Required vs Recommended

[jackdiamond]

Their code is not ambiguous. They have a policy, they list what is acceptable. They may be more ambiguous in enforcing it and that's their choice and for all we know, flexibility is part of their policy. They probably feel they negative issues it creates by being fashion police is not worth it. They have relaxed formal nights to include sport coats. Their policy does not need any clarification. They have intentionally left it as worded for their own reasons. I would take a reasonable guess and say one of those reasons is to appeal to a broader audience. Funny that only those who want everyone to dress formal seem to be the ones wanting 'clarification' ;)

 

I see no confusion with what they list on their website.

http://www.celebritycruises.com/footer/faqResults.do?faqSubjectName=Dress+Code&faqId=478&faqSubjectId=55

Wrong. They have not relaxed formal nights to include sport coats. A dinner jacket is not a sport coat.

[NnJ2010]

Wrong. They have not relaxed formal nights to include sport coats. A dinner jacket is not a sport coat.

 

Oops sorry. You are correct. I read that wrong! They haven't relaxed the written policy just the enforcement of it. Which is their choice and part of their policy. Anyone not dressing accordingly runs the risk of not being allowed to dine in the mdr. Which is up to that individual and the celebrity host at the door. No one else's concern, really. So everything else that I've stated still sends with the correction of relaxing the written policy.

[Petoonya]

Their code is not ambiguous. They have a policy, they list what is acceptable. They may be more ambiguous in enforcing it and that's their choice and for all we know, flexibility is part of their policy. They probably feel they negative issues it creates by being fashion police is not worth it. They have relaxed formal nights to include sport coats. Their policy does not need any clarification. They have intentionally left it as worded for their own reasons. I would take a reasonable guess and say one of those reasons is to appeal to a broader audience. Funny that only those who want everyone to dress formal seem to be the ones wanting 'clarification' ;)

 

I see no confusion with what they list on their website.

http://www.celebritycruises.com/footer/faqResults.do?faqSubjectName=Dress+Code&faqId=478&faqSubjectId=55

 

Admirably and beautifully said NnJ2010. :)

[excitedofharpenden]

My experience when on Celebrity (and I have a few cruises with them under my belt) is all this debate here about the dress code, what it is and if it is enforced is unnecessary because when you are actually on the ship and in the dining room most people abide by what is asked and look great. The very small percentage who don't are in the minority and stick out like a sore thumb. Required or requested it's all nonsense really.

 

Phil

[jackdiamond]

Phil, you are correct. Most folks, onboard, do follow the code. Remember that only about 8% of cruisers participate in CC; and, some of those folks rarely cruise.

[Bridge Maven]

Oops sorry. You are correct. I read that wrong! They haven't relaxed the written policy just the enforcement of it. Which is their choice and part of their policy. Anyone not dressing accordingly runs the risk of not being allowed to dine in the mdr. Which is up to that individual and the celebrity host at the door. No one else's concern, really. So everything else that I've stated still sends with the correction of relaxing the written policy.

 

NnJ2010 - and that was the point of my original post. The wording from that other cruise line made it clear that they expected their guests to follow the dress code, but since it was not mandatory a person who deviated from it slightly would not be denied access to the dining room. In spite of all the silly posts that imply that a person who doesn't follow a dress code is a slob, most people who don't follow the dress code perfectly "fit in".

 

Since Celebrity is so inconsistent with their enforcement of a dress code, it creates confusion. Therefore, I agree with the poster who stated that Celebrity should either be consistent about their enforcement of the dress code, or eliminate it. In reality, the implied dress code is more meaningful than the actual one. So if a number of passengers wear sports jackets in the main dining room, even though they are not in the dress code, other people will wear them, as well.

[tunaman2011]

Greetings

 

Dress code discussions seem to be a recurring theme on these boards. There must be a reason for all the debate. I will opine my nickel's worth (inflation had driven up the cost of everything :)).

 

The Celebrity dress code lacks specificity. The dress code right from the web site states:

 

Examples of 'Smart Casual and Above' and "Formal' attire include:

 

Formal

 

Ladies: Cocktail dress, gown or dressy pantsuit

Gentlemen: Tuxedo, suit or dinner jacket with slacks.

 

They do not lay out requirements but instead cite examples. Nowhere does it say this is an all inclusive list. Some may believe the above is all that is allowed, but that not codified in the above rule.

 

This may seem a technicality to some, but often what is not written is as important as what is written.

 

If the above is the only allowable dress on formal nights, then kilts would not be allowed and neither would most military dress uniforms.

 

Celebrity could certainly set the requirements in stone but I believe Celebrity uses this wording to give them a certain leeway. In giving themself leeway, they cause these never ending discussions about dress codes.

 

Just one man's opinion.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

[Ma Bell]

NnJ2010 - and that was the point of my original post. The wording from that other cruise line made it clear that they expected their guests to follow the dress code, but since it was not mandatory a person who deviated from it slightly would not be denied access to the dining room. In spite of all the silly posts that imply that a person who doesn't follow a dress code is a slob, most people who don't follow the dress code perfectly "fit in".

 

Since Celebrity is so inconsistent with their enforcement of a dress code, it creates confusion. Therefore, I agree with the poster who stated that Celebrity should either be consistent about their enforcement of the dress code, or eliminate it. In reality, the implied dress code is more meaningful than the actual one. So if a number of passengers wear sports jackets in the main dining room, even though they are not in the dress code, other people will wear them, as well.

 

In reality, people who sail on Celebrity ships know that a great majority of the people do abide by the dress codes as written. There are so many options available for those who don't wish to participate in Formal Night in the main dining room that most people just choose another option. Of course there will always be a few who don't, but they are a distinct minority. My suggestion is just take a Celebrity cruise and see for yourself.

 

Outside of the main dining room, many still wear formal wear to the specialty restaurants, even though smart casual is all that is necessary. There's room for everyone to wear what they like...just choose the venue that fits.

[Ma Bell]

Greetings

 

Dress code discussions seem to be a recurring theme on these boards. There must be a reason for all the debate. I will opine my nickel's worth (inflation had driven up the cost of everything :)).

 

The Celebrity dress code lacks specificity. The dress code right from the web site states:

 

Examples of 'Smart Casual and Above' and "Formal' attire include:

 

Formal

 

Ladies: Cocktail dress, gown or dressy pantsuit

Gentlemen: Tuxedo, suit or dinner jacket with slacks.

 

They do not lay out requirements but instead cite examples. Nowhere does it say this is an all inclusive list. Some may believe the above is all that is allowed, but that not codified in the above rule.

 

This may seem a technicality to some, but often what is not written is as important as what is written.

 

If the above is the only allowable dress on formal nights, then kilts would not be allowed and neither would most military dress uniforms.

 

Celebrity could certainly set the requirements in stone but I believe Celebrity uses this wording to give them a certain leeway. In giving themself leeway, they cause these never ending discussions about dress codes.

 

Just one man's opinion.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

 

I think Celebrity probably assumes that most know what formal wear is, including kilts, dress uniforms and other country's formal wear standard. They give examples for those few who really may not know. Most adults actually do understand what the word formal means. The only discussion here is not what Celebrity considers formal but "what can I get away with".

 

Anyone can try to wear whatever they wish. One thing I know for sure is that Celebrity is not interested in having their employees tackle people at the door, so they give the information and hope that most of their customers are polite enough to comply. I'm sure they don't think they need to threaten to throw them in the brig to get the message across. The thing that I find disingenuous is the attitude that if we see one person get away with something that means it's OK for everyone.

 

I personally don't care what anyone wears, that's up to them, but they just need to take responsibility for their choices and stop trying to convince others that it's OK. I don't understand why someone who doesn't care enough to do as requested would care about justifying it here.:confused:

[tunaman2011]

I think Celebrity probably assumes that most know what formal wear is, including kilts, dress uniforms and other country's formal wear standard. They give examples for those few who really may not know. Most adults actually do understand what the word formal means. The only discussion here is not what Celebrity considers formal but "what can I get away with".

 

Anyone can try to wear whatever they wish. One thing I know for sure is that Celebrity is not interested in having their employees tackle people at the door, so they give the information and hope that most of their customers are polite enough to comply. I'm sure they don't think they need to threaten to throw them in the brig to get the message across. The thing that I find disingenuous is the attitude that if we see one person get away with something that means it's OK for everyone.

 

I personally don't care what anyone wears, that's up to them, but they just need to take responsibility for their choices and stop trying to convince others that it's OK. I don't understand why someone who doesn't care enough to do as requested would care about justifying it here.:confused:

 

Greetings

 

I am sorry, but this is where we disagree. I think people are not trying to determine what they can get away with but what is allowable. That's a big difference. Formal means different things across the US and even more so when you throw in international passengers.

 

If 100 people go to the MDR in a sportjacket or blazer and none are turned away, then I would say that sportjackets and blazers are considered allowable. How can anyone reason that they are not? The dress code examples as written may not include these, but if diners are never turned away then by simple logic, they are allowed.

 

The same would hold true for whatever fashion is granted entry into the MDR. If you are assured 100% entry if dressed in a certain manner, it must be an allowable form of dress.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

[Ma Bell]

Greetings

 

I am sorry, but this is where we disagree. I think people are not trying to determine what they can get away with but what is allowable. That's a big difference. Formal means different things across the US and even more so when you throw in international passengers.

 

If 100 people go to the MDR in a sportjacket or blazer and none are turned away, then I would say that sportjackets and blazers are considered allowable. How can anyone reason that they are not? The dress code examples as written may not include these, but if diners are never turned away then by simple logic, they are allowed.

 

The same would hold true for whatever fashion is granted entry into the MDR. If you are assured 100% entry if dressed in a certain manner, it must be an allowable form of dress.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

 

If all they are just trying to find out what is allowable, why would they ever come here? They would just read the dress code and know. If they come here they are obviously looking for someone, who has nothing to do with the dress code, to tell them it's OK. As I said, they are not going to be wrestled to the ground if they are dressed in sport coats....but sport coats are certainly not formal wear by anyone's definition, regardless of where you are from and I'm sure most people know that. If they want to change the code and call it dress up night, that would be a different thing, but coming here and getting that kind of information is most certainly seeing what they can get away with.

 

If they call the cruise line, they will not be told that sport coats or shirt and tie only are part of the formal dress code. Why don't they ask the people who wrote the code if they want to know what it is? It's simply because they don't like the answer that is obvious so they come here looking for one they like better. That is simple logic.

 

Semantics have nothing to do with it.

[tunaman2011]

If all they are just trying to find out what is allowable, why would they ever come here? They would just read the dress code and know. If they come here they are obviously looking for someone, who has nothing to do with the dress code, to tell them it's OK. As I said, they are not going to be wrestled to the ground if they are dressed in sport coats....but sport coats are certainly not formal wear by anyone's definition, regardless of where you are from and I'm sure most people know that. If they want to change the code and call it dress up night, that would be a different thing, but coming here and getting that kind of information is most certainly seeing what they can get away with.

 

If they call the cruise line, they will not be told that sport coats or shirt and tie only are part of the formal dress code. Why don't they ask the people who wrote the code if they want to know what it is? It's simply because they don't like the answer that is obvious so they come here looking for one they like better. That is simple logic.

 

Semantics have nothing to do with it.

 

Greetings

 

Well I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. You think the code is clear, I think it is largely unsettled. Since it is so clear, I guess we will never see another dress code thread.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

[Ma Bell]

Tom,

 

We can certainly agree to disagree.

 

Personally, I think most of the people who come to these boards to report that they have seen an exception to Celebrity's dress code while on board are either very new Celebrity cruisers or have been on one cruise and are now experts on what goes on while on board. Most of the posters that I know who are very regular cruisers with Celebrity will certainly admit to seeing someone admitted to the dining room when they don't follow the dress codes, also report that a very great majority of passengers do comply with and understand what Celebrity requests. I see people dressed in smart casual and very casual clothing on Formal Nights, just not usually in the main dining room.

 

As we have all said many times, there are many options for this so coming to the main dining room isn't even necessary. There are only a couple of these evenings on board each cruise so it really would be kind of impolite to show up knowing one isn't dressed appropriately. It's really not nice to put the staff in the position of having to say something that should be known. I really think most passengers are nice people who either comply or choose another venue. I can only speak from my experience and consider the experience of the others who choose to post here.

[Peteymil]

Greetings

 

I am sorry, but this is where we disagree. I think people are not trying to determine what they can get away with but what is allowable. That's a big difference. Formal means different things across the US and even more so when you throw in international passengers.

 

If 100 people go to the MDR in a sportjacket or blazer and none are turned away, then I would say that sportjackets and blazers are considered allowable. How can anyone reason that they are not? The dress code examples as written may not include these, but if diners are never turned away then by simple logic, they are allowed.

 

The same would hold true for whatever fashion is granted entry into the MDR. If you are assured 100% entry if dressed in a certain manner, it must be an allowable form of dress.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

 

I agree with you totally.

[excitedofharpenden]

Since Celebrity is so inconsistent with their enforcement of a dress code, it creates confusion. Therefore, I agree with the poster who stated that Celebrity should either be consistent about their enforcement of the dress code, or eliminate it. In reality, the implied dress code is more meaningful than the actual one. So if a number of passengers wear sports jackets in the main dining room, even though they are not in the dress code, other people will wear them, as well.

Actually, when you get on the ship there doesn't seem to be much confusion and for the most part people comply. Why should this so called lack of consistency require the dress code to be eliminated altogether? Seems unnecessary for the small minority to change things for the majority. It's made into a much bigger thing here than what is actually seen onboard for the most part. You haven't been on Celebrity for a few years. Go on one of their cruises, let us know what you saw and tell me if I am wrong. Otherwise your "observations" really have no merit.

 

Phil

[WELSH WIZARDS]

It's acctually really simple.

 

Celebrity is having a " formal night. "

 

If people don't dress up.. what sort of formal occasion is it. ?

 

Not dressing up formally is like going to a fancy dress party in every day clothes, or a pyjama party in your suit. :rolleyes:

[David Owl]

On our recent Iceland/Norway trip I would say that almost everyone dressed in DJ's or dark suits on formal nights. I was in Blu and as far as I could see all diners complied with the code even though the restaurant was designated as Smart Casual every night.

 

I saw one or two people around the ship who didn't dress up and they really loooked out of place.

[gkny]

Have a look at these recent threads to get you started. They are all over the place on this board. Lots of opinions, but at the end of the day and depending upon who is on the ship and whether the dress requirements are enforced you may or may not be let in:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1649187&highlight=formal+nights

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1581100&highlight=formal+nights

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1658904&highlight=formal+nights

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1655926&highlight=formal+nights

 

Phil

 

I just noticed that the OP to this thread started one of those quoted above that was eventually locked.

Thank you Phil

[excitedofharpenden]

It's acctually really simple.

 

Celebrity is having a " formal night. "

 

If people don't dress up.. what sort of formal occasion is it. ?

 

Not dressing up formally is like going to a fancy dress party in every day clothes, or a pyjama party in your suit. :rolleyes:

I agree, Jennie and you know having spent plenty of days on Celebrity that when you get on the ship it is a non-issue and those that don't comply look very out of place.

 

Phil

[tally10]

Greetings

 

Well I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. You think the code is clear, I think it is largely unsettled. Since it is so clear, I guess we will never see another dress code thread.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

 

I totally agree with you, also. What is posted on these boards is very different than what we have experienced on Celebrity ships.

[Ma Bell]

I totally agree with you, also. What is posted on these boards is very different than what we have experienced on Celebrity ships.

 

You have listed your experience on Celebrity ships. 2005, 2006 and 2007 there was never a question about people not complying with the dress code. It was before S-Class ships, formal was throughout the ship for the evening, the only specialty restaurants were even more formal than the MDR. There were no options except the buffet and your cabin.

 

You have one cruise on Celebrity since then.

[Ma Bell]

The list is right there in the signature for all to see. Maybe you have it turned off.

[Can'tstopcruising]

The way I see it, Celebrity is trying to satisfy all customers. Or most! Those who want to dress truly formally, will do so. Those who don't, most likely will dress nicely, but not formally (Sport coat or blazer & tie). Those who want to dress in pants & top, either will be offered a jacket or not, allowed in or not.

I doubt that many would arrive at the MDR in sweats, shorts, tank tops, whatever. In all of our cruises, only once did I notice some seniors (i.e. older than I am, lol) in jogging outfits. They did look out of place. But they ate in the MDR and they didn't look unhappy.

 

Ironically, as someone else pointed out on one of these threads, the issue always concerns men's attire. Women Can get away with many more variations!

[tally10]

You have listed your experience on Celebrity ships. 2005, 2006 and 2007 there was never a question about people not complying with the dress code. It was before S-Class ships, formal was throughout the ship for the evening, the only specialty restaurants were even more formal than the MDR. There were no options except the buffet and your cabin.

 

You have one cruise on Celebrity since then.

 

The outfits I wore, sport coat and tie and dress slacks, have been worn on each and every Celebrity cruise. Nothing was said, nor was I stopped. I was warmly welcomed in that attire on formal nights. This is the same old argument ad nauseum. People are entitled to their opinions and interpretations of the dress code. It is up to CELEBRITY to enforce it.

[teajak]

The outfits I wore, sport coat and tie and dress slacks, have been worn on each and every Celebrity cruise. Nothing was said, nor was I stopped. I was warmly welcomed in that attire on formal nights. This is the same old argument ad nauseum. People are entitled to their opinions and interpretations of the dress code. It is up to CELEBRITY to enforce it.

Currently Celebrity does enforce it, in a nice way.Very glad they do.