FCD's - New Terms Begin on Friday

[sapper1]

I'm the same way. Nothing ever gets booked unless I can afford it. Same goes for my credit cards. I just use them to keep my money in the bank a little longer.

 

I sure hope that HAL does give better pricing to people that book well in advance. It gets very tiresome when HAL practically gives cruises away at the end and then wonders why these people are spending nothing on board. What do they expect?

 

We like to run everything under the sun through a credit card to get those points.:D:D Love the points. However, it is essential to pay in full every month or they become very expensive points. They should more properly be called, and used as, convenience cards.

As you say, you get to keep your money in the bank a month longer.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

I apologize if I came off wrong I am certainly not accusing anyone here but I see it frequently and not just HAL but Princess too. I have been told this is a growing thing with HAL. The economy had hurt many but those who always had the means still want what they have had and they feel if they have something to look forward to they can make it happen. It is a feel good thing saying I have a 30 day voyage booked on a Dam Ship. I have even seen this in Roll Calls, the number of people who come back to say they are canceling is much higher and we know many just do not come back into the Roll Call at all. Sadly you would be shocked the number of cancellations that HAL processes and has to move the Future Cruise Deposit to another sailing farther away and or back to the Mariner number.

 

I believe that HAL hopes that this will help to eliminate this in the Future but it will be a few years before the pattern totally goes away. In the mean time this will basically help to prevent this on new bookings on board.

In doing this it will help HAL to see the REAL Early bookings. Because of the low priced Future Cruise Deposits they were not really getting a true number of cabins that will actually stay with that voyage. They are currently doing a hard look at pricing for Early Mariner Bookings. Other Lines offer a much better price point for that Early Booking like Celebrity and NCL even RCI or CCL with Early Saver. In the past HAL claimed they had their "Early Advantage" BTW that is what they are calling it now but we all know in many cases it was not. HAL is looking to make changes to get away from many waiting for the FLASH Sales. This unfortunately is not going to happen over night and the wheels have always moved a bit slow with HAL :D

[sail7seas]

Lisa,

Are you saying HAL has far more cancellations of those early bookings than Celebrity and Princess? Those are the cruise lines I consider the closest competition to HAL.

 

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Lisa,

Are you saying HAL has far more cancellations of those early bookings than Celebrity and Princess? Those are the cruise lines I consider the closest competition to HAL.

 

Yes I believe Celebrity has fewer cancellations but not really Princess. Princess has the same problem as HAL with those booking a cruise with their FCD then canceling and moving it to a date further out. (Remember HAL copied Princess's Future Cruise Deposit program) I have not heard anything definitely but hearing that Princess is also making changes like HAL's they may have already but because of HAL being the line I specialize in I tend to keep a closer eye on the pulse there ;)

With lines such as Celebrity and NCL Suites and even Princess Suites few people cancel because those prices start out much lower and keep going up in price based on supply and demand. Princess mainly for the fact they have far fewer Suites compared to HAL when looking at Vista and Signature Class. If you book over a year out with Celebrity, Princess, and NCL Suites then take a look at your sailing right before Final in most cases the category in a Suite is gone or if there is a cabin remaining the price has doubled. Most people figure they better keep what they have unless they were just dreaming about going on the cruise. Granted there are true situations where people must cancel but I believe that number is small in comparison.

[Big Dawg CC]

Just not sure I understand how a heftier deposit, especially one that may ultimately be refundable back to your credit card, will create any greater assurances for HAL that the booking is "real." Sure, it is more money, but, in the end, no more "skin in the game," if it is fully refundable.

[sail7seas]

Yes I believe Celebrity has fewer cancellations but not really Princess. Princess has the same problem as HAL with those booking a cruise with their FCD then canceling and moving it to a date further out. (Remember HAL copied Princess's Future Cruise Deposit program) I have not heard anything definitely but hearing that Princess is also making changes like HAL's they may have already but because of HAL being the line I specialize in I tend to keep a closer eye on the pulse there ;)

 

With lines such as Celebrity and NCL Suites and even Princess Suites few people cancel because those prices start out much lower and keep going up in price based on supply and demand. Princess mainly for the fact they have far fewer Suites compared to HAL when looking at Vista and Signature Class. If you book over a year out with Celebrity, Princess, and NCL Suites then take a look at your sailing right before Final in most cases the category in a Suite is gone or if there is a cabin remaining the price has doubled. Most people figure they better keep what they have unless they were just dreaming about going on the cruise. Granted there are true situations where people must cancel but I believe that number is small in comparison.

 

Really interesting, Lisa. Thanks for the good conversation.

 

One thing I wonder about though.

If HAL suites are selling so well (which is sometimes the case but not always, of course), how are there so many upsells and upgrades? I understand that does not happen on all ships/all cruises but enough of the time to make me ask.

 

We book our suites very early most of the time and I do look to see what happens to the price in the months after we book and without question, I have seen sometimes the price goes up. But I have also seen lots of times when there are plenty of empty suites..... just waiting for free/low charge upsell/upgrade.

 

I think HAL may pare off a small percentage of 'dreamers' by raising the amount of the deposit but it will be interesting to see just how many get a dose of reality if the deposit goes up considerably.

 

Thanks for continuing the chat. I think it interesting.

 

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Really interesting, Lisa. Thanks for the good conversation.

 

One thing I wonder about though.

If HAL suites are selling so well (which is sometimes the case but not always, of course), how are there so many upsells and upgrades? I understand that does not happen on all ships/all cruises but enough of the time to make me ask.

 

We book our suites very early most of the time and I do look to see what happens to the price in the months after we book and without question, I have seen sometimes the price goes up. But I have also seen lots of times when there are plenty of empty suites..... just waiting for free/low charge upsell/upgrade.

 

I think HAL may pare off a small percentage of 'dreamers' by raising the amount of the deposit but it will be interesting to see just how many get a dose of reality if the deposit goes up considerably.

 

Thanks for continuing the chat. I think it interesting.

 

Sail the big thing I have noticed is that HAL's Suites are NOT selling well. Granted on a few sailings of the S and R Class ships there may be limited availability but in recent years that is becoming rare there are always upsells for single voyages (not Collectors Series). For Signature and Vista Class Ships the numbers of available Suites are actually quite high of cabins not selling.

Where one does not see this is if you are booked in a Collectors Series or a similar B2B2B voyage. The key to remember is if you are booked in a Collectors Series in order for HAL to offer an Up Sell there must be one cabin they can offer you that is available for both/all voyages/segments. But for those looking at Single Voyages the percentage is actually quite large for Suites not selling which is why HAL makes these Up Sell offers. HAL truly is the only cruise line that does this. It is extremely Rare for an Up Sell offer with other lines.

[Krazy Kruizers]

Just not sure I understand how a heftier deposit, especially one that may ultimately be refundable back to your credit card, will create any greater assurances for HAL that the booking is "real." Sure, it is more money, but, in the end, no more "skin in the game," if it is fully refundable.

 

Even though Interest rates are not high -- HAL will be collecting those pennies on your money instead of you.

And they are counting on more people booking longer cruises -- higher deposits -- more pennies for them. And those pennies will mount up.

[Krazy Kruizers]

We like to run everything under the sun through a credit card to get those points.:D:D Love the points. However, it is essential to pay in full every month or they become very expensive points. They should more properly be called, and used as, convenience cards.

As you say, you get to keep your money in the bank a month longer.

 

Oh yes -- we love those points as well. Rarely do we have to pay for a hotel room.

[chloes nana]

Sail the big thing I have noticed is that HAL's Suites are NOT selling well. Granted on a few sailings of the S and R Class ships there may be limited availability but in recent years that is becoming rare there are always upsells for single voyages (not Collectors Series). For Signature and Vista Class Ships the numbers of available Suites are actually quite high of cabins not selling.

Where one does not see this is if you are booked in a Collectors Series or a similar B2B2B voyage. The key to remember is if you are booked in a Collectors Series in order for HAL to offer an Up Sell there must be one cabin they can offer you that is available for both/all voyages/segments. But for those looking at Single Voyages the percentage is actually quite large for Suites not selling which is why HAL makes these Up Sell offers. HAL truly is the only cruise line that does this. It is extremely Rare for an Up Sell offer with other lines.

maybe customers/travelers are becoming more saavy and realizing their monies can be better spent elsewhere, than on a cabin they spend very little time in, and the Neptune is for so very few people it is really not worth the expense to alot of travelers. It might be alright if you just cruise and never get off the ship much, then it is "living quarters" where as to most of us, it is just a cabin. ;) JMO

[sail7seas]

maybe customers/travelers are becoming more saavy and realizing their monies can be better spent elsewhere, than on a cabin they spend very little time in, and the Neptune is for so very few people it is really not worth the expense to alot of travelers. It might be alright if you just cruise and never get off the ship much, then it is "living quarters" where as to most of us, it is just a cabin. ;) JMO

 

 

Very good point and I'm sure applies to many people.

 

I truly do use our cabin a lot and our veranda. Some ports we don't even leave the ship and often when we do go ashore, particularly in the Caribbean, it isn't always for a long time.

 

We make use of our cabin probably more than some other folks.

 

[Big Dawg CC]

Even though Interest rates are not high -- HAL will be collecting those pennies on your money instead of you.

 

And they are counting on more people booking longer cruises -- higher deposits -- more pennies for them. And those pennies will mount up.

 

I do get that, KK. I guess my point is that HAL is not in the business of making interest on our money. It is in the business of selling cabins and related products and services. According to Lisa, a major impetus for this new program is to create more certainty for HAL that cruises booked with the new FCDs will not be cancelled. Perhaps that will ring true for the longer cruises (perhaps though only for those with limited funds), but suspect it will not with the shorter ones, which, after all, are arguably the bulk of HAL's business.

[HALFans]

Well, for us, what I KNOW is we want to do a Trans-Atlantic soon. But what will PROBABLY happen is our next cruise is going to be another 7 day, which I hate. LOL.

 

So I'll buy 2 $100 FCCs and wait for the policy to fall out where it may.

 

I don't really care about the OBC. I care about the ability to scrimp and save until final payment is due... and with THAT said, the last thing I want to do on vacation... where I'm doing my best to spend every cent I can enjoying myself, is to spend an exorbitant amount reserving my next cruise.

 

Darn-it, when I'm on vacation if I have extra money I WANT TO SPEND IT NOW, NOW, NOW! (not give it to HAL for some other cruise - I want to spend it on THIS cruise.)

 

(sorry for the repetition... but for me it's an important message to send.)

[Typhoon1]

Book a cruise. Just book elsewhere.

[chloes nana]

Book a cruise. Just book elsewhere.

:confused:

[bcd2010]

HAL will (and probably expects to) lose some of us with this "strategy". For those who don't sail all that frequently, larger deposits have no appeal (the OBC is a nice but minor bonus).

 

We have been happy we could put out $100 as a deposit on a future unspecified cruise, then take our time in deciding what the next cruise will be. When we find it, we book it and haven't had to pay further until final payment date. Because of our FCDs, the first place we look is HAL - and, as it's turned out every time, the last place we look is HAL because we find an appealing itinerary there.

 

Our preference has been for longer cruises - simply don't want to cruise less than 2 weeks at a time. So under this new system, our deposits will increase, only we will not pay for them - too much too far in advance. As a result, HAL will not be the first place we look - this new "strategy" frees us up to look at other cruise lines first. Now when we get emails from other cruise lines, we will examine them more closely rather than first checking to see if HAL has something comparable.

 

We are each holding FCDs bought at a time when the policy as stated in the letter of receipt was that no further payment would be due until final payment date. If they try to force us into paying more (because we will be looking at a longer cruise, e.g., it would have been VOV next year if they hadn't switched ships to the Veendam), I am prepared to blow off the $100 I'm out already.

 

My traveling companion would rather we use it for a 1-week Caribbean cruise - no HAL shore excursions, few onboard expenses (only HSC) because we will bring our own soda with us. (Note: on our last cruise, onboard spending got us 12 bonus credits, so we normally spend a nice amount.)

 

So how smart is that "strategy"? (Yes, I realize that, even though we are 3* mariners with 5 HAL cruises each, we're no great loss.)

[kazu]

HAL will (and probably expects to) lose some of us with this "strategy". For those who don't sail all that frequently, larger deposits have no appeal (the OBC is a nice but minor bonus).

 

We have been happy we could put out $100 as a deposit on a future unspecified cruise, then take our time in deciding what the next cruise will be. When we find it, we book it and haven't had to pay further until final payment date. Because of our FCDs, the first place we look is HAL - and, as it's turned out every time, the last place we look is HAL because we find an appealing itinerary there.

 

Our preference has been for longer cruises - simply don't want to cruise less than 2 weeks at a time. So under this new system, our deposits will increase, only we will not pay for them - too much too far in advance. As a result, HAL will not be the first place we look - this new "strategy" frees us up to look at other cruise lines first. Now when we get emails from other cruise lines, we will examine them more closely rather than first checking to see if HAL has something comparable.

 

We are each holding FCDs bought at a time when the policy as stated in the letter of receipt was that no further payment would be due until final payment date. If they try to force us into paying more (because we will be looking at a longer cruise, e.g., it would have been VOV next year if they hadn't switched ships to the Veendam), I am prepared to blow off the $100 I'm out already.

 

My traveling companion would rather we use it for a 1-week Caribbean cruise - no HAL shore excursions, few onboard expenses (only HSC) because we will bring our own soda with us. (Note: on our last cruise, onboard spending got us 12 bonus credits, so we normally spend a nice amount.)

 

So how smart is that "strategy"? (Yes, I realize that, even though we are 3* mariners with 5 HAL cruises each, we're no great loss.)

 

I typically only do longer cruises too - 20 days - this will be our first 31 day. We do sneak in a 10 day here and there if we want to get away in the winter.

 

For us, HAL (Prinsendam) has offered perfect itiineraries that suit us both (some ports for DH and some for me). IF this strategy means early bookings save you money then we will be happy campers. I am tired of booking a long way out and then seeing people get 'deals' by hopping on late.

 

everyone is a loss to any line. Myself, I'm going to wait to see how this 'plays' out. If you can top up your FCD it isn't the end of the world - at least not to us. Ideally, if HAL prices bookings well early, it will be worthwhile to book early and the larger deposit will be justified IMO:)

 

Everyone is going to look at it differently - but until we know all the ins and outs we probably shouldn't jump the gun;) JMVHO

[LAFFNVEGAS]

HAL will (and probably expects to) lose some of us with this "strategy". For those who don't sail all that frequently, larger deposits have no appeal (the OBC is a nice but minor bonus).

 

We have been happy we could put out $100 as a deposit on a future unspecified cruise, then take our time in deciding what the next cruise will be. When we find it, we book it and haven't had to pay further until final payment date. Because of our FCDs, the first place we look is HAL - and, as it's turned out every time, the last place we look is HAL because we find an appealing itinerary there.

 

Our preference has been for longer cruises - simply don't want to cruise less than 2 weeks at a time. So under this new system, our deposits will increase, only we will not pay for them - too much too far in advance. As a result, HAL will not be the first place we look - this new "strategy" frees us up to look at other cruise lines first. Now when we get emails from other cruise lines, we will examine them more closely rather than first checking to see if HAL has something comparable.

 

We are each holding FCDs bought at a time when the policy as stated in the letter of receipt was that no further payment would be due until final payment date. If they try to force us into paying more (because we will be looking at a longer cruise, e.g., it would have been VOV next year if they hadn't switched ships to the Veendam), I am prepared to blow off the $100 I'm out already.

 

My traveling companion would rather we use it for a 1-week Caribbean cruise - no HAL shore excursions, few onboard expenses (only HSC) because we will bring our own soda with us. (Note: on our last cruise, onboard spending got us 12 bonus credits, so we normally spend a nice amount.)

 

So how smart is that "strategy"? (Yes, I realize that, even though we are 3* mariners with 5 HAL cruises each, we're no great loss.)

While I understand what you are saying, it also makes no sense. Who do you think you can book with that will allow you less money for a deposit that is for a longer cruise :confused: If you have not sailed with another cruise line recently you will be subject to the other's deposits of which many are as high as HAL or higher. Many do not offer Collectors voyages instead you have to do B2B2B and pay a deposit for each segment. Doing it this way with say Celebrity comes out to be a bit more in many cases for deposits. You can still purchase the $100 Future Cruise Deposit and HAL will just allow you to pay a bit more when booking a longer cruise. This is still a big savings over what HAL normally charges for the deposit. There is not another cruise line out there that is going to allow you to place just a $100 down PP for a 20+ day cruise.

[bcd2010]

While I understand what you are saying, it also makes no sense. Who do you think you can book with that will allow you less money for a deposit that is for a longer cruise :confused: If you have not sailed with another cruise line recently you will be subject to the other's deposits of which many are as high as HAL or higher. Many do not offer Collectors voyages instead you have to do B2B2B and pay a deposit for each segment. Doing it this way with say Celebrity comes out to be a bit more in many cases for deposits. You can still purchase the $100 Future Cruise Deposit and HAL will just allow you to pay a bit more when booking a longer cruise. This is still a big savings over what HAL normally charges for the deposit. There is not another cruise line out there that is going to allow you to place just a $100 down PP for a 20+ day cruise.

 

Did you ever hear the saying: "it's the principle"? The highest ethical principle is for all parties to do what they agreed to do. I kept my end of the agreement and, foolish as you may think a principled person is, expect HAL to keep theirs (see post # 57).

 

Let me clarify my post #116 to give you the opportunity to see the "sense" in it:

 

• HAL offered a way for me to "have some skin in the game" at a price I agreed to
  
• Conversely, they had "skin in the game" via their stated policy ("Your Future Cruise Deposit will be the only deposit needed until final payment.")
  
• My benefit was being able to book a cruise with a low deposit
  
• Their benefit was that I would book a subsequent cruise on one of their ships (i.e., give them more money)
  

If I'm going to have to pay a larger deposit, HAL no longer has that "preferred" status because I won't make an agreement at a price I don't like, especially considering their apparent principles.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Did you ever hear the saying: "it's the principle"? The highest ethical principle is for all parties to do what they agreed to do. I kept my end of the agreement and, foolish as you may think a principled person is, expect HAL to keep theirs (see post # 57).

 

Let me clarify my post #116 to give you the opportunity to see the "sense" in it:

 

• HAL offered a way for me to "have some skin in the game" at a price I agreed to
  
• Conversely, they had "skin in the game" via their stated policy ("Your Future Cruise Deposit will be the only deposit needed until final payment.")
  
• My benefit was being able to book a cruise with a low deposit
  
• Their benefit was that I would book a subsequent cruise on one of their ships (i.e., give them more money)
  

If I'm going to have to pay a larger deposit, HAL no longer has that "preferred" status because I won't make an agreement at a price I don't like, especially considering their apparent principles.

But they are keeping their end of the agreement on any Future Cruise Deposits that were Purchased Previously (as long as you talk to the right informed person at HAL) :confused: How is that not keeping their end of the agreement.

Now if you go on board and purchase new Future Cruise Deposits then yes things have changed.

My goodness Life is all about change. Nothing ever stays the same. When you Car Insurance Rates go up do you get upset with your insurance carrier saying they did not keep their end of the agreement? How about when prices go up at the grocery store. Or better yet you drive by the gas station in the morning and afterwork it has gone up 10 cents a gallon.

I am not going to argue about this, it is what it is....Everything in Life Changes sometimes good sometimes bad. In this case while it is not as good as it was it is still better than not having the Future Cruise Deposit and Ship Board Credit.

If you want to blame someone blame all the many hundreds of people that book a cruise, then cancel, then book again then cancel and never get around to actually paying in full for a cruise. They are the ones that helped convince HAL that there needed to be some change.

I do not remember HAL stating they would never ever change this program

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

Sounds good ...

[kazu]

But they are keeping their end of the agreement on any Future Cruise Deposits that were Purchased Previously (as long as you talk to the right informed person at HAL) :confused: How is that not keeping their end of the agreement.

Now if you go on board and purchase new Future Cruise Deposits then yes things have changed.

My goodness Life is all about change. Nothing ever stays the same. When you Car Insurance Rates go up do you get upset with your insurance carrier saying they did not keep their end of the agreement? How about when prices go up at the grocery store. Or better yet you drive by the gas station in the morning and afterwork it has gone up 10 cents a gallon.

 

I am not going to argue about this, it is what it is....Everything in Life Changes sometimes good sometimes bad. In this case while it is not as good as it was it is still better than not having the Future Cruise Deposit and Ship Board Credit.

 

If you want to blame someone blame all the many hundreds of people that book a cruise, then cancel, then book again then cancel and never get around to actually paying in full for a cruise. They are the ones that helped convince HAL that there needed to be some change.

I do not remember HAL stating they would never ever change this program

 

I don't see an issue myself - things change as always. The bottom line is that IMO the deposit will be less that what you would normally pay anyways. The only negative for us will be trying to determine what one to purchase;)

 

I have to agree on the people that cancel statement based only from our Prinsendam cruise last year - the ship was practically sold out and then - bang all of a sudden (surprise, surprise) three days before final payment there were all kinds of cabins.

 

There were several people that cancelled who I knew had FCD's. This was not a 7 day cruise. It was either a 20 or 38 day cruise (if my memory serves me). Sure, I know medical stuff happens - I also know some people just had too many cruises and decided to bow out.

 

Perhaps if some thought has to be put into FCD's it may encourage people to get serious - not sure - no right answers here - but it still a good deal. Pretty sure the deposit is still going to be less than if you were just booking straight out without it;) JMVHO though (I seem to be doing that a lot lately:rolleyes:)

[xjust4fun]

We have been reading this thread with keen interest as we had never purchased FCC/FCD in the past considering we were newbie cruisers (2 years). However for our cruise next month we had to pay a $2,900.00 deposit, ouch. We are making plans for our future cruises and are seriously considering buying several certificates on our cruise. Thank you to all who have made comments on this thread as we now realize that this is certainly a huge benefit for us as we know what our bucket list trips are. Perhaps we have been very fortunate and never had to cancel any of our travels (work/pleasure) but I can understand if one needs to cancel things do happen that are not within one's control. Again sincere thank you for this board and for the shared information.

 

Diane.

[Bluwater7]

I wish this new system had been in place in June - we bought the OBC for $100 with the refundable clause if not used in 4 years will be refunded to our credit card. Good. Then we decided our next cruise would be in Jan 2013 for 88 days. Not able to use FCC for the deposit or get the OBC. Our deposit was close to $7000.... and no OBC .... new system would have been a lower deposit and some OBC. guess we can't have it both ways. Wonder if now we can apply our old one or would it be worth it to even try to. Will let the dust settle and see how it all goes.

[chloes nana]

So Friday has come and gone, any final word on the costs, add on prices for longer cruises, amounts of shipboard credits, etc??