Feeling Deceived and Powerless

[KirkNC]

14 hours ago, blag said:

Clearly an error. A CC suite would cost, roughly, about $12000 a day, for two guests, in my experience.

I think anyone who books at $1266 for 7 days should not expect that price to be honoured, whether it be in the short-term or even months later.

I don’t think a club continental is $12,000 per day…..

[tgg]

4 hours ago, blag said:

Clearly an error. A CC suite would cost, roughly, about $12000 a day, for two guests, in my experience.

I think anyone who books at $1266 for 7 days should not expect that price to be honoured, whether it be in the short-term or even months later.

Think you have an extra zero, but your point is spot on. Azamara doesn't price suites at $180 p/p. Anyone who has priced a cruise will recognize the OP's price as a clear mistake.

[blag]

1 hour ago, KirkNC said:

I don’t think a club continental is $12,000 per day…..

Oops.. $1200!

[blag]

16 minutes ago, tgg said:

Think you have an extra zero, but your point is spot on. Azamara doesn't price suites at $180 p/p. Anyone who has priced a cruise will recognize the OP's price as a clear mistake.

You are correct, there is an extra zero!

I think the reality of the situation is 'If it seems too good to be true - it is.'

Of course, it is very easy to claim ignorance of pricing, but to me it seems highly unlikely that anyone buying a cruise will not have done some research, and will, therefore, be aware of the approximate average pricing.

And, caveat emptor. 

[java spot]

That said, $1200 for a 7 day cruise in an inside cabin would seem like a decent deal but not earth shattering/suspicious. 

[blag]

28 minutes ago, java spot said:

That said, $1200 for a 7 day cruise in an inside cabin would seem like a decent deal but not earth shattering/suspicious. 

But, I believe that there was specific reference to a suite.

[davekent]

I am slightly relieved that our 7 day Greek intensive cruise in an Oceanview room still appears to be a good deal but not a ridiculously good deal so presume unlike the unfortunate people in this thread we should not be impacted. As it was booked as a TA package with direct BA flights to Istanbul and from Athens, 2 nights hotel in both cities and 4 private transfers I have no idea how much the cruise itself actually cost to do comparisons. We join the cruise on the 8th June and with the dramas around the repositioning cruise to Athens and the subsequent uncertainty around the following Athens to Istanbul cruise I guess it is not surprising that Azamara have revisited who has booked and the pricing around this cruise. It all tends to reinforce our view that the complexities around cruising as against land/air/rail holidays mean that it does take a good deal for us to want to book one

[laurieb]

11 hours ago, Vineyard View said:

As that new person to Az, do I sincerely know that it was an obviously wrong rate? Am I all of a sudden the person in the wrong instead of the company that to seasoned Az travelers might wonder if it is “an obviously wrong rate” ?  And even if I am a seasoned Az traveler, and I caught a great sale, should I just accept that it was a website error? 
IMO. Regardless of the legal loopholes sited, this just seems ethically wrong to a pretty large degree. I am having a pretty tough time finding the majority of fault here with OP. 
I sincerely hope that this all gets straightened out. Don’t give up! 

A suite for 1200.00 for a 7 night cruise is an obvious wrong rate on any cruise line and anyone should be able to realize it!  

[calicrzr]

FYI, I have no idea what cabin or price the OPs booking was.

The intent was to illustrate the current state of the web site/IT and

that nothing much has changed.

 

On a side note, I recently booked a 9 day transatlantic suite for ~3300.

So lower priced suites are out there.

 

re the 5% OBC issue mentioned. You would think something so simple would

be easy to correct but obviously isn't.

 

Again, onboard experience seems to be pretty good.

 

 

 

[Vineyard View]

1 hour ago, laurieb said:

A suite for 1200.00 for a 7 night cruise is an obvious wrong rate on any cruise line and anyone should be able to realize it!  

OP never posted this cost. It was an arbitrary number as an example posted by blag. I was not referring to that at all in my post, as the $1,200 was brought up afterwards, but yes, if I saw an offer for $1,200 in a cc for 7 days I would question it. I have followed pricing for a few years, and average pricing on a 9-14 day in a cc averages much more. 
I still cannot find a way to defend the company, any cruise line, in the situation that the OP is in. The company owns the error. Legal loop holes or not. To do absolutely nothing just does not seem right. 

Edited April 8 by Vineyard View

[fruitmachine]

2 hours ago, tgg said:

Think you have an extra zero, but your point is spot on. Azamara doesn't price suites at $180 p/p. Anyone who has priced a cruise will recognize the OP's price as a clear mistake.

I beg to differ.  8 night Greece Intensive last October in an N1 CC suite with $400 OBC was around that price on the Azamara website when I booked in May 2023 through a major UK TA.  I actually paid a little less than that for the cruise element when combined with flights.

 

The price on the website rose following the "3 free nights" deal that we got it under.  But from memory, that was by less than the implied discount.

Edited April 8 by fruitmachine

[blag]

47 minutes ago, Vineyard View said:

OP never posted this cost. It was an arbitrary number as an example posted by blag.

I used the approximate figure that quoted in a post in this thread.

The OP is silent as to how much they paid.

Being somewhat Macchiavellian, if I were to find an astonishingly low price for a cruise, I would be inclined to pay in full immediately on the basis that this 'seals the deal' and makes it difficult for the cruise line to wriggle out of it.

And, of course, because months elapse without any attempt by the cruise line to renege on the deal, I might assume that it would be safe for me to make reservations gir flights, hotels etc. 

[excitedofharpenden]

This has turned into a very strange thread full of speculation. I asked the op if they'd share the details, but they didn't reply to me so who knows what's gone on 🤷‍♂️

 

Phil 

[Dynacruiser]

22 minutes ago, excitedofharpenden said:

This has turned into a very strange thread full of speculation. I asked the op if they'd share the details, but they didn't reply to me so who knows what's gone on 🤷‍♂️

 

Phil 

 

I think we have to be able to read through all the noise.  

 

The main points are (according to my recollection, won't reread every post):  

• The OP reported that Azamara had sold them a cruise at a low price, 
• OP paid in full.
• Months later, Azamara informed OP that there was an error and OP would have to pay more or cancel their cruise (but they have bought tickets and hotel already).
• A couple of folks contributed stating that they had experienced the same problem.
• At least one different person here said they were able to negotiate with Azamara and retain the original price.

 

While my nosiness would like to have more details, the above info has been clear from reading this thread.

 

For example, I still arrive to the same conclusion regardless of price paid.  If OP paid $1 for their cruise, or $10,000, the issue remains the same:  Azamara posted an erroneous price, took payment, found the error months later, so Azamara should own up to it and not cancel their cruise.  It is reasonable to expect a company like Azamara to adhere to certain ethical behaviors and business practices.  

 

 

 

 

[Carolexas Cruiser]

48 minutes ago, Dynacruiser said:

 

I think we have to be able to read through all the noise.  

 

The main points are (according to my recollection, won't reread every post):  

• The OP reported that Azamara had sold them a cruise at a low price, 
• OP paid in full.
• Months later, Azamara informed OP that there was an error and OP would have to pay more or cancel their cruise (but they have bought tickets and hotel already).
• A couple of folks contributed stating that they had experienced the same problem.
• At least one different person here said they were able to negotiate with Azamara and retain the original price.

 

While my nosiness would like to have more details, the above info has been clear from reading this thread.

 

For example, I still arrive to the same conclusion regardless of price paid.  If OP paid $1 for their cruise, or $10,000, the issue remains the same:  Azamara posted an erroneous price, took payment, found the error months later, so Azamara should own up to it and not cancel their cruise.  It is reasonable to expect a company like Azamara to adhere to certain ethical behaviors and business practices.  

 

 

 

 

 

I was hesitant to post the price because of exactly what @blag described: folks might be inclined to assume I'm either stupid or intentionally deceitful based on the price paid. And trust me, after all this I have wondered if it was my own fault for not assuming that it was too cheap. But I'm not in hospitality. Do they use some sort of surge pricing model that offers special prices for the first few passengers in order to raise the price later? Do they offer low rates because excursions are more or because no on-board credits are available? Was it so low because I booked it 13 months out? I have no idea. But why is it my job as a consumer to figure that out? The only reason I went to the website in the first place was in response to Azamara's email offering "special rates." Plus, every cruise site in the world says book as early as possible for the best rates.

 

@Dynacruiser, thank you so much for your support. I have decided that I am just going to get a refund. I don't want anything to do with Azamara at this point nor do I want to give them anymore of my money. Dealing with this has taken too much time and energy already.

[Dynacruiser]

On 4/7/2024 at 7:36 AM, laurieb said:

This is a story you wrote, correct?  You have a lot to say for someone who hasn't ever sailed with the line either, according to your signature

 

 

Dear @commodoredave

 

I appreciate your desire to help us Azamara customers,

 

I read the thread you started back in September, and had the same thought that @laurieb and others expressed here.

 

Your article is based on third party experiences.  In addition to the experience of a Toronto couple, you refer to mostly anonymous posters here on Cruisecritic.  But you have never cruised with Azamara.

 

This felt like someone writing a strong critique about a restaurant based solely on online reviews, but not having eaten there.   In my personal opinion, this greatly reduced the seriousness of your article.   I also tried to write these comments on your blog a couple of times in the past few months, but for some reason, my comments didn't get published on your site.  This further diminished the credibility of your site, at least in my opinion.

 

However, I believe you can help consumers and that appears to be one of your motives.  I believe you can guide folks on how to resolve an issue (or at least try).  Or you can continue to share valuable info.  For example, I learned from you that Apollo, a private equity group, had taken over Regent and Oceania years ago.  I don't follow the industry closely, so this made me search for more info.  I became less apprehensive when I learned that Apollo apparently made a good profit selling those lines and didn't have to bankrupt them.    

 

I hope Sycamore Partners makes Azamara a successful company, as I have enjoyed every one of my many cruises  and I have reserved several future ones.  Unfortunately, Private Equity companies are not as transparent as public companies, so it is hard to know what Sycamore is up to.

 

Finally, I do not think Azamara can be described as mediocre, and I have sailed with them around 200 days over the past years.  The title of your article felt like clickbait.  I hope I am not proven wrong in the future.

Edited April 8 by Dynacruiser

[commodoredave]

3 hours ago, Dynacruiser said:

 

 

Dear @commodoredave

 

I appreciate your desire to help us Azamara customers,

 

I read the thread you started back in September, and had the same thought that @laurieb and others expressed here.

 

Your article is based on third party experiences.  In addition to the experience of a Toronto couple, you refer to mostly anonymous posters here on Cruisecritic.  But you have never cruised with Azamara.

 

This felt like someone writing a strong critique about a restaurant based solely on online reviews, but not having eaten there.   In my personal opinion, this greatly reduced the seriousness of your article.   I also tried to write these comments on your blog a couple of times in the past few months, but for some reason, my comments didn't get published on your site.  This further diminished the credibility of your site, at least in my opinion.

 

However, I believe you can help consumers and that appears to be one of your motives.  I believe you can guide folks on how to resolve an issue (or at least try).  Or you can continue to share valuable info.  For example, I learned from you that Apollo, a private equity group, had taken over Regent and Oceania years ago.  I don't follow the industry closely, so this made me search for more info.  I became less apprehensive when I learned that Apollo apparently made a good profit selling those lines and didn't have to bankrupt them.    

 

I hope Sycamore Partners makes Azamara a successful company, as I have enjoyed every one of my many cruises  and I have reserved several future ones.  Unfortunately, Private Equity companies are not as transparent as public companies, so it is hard to know what Sycamore is up to.

 

Finally, I do not think Azamara can be described as mediocre, and I have sailed with them around 200 days over the past years.  The title of your article felt like clickbait.  I hope I am not proven wrong in the future.

I’m sorry your attempt to post a comment on my GP story was not successful. I am not the publisher, and therefore do not control the comment section. However, I will email the publisher today and ask him to pay greater attention to people attempting to post comments, and to advise me of any issues. Please try again.

[commodoredave]

On 4/9/2024 at 3:46 AM, Dynacruiser said:

  I also tried to write these comments on your blog a couple of times in the past few months, but for some reason, my comments didn't get published on your site.  This further diminished the credibility of your site, at least in my opinion.

I shared your experience with the publisher of GP, and here is his response: “I've looked at every comment since Aug 28, 2020! Every single one approved, and no sign of one from him either approved or not, so not at all sure what the problem is.”

So, if you would still like to leave a comment, please try again and let me know how it goes. Thanks.

[Vineyard View]

On 4/8/2024 at 11:14 AM, Carolexas Cruiser said:

 

I was hesitant to post the price because of exactly what @blag described: folks might be inclined to assume I'm either stupid or intentionally deceitful based on the price paid. And trust me, after all this I have wondered if it was my own fault for not assuming that it was too cheap. But I'm not in hospitality. Do they use some sort of surge pricing model that offers special prices for the first few passengers in order to raise the price later? Do they offer low rates because excursions are more or because no on-board credits are available? Was it so low because I booked it 13 months out? I have no idea. But why is it my job as a consumer to figure that out? The only reason I went to the website in the first place was in response to Azamara's email offering "special rates." Plus, every cruise site in the world says book as early as possible for the best rates.

 

@Dynacruiser, thank you so much for your support. I have decided that I am just going to get a refund. I don't want anything to do with Azamara at this point nor do I want to give them anymore of my money. Dealing with this has taken too much time and energy already.

I sincerely hope that you find an alternative that is even better to honor your Mom, with your family.  I hope that it will work out in a way, that upon reflection, it was supposed to. I am sorry that you went through all of this angst. 

[Mailman055]

On 4/8/2024 at 6:16 AM, tgg said:

Think you have an extra zero, but your point is spot on. Azamara doesn't price suites at $180 p/p. Anyone who has priced a cruise will recognize the OP's price as a clear mistake.

Interesting that a person making a point about typos would make a grievous typo themselves to further their point. 

The fact is, NOT ONE OF US would hesitate to insist on purchasing a vehicle that was mispriced or even a can of corn at the grocery store. The company is responsible for pricing and advertising their product. The consumer is NOT responsible for figuring out the motives or the honesty of that pricing. A transaction (agreed and paid for) made at the agreed upon price is what matters. For those of you that think "leagaleze" protects companies, STOP and think about the can or worms you are opening in respect to consumer rights. 

 

I realize there are cruise line "homers" out there. As a frequent Regent (former Radisson) cruiser, I see it all the time. Oceania in particular is not a line I would consider because of the passive aggressive behavior displayed on that forum. In the posts on this thread, I see no evil intention from the OP to smear Azamara. Instead, I see a lot of flat out innuendo ($1200 for a CC 7 night, nobody made that claim!) and strawmen arguments defending what is pretty much indefensible, as originally reported. 

 

I am booked on my first Azamara cruise after 12 Regent/Radisson trips and I sincerely hope this story, nor the guest experience I am reading is what I am stepping into. 

[blag]

4 hours ago, Mailman055 said:

$1200 for a CC 7 night, nobody made that claim!)

In fact, someone did.

[tgg]

7 hours ago, Mailman055 said:

I realize there are cruise line "homers" out there. As a frequent Regent (former Radisson) cruiser, I see it all the time. Oceania in particular is not a line I would consider because of the passive aggressive behavior displayed on that forum.

People posting on any of these boards are a tiny fraction of a cruise line's passengers. Perhaps you should make up your own mind about Oceania based on something more substantive.

[commodoredave]

16 hours ago, tgg said:

People posting on any of these boards are a tiny fraction of a cruise line's passengers. Perhaps you should make up your own mind about Oceania based on something more substantive.

I agree it’s better to have more than one source about a cruise line. Here’s another source of comments about Oceania:

https://www.trustpilot.com/review/oceaniacruises.com?page=2

 

Edited April 12 by commodoredave

[commodoredave]

2 minutes ago, commodoredave said:

I agree it’s better to have more than one source about a cruise line. Here’s another source of comments about Oceania:

https://www.trustpilot.com/review/oceaniacruises.com?page=2

 

Trust pilot is also not very kind to Azamara. However, there are always more disappointed people leaving reviews than happy people.

https://www.trustpilot.com/review/azamara.com