YC Tips

[RichYak]

20 hours ago, nlclhc said:

I still can't understand

 

1 hour ago, nlclhc said:

I completely disagree

I wasn't trying to get you to agree. I was trying to help you understand why it's acceptable, which is what you said in the post I responded to. Another reason it's acceptable is because US federal labor guidance and state labor laws say it is. You don't have to agree with that either, but it is law.

[nlclhc]

1 minute ago, RichYak said:

 

I wasn't trying to get you to agree. I was trying to help you understand why it's acceptable, which is what you said in the post I responded to. Another reason it's acceptable is because US federal labor guidance and state labor laws say it is. You don't have to agree with that either, but it is law.

 

I was discussing it from an philosophical point of view, not from a legal stand point.

 

In any case, thanks for your input.

[DaKahuna]

8 hours ago, RichYak said:

Finally, the lousy tippers get the worst service, which is a win for the rest of humanity.

 

 How does this happen since tipping is done at the end of the cruise and chance are those crew members and passengers will never meet again? 

 I can see this at bars were you typically tip when served and maybe in the YC with the servers in the Top Sail Lounge but other than that, I am not sure how the average crew member would know if someone was a lousy tipper or not. 

 

 

[perakcruiser]

6 hours ago, DaKahuna said:

How does this happen since tipping is done at the end of the cruise and chance are those crew members and passengers will never meet again? 

And usually people care about the quality of the food, not about the gentle movements of the waiter serving it 😄

 

 

[RichYak]

10 hours ago, DaKahuna said:

How does this happen since tipping is done at the end of the cruise

On every cruise I have taken in the last 15 years, the tip has been prepaid or charged to my account daily.

 

3 hours ago, perakcruiser said:

And usually people care about the quality of the food, not about the gentle movements of the waiter serving it 😄

I care that what I'm about to order is what I'll like. The menu only tells you so much.

[sverigecruiser]

2 hours ago, RichYak said:

On every cruise I have taken in the last 15 years, the tip has been prepaid or charged to my account daily.

 

 

Really? Normally that's the service charge and not the tip.

[morpheusofthesea]

"The common feature of all forms of tipping is the voluntary and discretionary nature of the tip: the consumer is free to choose how much to tip, if at all. This definition excludes service charges, imposed gratuities, and imposed tips which have nothing in common with voluntary tipping."

  "I (Azar) categorize tipping in six different categories: reward-tipping, pricetipping, tipping-in advance, bribery-tipping, holiday-tipping and gift-tipping, and discuss the economics of each of these categories. "

  https://econwpa.ub.uni-muenchen.de/econ-wp/lab/papers/0309/0309002.pdf

Edited June 4 by morpheusofthesea

[chrisgp999]

I always find it helpful to pop a bowl of popcorn and relax in my easy chair before I start reading another thread about tipping.

[bucfan2]

13 hours ago, chrisgp999 said:

I always find it helpful to pop a bowl of popcorn and relax in my easy chair before I start reading another thread about tipping.

Absolutely!!  And it's comical to read and think 'these people actually believe they're going to influence someone's tipping choices'.

[morpheusofthesea]

1 hour ago, bucfan2 said:

Absolutely!!  And it's comical to read and think 'these people actually believe they're going to influence someone's tipping choices'.

Absolutely correct. I read post after post of how someone's butler is a 'no show'. How they are being overlooked. How a certain waiter avoids their smiles and friendly salutations. How the maitre d or YC director avoids them. That their meals are too cold or take too long or not cooked or over cooked. That they did not receive a bottle of liquor or a plate of macaroons or chocolate dipped strawberries. What was Einstein's definition of insanity? "Continuing the same act (not tipping) and expecting a different result."  

  For those that fail to understand the academic's definition of tipping. Tipping is NOT your hotel service charges, forced or mandatory gratuities, or forced tips imposed. Tipping is voluntary and discretionary.

  I posted in April that our cruise on the MSC Seascape was the best cruise we have ever had in 50 years of cruising. We were treated Royally the entire week. I can not attribute our good time to my goods looks and charming personality (for I have neither). All I am saying, is it doesn't take very much and reprimands and asking for an audience with your "friend" the hotel director in lieu of a 'douceur' is gauche (lacking social grace, sensitivity, crude and tactless) akin to colonial classism in former times.

[bucfan2]

15 minutes ago, morpheusofthesea said:

Absolutely correct. I read post after post of how someone's butler is a 'no show'. How they are being overlooked. How a certain waiter avoids their smiles and friendly salutations. How the maitre d or YC director avoids them. That their meals are too cold or take too long or not cooked or over cooked. That they did not receive a bottle of liquor or a plate of macaroons or chocolate dipped strawberries. What was Einstein's definition of insanity? "Continuing the same act (not tipping) and expecting a different result."  

  For those that fail to understand the academic's definition of tipping. Tipping is NOT your hotel service charges, forced or mandatory gratuities, or forced tips imposed. Tipping is voluntary and discretionary.

  I posted in April that our cruise on the MSC Seascape was the best cruise we have ever had in 50 years of cruising. We were treated Royally the entire week. I can not attribute our good time to my goods looks and charming personality (for I have neither). All I am saying, is it doesn't take very much and reprimands and asking for an audience with your "friend" the hotel director in lieu of a 'douceur' is gauche (lacking social grace, sensitivity, crude and tactless) akin to colonial classism in former times.

We tip generously, and at the END of the trip.  Additional tipping is purely by our choice.  Service throughout the week would be the same regardless, as we tip at the end and it has no effect on our service received throughout the week.

[morpheusofthesea]

1 minute ago, bucfan2 said:

and it has no effect on our service received throughout the week.

Our perception is our reality until we see it happening to others.

[nlclhc]

I have sailed twice in YC, both times I got excellent service, I only tipped at the end.

[bucfan2]

1 hour ago, morpheusofthesea said:

Our perception is our reality until we see it happening to others.

If you say so.  I refer to 'tipping ahead' as bribing.  But just the same....prefer to simply read thru yet another tip thread for entertainment, wait for inevitable lock of the thread, and see another start up in a week or so.

Edited June 5 by bucfan2

[morpheusofthesea]

 

1 hour ago, bucfan2 said:

I refer to 'tipping ahead' as bribing.

It is more nuanced. It infuriates most people "to be wrong, when they know they are right". Moliere

https://econwpa.ub.uni-muenchen.de/econ-wp/lab/papers/0309/0309002.pdf

"V. Tipping-in-Advance Tipping in advance was the original type of tipping in commercial enterprises. There are several versions for the origin of tipping, but one of the common versions dates tipping back to England of the sixteen century. Brass urns with the inscription “To Insure Promptitude” were placed first in coffee houses and later in local pubs, and people tipped in advance by putting money in these urns. The purpose of tipping-in-advance from the consumer’s perspective is to commit the worker to provide good service quality. This form of tipping reverses the opportunism problem: instead of the consumer being able to stiff, here the worker is able to provide bad service despite the advance tip. Tipping experts, however, suggest that workers who get advance tips try very hard to justify the trust they received: Brenner (2001) claims, “The advance tip is the most effective method for assuring results… This strategy will insure that you’ll be taken care of with the highest degree of consideration,” and Star (1988) suggests about hotel concierge “If you want to be fawned over, tip the concierge upon arrival as you introduce yourself.” Just as the consumer finds it less costly to tip than to feel unfair and embarrassed in reward-tipping, the worker prefers to exert effort than to feel unfair and untrustworthy with tipping-in-advance."

The next paragraph explains bribery tipping if you are really interested to know the difference found in the link above.

 

Edited June 5 by morpheusofthesea

[Sharon_and_TC]

Darn.  I saw the title "YC Tips" and thought maybe it was a discussion about things to do or see in the YC that I hadn't thought about - aka - suggestions and recommendations to make my time in YC better.   

[MonsterJoe]

I always tip the waitstaff, maitre d, steward(s), and certain bartenders* - I also have alternated doing it at the beginning and at the end of the cruise.

I've never had bad service either way, but my experience is that I almost always get much better service when tipping in advance.

When I do stay in YC it is always great, and I agree with an earlier poster that the experience is paid for in the fare - however, tipping will get you even better service.

*personality and engagement matters more here for me, as tipping a disengaged bartender isn't much different than tipping at a counter service restaurant for me.

Edited June 5 by MonsterJoe
flow

[morpheusofthesea]

21 minutes ago, Sharon_and_TC said:

Darn.  I saw the title "YC Tips" and thought maybe it was a discussion about things to do or see in the YC that I hadn't thought about - aka - suggestions and recommendations to make my time in YC better.   

This is exactly what this thread is about. The suggestion and recommendation to tip to make ones time in YC better.

[bucfan2]

45 minutes ago, morpheusofthesea said:

 

It is more nuanced. It infuriates most people "to be wrong, when they know they are right". Moliere

https://econwpa.ub.uni-muenchen.de/econ-wp/lab/papers/0309/0309002.pdf

"V. Tipping-in-Advance Tipping in advance was the original type of tipping in commercial enterprises. There are several versions for the origin of tipping, but one of the common versions dates tipping back to England of the sixteen century. Brass urns with the inscription “To Insure Promptitude” were placed first in coffee houses and later in local pubs, and people tipped in advance by putting money in these urns. The purpose of tipping-in-advance from the consumer’s perspective is to commit the worker to provide good service quality. This form of tipping reverses the opportunism problem: instead of the consumer being able to stiff, here the worker is able to provide bad service despite the advance tip. Tipping experts, however, suggest that workers who get advance tips try very hard to justify the trust they received: Brenner (2001) claims, “The advance tip is the most effective method for assuring results… This strategy will insure that you’ll be taken care of with the highest degree of consideration,” and Star (1988) suggests about hotel concierge “If you want to be fawned over, tip the concierge upon arrival as you introduce yourself.” Just as the consumer finds it less costly to tip than to feel unfair and embarrassed in reward-tipping, the worker prefers to exert effort than to feel unfair and untrustworthy with tipping-in-advance."

The next paragraph explains bribery tipping if you are really interested to know the difference found in the link above.

 

That's good stuff right there.  I've never been one to underestimate the power of a bribe, but for those that do, it might interest them (most likely not IMO).

[nlclhc]

It is interesting to see how almost everyone who support tipping is American.

[MonsterJoe]

17 minutes ago, bucfan2 said:

That's good stuff right there.  I've never been one to underestimate the power of a bribe, but for those that do, it might interest them (most likely not IMO).

 

Tipping before service and bribery do share similarities in that both involve giving something of value to influence behavior. However, bribery is a legal term and specifically speaks to attempting to corrupt someone in a position of authority for an unfair advantage. Tipping is a legal and socially accepted practice meant to ensure or reward good service without unethical implications.

[MonsterJoe]

1 minute ago, nlclhc said:

It is interesting to see how almost everyone who support tipping is American.

I don't support it because I agree with it, I support it because it is the social custom here.

[nlclhc]

3 minutes ago, MonsterJoe said:

I don't support it because I agree with it, I support it because it is the social custom here.

This is exactly my point of view, I do it in the US, MSC is not the US.

[MonsterJoe]

1 minute ago, nlclhc said:

This is exactly my point of view, I do it in the US, MSC is not the US.

Fair point - I suppose I read the forum from the lens of the ports in the US, since that's where I cruise from.

[nlclhc]

5 minutes ago, MonsterJoe said:

Fair point - I suppose I read the forum from the lens of the ports in the US, since that's where I cruise from.

 

But even in itineraries that start in US ports the population of MSC is much more international than the one in RCL, Carnival et al.

 

MSC is the only line that I know that publicly says individual tips are not encouraged. 

Edited June 5 by nlclhc