More Bearing Problems for Millie - Millie Cancellation (Combined Thread)

[Andy]

I wonder if the deployment of Solstice is because X is planning to sell these ships or transfer them to another division of the parent?

 

It would be a real shame from the perspective of X moving to a bigger ship size which IMO is a big step away from what has set them apart from the pack.

 

But one does have to wonder...

 

Hi Caviargal !

 

IMHO, I would say HIGHLY doubtful that Celebrity has ANY thoughts of selling or moving the M-Class ships. However, when the 3 Solstice class ships are up and running, I would think this would give Celebrity the opportunity to pull each M-Class ship out of the water for a longer period of time, assuming they can come up with a long term solution to the pod problems.

[florisdekort]

I won the "Celebrity lottery" twice this year... First the 9/13 Infinity and now the 12/10 Millennium... :o The first time I liked the generous compensation, but by now I really don't know what to do anymore with yet another future cruise certicate.

 

Floris

[Nurse Bambi]

In MHO, it is a corporate bottom line decision. It is cheaper to just keep sailing, than it is to fix it! Buy off the passengers, sue the manufacture of the pods to recover lost revenue and just continue on. It is as simple as that! This is the third pod failure in the last seven months. This has resulted in three cancelled cruises and affected thousands who were unfortunate enough to be on board while the problems were going on. What other business would allow this to continue to happen, three times within seven months, with no fix in sight? What other business would have such a passionate group supporting their decision to do this?

[caviargal]

Hi Caviargal !

 

IMHO, I would say HIGHLY doubtful that Celebrity has ANY thoughts of selling or moving the M-Class ships. However, when the 3 Solstice class ships are up and running, I would think this would give Celebrity the opportunity to pull each M-Class ship out of the water for a longer period of time, assuming they can come up with a long term solution to the pod problems.

 

Andy, I like that concept and hope it's true. I am sure the financial as well as the emotional impact has taken (and will continue to take) a real toll on X's bottom line.

[Drew B]

Oy! That's really a shame!

 

I think that if they put these ships on a preventative maintenance schedule (such as PLANNED drydock every 9 months to replace the bearings before they wear too much), it might solve a lot of problems. However, it would reduce the company's income, and might lead to price increases (or increases in other fees such as corkage:p) to offset the issue. Having 3 Solstice-class ships sailing would make it MUCH easier to schedule such a scenario.

[Nurse Bambi]

I won the "Celebrity lottery" twice this year... First the 9/13 Infinity and now the 12/10 Millennium... :o The first time I liked the generous compensation, but by now I really don't know what to do anymore with yet another future cruise certicate.

 

Floris

 

Floris, Congratulations on your second "Celebrity pod lottery" winner this year. You will have to let us all know when your next Celebrity cruise is going to be on Celebrity, so we can all get in on this bonanza.

[caviargal]

However, it would reduce the company's income, and might lead to price increases (or increases in other fees such as corkage:p) to offset the issue. Having 3 Solstice-class ships sailing would make it MUCH easier to schedule such a scenario.

 

Drew, I knew there was a solution to both problems. X can raise the corkage to $100 per bottle for the wine no one is allowed to bring on and put that toward the ongoing maintenance!

 

Brilliant:p!

[Drew B]

In MHO, it is a corporate bottom line decision. It is cheaper to just keep sailing, than it is to fix it! Buy off the passengers, sue the manufacture of the pods to recover lost revenue and just continue on. It is as simple as that! This is the third pod failure in the last seven months. This has resulted in three cancelled cruises and affected thousands who were unfortunate enough to be on board while the problems were going on. What other business would allow this to continue to happen, three times within seven months, with no fix in sight? What other business would have such a passionate group supporting their decision to do this?

 

Nurse Bambi, those three cancelled cruises cost Celebrity WAYWAYWAYWAYWAY more than they cost any of the passengers. "Buying off" those passengers isn't cheap. Do you have any idea if it is even POSSIBLE to "fix it" as you say? If so, what would it cost? Would they even be able to stay in business if they paid to "fix" all 4 ships? If so, how much higher would all of our cruise fares be? I think a lot more people would be outraged if they had to pay 50% more for all of their cruises. Or if X couldn't raise prices that much, perhaps they'd find other ways to make up for it. They could cut way back on the quality/variety of food. They could lay off staff so that each waiter was responsible for twice as many tables or each cabin steward was responsible for twice as many rooms... Do you think that the customers would be happy with THAT?

 

I can pretty much guarantee you that they can't fix these ships simply by cutting back a bit on their profit margin. In order to stay in business, they can't LOSE money. Therefore, if they're going to "fix" them (if that is even possible) we're going to pay for it in various unpleasant ways.

 

My one and only cruise on X was on a cruise that was severely affected by a pod issue (the 5/7 Summit cruise). Even with that "bad luck", I'd STILL rather take my chances with the pods than pay much more for the cruise or see the quality of everything else suffer.

[goofysmom99]

We're on the 11-24 TA to FLL and they've rearranged our ports a little bit and cancelled Naples. As a previous poster noted, with all the problems they've been having in Naples (crime), it wasn't a huge surprise that that was the port they would eliminate. The $300 onboard credit certainly makes it much more palatable, too. Pays for a large portion of the tips. We book TAs because we love sea days, so this isn't much of a tragedy for us anyway. And now we'll just have to go back and do it again in 2008!:D

[sasset]

We're on the Med/Transatlantic cruise prior to the 12/10 cruise. Just got a call from X and Naples (Pompeii) has been cancelled and replaced by a day at sea and a $300 per cabin on board credit for CC. Hope that's all they end up cancelling. A transatlantic with one pod could be an adventure. The last Med cruise we were scheduled to go on was cancelled because of 9/11. RCL didn't even deploy the Grandeur to the Med that year.

 

Hope the folks on the 12/10 cruise find a way to make the best of this. Like some others said....the Millie is definitely not the only Caribbean cruise for that week.

 

Rick

 

I just got an e-mail from my travel agent. He said that Florence (Livorno), November 26, was being replaced by a day at sea. Compensation numbers were the same.

 

Wonder which one it is.

 

Regards

[cruisinelsewhere]

I won the "Celebrity lottery" twice this year... First the 9/13 Infinity and now the 12/10 Millennium... :o The first time I liked the generous compensation, but by now I really don't know what to do anymore with yet another future cruise certicate.

 

Floris

 

I just rebooked my cancelled 12/10 cruise. Celebrity is refunding every penny I paid them and instead I will sail on 12/11 Century out of Miami in a suite for free. Works out Ok for me....why hold onto cruise credits when there is another ship right around the corner and I really need a vacation!!:cool:

[caviargal]

Florence is a real loss in terms of itinerary.

 

I am also a fan of Naples but know I am in the minority on that city:).

 

I imagine that this is still a moving target and that is the reason that information is changing.

[Drew B]

And as always, I think a per-person rebate would be much more sensible than a per-cabin one.

[sasset]

We are hoping that the Naples version is the true one, but we are prepared to miss Florence.

[thmpsn]

Our TA called and said that Naples wiil be skipped and we will get a $300 credit to drink away our sorrows. Now at the end we will have 7 sea days to cross from Tenerif to FLL.

Jim

[Captain Cosmo]

Not sure I understand those who are sympathetic to X's dillema with the pods; In real life, when a company buys something that doesn't work, they first try to get the manufacturer to fix it, then they sue, and if that doesn't work they bring in consultants to propose a fix. If the fix is cost prohibitive then the equipment is retired or sold to someone who can "live" with the situation. I'm just glad that X doesn't run an airline...imagine what air travel would be like if airlines flew planes with critical defects because "its too expensive to fix it". Of course, no one will die as a result of X's inability to address this problem properly, but when you wonder why the cruising experience continues to deteriorate you have to look at the mindset of a management team that would continue to use unreliable equipment. I'd rather see the M-class ships fixed for good than to see X building another floating shopping mall, aka Solstice. Apparently some of you stock holders are also overlooking the fact that if X is spending so much money because of cancelled cruises what will that do to the bottom line?

 

As Nurse Bambi says, if you can cruise anytime and wind up "winning" a free cruise when your scheduled cruise gets cancelled, then congratulations! But for most of us, this game of "musical drydocks" that X is playing with the M-Class ships means the loss of a planned vacation and time off from work that may take months to reschedule. Nope, X is not the victim here...

[Lois R]

Hey Kim, thanks....hoping she is up and sailing the next week

too;)

And wishing you a wonderful cruise as well:)

[Captain Cosmo]

Double post...

[caviargal]

I'd rather see the M-class ships fixed for good than to see X building another floating shopping mall, aka Solstice. Apparently some of you stock holders are also overlooking the fact that if X is spending so much money because of cancelled cruises what will that do to the bottom line?

 

As Nurse Bambi says, if you can cruise anytime and wind up "winning" a free cruise when your scheduled cruise gets cancelled, then congratulations! But for most of us, this game of "musical drydocks" that X is playing with the M-Class ships means the loss of a planned vacation and time off from work that may take months to reschedule. Nope, X is not the victim here...

 

I feel the same way about Solstice which is why I raised the question about the reason for those ships. Is X planning to become RCI in every was, including the floating mall concept? While I hope not, I think they are evidencing behavior to the contrary.

 

I also agree that X is not the victim here and each time I recommend a M class ship it is with the sincere concern that my clients get lucky and avoid winning the X lottery:cool:.

 

For us, changing a vacation at the last minute is a huge burden and I am happy I am on Century next week instead of an M class ship.

[thmpsn]

Caviargal,

I am confused.

If you are so concerned about your clients not getting their cruise because of X's lottery with the M class ships, why do you recommend Celebrity to them? Seems to me if you are so worried about your clients, you would not recommend something that you feel is not dependible but look to all of the other lines and ships that you can feel safer recommending.

Karon

[lvz2cruz]

We are on the 12/17 Millie and are wondering what our chances are of having our cruise as planned. Is it realistic to expect the repairs to be completed in a week? I'd gladly take a refund and free cruise, but would hope for time to reschedule my plans for that week.

 

My best wishes to those who are missing the 12/10 cruise. It's great to see the good attitudes and the ability to make lemonade out of lemons.

Hope you find something fun to do that week.

[caviargal]

Caviargal,

I am confused.

If you are so concerned about your clients not getting their cruise because of X's lottery with the M class ships, why do you recommend Celebrity to them? Seems to me if you are so worried about your clients, you would not recommend something that you feel is not dependible but look to all of the other lines and ships that you can feel safer recommending.

Karon

 

I am concerned, not "so concerned" as you put it. And my concern is justified and this potential problem was explained to them.

 

Clients want X for certain reasons and those reasons are accurate. Food, service, traditional cruise experience, not too many kids on board, etc. X is a fit.

 

The pod problems are a crapshoot. They are retired therefore willing to roll the dice.

 

And, to be honest, I did try to steer them to HAL. But, they were set on X, even though they have never cruised with them before.

 

The other options in Alaska were not up to the quality they were seeking. IMO, X and HAL offer the best in mass market cruising. But sometimes folks want what they want, as is obvious from this board.

[Drew B]

Not sure I understand those who are sympathetic to X's dillema with the pods; In real life, when a company buys something that doesn't work, they first try to get the manufacturer to fix it, then they sue, and if that doesn't work they bring in consultants to propose a fix. If the fix is cost prohibitive then the equipment is retired or sold to someone who can "live" with the situation. I'm just glad that X doesn't run an airline...imagine what air travel would be like if airlines flew planes with critical defects because "its too expensive to fix it". Of course, no one will die as a result of X's inability to address this problem properly, but when you wonder why the cruising experience continues to deteriorate you have to look at the mindset of a management team that would continue to use unreliable equipment. I'd rather see the M-class ships fixed for good than to see X building another floating shopping mall, aka Solstice. Apparently some of you stock holders are also overlooking the fact that if X is spending so much money because of cancelled cruises what will that do to the bottom line?

 

As Nurse Bambi says, if you can cruise anytime and wind up "winning" a free cruise when your scheduled cruise gets cancelled, then congratulations! But for most of us, this game of "musical drydocks" that X is playing with the M-Class ships means the loss of a planned vacation and time off from work that may take months to reschedule. Nope, X is not the victim here...

 

Is it feasible to simply "retire" the ships or sell them, most likely, at a fraction of their value? I'm guessing that they're probably not all even paid for yet! When you build something as expensive as a cruise ship, you need many years of income coming in simply to pay back the cash outlay for the construction. These ships are not particularly old. How many BILLIONS of dollars would they have flushed down the toilet on their construction if they are not able to continue to run them to generate income? What would happen to the company if they retired these 4 ships? Would they be able to stay in business? I doubt it. Once again, yours is a very simplistic answer...

 

And as for X being the "victim", it is not an either/or situation. I guarantee you that if ANY person affiliated with the line (from the lowliest diswasher aboard one of the ships to the CEO of RCCI) had the choice to magically fix the pod problems or leave things as they are, every single one of them would choose to fix them. It's not as though X asked for these pod problems or wants them to persist. They don't. They just don't have any alternatives that make sense financially in order to simply stay afloat. That doesn't take away from the disappointment or suffering of passengers whose trip is affected. I say that both X and the customers can be victims. Nobody wants this!

 

I DO think that X should warn people of the potential danger, and I wouldn't blame anybody if they chose another line. I also think they should standardize a preventative maintenance schedule and come up with a fair and uniform "compensation" policy. Beyond that, though, I don't expect them to perform magic and fix something that it is not feasible to fix!

[Nurse Bambi]

It not a question that the pod problem can not be fixed, its a question of Celebrity choosing to just go on and wait for the next failure. I am still waiting to hear what other company would be allowed to operate this way!

That being said, Celebrity has refused to do any of the things that you mentioned. (1) Warn people about the potential problems. (2) Standardize preventative maintenance schedule. (3) uniform "compensation' policy for those caught on board when pod problems start. All three of these points, Celebrity steadfastly refuses to address. Another poster pointed out that they had called Celebrity and was told there had only ever been one pod problem on the M-Class ships. This sounds more than a little strange to me. Passing the cost of the cruise interruptions onto the lawsuit settlement may be great for Celebrity, but what about the poor unsuspecting passenger who misses a lot of their cruise because of pod problems? I realize this if fine with some, but what about those who have never heard of a pod?????

[Drew B]

It not a question that the pod problem can not be fixed, its a question of Celebrity choosing to just go on and wait for the next failure.

 

Do you have any way to prove this? I believe the reverse is true - I've never once heard an engineering expert say that it's even POSSIBLE let alone financially practical to permanently fix these pods. But I don't have any proof of that, either. In this case, we may have to agree to disagree.