Panama Canal - Is Crystal Cancelling Panama Canal in December?

[Yankeeclipper1]

Read on a FB site (private group) that several clients received notification their Dec 13, 2023 Puerta Caldera to Miami was cancelled.  Have been reading Panama Canal is having drought problems and traffic is curtailed and backed up.  RCCL has cancelled all its Panama Canal cruises as of August 8.  Crystal website still shows Dec 13 Panama Canal.  I have Dec 3 Miami - PC booked but am waiting for the shoe to drop since that is a R/T cruise (two parts).  Anyone else have any info? (Crystal 800) didn't know what I was talking about.

[AtA]

I wonder how that will affect the WC since it's first leg is MIA to San Diego.

[KenzSailing]

We're booked on RSSC in December going thru the canal.  All's well with that cruise.

[Yankeeclipper1]

Shoe just dropped - TA informed me Dec 2 Miami - Puerto Caldera - changed.  He is on the  phone with them now because their "offer" was outrageously ridiculous - as if it was just a dropped port.     New itinerary is Miami - Nassau - St. Martin - St. Kitts - BVI - San Juan.  Eleven night cruise just became 7 nights and the title Panama Cruise - eliminated. No thanks - I'll pass.

(KenzSailing - you may want to double check that or keep on top of it).

[j_anandu]

41 minutes ago, Yankeeclipper1 said:

Shoe just dropped - TA informed me Dec 2 Miami - Puerto Caldera - changed.  He is on the  phone with them now because their "offer" was outrageously ridiculous - as if it was just a dropped port.     New itinerary is Miami - Nassau - St. Martin - St. Kitts - BVI - San Juan.  Eleven night cruise just became 7 nights and the title Panama Cruise - eliminated. No thanks - I'll pass.

(KenzSailing - you may want to double check that or keep on top of it).

It is ridiculous especially because if you decide to cancel and not proceed, they will penalize you for canceling. So they are wanting to charge me 25% for canceling my December 13th cruise 

[ctjon]

How will ships get from ocean to ocean without the Panama canal?  Maybe changing path etc.  but I'd think they have to do the canal (or my geography is wrong)

[Yankeeclipper1]

Canal is open - but slowed down due to lake water levels.  Canal operations are chargeing outrageous sums to guarantee front of the line access (Disney and Universal must be involved 😆).  Commercial cargo backing up big time - the fee for guaranteed slot makes a cruise financially not worth it - ships can still get through but cruise ships on strict schedules are considering other options.

[KenzSailing]

51 minutes ago, Yankeeclipper1 said:

Shoe just dropped - TA informed me Dec 2 Miami - Puerto Caldera - changed.  He is on the  phone with them now because their "offer" was outrageously ridiculous - as if it was just a dropped port.     New itinerary is Miami - Nassau - St. Martin - St. Kitts - BVI - San Juan.  Eleven night cruise just became 7 nights and the title Panama Cruise - eliminated. No thanks - I'll pass.

(KenzSailing - you may want to double check that or keep on top of it).

 

Yeah, thanks I just dropped a note to my TA.  Our last scheduled cruise was on Crystal and was vaporized by The Unfortunate Hiatus.  If this one evaporates, well I just don't know....

 

It's almost 6 PM here.  I'm hitting the wine.

[KenzSailing]

Good article on the canal in the Washington Post:

 

https://wapo.st/44mtPir

[ctjon]

so go around South America?  Long trip

[Leejnd4]

Yeah, as others pointed out, this is not Crystal's fault. Severe drought conditions are causing all kinds of problems in the Panama Canal. Many cruise lines are changing their itineraries.

 

As some of you know, we live on our sailboat in Mexico, and every season we have friends who sail down to Panama and transit the canal. This season many of our friends are rethinking their plans, due to all the chaos down there. 

[goldengatecruisers]

Very interesting thread.  I had no idea there were issues with delays at the Panama Canal.   I’ll be following this conversation.  Thank you for bringing it to everyone’s attention.  

[History&Wine]

2 hours ago, AtA said:

I wonder how that will affect the WC since it's first leg is MIA to San Diego.

I am on that segment and the WC.  I'm not concerned.  Serenity has to cross the canal on that cruise or there is a domino effect for every cruise after MIA-SAN.  Now...we might drop a port if the crossing is really backed up, but we must transit the canal. 

 

The cruises of December 2 and 13 can be rejiggered to exclude the canal and still proceed with succeeding cruises.

[crickette]

The low water levels in the lake and the impact on shipping was covered by Canadian news media quite awhile ago, as part of their coverage of global warming thoughout the world.  If I remember correctly (and I could easily be missing some of it) cruise ships that had reservations to transit the canal would be honoured (oops, bad sentence construction, so read between the lines).  New reservations have  become very expensive, and are limited in numbers.  I'm guessing now, but I wouldn't be surprised if Serenity was late to the reservation queue, and may have suffered the consequences (expense/limited supply).

[BWIVince]

2 hours ago, ctjon said:

so go around South America?  Long trip

 

I imagine it's probably going to be a case where you'll see the impacted cruise lines pay the premium for a repositioning cruise (unless they can afford to add a South America season), but not for individual transcanal sailings, but that's just a prediction.   

 

Vince

[Yankeeclipper1]

I am getting a bad vibe about this.  First - Crystal did not prepare its own 800 call center for this.  They (call center) did not know nor did they have any answers.  My TA had to elevate it to a Sr. Supervisor who admitted they were not prepared and he wasn't armed with any solutions today.  Later TA receives the communications about "offers".  Saw the "offers" - not satisfactory.  And before Crystal defenders start in - I get the out of Crystal control etc. I have no problem with the events causing this.  

 

But  - NO REFUND - and the offers (so far) absolutely do not work for me. We don't do cruises over 14 days, Panama Canal was the purpose of the trip, no refund is offered and only 10% on future cruise is not anything I am interested in with the limited time you have to use the credit - and the future PC trips DO NOT work for me - even at the same price with a couple extra sea days. The current cruise - with changed itinerary to those Caribbean ports? - been their a million times - no thanks. 

 

I am getting really pissed off when I hear that a straight refund is not offered. This is not dropping a port this is a total change of the cruise - 11 nights to 7 nights on a totally different 100% different itinerary.  Crystal is treating it as a dropped port or two. AND - They are not using the word CANCELLATION which some people are using - there is a reason Crystal will not say cancellation.  Not calling this a cancellation is a manipulation to serve the purpose of not providing refunds if requested - if the other offers don't work for the customer.

 

If I am roped in to a limited set of options with my money tied up - I may take that cruise I am limited to but I swear there will never be another Crystal cruise for us.  I would prefer to have the freedom to have my money back and choose exactly what I want. 

 

And yes - this has all been told to Crystal.

 

[BWIVince]

31 minutes ago, Yankeeclipper1 said:

I am getting a bad vibe about this.  First - Crystal did not prepare its own 800 call center for this.  They (call center) did not know nor did they have any answers.  My TA had to elevate it to a Sr. Supervisor who admitted they were not prepared and he wasn't armed with any solutions today.  Later TA receives the communications about "offers".  Saw the "offers" - not satisfactory.  And before Crystal defenders start in - I get the out of Crystal control etc. I have no problem with the events causing this.  

 

But  - NO REFUND - and the offers (so far) absolutely do not work for me. We don't do cruises over 14 days, Panama Canal was the purpose of the trip, no refund is offered and only 10% on future cruise is not anything I am interested in with the limited time you have to use the credit - and the future PC trips DO NOT work for me - even at the same price with a couple extra sea days. The current cruise - with changed itinerary to those Caribbean ports? - been their a million times - no thanks. 

 

I am getting really pissed off when I hear that a straight refund is not offered. This is not dropping a port this is a total change of the cruise - 11 nights to 7 nights on a totally different 100% different itinerary.  Crystal is treating it as a dropped port or two. AND - They are not using the word CANCELLATION which some people are using - there is a reason Crystal will not say cancellation.  Not calling this a cancellation is a manipulation to serve the purpose of not providing refunds if requested - if the other offers don't work for the customer.

 

If I am roped in to a limited set of options with my money tied up - I may take that cruise I am limited to but I swear there will never be another Crystal cruise for us.  I would prefer to have the freedom to have my money back and choose exactly what I want. 

 

And yes - this has all been told to Crystal.

 

Legally Crystal is 100% correct about the voyage not getting cancelled (the itinerary can be changed for reasons without their control), and that doesn’t count as a cancellation if they are still operating during the same timeframe, even if the dates and ports change.  Cruise line contracts vary from airlines in many ways.  THAT SAID, that doesn’t mean you just have to accept whatever they toss out without pushback.  If the dates embarkation/disembarkation dates changed before or after your original booking dates, your agent should push back on that point and say you’re unavailable for the new dates.  If the per diems are higher now for the shorter sailing, the agent can push back on that for a cancellation as well.  Seasoned agents know the points to make to get cruise lines to back down.

Keep pushing for a refund if that’s what you want.  It may require more than just a supervisor, but agents are used to that if they’ve been around.

 

Vince

Edited August 25, 2023 by BWIVince

[Yankeeclipper1]

2 minutes ago, BWIVince said:

Legally Crystal is 100% correct about the voyage not getting cancelled (the itinerary can be changed for reasons without their control), and that doesn’t count as a cancellation if they are still operating during the same timeframe, even if the dates and ports change.  THAT SAID, that doesn’t mean you just have to accept whatever they toss out without pushback.  If the dates embarkation/disembarkation dates changed before or after your original booking dates, your agent should push back on that point and say you’re unavailable for the new dates.  If the per diems are higher now for the shorter sailing, the agent can push back on that for a cancellation as well.  Seasoned agents know the points to make to get cruise lines to back down.

Keep pushing for a refund if that’s what you want.  It may require more than just a supervisor, but agents are used to that if they’ve been around.

 

Vince

My agent is very savvy and has worked miracles before.  I just want my money back since this is not even close to the original (at all) and I want to pick when and where on my own time frame - without constraints. Their offers do not work for me.  

[BWIVince]

22 minutes ago, Yankeeclipper1 said:

My agent is very savvy and has worked miracles before.  I just want my money back since this is not even close to the original (at all) and I want to pick when and where on my own time frame - without constraints. Their offers do not work for me.  

That’s perfectly reasonable….  I obviously don’t know all the details so I’m not passing any judgement on your agent, I’m just making observations and suggestions.  
 

The reservations department at every cruise line is responsible for three things — processing new reservations, processing changes/booking maintenance, and retaining reservations.  They are absolutely the first step and first (and second) points of contact in cases like this.  They are not the ones to grant exceptions though, they’re not responsible for customer retention or agent account management, and their primary function is at odds with what you’re trying to accomplish.  In retail terms, it’s kind of like arguing about a refund or exchange with a cashier at Target.  

 

Based on what’s outlined above, it’s probably time for your agent to take this to their sales contact, because this is going to start to become an account management issue for them either at the customer or the agent level if they don’t (understandably), and that is the department tasked with that mission — not reservations.  Your agent may not yet have a relationship with the sales department, since Crystal’s sales team (as such) is relatively new, but this is the perfect reason to start forming one from scratch.  Someone in sales is going to want this resolved quickly, if they want to be around long.

 

Vince

Edited August 25, 2023 by BWIVince

[Ethereal Cruiser]

2 hours ago, Yankeeclipper1 said:

If I am roped in to a limited set of options with my money tied up - I may take that cruise I am limited to but I swear there will never be another Crystal cruise for us.

 

I see they haven't learned their lesson about creating bad will.

 

But what if they gave you an extra reservation to Umi Uma?

 

[Leejnd4]

 

12 hours ago, Yankeeclipper1 said:

My agent is very savvy and has worked miracles before.  I just want my money back since this is not even close to the original (at all) and I want to pick when and where on my own time frame - without constraints. Their offers do not work for me.  

 

I'm in total agreement with you that this is very bad form for any cruise line. That much of a change should absolutely qualify for a full refund. Just like the airlines have rules in place that if a flight changes beyond a certain threshold they will issue a full refund, cruises should offer the same.

 

My booked Crystal cruise is visiting a few ports that matter to me - places I went with my recently-passed mother, where I promised her I would spread some of her ashes. I could deal with some port changes, but if they changed the entire itinerary such that I wouldn't be stopping in ANY of the places we visited together, then there would be no reason for me to take that cruise. So I do relate to your predicament.

 

I'm willing to give Crystal quite a bit of leeway as they are essentially a new cruise line, dealing with the expected start-up and growing pains. But THIS is unacceptable. 

 

I sincerely hope your TA is able to work his magic and get you the full refund. Keep us posted.

[cruisr]

Waiting for Crystal cheerleaders to weigh in on this.  IMHO Crystal does not want to spend the dollars which would guarantee the transit if they can avoid it.  I get it, its a financial decision.  That being said the way they are handling it is poor form.  Transiting the PC is a bucket list for some and substituting a typical Caribbean cruise and a shorter duration at that does not cut it.  I feel very bad for the OP.  I also think its bad that the reservation department did not know about this when questioned.  They are the first contact TAs or guests have with Crystal and it doesn’t exactly give a positive impression that they were not advised.  They should have been briefed.  If the supervisor knew then front line should have been told.

[BWIVince]

I'm certainly anything but a Crystal cheerleader, but I do have a couple of thoughts...

 

I don't know what Crystal is actually offering anyone, but the reports of how people FEEL about what's being offered here definitely indicates poor form.  They should be offered no-penalty moves to other sailings or full refunds in cases where dates and durations are changing.

 

OTOH, I think Crystal is absolutely doing the responsible thing by cancelling the sailings.  The Canal Authority is in a bind and the canal is operating at extremely reduced capacity.  The canal is a vital link between oceans that carries essential traffic and trade without timely alternatives.  With capacity choked down, every slot is precious, and if this persists long enough we can have major supply chain challenges (including with things like fuel).  

 

I don't doubt that people have worked hard for their vacations and they may have their heart set on particular experiences, but sailings by cruise ships just going back and forth through the canal for tourism reasons when other lines are returning those slots for more essential traffic to use would just be plain irresponsible.  Repositioning sailings are a different story, but transit series sailings should be a no-go.

 

Vince

[History&Wine]

@BWIVince  Excellent post.

[May B]

All front-line res agents are not created equal. If the supervisor had been briefed, the res agents had also probably been briefed … but did they actually take the time to read the email?

 

Has the Crystal web site been updated? I tried to refresh, but still find the old cruises. Perhaps this will be the case until all the currently-booked (and fully paid!) guests have made their decisions.