"Class Wars" on the ships--Diamond+ folk, Carnival haters, etc

[Jumbiecruiser]

This Carnival bashing is absolutely the most ridiculous thing I have read on the RCCL site. I'm sure I'll see and meet less than perfect people on RCCL also. We have been on 4 CCL cruises and as I said earlier have met many wonderful people. I have yet to see a wife beater on anyone. People dress up, very nicely, I might say for dinner. I saw very good manners and met very nice people. I happen to know someone who was on a large family cruise in the last few weeks on, gasp, a Carnival cruise and he makes more money than any of you probably ever hope to. He could easily afford to go as upscale as they come, but chose something that makes financial sense. And, you would never know that he is wealthy.

 

The so called "bashing" is just as bad on the Carnival board against Royal Caribbean. Funny how some people only see one side.:rolleyes: Ones wealth has nothing to do with what a person likes or dislikes. Carnival has a reputation that they themselves created. Too bad that they can't live it down. They are the most popular cruise line in the world but not for the reasons that they would like.;) Maybe if more of the Carnival posters would stay on their own board then life would be good.:rolleyes:

[acc82]

The so called "bashing" is just as bad on the Carnival board against Royal Caribbean. Funny how some people only see one side.:rolleyes: Ones wealth has nothing to do with what a person likes or dislikes. Carnival has a reputation that they themselves created. Too bad that they can't live it down. They are the most popular cruise line in the world but not for the reasons that they would like.;) Maybe if more of the Carnival posters would stay on their own board then life would be good.:rolleyes:

 

I agree. this is the royal caribbean board and people here are going to favor royal. I haven't been on a carnival cruise before so, I won't bash carnival since I have no experience with them. however, i can choose to keep cruising with royal. I stay with royal because i have had nothing but good to say about them and doubt it can get much better. You may view me as closed minded but realize that this is the same as saying " i like hilton brand hotels and will choose to book those when at all possible". I certainly know what to expect on my vacation and know i won't be disappointed.

 

also, may i point out the siding works both ways. there are carnival cruisers posting here who know nothing about royal and don't understand the draw. like the person who 'didn't understand why someone would want a room above the cruise ships mall' - she doesn't understand the way the ship is laid out and why promenade staterooms are great for a lot of people. this would be like me agreeing on the carnival drunkenness that i've never witnessed.

 

all i know of carnival is the clientele as we all go to the same excursions. the only thing i've noticed is that carnival seems to have more young children than royal does but the statistics speak to this (royals median age is about 40).

 

so, to each his own. :cool:

[MrPete]

I agree. this is the royal caribbean board and people here are going to favor royal. I haven't been on a carnival cruise before so, I won't bash carnival since I have no experience with them. however, i can choose to keep cruising with royal. I stay with royal because i have had nothing but good to say about them and doubt it can get much better. You may view me as closed minded but realize that this is the same as saying " i like hilton brand hotels and will choose to book those when at all possible". I certainly know what to expect on my vacation and know i won't be disappointed.

 

Nothing wrong with that! If you like it, there's no problem.

 

However, you will not be able to proclaim or post it's the "BEST". Some try to say that when they have never tried what else is out there. It seems silly to read that, or try to based on heresay.

 

And then there are those that have ventured out and have preferences. And there's nothing wrong with that either. Those comparisons are interesting reads.

[dmdiver]

I have also heard there are more kids on Carnival ships - from others. My daughter sailed during the school year on RCCL, so she wouldn't have a good feel for that. My guess is that Carnival's pricing makes cruising more affordable for families. I'm more than willing to sail other lines if their pricing falls in line, but I haven't had the good luck to catch one of those deals.

 

For those wondering why CCL fans are over here - we were invited.

[sailnsee]

AHHHH...Carnival vs RCCL-everyone sails for different reasons and with different demands,so there is no contest for me. We have been on 3 Carnival cruises(when our kids were much younger) and now are close to D+ on RCCL(We also have sailed on Princess, Norweigen,and Celebrity;great experiences on Princess and Celebrity,not on Norweigen and quite frankly would not go back to Carnival unless I was sure they had changed(a lot).

It is funny,you don't know what anything else is like until you try it and since we started sailing RCCL after 3 Carnival cruises I know what I was missing. Maybe we will try a short Carnival after we reach D+ and see what the "talk" is a about :O) I personally get a kick out of the "cabin status seekers"-we have been in insides,ov,bal.j.s and grand suites(because of an unbelievalbe deal) so I can talk about all of them but pick the one that works best and cost the less for that trip....who cares-except me?

[barbie5401]

I had the pleasure of attending a focus group here in Miami, that was about cruising it lasted two hours and out of the 14 people in the group, I was the only one who had been on RCCL, a lot of questions were asked to determine why I favored RCCL and the other 13 people had either been on Carnival or had taken 1 cruise on NCL. They all said they would consider RCCL next, however, they made the previous decision soley based on money - since all were the 3 day Bahama cruises out of Miami. I believe the leader was surprised that I have sailed more than 50 times. I have family working for the Carnival Corporation for 8 years now and we have never sailed on anyone of the ships under corporation in the last 8 years.

 

I love being a passenger on RCCL and will continue to sail with them. Yes, I wish they would have more sailings to Hawaii and Alaska, yes I wish there was another option besides the WJ on embarkation day. But those are things I will live with an continue to be loyal to RCCL.

 

p.s. we were once on the MJ and this couple who sails on them often gets extra coupon books so they don't have to pay for thier drinks. Yes they sail often over 100 times, but they are so cheap the wife can't buy anything and he only drinks when it is for free.

[X]

Carnival vs Royal. Its more a money issue.

 

Carnival = Walmart of cruises. Usually the cheapest line, so it attracts those people on a budget. College students, families with little kids, and maybe lower to middle class (maybe under $50k/year).

 

Royal = still a mass marketed cruise but a more refined and a little more elegant. Attracts middle class to upper class ($50k-$125k/year) as well as families with older kids. Definately not wealthy though.

[A2Mich]

I have also heard there are more kids on Carnival ships - from others. My daughter sailed during the school year on RCCL, so she wouldn't have a good feel for that. My guess is that Carnival's pricing makes cruising more affordable for families. I'm more than willing to sail other lines if their pricing falls in line, but I haven't had the good luck to catch one of those deals.

 

For those wondering why CCL fans are over here - we were invited.

 

As for pricing, that is a very good point. While we all come from different walks of life, we all have different income levels, and different amounts of "disposable income" for things like vacations. I've been having our TA price out RCI and CCL cruises for Sept 2010, and while there is a fairly large difference in price (with RCI being about $1000 more than a similar CCL cruise, both balcony staterooms), I think we're going to bite the bullet and book Freedom of the Seas. We're hoping that RCI will be nice and the rates will drop over the next year, which they very well may.....if so, RCI may end up being very similar in price. We're hoping that we get a more refined product than Carnival (and I do like CCL, as we've sailed mostly with them), but have been told by several people, including our TA, to try either RCI or NCL, and think we're going to try RCI. We also have 2 younger children (will be 3 and 5 at sailing time), and think they may enjoy Adventure Ocean and the H20 Zone. Believe me, it's hard to pass up the lower Carnival fares, as we try to be smart shoppers (and yes, we are also WalMart shoppers). We don't like to spend money un-necessarily, but are willing to spend a bit more to get something nicer in return. As for the remarks of Carnival being the WalMart of cruise lines, I actually don't like that comparison.....if it's meant to be that CCL and Walmarts prices are low, that's one thing, but I take it in a derogatory sense that Carnival cruisers are low-class, trashy people (recalling the typical image that non-WalMart shoppers have). We choose to shop at WalMart for certain things, as we would rather save money. Could we afford to shop elsewhere? Sure....but why pay more than you have to????

[The Grateful Dad]

This class discussion has brought me some memories from a while back when I was going through a depressive state and I would find myself being envious of others with more. It did start to get me down and I found myself shying away from others in order to control those feelings. The few cruises we've been on we tended to sit by ourselves and missed out on some nice people because of the minority of 'in your face blow hards' who had to let you know all the things that they had or said they had. This was until I read the following and it had a big impact on how I've adjusted my life. It's not original but I thought I'd share. I apologize to those who might take offense.

 

Desiderata (Desired Things)

Go placidly amid the noise and the haste,

and remember what peace there may be in silence.

As far as possible, without surrender,

be on good terms with all persons.

Speak your truth quietly and clearly;

and listen to others,

even to the dull and the ignorant;

they too have their story.

Avoid loud and aggressive persons;

they are vexatious to the spirit.

If you compare yourself with others,

you may become vain or bitter,

for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.

Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.

Keep interested in your own career, however humble;

it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.

Exercise caution in your business affairs,

for the world is full of trickery.

But let this not blind you to what virtue there is;

many persons strive for high ideals,

and everywhere life is full of heroism.

Be yourself. Especially do not feign affection.

Neither be cynical about love,

for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment,

it is as perennial as the grass.

Take kindly the counsel of the years,

gracefully surrendering the things of youth.

Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune.

But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.

Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.

Beyond a wholesome discipline,

be gentle with yourself.

You are a child of the universe

no less than the trees and the stars;

you have a right to be here.

And whether or not it is clear to you,

no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God,

whatever you conceive Him to be.

And whatever your labors and aspirations,

in the noisy confusion of life,

keep peace in your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams,

it is still a beautiful world.

Be cheerful. Strive to be happy.

 

 

:p

 

 

 

 

Peace

[regjr13]

All this talk of class and the rival of one ship versus the other and what crowd of people chose one over the other and who has what and who doesn’t have is ridiculous.

First, I am in my late 20’s, own my own home for starters in the Washington, DC area, which is one of the top 10 most expensive places to live in the country. Do I need to spell out what I do and how many luxury cars I have and what my net worth is and what my assets are? No. I choose to vacation the way I choose to vacation. While some prefer Carnival and others prefer RCCL, it really doesn’t matter, it’s all based on what you are looking for in YOUR vacation. While I could afford to cruise the Yacht’s of Seabourn, ResidenceSea or Cunard or any other ultra-luxury ship that’s out there, that environment and clientele does not appeal to me. The average age is usually 50+ and not at all the type of environment that would appeal to my “vacation” side. People I would choose to cruise with are closer to my age, regardless of income level, education, etc…that doesn’t matter to me. The days that I choose to go into the office, whether I’m being driven, take the Metro or decide to walk down the street, you meet every class of people and not one time do I look and wonder what they do and how much they make and where they live. The moment people get over their individual prejudices, the better we will be as a whole. I look at a cruise like this; I book the location of the ship I want to be in based on what I want. If I book a Riviera inside room, I know that I have to expect certain things. If I book a Panorama Suite, again, I expect certain things…look at it this way, everyone paid to be on whatever cruise ship they’ve chosen for whatever reason and so do I.

[G'ma]

In another thread on whether to tip porters at Port Canaveral (even though signs explicitly state it's not necessary), I realized something. People from all walks of life cruise RCI ships; perhaps more than a few upper-class folk (whether from old or new money).

 

One person cited as justification for tipping the porters that he or she tipped well all around--e.g. tipped a guy who mowed his or her lawn for 3 summers a brand new car (what's the least expensive new car one can get these days--~USD 15K?). That's some tip. Must be great to be blessed that well (whether starting on third base or otherwise) to tip that generously. We should all be so fortunate.

 

Anyway... I'm an IT professional. I have a Masters degree. And I don't look, dress, or speak like a bubba. I consider myself educated and middle class--haven't gotten that PhD yet, but considered it.

 

Are all the debates about RCI vs. Carnival coming predominantly from upper-class Diamond and Diamond+ members? Are most diamond and diamond+ members wealthy? Wealthy is a loaded term, because everyone has a different idea of what wealthy is. However, I think it's safe to say if a person regularly stays at the Four Seasons chain of hotels pre-cruise and tips lawn mowers a new car, then they're wealthy enough to qualify by my definition of wealthy.

 

Here's the question: Are most diamond and diamond+ cruisers from the upper echelon of net worth, or is it that they've been cruising for many decades?

 

Every now and then, you hear folks who've cruised both lines state that there's very little difference between these two mass market lines. With the exception of decor, I suspect they're probably right (looking forward to trying one of the newer Carnival ships). In other words, their concerns (formality, having the "correct" decor, etc) are not mine.

 

I once sat at a table in the MDR with two "power couples." They'd obviously done well in life and were happily chattering about their many conquests. I couldn't have felt more uncomfortable. Ever since then, I now request a table for two in the MDR. It's wonderful for those who've inherited great sums or built great empires. But I'd rather not spend my cruise vacation in the company of such folk--not if they intend to flaunt it (some of the most wealthy folks are the least conspicuous about it).

 

Anyway, one tenet I live by is "consider the source" when soliciting info from others. Everyone has a unique perspective shaped by their station in life, their experiences, etc. And some groups of people have similar opinions based on similar life experiences.

 

I wonder if it's mostly rich folk who hate Carnival. To be fair, I should be posting this on the Carnival board. Obviously, people here love RCI or they wouldn't be posting (unless they're RCI-hating trolls who delight in nothing else but stirring the pot). I have nothing against people with trust funds and those who've achieved great things monetarily in life. But again, I want to "consider the source" when collecting opinions to put things in their proper context, e.g. are Carnival-haters self-selecting folk to who choice of decor puts their knickers in a terrible twist? "Vegas style abomination" seems to come up quite often in critiques of Carnival. As a cruiser who's mostly interested in what's on offer in various ports, I just have to laugh--and that's my bias. I'm not so concerned about the ship's decor. More about the itinerary.

 

Mike

 

Most of those "upper crust" folks are simply legends in their own minds." If they were of great wealth, they probably would not be on RCCL or on CC grumping about not getting an upgrade or not enough free drinks in the "upper crust" lounge.

 

People who are wealthy rarely give outward signs of being so.......those who so proclaim protesteth too much...or something like that.

 

Online forums and chat rooms are completely anonymous and anyone can be anything, live anywhere, drive anything and tout how sensitive and rare they are.......without anyone challenging their high opinion of themselves.... With no way to check facts, it's better to take it all with a grain of salt....and don't believe anything you hear....or read.

[vickiw0318]

Y'all have made me want to again post my favorite quote from Country Music singer Charlie Pride which is "If I have to tell you who I am, I'm not who I think I am."

[SingingPixie]

My reluctance to sail Carnival has more to do with what I've seen of the ships themselves, as well as the lack of activities onboard which seem to steer people mostly toward bars and lounges. I'm certainly not averse to a drink or two (per day :o) on vacation, but I appreciate that RCCL ships have myriad other things to occupy me. Carnival feels too booze-cruisey to me, even when I look at their own website. The other thing that gets me is decor- I'm not a fan of the Vegas thing. That said, I'm considering a carnival cruise at some point in the next couple years- the Victory itinerary that visits St Thomas, Dominica, Barbados, St Lucia, Antigua and St Kitts. With a port a day (and all but one are ports that I really want to see!), the ship won't matter as much.

 

For the record, I'm just short of 25 and definitely not wealthy. Grew up middle class, have two bachelors degrees and can finally afford to not have a roommate in this high cost-of-living area.

[monkeyinhat]

We first cruised four years ago Royal because we went to a travel agent said, our last kid went to college, we want to try a cruise, leave it up to you. They put us on Royal. We stay and go back for the discounts & perks yes, but mainly for the familiarity. Know the ships, food, procedures. no complaints. I guarantee we would be loyal to Carnival had we started there.

We have some very nice things and perks in our lives but have never ever bragged on a ship . We work very hard for what we have and where our finances are. But then again Only a lowly Platnium I Have heard others complain and whine about how expensive, how much this cost, how much that was, the cruise was, this bugs me equally to your feelings on "well to doers". First cruise our table mates whined and moaned the whole time about how Royal sucked and how great Carnival is.

 

We are going on Carnival Dream for a 12 day Med cruise. The cost of a 12 balcony was very little more than Royal 7 day ov Med cruise. I expect to have every need met and a great time. I priced the same type cabin for a Caribbean cruise, with my balcony discounts and stock certificates Royal was cheaper then Carnival.

 

What I have noticed reading these boards no matter what cruise line

Carnival , Royal , Etc. Someone always brags and looks down. If you have interior, snap, I have OV, snap I have balcony, snap I have Jr suite, snap I have Royal suite. snap etc snap etc. Oh you have been on 40 cruises I have been on 43. I have this category etc. someone , somewhere is always one upping the other.

 

Fellow cruisers Trailer park to Mansion.. I don't care. Put me on a ship, dont' step on my foot and feed me.

 

Happy sailing.

[MrPete]

We first cruised four years ago Royal because we went to a travel agent said, our last kid went to college, we want to try a cruise, leave it up to you. They put us on Royal. We stay and go back for the discounts & perks yes, but mainly for the familiarity. Know the ships, food, procedures. no complaints. I guarantee we would be loyal to Carnival had we started there.

We have some very nice things and perks in our lives but have never ever bragged on a ship . We work very hard for what we have and where our finances are. But then again Only a lowly Platnium I Have heard others complain and whine about how expensive, how much this cost, how much that was, the cruise was, this bugs me equally to your feelings on "well to doers". First cruise our table mates whined and moaned the whole time about how Royal sucked and how great Carnival is.

 

We are going on Carnival Dream for a 12 day Med cruise. The cost of a 12 balcony was very little more than Royal 7 day ov Med cruise. I expect to have every need met and a great time. I priced the same type cabin for a Caribbean cruise, with my balcony discounts and stock certificates Royal was cheaper then Carnival.

 

What I have noticed reading these boards no matter what cruise line

Carnival , Royal , Etc. Someone always brags and looks down. If you have interior, snap, I have OV, snap I have balcony, snap I have Jr suite, snap I have Royal suite. snap etc snap etc. Oh you have been on 40 cruises I have been on 43. I have this category etc. someone , somewhere is always one upping the other.

 

Fellow cruisers Trailer park to Mansion.. I don't care. Put me on a ship, dont' step on my foot and feed me.

 

Happy sailing.

 

Snap! I bet your alphabet only has 26 letters.

[Captain Jake]

Carnival vs Royal. Its more a money issue.

 

Carnival = Walmart of cruises. Usually the cheapest line, so it attracts those people on a budget. College students, families with little kids, and maybe lower to middle class (maybe under $50k/year).

 

Royal = still a mass marketed cruise but a more refined and a little more elegant. Attracts middle class to upper class ($50k-$125k/year) as well as families with older kids. Definately not wealthy though.

 

 

 

LOL If Carnival is the Walmart of cruises than RCCL is the KMart of cruise lines.Both are middle class cruise lines,Both attract the same income levels

[G'ma]

The so called "bashing" is just as bad on the Carnival board against Royal Caribbean. Funny how some people only see one side.:rolleyes: Ones wealth has nothing to do with what a person likes or dislikes. Carnival has a reputation that they themselves created. Too bad that they can't live it down. They are the most popular cruise line in the world but not for the reasons that they would like.;) Maybe if more of the Carnival posters would stay on their own board then life would be good.:rolleyes:

 

What's really "too bad" is people who bash Carnival and have never sailed on one of their ships.....or haven't for 20-25 years. They are simply parroting things they have heard.....

 

Carnival didn't get where they are by having a certain "reputation" you might be referring to. Having just completed my 64th on a Carnival ship, my first at 35, my last at 68, I can say with experience, they do a bang up job....and everyone has a great time....from the youngest to the grannies......!!!!!

[G'ma]

Carnival vs Royal. Its more a money issue.

 

Carnival = Walmart of cruises. Usually the cheapest line, so it attracts those people on a budget. College students, families with little kids, and maybe lower to middle class (maybe under $50k/year).

 

Royal = still a mass marketed cruise but a more refined and a little more elegant. Attracts middle class to upper class ($50k-$125k/year) as well as families with older kids. Definately not wealthy though.

 

Your demographics are WAAYYY off base.

 

Go on the internet and find the REAL information..the information is readily available....... Your "information" couldn't be more wrong....

[monkeyinhat]

Snap! I bet your alphabet only has 26 letters.

 

Mr Pete. Your going to have to explain that insult to me .

When someone puts me down for my opinion, I like to know what it is.

[amybeth4]

Mr Pete. Your going to have to explain that insult to me .

When someone puts me down for my opinion, I like to know what it is.

 

Well, it's cuz you kept doing that *snap* thing referring to one-upping...so Mr. Pete was one-upping you because YOUR alphabet only has 26 letters whereas he's special and can one-up you with a 27-letter alphabet...

 

It was a joke...

[amybeth4]

Your demographics are WAAYYY off base.

 

Go on the internet and find the REAL information..the information is readily available....... Your "information" couldn't be more wrong....

 

Since I'm too tired and lazy to look up this info, can you give me a hand here, Gma? I would LOVE to know what the actual demographics are.

 

My bro and SIL love Carnie and they do NOT fall into the under $50k/year category. And their youngest (of 3) is 17.

 

I, on the other hand, while I USED to make between $40k and $50k back in the early '00s, traveled RCI. And this past Feb when I was basically out of work and made about $30k last year, also cruised RCI. So I'm outta the demographic as well.

 

So I'd love to know! :)

[amybeth4]

Online forums and chat rooms are completely anonymous and anyone can be anything' date=' live anywhere, drive anything and tout how sensitive and rare they are.......without anyone challenging their high opinion of themselves.... With no way to check facts, it's better to take it all with a grain of salt....and don't believe anything you hear....or read.[/quote']

 

Which 100% explains the gdamn tip police on these boards, and worse, the MULTITUDE of posters who canNOT go without saying, "We always tip more than the recommended." It's almost at the point of happening when the thread has NOTHING to do with tipping!!!

 

-How's the weather in the Caribbean in January?

-Well, since we always tip above the recommended amount, it's pretty warm year-round.**

 

-Can I bring alcohol onto an RCI ship?

-Only if you tip an extra $10 in Portofino. Per person. You know, like we do.

 

(**okay I cracked myself up a little here...)

[relaxandenjoy]

Your demographics are WAAYYY off base.

 

Go on the internet and find the REAL information..the information is readily available....... Your "information" couldn't be more wrong....

 

I have to agree with G'ma. On my next Adventure cruise, I paid $669.00 per person for an interior cabin. Certainly not a price only the "wealthy" can afford. I am by no means wealthy!

 

My parents are the perfect "opposite" example of what's been talked about on this board. If you met them on the ship, you'd be sure they come from money. They dress well, have been on many cruises (I'm still recovering from them being on "Love and Marriage" the last cruise!), and have had experiences very few get to have. They are friendly and polite to everyone, and appreciate every single thing they have. You'd never guess that they lived in poverty for a good part of their 50 year marriage or that my Dad supported us 5 children as a truck driver! I'm so proud of them and all that they've come through that made them, and their children, stronger. I have no problem telling anyone that my Dad is a retired truck driver or that they are living it up in retirment due to strong work ethic and many sacrafices throughout the years.

[julia]

What an interesting thread!

 

As per my signature, we are cruise "ho's" (can I say that?!)... meaning, I will sail any line at any time. A pet peeve of mine are folks who proclaim to dislike Carnival when they've never even sailed them. How can you base an opinion on something you know NOTHING about?

 

As for the "money vs. class" discussion... the one thing my DH truly dislikes (in society in general) is what he calls the "breakdown conversation". (It's the "who are you, what do you do" questions that come right off the bat). He and I both will side-step these questions until we feel comfortable answering, or the conversation warrants it. People who feel a need to tell you just "who they are" usually are the one's asking in the first place....

[MrPete]

Mr Pete. Your going to have to explain that insult to me .

When someone puts me down for my opinion, I like to know what it is.

 

If I have to 'splain, it's obviously on its way to the moon. :eek::rolleyes:

 

Not even close to sure why you would think it was an insult. It was YOUR logic.