9643 said:

I think this is one sentence that no one can disagree with, although there's always going to be one out there.

I'll be that contrarian.  If they need to do both to remain viable and compete, then so be it.  Let's use the DSC as an example.  For steerage, the cost per person per day went from $16 to $20, and the evening turn downs were cancelled.  IOW, the cost went up but the service went down.  I'm fine with both if keeping the evening turn down would have instead necessitated the DSC going to $24 per person per day.  That said, I'm likely a bit more analytical and a bit less emotional than many of my fellow cruisers.😎🐀

[RB9643]

2 hours ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

I'll be that contrarian.  If they need to do both to remain viable and compete, then so be it.  

 

Of course you will! 😆

 

You forgot my "something has to give".  My preference is a higher price for the same experience. Do whatever is necessary with regards to price, but don't lower quality.

 

And yes, that's a tightrope. So, as you also missed, we'll wait and see. I think we're on the same page overall.

 

[ChiefMateJRK]

26 minutes ago, RB9643 said:

You forgot my "something has to give".  My preference is a higher price for the same experience. Do whatever is necessary with regards to price, but don't lower quality.

Sure.  My preference is to keep the DSC increases lower by eliminating that nighttime turndown which provided no value to me whatsoever.  That doesn't lower the quality of my cruise experience at all.  If it lowers your cruise experience, then you may want to pass that along to NCL in your next post-cruise survey.

28 minutes ago, RB9643 said:

Of course you will! 😆

Yikes!! I see no reason to get personal just because I shared a contrarian opinion.  It would be pretty boring around here if everybody agreed on everything. 😎  Some/most of us enjoy the various opinions.  Sometimes they even change my mind on some things, although I may be in the minority on that one.

[RB9643]

9 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Yikes!! I see no reason to get personal just because I shared a contrarian opinion. 

 

C'mon man! I don't get personal. It might take a bit of time to get to know each other. 😂

 

The once a day room service is a no-brainer to us. The 100-seat Syd Norman's and Comedy Club on the Prima was a much bigger factor.

 

We'll just wait and see.

 

 

[ChiefMateJRK]

2 minutes ago, RB9643 said:

The once a day room service is a no-brainer to us. The 100-seat Syd Norman's and Comedy Club on the Prima was a much bigger factor.

I'll agree with those as being problems.  I think these are more logistics and programming than cost reductions.  The performers get paid the same whether they are performing in one of those small venues or the main theater (which goes unused for much of the time).  I (and likely many others) don't understand why folks should cram into or miss the Rumors show when it could instead be presented in the theater.  That said, I haven't had the benefit of sailing on a cruise with that show but I'm sure it's great.  Is Syd Norman's any smaller than the Cavern Club on many other ships?