LGBT-FOD Confusion on NCL

[sjbdtz]

AGREED!

 

Do they have straight parades? Yes. the New York St. Patrick's Day parade, for one.....almost every other parade in the world, for another.

 

What is a gathering of straight people called? Friends of Jim? "a gathering" (there's this assumption that everyone is straight)

 

Are there straight cruises? Yes. All of them, except for the little oasis created by FOD, LGBT, Rainbow warrior meetings! :p (and Atlantis & RSVP)

 

I entirely agree with the sentiment. When I am at home or abroad I make friends or aquaintances with people for who there are - not who they sleep with. Is that not the non-judgemental attitude everyone wants?

 

See above, in red.

 

 

I work in an environment where I spend a lot of time on various university campuses, and frequently see little rainbow stickers which say "Positive Space", meaning....all are welcome here, and this person would be supportive.

 

Why is this needed? Because now that gender & racial & ability biases have been eradicated :rolleyes:, the only major remaining one is LGBT issues. Too much bashing goes on in the world, especially in environments where alcohol is served.

 

Knowing you're not alone on board can be comforting for some, and since many of those on board cruises are couples, it provides a social environment outside of gay bars, where gay couples might have a chance to actually meet & chat with each other.

 

It's not harming anyone....so why stop it? I'm not a Friend of Bill W, but I don't think THEY should stop meeting, either. In fact I'm not religious so I don't think that yielding to a higher power is beneficial at all....but I'm not against all 12-step programmes.

[soldham]

Then neither of you have to participate. Do what you want to do. Why is it your business and concern about the way the rest of choose to socialize?

 

Well there goes the civil and respectful discussion we were so proud of........:(

 

 

SJBDTZ - don't get me wrong I was not suggesting they be banned or anything....I think the discussion was more about whether, by choosing to isolate ourselves, we perpetuate distrust, misinformation, and general homophobia (I think this discussion has circled around Toronto's Boys Town several times over the years.) I personally (and I stress the personally) have had more success furthering an understanding and acceptance of homosexuality by immersing myself in the larger society whether at work, in my neighbourhood, or on vacation. That is not straight society - it is everyone society.

[CruisinMaterial]

I am with ya CrusinMaterial....hell even one night the Daily listed two of them...one at 6:15 and one at 8:30. The funny thing was it was near the end of the trip and everyone ended up showing at 7pm which was the usual time.

 

You have got to be kidding me. I know NCL is very gay friendly but forcing them to do two separate meetings is just rediculous. I don't flaunt my homosexuality but I do attend FOD / GLBT meetings onboard. If other passengers figure it out then that's fine by me. There's enough security cameras onboard NCLs ships that I don't give a rat's posterior if anyone sees me.

 

I am just amazed that people would go to that great of a length. I am happy NCL just offers them daily for us as a community. It's a great way to meet fellow family members onboard and know that there is people you can possibly disco with or hang out with. I use it as a great socialization tool and I don't want it gone because some people need to remain hidden or be PC. It's so stupid! :(

[soldham]

sorry for the double post - I had not finished.....

 

Well there goes the civil and respectful discussion we were so proud of........:(

 

SJBDTZ - don't get me wrong I was not suggesting they be banned or anything....I think the discussion was more about whether, by choosing to isolate ourselves, we perpetuate distrust, misinformation, and general homophobia (I think this discussion has circled around Toronto's Boys Town several times over the years.) I personally (and I stress the personally) have had more success furthering an understanding and acceptance of homosexuality by immersing myself in the larger society whether at work, in my neighbourhood, or on vacation. I don't think a cruise is a straight cruise simply because the vast majority are heterosexual - thems the facts - they say what? 10% of people are gay? It would make sense that a cruise, a parade, or any gathering of people would represent those numbers. And if I look around at my work or where I live that would seem just about right. It has never even crossed my mind that I live in a straight neighbourhood or work at a straight employer......

[BalconyGal]

Good question....maybe so we can all gather posts for our post count?:D

 

 

 

I have no clue, but I do know that i don't attend them. I will support and demonstrations, and political actions, but other than that.....Maybe it's because (at least in my home town) the "gay scene" is filled with petty queens who insist on causing drama. And there is one thing i hate worse than anything is a queens causing needless drama.

 

LOL to both!!!:D

[BalconyGal]

I think for me personally & my wife as well it's just nice to talk to people who potentially have more in common with us. I cannot tell you how many times my eyes have glazed over while listening to a bunch of women brag about their "genius" children. I don't have any kids, don't want any and don't want to hear about yours.

 

Of course, more and more LGBT are becoming parents (and no doubt have been since the beginning of time), but it seems easier to talk about different topics.

 

Don't flame me, it's just my humble opinion. And yes, I know I'm a selfish brat! :rolleyes:

 

And regarding the changing the world aspect of this conversation, I believe the only way we are going to change the world is through authenticity. We have to be who we are honestly, proudly and unapologetically. And that means to me doing what you want to do with whoever you want to do it. You don't want to go to FOD, ok. You want to go, ok. You want to call it Feather Boas and Tool Belt hour, ok! :)

[Clay Clayton]

You have got to be kidding me. I know NCL is very gay friendly but forcing them to do two separate meetings is just rediculous. I don't flaunt my homosexuality but I do attend FOD / GLBT meetings onboard. If other passengers figure it out then that's fine by me. There's enough security cameras onboard NCLs ships that I don't give a rat's posterior if anyone sees me.

 

I am just amazed that people would go to that great of a length. I am happy NCL just offers them daily for us as a community. It's a great way to meet fellow family members onboard and know that there is people you can possibly disco with or hang out with. I use it as a great socialization tool and I don't want it gone because some people need to remain hidden or be PC. It's so stupid! :(

 

no, no...I wasn't very clear, sorry about that...both of these were listed by the same name...I forget which term they used that day...but it was listed twice. My presumption was it was just a typo but I thought about it when you said you were glad they had one a day.

 

Sorry for the confusion

[bbenson]

....I think the discussion was more about whether, by choosing to isolate ourselves, we perpetuate distrust, misinformation, and general homophobia (I think this discussion has circled around Toronto's Boys Town several times over the years.) I personally (and I stress the personally) have had more success furthering an understanding and acceptance of homosexuality by immersing myself in the larger society whether at work, in my neighbourhood, or on vacation. That is not straight society - it is everyone society.

 

Ok, quick point... we aren't Isolating ourselves..... we are holding meetings with others who share similar interests but you don't have to be gay to go.... you just have to like gay people... That's not isolating, thats networking<G>.. and besides, there are 24 hours in day, now granted on a cruise you are sleeping 9 hours and eating 6 hours but, there are still 9 hours to fill up.... so whats wrong with taking an hour to visit with your LGBTQ family and supporters to socialize and what not?

 

See thats the thing, its not just LGBTQ people involved... its also our heterosexual friends and family.... they aren't being exluded, we aren't isolating ourselves, we're just changing the focus a little bit.

 

And I agree, I can't stand a drama queen causing drama for no good reason :rolleyes:....

[bbenson]

You want to call it Feather Boas and Tool Belt hour, ok! :)

 

LOL Do I have to choose one or can I have both?

[BalconyGal]

LOL Do I have to choose one or can I have both?

As long as you wear both!! :p

 

You made good points in your previous post! :)

[soldham]

Bbenson - that's a good perspective. However - if some proportion of gay people don't attend because they don't know what FOD/LGBT is what do you think the hetero crowd is going to react?

 

Ond OneStarTattoo - I was just saying to my partner last weekend that one of the best perks of being gay was absolutely NO pressure to have children. One can be entirely selfish with ones time and money and feel no societal guilt! :)

[bbenson]

Bbenson - that's a good perspective. However - if some proportion of gay people don't attend because they don't know what FOD/LGBT is what do you think the hetero crowd is going to react?

 

Ond OneStarTattoo - I was just saying to my partner last weekend that one of the best perks of being gay was absolutely NO pressure to have children. One can be entirely selfish with ones time and money and feel no societal guilt! :)

 

 

Ok and I mean this in the nicest way...if you don't know what LGBT stands for its time to turn in your gay card...seriously.... FOD I can understand not knowing, I myself didn't know it until the second or third cruise.

[CruisinMaterial]

no, no...I wasn't very clear, sorry about that...both of these were listed by the same name...I forget which term they used that day...but it was listed twice. My presumption was it was just a typo but I thought about it when you said you were glad they had one a day.

 

Sorry for the confusion

 

No worries! :D Funny that they would list it twice like that. True story though on the Celebrity Solstice sailing in 2009 they had a Friends of Dorothy gathering on the Atlantis Charter. That was funny. It was in a small venue too (Quasar I think) so that was even more funny because if the whole boat showed up... well no one would fit! :D

 

Can't wait for my next cruise in 4 weeks! The Spirit is getting ready to leave Boston in 18 minutes!!! :D

[BalconyGal]

No worries! :D Funny that they would list it twice like that. True story though on the Celebrity Solstice sailing in 2009 they had a Friends of Dorothy gathering on the Atlantis Charter. That was funny. It was in a small venue too (Quasar I think) so that was even more funny because if the whole boat showed up... well no one would fit! :D

 

Can't wait for my next cruise in 4 weeks! The Spirit is getting ready to leave Boston in 18 minutes!!! :D

That is funny!

[BalconyGal]

Soldham, I have to say the best cruise I ever went on was the RFamily cruise and yes, there were many many kids! But they were so well behaved. I have a theory that children of LGBT parents are better bahaved beause their parents had to really want to have them and in some cases had to try to become parents for years.

 

Anyway, the reason the cruise was so amazing is that parents and children of LGBT adults were there alongside couples with no kids, grandparents etc. It was amazing how welcoming and friendly everyone was. My wife & I (31 at the time) made friends with an 80 year old lady who was traveling with her gay son. It was so touching to see how much she adored and accepted ( I hate that term) him. So, back to the topic having a small venue even for an hour a day on a "mainstream" cruise maybe gives some people that total sense of belonging.

 

Anyone have another alternate name we could call the gathering?

[bbenson]

 

Anyone have another alternate name we could call the gathering?

 

So we don't leave anyone out and its easily understood, how about the:

 

LGBTQSO, Rainbow Pride, FOD, Gay, Homosexual (heterosexual friendly), Boas and Tool Belt Big Pink Power Hour??

 

I'm joking of course

[VibeGuy]

Another reason to retain the FOD/GLBT get-togethers...

 

We were sailing out of Glacier Bay during one last year, and down the stairs came a VERY cute Park Ranger in full uniform. He's based at the park HQ there at the mouth of the Bay, and said it's about his only contact with other gay dudes during the season.

 

I was drooling out both sides of my mouth when he arrived. ROWR. Long hair, totally votable as "Park Ranger most likely to disappear around 4:20", but looked gooooood in the uniform. I've wanted one of their belts and hatbands for some time - didn't happen that afternoon.

 

But, hey, Ranger Mountainrange? CALL ME.

[bbenson]

Another reason to retain the FOD/GLBT get-togethers...

 

We were sailing out of Glacier Bay during one last year, and down the stairs came a VERY cute Park Ranger in full uniform. He's based at the park HQ there at the mouth of the Bay, and said it's about his only contact with other gay dudes during the season.

 

I was drooling out both sides of my mouth when he arrived. ROWR. Long hair, totally votable as "Park Ranger most likely to disappear around 4:20", but looked gooooood in the uniform. I've wanted one of their belts and hatbands for some time - didn't happen that afternoon.

 

But, hey, Ranger Mountainrange? CALL ME.

 

Is that what you call a real Mountie?:D

[BalconyGal]

So we don't leave anyone out and its easily understood, how about the:

 

LGBTQSO, Rainbow Pride, FOD, Gay, Homosexual (heterosexual friendly), Boas and Tool Belt Big Pink Power Hour??

 

I'm joking of course

 

I like heterosexual friendly! :p

 

Another reason to retain the FOD/GLBT get-togethers...

 

We were sailing out of Glacier Bay during one last year, and down the stairs came a VERY cute Park Ranger in full uniform. He's based at the park HQ there at the mouth of the Bay, and said it's about his only contact with other gay dudes during the season.

 

I was drooling out both sides of my mouth when he arrived. ROWR. Long hair, totally votable as "Park Ranger most likely to disappear around 4:20", but looked gooooood in the uniform. I've wanted one of their belts and hatbands for some time - didn't happen that afternoon.

 

But, hey, Ranger Mountainrange? CALL ME.

 

Well, there's that too! :p

[cruisejames]

On our last cruise on Norwegian Dawn the FOD meeting was actually held in Dazzles nightclub.

 

We loved the venue as we never felt we were hidden away it was great to be able to socialise with GLBT people from all over the world. Of course we talked with other people in the various bars and lounges.

 

We did see one great benefit of the FOD meeting and that was on one of the evenings a couple of guys were dancing together and got some negative comments, the rest of the FOD group got up and danced with them and for the rest of the cruise we never heard any comments from the people who did it.

 

I do agree that for alot of people from the UK who are younger than me (i'm 31) would miss the term FOD on the daily news and the term LGBT would be easily reconised. Maybe we should just go for FOD/LGBT Gathering. ;)

[TravelingProf]

As a historian I fully understand the appeal of the term FOD as it keeps alive and in present memory (oxymoron?) the pre-Stonewall days and commemorates those who fought for our rights. As a woman on the other side of fifty, it also appeals to me. But dealing with college students also gives me another perspective and they do not get the term FOD so I can also understand (and in some ways agree) that we need a more contemporary term for these meetings; I think GBLT or Rainbow gatthering would probably suffice. As for the idea that having these meetings somehow undermines our demands for equality, I don't agree. I quite enjoy being around others who do not ask if my wife is my sister or try to 'save' me. It is a social space where people who have common interests can meet--and an environment within a larger one where one is not the minority.

[Tim-n-Rick]

I've mentioned this before on previous posts about FOD vs. GLBTQ. Some of us are taking these gatherings way too seriously! What's wrong with wanting to meet some fellow gay or lesbian passengers onboard? There are gatherings of people who play bridge, line dance, etc... and nobody assigns any political meaning to them. It's a simple solution, if you don't want people to know you are gay then don't attend.

 

I don't know about the FOD meetings you've attended but no world problems were solved at any of the one's I've been to. It's just some really nice people who enjoy cruising having a few cocktails together.

 

As for what to call it I used to really like the campyness of FOD but I see the value of calling them something more universally understood. Having said that, now that I've read Big Pink Power Hour I'm all for that! Reminds me of a variety show from the 70's. :p

[Kenito]

If we can't agree on whether to have a gathering or what to call it, imagine the cruise line suits having to deal with it.

 

:) I for one enjoy the gatherings, and have never heard anyone "demand" one. It is simply a social function, to which we may take advantage of, or not. It's our choice.

 

:) Personally, I prefer "GLBT Friends of Dorothy." It pays homage to the history of those who had to fight just to get the FOD recognized, and moves us a little bit forward historically.

 

:cool: Just because we are out of the closet does not mean everyone else is. If a guy/gal is not completely out and travelling with family or friends, but nevertheless wants to join us, we should welcome him/her and help them on their journey. Cruises bring a wide variety of ages... from a quiet elderly gentleman who still clings to old ideas, to a young girl who is just coming into her own. Welcome... don't judge.

 

:) In some ways, we are also proving Harvey Milk was right. He said, "if they know us, they won't hate us." Every time I go to a FOD gathering, or pose for photos with my boyfriend while everyone watches, or dine together with a group of all gay men... I am quietly letting my presence in the world be known.

 

:) I don't have to demand anything... I just am. But I got here on my schedule and in my own way. So I am patient with others, and patient with the corporate interests who want to welcome us simply by scheduling an "FOD gathering" even if some of us would prefer "Gay Happy Hour."

 

:) We are entitled to our opinions, but this should not bother anyone. There's no need for harsh sentiments or sharp words. It's a big world with a lot of people in it... and one thing we should have learned is a little tolerance.

[HLR]

Soldham...

 

No idea how to email you alone on this site...wanted to hear what you though about cruising on Costa. Don't want to talke the thread off topic...

 

I'm at Cowboychef @ Verizon.net

 

HLR

[keithm]

Then neither of you have to participate. Do what you want to do. Why is it your business and concern about the way the rest of choose to socialize?

Totally agree. Why do others feel they have the right to force their opinion on others?On Cunard they host FOD/Rainbow Pride groups. I figure Rainbow Pride should get it across to those unfamilar with FOD. In the past 6 years of cruising on Cunard only 1(2004) was the meeting hosted. That host was one of the strangest folk I've ever met. Chech some of the FOD threads for my story. The events are either in the Boardroom or Commodore Club. It's fun just showing up & seeing potential new friends. I'd say only about 25% of GLBT we "see" on board may actually attend a meeting.