Sometimes it's good to pay full price

[CantanaLobo]

Heard this on NPR driving home:

 

http://www.npr.org/2013/07/08/200086955/in-the-world-of-air-travel-not-all-passengers-created-equal

 

Interesting the couple on award tickets got bumped, while the mother that paid full fare kept her seat.

 

Relevance to CC - where do you think cruise air tickets are in the airline pecking order when things go pear-shaped? I'd say pretty close to the bottom.

[Zach1213]

Many cruise air tickets would indeed be at the bottom. Not all, but many. The thing is, customers probably won't know how low they are until something happens.

 

It's not really surprising that full fare travelers get priority. Full fare coach tickets are viewed very highly by the airlines, as they often cost more than (discount) business class tickets.

 

My airline status has saved me many times. That's part of the reason I keep using the same airline/alliance. They really do reward those who spend more money on a regular basis.

[CantanaLobo]

...My airline status has saved me many times. That's part of the reason I keep using the same airline/alliance. They really do reward those who spend more money on a regular basis.

 

Unfortunately, I'm in the "almost worthless" category a - couple trips a year in the cheap economy seats.

[RickT]

I'll continue to take my chances and use the money I save to go on more cruises :D

 

I understand the golden rule that airlines (and other businesses) will take care of their bread and butter first. Even if I were to pay full fare you can be sure there is some "elite" level flyer who is going to get a seat before me.

 

No point in worrying about stuff you have little to no control over. You'll eventually get to your destination.

 

If I had all the money in the world I'd fly first class every time... but since I don't there is no point in complaining.

[klfrodo]

I'll continue to take my chances and use the money I save to go on more cruises :D

 

I understand the golden rule that airlines (and other businesses) will take care of their bread and butter first. Even if I were to pay full fare you can be sure there is some "elite" level flyer who is going to get a seat before me.

 

No point in worrying about stuff you have little to no control over. You'll eventually get to your destination.

 

If I had all the money in the world I'd fly first class every time... but since I don't there is no point in complaining.

 

You're not wrong in your thought process.

The HUGE difference is that you KNOW this going in and accept it.

Your phliosphy is the exception, not the rule amongst most amateur travellers.

[ducklite]

As an elite I can tell you that the OP is correct. I have bumped people who were already in their seat on the plane off when I put my foot down to get on a flight after my scheduled flight was cancelled. The airlines will bend over backwards for the elites. I once had my connection cancelled and they had rebooked me onto a flight going into a different airport with the intent to bus me to the one I was supposed to be headed to. Unacceptable for a bunch of reasons (#1 because this gal doesn't fly into LGA. It's non-negotiable). I made them find my checked bag and rebook me into a flight to PHL, which delayed both the LGA and PHL bound flights, but too freaking bad.

 

They have also held a connecting flight at the gate at DCA when my flight was delayed coming in and I had to change terminals. I simply asked a gate agent where I came in to call the gate I was going to and tell them I was in my way.

 

The airlines don't care about the once or twice a year travelers, but boy they will do what it takes to retain the business of their highest level FF's.

[sverigecruiser]

I think that it's fair that people paying more for their tickets getting a higher priority with one exception, overbooking!

 

The airlines overbook because some passengers don't show up but people with nonrefundable tickets can't get any money back if they don't show up so noone can blame them for that! Because of that, I don't think that it's fair to "take" their seat because of overbooking!

[Zach1213]

The airlines don't care about the once or twice a year travelers, but boy they will do what it takes to retain the business of their highest level FF's.

 

And that may (and has) ticked off a lot of people on CC. But it's no different than other businesses, including cruise lines. As an infrequent cruiser, you are damn sure that RCCL doesn't give much of a care about me compared to someone who gives them tens of thousands of dollars a year as a result of cruising 10+ times since they live in a city with a port. But you can be sure American Airlines doesn't care about them the way they care about me, who pays (or my company pays) tens of thousands of dollars a year to fly and reach Executive Platinum status.

 

Companies are dumb to not reward their best customers, no matter what industry it is. Cruise lines, hotels, airlines, rental car companies, Amtrak...hell, even my grocery store rewards me by offering gas discounts.

[ducklite]

I think that it's fair that people paying more for their tickets getting a higher priority with one exception, overbooking!

 

The airlines overbook because some passengers don't show up but people with nonrefundable tickets can't get any money back if they don't show up so noone can blame them for that! Because of that, I don't think that it's fair to "take" their seat because of overbooking!

 

Then what would you suggest as the fair way of determining who gets IDB? If you were an airline, would you really want to risk ticking off the person who has spent $80K with you in the past year, or the people who shopped for a rock bottom fare and has zero loyalty? That's business 101, keep your loyal customers loyal and ditch the Kettles who would fly a different carrier for next years trip if it saved them $1.

 

By the way, read the contract of vpcarriage, if you are IDB and they can't get you to your destination in a certain amount of time (2-4 hours) you are entitled to a full cash refund on most carriers. A savvy traveler can negotiate for that plus some in an IDB situation.

[ducklite]

And that may (and has) ticked off a lot of people on CC. But it's no different than other businesses, including cruise lines. As an infrequent cruiser, you are damn sure that RCCL doesn't give much of a care about me compared to someone who gives them tens of thousands of dollars a year as a result of cruising 10+ times since they live in a city with a port. But you can be sure American Airlines doesn't care about them the way they care about me, who pays (or my company pays) tens of thousands of dollars a year to fly and reach Executive Platinum status.

 

Companies are dumb to not reward their best customers, no matter what industry it is. Cruise lines, hotels, airlines, rental car companies, Amtrak...hell, even my grocery store rewards me by offering gas discounts.

 

Exactly. I buy most of my clothes from a brick and mortar store. When I walk in, they greet me by name, and if I call in advance, they'll have a fitting room held with clothing they think I might like based on my preferences--even if there is a line for the other fitting rooms.

 

Like any business, they are smart to cater to their top 5%, even if it causes inconvenience for the twice a year shopper who spends a whole $200 on the clearance rack merchandise. I also get an hour of private shopping at the semi-annual clearance (not totally private, there are usually 3-4 of us invited) before they open to the public, so I can grab all the best deals.

 

It pays to be loyal.

[Zach1213]

Exactly. I buy most of my clothes from a brick and mortar store. When I walk in, they greet me by name, and if I call in advance, they'll have a fitting room held with clothing they think I might like based on my preferences--even if there is a line for the other fitting rooms.

 

Like any business, they are smart to cater to their top 5%, even if it causes inconvenience for the twice a year shopper who spends a whole $200 on the clearance rack merchandise. I also get an hour of private shopping at the semi-annual clearance (not totally private, there are usually 3-4 of us invited) before they open to the public, so I can grab all the best deals.

 

It pays to be loyal.

 

Well damn...you beat me hands down on the perks side of life ;)

[sverigecruiser]

Then what would you suggest as the fair way of determining who gets IDB? If you were an airline, would you really want to risk ticking off the person who has spent $80K with you in the past year, or the people who shopped for a rock bottom fare and has zero loyalty? That's business 101, keep your loyal customers loyal and ditch the Kettles who would fly a different carrier for next years trip if it saved them $1.

 

By the way, read the contract of vpcarriage, if you are IDB and they can't get you to your destination in a certain amount of time (2-4 hours) you are entitled to a full cash refund on most carriers. A savvy traveler can negotiate for that plus some in an IDB situation.

 

Maybe they shall add some to the price of all tickets and don't overbook? I know that the compensation for being denied boarding because of overbooking is generous but I still think that it's unfair that someone with a nonrefundable ticket shall be denied boarding because of overbooking.

 

Of course I understand that the people paying fullfare are more important for the airlines than people with cheap tickets.

[ducklite]

Maybe they shall add some to the price of all tickets and don't overbook? I know that the compensation for being denied boarding because of overbooking is generous but I still think that it's unfair that someone with a nonrefundable ticket shall be denied boarding because of overbooking.

 

Of course I understand that the people paying fullfare are more important for the airlines than people with cheap tickets.

 

People already paying full fare shouldn't pay more. Instead they should make all tickets full fare. How about them apples?

[sverigecruiser]

People already paying full fare shouldn't pay more. Instead they should make all tickets full fare. How about them apples?

 

People paying full fare are the people who can choose not to show up so maybe they should pay more.

 

How many airlines should survive if they only sold full fare tickets?

 

I should understand if airlines should make all tickets full fare and if they could sell all tickets it's a VERY good decision to do it.

[Zach1213]

Maybe they shall add some to the price of all tickets and don't overbook? I know that the compensation for being denied boarding because of overbooking is generous but I still think that it's unfair that someone with a nonrefundable ticket shall be denied boarding because of overbooking.

 

Of course I understand that the people paying fullfare are more important for the airlines than people with cheap tickets.

 

The issue with adding some money to the price of tickets is that one airline will inevitably have to be the first to do so. And with travelers in 2013, if one airline adds a mere $5 in fees, they will be looked over in lieu of whatever comes cheapest on Expedia, Orbitz, etc.

 

Let's say Delta says "Let's add this $5 and never overbook", but American, US Airways, and United don't. Suddenly, Delta is $5 more expensive than everyone, and people go to American, US Airways and United instead. How long will Delta keep that no-overbooking policy alive? Not very long.

 

While I like the idea, it's unfortunately not realistic for the aviation business environment in 2013.

 

(dollar figures are just hypothetical...it would cost much more than that to overcome the overbooking costs)

[ducklite]

People paying full fare are the people who can choose not to show up so maybe they should pay more.

 

How many airlines should survive if they only sold full fare tickets?

 

I should understand if airlines should make all tickets full fare and if they could sell all tickets it's a VERY good decision to do it.

 

The people who wild choose not to fly make a small percentage of the carriers revenue. Without those full fare passengers, fares would go up sharply for the Kettles.

[PennyAgain]

I had a full fare ticket on a flight last week and there was weather coming in. When I checked my bag in, the agent put me on an earlier flight to 'get me out of the airport'. My original flight was severely delayed so I would have missed my connecting flight.

 

That's why it is sometimes good to pay full fare.

[sverigecruiser]

The issue with adding some money to the price of tickets is that one airline will inevitably have to be the first to do so. And with travelers in 2013, if one airline adds a mere $5 in fees, they will be looked over in lieu of whatever comes cheapest on Expedia, Orbitz, etc.

 

Let's say Delta says "Let's add this $5 and never overbook", but American, US Airways, and United don't. Suddenly, Delta is $5 more expensive than everyone, and people go to American, US Airways and United instead. How long will Delta keep that no-overbooking policy alive? Not very long.

 

While I like the idea, it's unfortunately not realistic for the aviation business environment in 2013.

 

(dollar figures are just hypothetical...it would cost much more than that to overcome the overbooking costs)

 

I understand the problem. Lots of people always look for the cheapest option. I never look for the cheapest option when it comes to flying because for me vacation is not about getting the cheapest possible vacation, it's about getting the best vacation!

[ducklite]

People paying full fare are the people who can choose not to show up so maybe they should pay more.

 

How many airlines should survive if they only sold full fare tickets?

 

I should understand if airlines should make all tickets full fare and if they could sell all tickets it's a VERY good decision to do it.

 

Anyone can choose to not show up. Your logic is flawed.

[PennyAgain]

As a point of reference: every flight I've been on since June 1, 2013 has been sold out and even lap children.

[Gardyloo]

I would hesitate before drawing too many sweeping conclusions based on one anecdotal news article, even if it is NPR. Mr. Kondros, the man cited in the article for whom UA "bent over backwards" is a UA Global Services member, equivalent to American Airlines' "Concierge Key."

 

These are not just the top tier frequent flyers in their respective FF programs, (known as 1K at United and Executive Platinum at AA) who fly 100,000 miles or more per year, but are customers who also regularly pay very high prices for their tickets - walk up first class, for example. You don't "qualify" for this status, but are invited only after the airline has reviewed your track record for several years. Think George Clooney in the movie. Think the guys who get invited into the $1000-minimum tables in Vegas.

 

Comparing a Global Services guy to tourists flying on cheap tickets is like comparing a little league player with Derek Jeter.

 

I have had EXP status with AA for a number of years and while I've been in several "IRROPS" (irregular operations) situations I have never been given a seat when somebody else got bumped. And frankly I probably wouldn't take it anyway.

[Zach1213]

I understand the problem. Lots of people always look for the cheapest option. I never look for the cheapest option when it comes to flying because for me vacation is not about getting the cheapest possible vacation, it's about getting the best vacation!

 

That's great, but you sound like the minority, especially around these parts.

[Taxguy77]

Had a friend who was flying home from vacation with his family of four, and took a voluntary bump. He got future ticket credit equal to the full airfare, and still got home only 40 minutes late!

[ducklite]

I would hesitate before drawing too many sweeping conclusions based on one anecdotal news article, even if it is NPR. Mr. Kondros, the man cited in the article for whom UA "bent over backwards" is a UA Global Services member, equivalent to American Airlines' "Concierge Key."

 

These are not just the top tier frequent flyers in their respective FF programs, (known as 1K at United and Executive Platinum at AA) who fly 100,000 miles or more per year, but are customers who also regularly pay very high prices for their tickets - walk up first class, for example. You don't "qualify" for this status, but are invited only after the airline has reviewed your track record for several years. Think George Clooney in the movie. Think the guys who get invited into the $1000-minimum tables in Vegas.

 

Comparing a Global Services guy to tourists flying on cheap tickets is like comparing a little league player with Derek Jeter.

 

I have had EXP status with AA for a number of years and while I've been in several "IRROPS" (irregular operations) situations I have never been given a seat when somebody else got bumped. And frankly I probably wouldn't take it anyway.

 

I'm Chairman's with US and shudder to think how much our FF program is going to get dumbed down after the merger. I took the seat as I was on my second cancellation of the day and if I wasn't at my destination the next morning I would lose a $3M deal. That's three with six zero's after it. Without that deal, I would have laid off 15 employees.

[ducklite]

Had a friend who was flying home from vacation with his family of four, and took a voluntary bump. He got future ticket credit equal to the full airfare, and still got home only 40 minutes late!

 

My husband purposely books flights where he is likely to get bumped, and we pay for very few tickets for personal travel as a result.