viking river cruise air pkg

[CDNPolar]

28 minutes ago, Janie1229 said:

Hi, no my sister and I are going on Viking Christmas Market Amsterdam-Basel this Dec 17-24. It is our first time on Viking. The choice of air through Viking or on your own is very individual and I believe depends largely on your flexibility. I had a specific flight that I wanted on Delta nonstop from Detroit to Amsterdam. After speaking with Viking Air dept several times, and the regular Viking reps who were very unhelpful (yes I know it is not in their wheelhouse, that is for the Viking Air dept but the reps should have better info than they provide) - it was costing a lot more to book through Viking. Now, I could have booked economy for $799 plus $100 (deviation for flying in 2 days prior to cruise) plus $150 (cost of seeing air schedule) plus $554 (extra cost for flight being "outside viking contract with airline') for grand total of $1603 - but that's crazy. I booked premium select on my own for a little more than that. I know some people on Facebook said they were able to get that same Delta flight out of Detroit without paying the extra $554 b/c it is "out of their contract" and I don't know how that happens. If so, Viking is playing very fast and loose with passengers so hopefully there was more to the story. Possibly those passengers had booked an expensive suite and it was an added perk. Anyway, it is done! 

 

This is not Viking playing fast and loose, it is the airlines.

 

We had flights booked - and confirmed - with Viking air for flights out of San Juan to Toronto.  These were the preferred flights for us and got us home that day at about 3pm.  All of a sudden the airline made changes, we were put on alternate flights on a different airline that don't get us home until almost midnight.

 

The same flights that we WERE on were then available in MVJ for a premium of $450 pp.

 

This is not Viking, these are the airlines changing fares, and Viking under contract has to follow through.

 

This is the first time we did not use Viking Air Plus, and did not ask for flights to be ticketed in advance.  With Viking Air, you cannot have flights ticketed before they are ready to ticket.  Had we used Viking Air Plus, and had the flights ticketed in advance, then I believe we still would have had the original flights and without a premium.

 

@FlyerTalker has given info about these situations before, and perhaps can add some context here?

 

Viking and other cruise lines are not air carriers and they are slaves to the contracts and what the airlines dictate.

 

This was a lesson for us, and it just reinforces that air travel in general is volatile at the best of times and changes, cancellations, and delays are just part of the game whether you book direct or thorough the cruise line.

[FlyerTalker]

On 8/21/2024 at 7:02 PM, vhs said:

concerned with flight choice 

times and direct flights

heard they could change flight at last minute

 

Well, it's been a while -- guess the OP (vhs) didn't want to add anything.

 

I was curious to find out what her definition of "last minute" was.

 

Especially because changes happen in TWO separate categories.  There are operational cancellations which generally happen the day of flight, or perhaps the day before.  This is when your flight doesn't operate because of any of three things:  mechanical issues, staffing issues, and weather issues.  These are proximate to your flight.

 

The other time your flight changes is if the airline does a schedule change.  Unless they are dropping the route entirely, they are not "cancelling" your flight, but rather adjusting flight times, equipment and frequencies.  This is a regular part of airline operations - fine tuning what were long-range assumptions into short range operational plans.

 

If you want to know more, here's a CC post that I made with a link to an AA YouTube video.  As I wrote:  Here's a very illuminating interview with Brian Znotins, the VP of Network Planning for American Airlines. It's part of AA's internal communications effort, but available to everyone through YouTube.

 

https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2878237-placeholder-scheduling-at-aa-and-others-youtube-video/#comment-63879985

 

What does this all mean? So, you first need to differentiate the two separate cases.  There isn't much you can do about the former - the airline doesn't want to disrupt their daily schedule, so please don't assign nefarious motives - such as "not enough seats sold on the flight", which is a huge urban legend with no basis in fact.  For the latter, know that this is a fact of life.  Schedules won't be adjusted near your flight, so within 1-2 months of flight, you are pretty well set.

 

For more questions, try the Cruise Air forum here at CC, where a bunch of very knowledgeable folks hang out.

 

 

 

[FlyerTalker]

On 8/22/2024 at 8:14 PM, Host Jazzbeau said:

You can always pay Viking a small fee to get custom choices on the airfare, if the flights they offer you aren't exactly what you want.  EWR is such a major gateway that you should have no problem getting them to offer you suitable flights.

 

Plus any difference in the fare, especially if the desired flights are not part of their contracted rates.  And even if in the contract, the actual price to the customer may vary.  So it's not just the "fee".

 

 

[FlyerTalker]

4 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

Viking and other cruise lines are not air carriers and they are slaves to the contracts and what the airlines dictate.

 

Ding Ding Ding.

 

Absolutely correct, and spot on with the recognition of the contracts.

 

Cruiseline promo air is ALWAYS a function of them getting a contracted rate from the airline.  And those contracts include routings, dates, flights and most importantly, capacity.  The airline doesn't get an unlimited number of seats on all flights.  And they are always working with a subset of the overall availability to the general public.

 

For the poster who wanted that one flight from Detroit.  Yes, when you add in fees, plus the fare differential (due to being out of contract), it's more expensive than buying it on your own.  Had it been in contract, you likely would not have a fare differential, so it would just be the fees.  And guess what -- you can't find this out without getting into the process first.  So there is a definite risk factor at play.

 

Simple thing to remember is TANSTAAFL.  Viking uses "free air" as a way to discount the overall price of the cruise - to stimulate business on cruises that aren't selling.  They make the choice not to discount the cruise price, so as to maintain price integrity on their product.  The only other way to "discount" is to give out benefits -- free or discounted air, drink packages, gratuities and the like.

 

Decide what is important to you.  Then you are better positioned to make an informed decision.

 

 

[Janie1229]

25 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

Ding Ding Ding.

 

Absolutely correct, and spot on with the recognition of the contracts.

 

Cruiseline promo air is ALWAYS a function of them getting a contracted rate from the airline.  And those contracts include routings, dates, flights and most importantly, capacity.  The airline doesn't get an unlimited number of seats on all flights.  And they are always working with a subset of the overall availability to the general public.

 

For the poster who wanted that one flight from Detroit.  Yes, when you add in fees, plus the fare differential (due to being out of contract), it's more expensive than buying it on your own.  Had it been in contract, you likely would not have a fare differential, so it would just be the fees.  And guess what -- you can't find this out without getting into the process first.  So there is a definite risk factor at play.

 

Simple thing to remember is TANSTAAFL.  Viking uses "free air" as a way to discount the overall price of the cruise - to stimulate business on cruises that aren't selling.  They make the choice not to discount the cruise price, so as to maintain price integrity on their product.  The only other way to "discount" is to give out benefits -- free or discounted air, drink packages, gratuities and the like.

 

Decide what is important to you.  Then you are better positioned to make an informed decision.

 

 

I understand all - or most of this situation with air fare and Viking vs. booking on your own. The part that bewildered me is that a couple of people on Facebook said they were able to get that same exact nonstop flight out of DTW without paying extra or it being outside the contract. But perhaps at the time they booked it was in contract, and changed after. Who knows! I would love to take advantage of less expensive fare, and having Viking available to help with any issues, but at least for this trip, I want that nonstop!! Oh and by the way - after all of that, I ended up adding the leg from Columbus to Detroit the day prior to the flight leaving, and my sister and I will stay at the Marriott at the airport. I didn't want my husband to have to drive us in case of crappy weather, and then we can sleep in, leisurely breakfast etc. before checking in for the flight. !!!!

[CDNPolar]

6 minutes ago, Janie1229 said:

I understand all - or most of this situation with air fare and Viking vs. booking on your own. The part that bewildered me is that a couple of people on Facebook said they were able to get that same exact nonstop flight out of DTW without paying extra or it being outside the contract. But perhaps at the time they booked it was in contract, and changed after. Who knows! I would love to take advantage of less expensive fare, and having Viking available to help with any issues, but at least for this trip, I want that nonstop!! Oh and by the way - after all of that, I ended up adding the leg from Columbus to Detroit the day prior to the flight leaving, and my sister and I will stay at the Marriott at the airport. I didn't want my husband to have to drive us in case of crappy weather, and then we can sleep in, leisurely breakfast etc. before checking in for the flight. !!!!

 

With my situation, had I gone for Viking Air Plus and booked the original flight that I wanted, I believe that I would have had it at no additional cost.  Because on this particular cruise we opted for the first time to try Viking Air, without the Plus, then we experienced being shuffled around based on the reasoning that @FlyerTalker provided.

[FlyerTalker]

10 minutes ago, Janie1229 said:

The part that bewildered me is that a couple of people on Facebook said they were able to get that same exact nonstop flight out of DTW without paying extra or it being outside the contract. But perhaps at the time they booked it was in contract, and changed after

 

Or the number of seats under the contract were already gone.  Remember, there are likely capacity controls on how many seats the cruiseline can access at the contract price.  So anything beyond that is at a higher price.

 

 

[CDNPolar]

36 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

 

 

Simple thing to remember is TANSTAAFL.  Viking uses "free air" as a way to discount the overall price of the cruise - to stimulate business on cruises that aren't selling.  They make the choice not to discount the cruise price, so as to maintain price integrity on their product.  The only other way to "discount" is to give out benefits -- free or discounted air, drink packages, gratuities and the like.

 

 

 

 

 

In my mind, and from being in sales for my full career, I salute this method of Viking's to keep their cabin price intact.  This is a strategy that has a lot of psychological aspects built in.

 

If I am used to paying $6K per person for a cabin, or $12K total, and all of a sudden cabins are going for $4.5Kpp or $9K total, I will forever remember the $9K and then feel that every cabin after that is expensive or has had a huge price increase.

 

Viking's philosophy of giving reduced air, free air, SSBP, reduced deposits is a direct move to - as FlyerTalker says - maintain price integrity.  We get our savings in other ways, but not through the main product offering.

 

Psychology of pricing wins here because we never see the cabin price drop.

[Janie1229]

3 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

 

With my situation, had I gone for Viking Air Plus and booked the original flight that I wanted, I believe that I would have had it at no additional cost.  Because on this particular cruise we opted for the first time to try Viking Air, without the Plus, then we experienced being shuffled around based on the reasoning that @FlyerTalker provided.

I started the booking with Viking Air Plus. And that's what happened above!

[ericosmith]

So here's my plan.  I'm willing to gamble $300 for a potential much larger savings.  I'm looking for premium economy so there aren't as many available seats to choose from.  I've reserved flights under the contract which in my case is $2400 multi city.  The flights I would have picked myself are over $4000 and are not under the contract.  I'm arriving 2 hours later on a "do nothing" day and laying over 2 hours longer on the return.  For that I'm saving over $3200 for two.  I'm told that contracts change frequently and with Air Plus I can call back at any time to check.  I'll be back with them monthly until ticketing time so see if I can save that 4 hours while at the same time checking for fare changes on flights I can book myself.  

[Host Jazzbeau]

@ericosmith sounds like a plan.  Glad it worked out for you.

 

I have also read on this forum that you can call Viking Air Plus and find out whether it looks like they can accommodate your needs/price point before committing to the payments.  That would work for me.  I'm happy to get the flights I want at a lower price, and even willing to take slightly less desirable flights at a killer price – but not willing to pay for the privilege of speaking to someone who can only tell me that they can't meet my needs!

[CDNPolar]

7 hours ago, ericosmith said:

So here's my plan.  I'm willing to gamble $300 for a potential much larger savings.  I'm looking for premium economy so there aren't as many available seats to choose from.  I've reserved flights under the contract which in my case is $2400 multi city.  The flights I would have picked myself are over $4000 and are not under the contract.  I'm arriving 2 hours later on a "do nothing" day and laying over 2 hours longer on the return.  For that I'm saving over $3200 for two.  I'm told that contracts change frequently and with Air Plus I can call back at any time to check.  I'll be back with them monthly until ticketing time so see if I can save that 4 hours while at the same time checking for fare changes on flights I can book myself.  

 

If you have actually "booked" these flights with Air Plus then you can go into MVJ - MyVikingJourney - at anytime and see your flights.  As well, if changes occur to the flights you have blocked in MVJ, you will get an email with an update air itinerary.

 

I look at my flights in MVJ probably about once a week.  
 

One thing that can happen with MVJ flights that you DON'T get an email about is the seats that you chose can drop...  no warning, they just disappear.  I have a theory, that the flight number did not change, the time of the flight did not change, but the airline changed the equipment and therefore the seat configuration changed.  I could be totally wrong with that.  

 

You can pick your seats again on MVJ and Bob's your Uncle.

 

You can cancel your flights and get a refund of the flight costs - if full payment made - as long as the flights have not ticketed.  The ticketing happens without warning.

 

You say you are willing to gamble $300 bucks, so I assume that you are aware that you lose the cost of Air Plus even if you cancel those flights.

[CDNPolar]

7 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

@ericosmith sounds like a plan.  Glad it worked out for you.

 

I have also read on this forum that you can call Viking Air Plus and find out whether it looks like they can accommodate your needs/price point before committing to the payments.  That would work for me.  I'm happy to get the flights I want at a lower price, and even willing to take slightly less desirable flights at a killer price – but not willing to pay for the privilege of speaking to someone who can only tell me that they can't meet my needs!

 

I believe that you can do this... however in the beginning...  (haha, 2018'ish for me) you could put Air Plus on and talk to them and then everything happened at final payment.

 

Now when you add Air Plus and you call Air Plus they ask for your Credit Card and you pay on the spot for the Air Plus fees and any deviation fees.

 

I have not tried to ask questions about fares and schedules before paying so I cannot give you a direct answer to this.  I have however found the Air Plus folks to be very accommodating, so this is possible.

 

There has been rumour that Viking is going to get rid of Air Plus, but I don't believe that.  Viking are just making Air Plus a profit centre or to at least cover costs.  I am sure that there were a lot that used the services of Air Plus in the past and then walked away and did their own thing.

 

[ericosmith]

2 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

If you have actually "booked" these flights with Air Plus then you can go into MVJ - MyVikingJourney - at anytime and see your flights.  As well, if changes occur to the flights you have blocked in MVJ, you will get an email with an update air itinerary.

 

I'm wondering if there's some trick I'm missing.  Perhaps Oceans are different than rivers.  I have an emailed itinerary for my river cruise but MVJ still says my itinerary will be available at 90 days.  Since it's the same air department (I think) I don't know why it wouldn't be the same.  

[CDNPolar]

2 hours ago, ericosmith said:

I'm wondering if there's some trick I'm missing.  Perhaps Oceans are different than rivers.  I have an emailed itinerary for my river cruise but MVJ still says my itinerary will be available at 90 days.  Since it's the same air department (I think) I don't know why it wouldn't be the same.  

 

Did you pay for Air Plus, or are you just using Viking Air.  Big difference between the two.

 

If you paid for Air Plus - $150.00 pp - and have booked flights with the Air Plus department then you should be able to see them in MVJ.

 

If you are just using Viking Air (and not Air Plus) then you get to see flight schedules about 90 days in advance and after you pick the flights then they will populate into a flight itinerary.

 

Did you actually pay for Air Plus?

 

If so, did you call Viking Air Plus department to book?

 

The other option is to wait until the 90 days and then call Air Plus, but unless you have engaged Air Plus, you won't see an itinerary before you have made selections.

 

Hope this makes sense.

[ericosmith]

17 minutes ago, CDNPolar said:

Did you actually pay for Air Plus?

 

If so, did you call Viking Air Plus department to book?

 

Yes to both.  I have the invoice showing the $300 charge and also an itinerary and airline booking number from them but nothing showing in MVJ.  I'll give them a call and see what they say.

[CDNPolar]

4 minutes ago, ericosmith said:

Yes to both.  I have the invoice showing the $300 charge and also an itinerary and airline booking number from them but nothing showing in MVJ.  I'll give them a call and see what they say.

 

When did you do all this?

 

Viking are having problems with their systems and the air portion.  I cannot see air for one of my cruises, but it is done.

 

Make sure that you are talking to Air Plus and not regular reservations.  Ask to be transferred.

 

Did you pay on your credit card the $300 or is it just showing on your invoice.

 

[FlyerTalker]

6 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

One thing that can happen with MVJ flights that you DON'T get an email about is the seats that you chose can drop...  no warning, they just disappear.  I have a theory, that the flight number did not change, the time of the flight did not change, but the airline changed the equipment and therefore the seat configuration changed.  I could be totally wrong with that. 

 

That's one possibility.  Another is that your seat request (which is all it is) got bounced for an actual ticketed passenger.  An airline has incentive to cater to those who have put down cash for the tickets, as opposed to a "reservation".

 

 

[CDNPolar]

2 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

That's one possibility.  Another is that your seat request (which is all it is) got bounced for an actual ticketed passenger.  An airline has incentive to cater to those who have put down cash for the tickets, as opposed to a "reservation".

 

 

 

Had not thought of this but very possible consideration as this only happens before payment.  I have not had it happen this way after payment.

[sharkster77]

For our tulip cruise in April MVJ, until the day we sailed, displayed incorrect flight and seat information.  I checked the airline website every few weeks until departure date, and assumed the airline's info, not Viking's, was correct.  My assumption was right.

[ericosmith]

11 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

 

When did you do all this?

 

Viking are having problems with their systems and the air portion.  I cannot see air for one of my cruises, but it is done.

 

Make sure that you are talking to Air Plus and not regular reservations.  Ask to be transferred.

 

Did you pay on your credit card the $300 or is it just showing on your invoice.

 

I called Air Plus today and they fixed the issue with MVJ so it now shows there.  
Thanks for the tips!