Danube water levels 2024 and similar topics - plus tips and info

[notamermaid]

On 2/2/2024 at 2:08 AM, 14ersco said:

Back in the 1800's the city started buying vast tracts of land to preserve undeveloped and within those land tracts they built reservoirs and aqueducts that feed into the city.  The land is still undeveloped and the water still does not need filtered.

Great forethought. There are of course reservoirs in Germany, especially for the big towns. The system is much the same. I would reckon that almost every country has what we call a "Wasserschutzgebiet", an area that is protected for its valuable water (supply).

 

Loosely connected to this topic: I have not mentioned this for a long time but the Danube has been altered to accommodate more traffic with larger ships over the last two hundred years. Not as brutal as the Rhine perhaps in France/Germany but both rivers have partly been given a new bed, on the Danube this is perhaps most striking in Vienna, the old river: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bd/Josephinische_Landesaufnahme_Wien.jpeg

 

Further downstream, the former Soviet states went for the full brutal - burying islands and villages when building the Iron Gates for example. Further on, the Danube Delta is a nature reserve.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

It is February, time to have a look at how the river did in January. This time we look at both Pfelling and Passau in Germany. For those new to the topic: Pfelling is the place where the Danube can get notoriously low, Passau is the place where an old-ish, beautiful but infamous bridge is low and therefore a potential obstacle for river traffic in high water. In low water it is up to the captain to decide whether it is safe for him to sail his ship through the shallows, in flooding the authorities ban river traffic.

 

Pfelling gauge:

 

The river was high all through the month, with three peaks that took it even further above the mean and into the high water range, mild flooding, but short of getting to the level for a river traffic ban. That is at 620cm. Subsequently this lead to some flooding at Passau. There is a large river joining and a lock between Pfelling and Passau so such levels do not automatically translate into a specific range of figures for Passau.

 

Passau gauge:

 

We see the three peaks but different in length and height. There was a brief drop to the mean in the middle of the month. The first peak took the river to around 630cm which is considered the level at which the river cruise ships with the highest superstructure get problems with the passage under the bridge. If that peak was still manageable, then the last peak certainly will have caused a few problems. However, few river cruise ships are sailing. In the absence of rain the level has steadily gone down again. A good start for February but no indication whatsoever of what March will bring.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

It is this time of year again - Carnival! But we are in the Southeast of Germany in this thread so the word is Fasching. It is different from the Rhenish Carnival but the essence and the timeline are the same. For those who want to study the Carnival traditions more intensively, here is a comprehensive page on "the fifth season": https://www.german-way.com/history-and-culture/holidays-and-celebrations/fasching-and-karneval/

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

The water levels are rising again in the Danube basin, the Regen river is carrying a high volume of water. That will make the Danube in Bavaria rise over the weekend, but it should not lead to flooding.

 

notamermaid

 

[RDVIK2016]

6 hours ago, notamermaid said:

The water levels are rising again in the Danube basin, the Regen river is carrying a high volume of water. That will make the Danube in Bavaria rise over the weekend, but it should not lead to flooding.

 

notamermaid

 

It looks like it is just the Regen that will be exceeding the first one or two warning levels. The upper Danube does not appear to be carrying excessive water, nor the Naab, so the Danube should stay within its banks. Also there is no heavy snowpack in the Bavarian Forest. The Isar and Vils seem OK now also, the German Danube ought to be in good shape for a while.

RDVIK

[Canal archive]

Pity about the lack of snow as from what I gather it’s the snow that saves the future low water levels.

[notamermaid]

Thank you for the extended assessment. Yes, it looks all okay for now. All problems are North of the Danube proper so we will not see any real impact from the Alps or the Danube itself. The colour map:

https://www.hochwasserzentralen.de/en/aktuelle-situation

Problems for the Rhine come mainly from the Neckar and the Main. But there are no through river cruises, meaning itineraries using the Main at the moment as far as I know.

 

Hopefully all will stay good for the first long itinerary in March.

 

By the way, looking further into Spring there will be the annual closure for maintenance of the Main, Canal and Danube locks again. Just in case you are wondering why there are no long river cruises scheduled for a period in April.

 

notamermaid

 

[RDVIK2016]

12 hours ago, notamermaid said:

By the way, looking further into Spring there will be the annual closure for maintenance of the Main, Canal and Danube locks again. Just in case you are wondering why there are no long river cruises scheduled for a period in April.

 

notamermaid

 

For how many years have shutdowns been occurring at this time for annual lock maintenance?

 

Viking's Romantic Danube itinerary used to travel on the canal as far as Nürnberg, with the other terminus at Budapest. However, not too many years ago they cut out that part of the itinerary - for the better in several ways. It made sense to cut it whether they were forced to by maintenance or not.  There are 12 time consuming locks between Regensburg and and Nürnberg. My wife and I took this cruise in 2016 starting in Budapest. On the last full day we were transferred on to buses at a dock opposite the Nürnberg shipping terminal and driven into the city. When our walking tour was done we were taken back to the ship which had moved up to Erlangen - to another industrial area. The ship took all night and more to make the trip. You can drive from Regensburg to Nürnberg in 1.5 hours. They would have been just as well off to offer a day trip to Nürnberg from the dock at Regensburg.

 

Another thing was that use of the upper deck was restricted while on the canal because of the low bridges, one of which crushed the wheelhouse of a Viking longship that had failed to retract. That was just a few months after our trip.

 

RDVIK

[Canal archive]

The rivers and canal systems across Europe including the U.K. have had annual maintenance closures for eons including Roman times when evidentially any odd local Legion could be used as manpower. Englands system had an annual stoppage but how they managed to find the manpower across the system in the short time allowed seems to me a bit of a mystery, and especially at harvest time during canal building no farm workers could be employed.

[notamermaid]

12 hours ago, RDVIK2016 said:

For how many years have shutdowns been occurring at this time for annual lock maintenance?

I have no idea. I would tend to go with Canal archive and say a very long time. It has to be after frost (and snow melt) so April is ideal I would say. River traffic knows this and can look this up far in advance.

 

notamermaid

 

[RDVIK2016]

12 hours ago, notamermaid said:

I have no idea. I would tend to go with Canal archive and say a very long time. It has to be after frost (and snow melt) so April is ideal I would say. River traffic knows this and can look this up far in advance.

 

notamermaid

 

I was just thinking that they might have been able to operate the canal for several years while it was still relatively new with minimal closures for only minor repairs. The full length between Bamberg on the Main and Kelheim on the Danube wasn't opened until 1992, although parts of it from each end had been opening for several years prior.  I haven't searched too deeply, but I did find a few articles describing such things as the need to clean sediment from the Hilpoltstein lock on a periodicity of five years, and that the lock at Erlangen and some other place required major repairs a few years ago, but that was after 20 years of use. 

 

On the WSV website there are schedules for closures everywhere in Germany. You can search by watercourse and year. The schedules for future years are not complete, but for previous years it is interesting to see how many closures, planned and emergent, some just overnight, that there were.  I only looked a the Main-Danube section.

 

This year looks like a big year for planned repairs, taking up most of April, but in other years it looks like they have been planning much of the work as early as mid-March and into only the first week or so of April.

 

RDVIK

 

 https://www.elwis.de/DE/dynamisch/mvc/main.php?modul=schleuse

[Canal archive]

Excuse the pun but where water is concerned your working in a very “fluid” environment regardless of how well something has been constructed water has this way of inveigling  its way into areas it’s not supposed to and upsetting the most expert design in an extremely short period of time, hence the necessity for regular maintenance, even the smallest check can involve divers.

 

[Canal archive]

katrust.org.uk

 
Found this in our archive can you believe in a canal! No date will try to check when next in.

[notamermaid]

6 hours ago, RDVIK2016 said:

This year looks like a big year for planned repairs, taking up most of April, but in other years it looks like they have been planning much of the work as early as mid-March and into only the first week or so of April.

Interesting. Had not noticed the relatively early March closures. All in all the Moselle lock maintenance looks to be a bit more tightly scheduled, i.e. a very specific time frame with far in advance publication. Although everywhere you can never be sure that an "emergency" closure will not become necessary. Like with the very unfortunate and really annoying incident at Iffezheim lock on the Rhine. Sediment can become a real problem for sure, but there are of course what we call "Verschleißteile" (I like that word), which is standard wear and tear of the moving parts mostly and those parts need to be inspected and replaced. But every few years the concrete needs checking as well. We are talking heavy duty and in constant use "bathtubs" for ships. Age and regular use play into it, when new I reckon some intervals can be longer, but some things like these locks just need regular maintenance, I mean there are things you cannot push out a couple of years or at least you should not as an authority. The Canal in its present form is indeed relatively modern, completed in 1992, other locks are much older.

 

About concrete: I was a bit shocked to see how concrete from the 50s had been working with gravity and the elements and in itself when a building in "my shopping turf" was knocked down. The steel inside had eaten into it and the concrete aggregate was brittle, i.e. partly visible. No chance of any repairs...

 

notamermaid

 

P.S.: Little change to water levels, relatively stable. The Main river will drain more of the rain than the Danube.

 

[Canal archive]

Because of the flooding the sediment ‘problem’ seems to have become the norm both in Europe and here and I would say a slightly new phenomenon.
There has been a challenge with concrete (sickness) in the U.K. in the past has this been the same in Europe? 
 Naturally locks flex, there usually built that way, I must admit the sheer size of them is amazing but they work.

 

[notamermaid]

The recent concrete sickness thing, I read about that. There have been reports over the decades here and as I mentioned above I have seen it in a building. I guess it is just something that happens over time, not sure how much can be avoided, but I am not familiar with the topic much. As soon as you put metal in concrete you get two materials that react to each other, you have got to know what you are doing...

 

I have just remembered - there was a case on the Rhine, at Neuwied. I recall from a newspaper report that the wrong concrete was used, i.e. for the re-development about six years ago. It could not sustain the action of the fast-flowing river and the pull from the ships that were supposed to dock there when the embankment was finished. They got it sorted and the new embankment is now complete but there is still no ship docking. Seem to be some further financial and legal issues that need to be sorted.

 

1 hour ago, Canal archive said:

 Naturally locks flex, there usually built that way, I must admit the sheer size of them is amazing but they work.

The photos when the locks are drained and the workmen are standing in them are fascinating.

 

That creature in the canal that you posted looks like something out of a black-and-white 50's science fiction film. 😉

 

notamermaid

 

[Canal archive]

Your right even earlier I would say as it’s the really old style divers suite.

[RDVIK2016]

1 hour ago, notamermaid said:

The recent concrete sickness thing, I read about that. There have been reports over the decades here and as I mentioned above I have seen it in a building. I guess it is just something that happens over time, not sure how much can be avoided, but I am not familiar with the topic much. As soon as you put metal in concrete you get two materials that react to each other, you have got to know what you are doing...

 

notamermaid

 

It is such a marvel that Roman aqueducts still stand. How long will the concrete trough bridges of the  canals survive?

 

By the way it seemed to be a remarkable sight to be on board a river cruise ship passing over a busy highway.

 

RDVIK

[notamermaid]

I nearly missed this... Amawaterways had announced last year that they would be sailing early in 2024. The AmaMagna is now on her first 2024 itinerary.

 

Looks like the passengers are having favourable water levels and pleasant February temperatures.

 

I wonder if they got to experience Bavarian Fasching?

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

The Rhine has so many docking locations at such a variety of towns that you can get an incredibly wide range of itineraries together, if a company so wishes. A smaller ship has more locations available but even with the 135m ships there are tons of options. On the Danube in Germany and Austria it is a bit more limited but you can still vary a lot. Hainburg is one place that has only recently come to my attention. It is a small town in Austria that looks quite attractive. Amadeus river cruises use the town quite often this year as a "technical stop", here meaning to pick up passengers from an excursion. This year the Viva Two actually has a proper stop in Hainburg with an excursion (afternoon guided tour) scheduled on a round trip Vienna itinerary. Hainburg dock was moved and updated in 2018 to allow for safer navigation in the now slightly wider navigation channel around Hainburg. According to a regional newspaper the new landing station can accommodate two large river cruise ships.

 

Hainburg has no English website, so I roamed around videos for a change and found this really nice one about hiking around Hainburg: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fJZUkLQiqQ

 

notamermaid

 

 

[sboh]

Am considering an Avalon Danube river cruise for next Fall (Budapest to Vilshofen), can go September, October or November-would one of these months be preferable based on historic water levels? 

[notamermaid]

3 hours ago, sboh said:

Am considering an Avalon Danube river cruise for next Fall (Budapest to Vilshofen), can go September, October or November-would one of these months be preferable based on historic water levels? 

For that we look first at your route which is Budapest to Vilshofen. As you avoid the stretch from Vilshofen to Regensburg the likelihood of encountering low water is much reduced.  Secondly, let us check the second most likely area for problems which is Komárom to Budapest, this means that sailing in(to) Budapest may not be possible. Data for Budapest is available from 2002, so I have had a look at these figures. Overall, all three months carry a risk of low water but September appears to be the best of them. October and November have more low water occurring. But it is not that much of a difference. All in all we can say that beginning of September is best. But all months can be okay.  Every year is a little different. Flooding risk is minimal.

 

notamermaid

 

[goksucats]

Wow some fascinating information here.  We are going on our first river cruise of the Danube in June.  Avalon Danube Symphony with 2 nights in Munich, June 19th - June 26th and then a train to Paris. I've been on the Rhine but this will be our first Danube.   Will be watching the water level information though based on your comment above it sounds like we are missing the most troublesome part of the Danube.  We will be cruising from Budapest to Vilshofen.  

[notamermaid]

12 hours ago, goksucats said:

Will be watching the water level information though based on your comment above it sounds like we are missing the most troublesome part of the Danube. 

For low water this is certainly the most troublesome part. June is a great month for sailing the Danube. Not much flooding and normally enough water at Pfelling, enough water downstream from Vilshofen anyway then.

 

As regards flooding I need to add that while real flooding does not happen that much in June or in (early) autumn, and is unlikely to be high enough for problems from Vilshofen to Budapest, there is the bridge at Passau which is so low that it can keep river cruise ships with a high superstructure from sailing safely under it long before the river itself elsewhere causes problems and the authorities issue a river traffic ban. However, coming upstream from Budapest, by the time you get to Passau your river cruise that is supposed to end in Vilshofen is nearly over anyway. There are docking places in or near Passau before the infamous bridge so getting to Vilshofen by other means of transport is no big deal.

 

notamermaid

 

[sboh]

notamermaid thank-you for your excellent information! I’ve never even seen the Danube so it’s nice to have your insights.