Tipping on the cruise

[NMLady]

I recently too another cruise and have some more thoughts on the tipping discussion.

 

Many people tip because they feel the receiver is underpaid and deserves the extra money. This is noble but I think it misses a key point. The main reason the person is underpaid is because of the expectation of tips. If the person received no tips the cruise line would have to pay more. The cruise line pays them a very low salary and tells them that the tips will make up the difference. So by tipping we are enabling the cruise lines to continue to underpay those employees. If everyone would stop tipping, the cruise lines would have to pay them a decent salary.

 

Many cruise lines allow you to prepay your tips. Many require mandatory tips be added to your room if you are using anytime dining. If tips are a reward for good service, why would you prepay them. You have no idea what kind of service you will receive before you even board the ship. Why require tips if you do anytime dining? These both indicate that tipping is not a viewed by the cruise line as a reward for good service, but part of the cost of the cruise that you pay separately.

 

Free riders who do not pay tips make the tip requirement higher for those of us that do tip. They also short change the person who deserves the tip. If the cruise lines paid the person a decent wage and put it into the cost of the cruise, everyone would pay their fair share and the workers would earn a fair wage.

 

Have you ever tipped the chef on a cruise? When your steak comes out exactly as you asked, why do you tip the waiter when it was the chef who provided great service. When the Captain does a great job of piloting the ship, do you tip him? Why do we tip some people who directly provide us with great service and not others? Because tipping is used as way for the employer to pay the person less and put the responsibility on the customer to pay the person.

 

My point is that although many tip out of good intentions, they are enabling the unfairness to the crew and customers.

 

You brought to life a thread that is a year old!

[AmberCascades]

You brought to life a thread that is a year old!

 

Because there is a lack of fresh tipping threads??? :)

 

I've heard of TBT (throwback Thursday). Is WBW (Way Back Wednesday) the new thing ?

[ducklite]

And by adding it on, the fare will go up at least that amount, and maybe more. Now the cruise fare is higher, and any taxes and fees that may be required will also go up. And, if you purchase insurance, the higher fare might put you in a higher price bracket, so you might also pay more for insurance.

 

Bottom line, you may think you are paying the same, but it could be hundreds of dollars more to cover the added fees and insurance costs if the new price surpasses a certain price point that allowed lower fees and insurance to be assessed.

 

When Azamara decided to include gratuities in the base fare, the fare went up much more than the cost of the tips. People ended up paying more just for the convenience of having it included. Seems like that is an expensive way to save a moment's worth of math.

 

I prefer that they keep it the way it is. If the math to figure out the total cost is too complicated for someone to figure out, they will have much worse problems in life than worrying about the cost of tipping on a cruise.

 

On a typical seven day cruise it would be under $10 per person in additional taxes, fees, and insurance costs. It seems to me there are worse problems in life than an extra $10 in cruise fares.

 

I suspect that Azamara was going to have a price increase anyhow, or additionally added in other amenities at the same time.

[ducklite]

Depending upon the cruise line, the tips "kinda" go to the room steward and the waiters. On HAL, for instance, if you leave the Hotel Service Charge in place and pay by credit card, HAL deducts the credit card service charge from the total amount. HAL also deducts an amount (less than 1%) and reallocates it to other ships. In other words, you are contributing to tips for a cruise you didn't take.

 

Once these deductions are taken, the remainder is then pooled and allocated to the crew on a points based system. So it is the number of points that each crew member has accumulated that determines how much of the tip that he or she receives. It is a mystery how points are allocated, but it is reasonable to assume that points are awarded based on crew position, tenure and passenger feedback (this is the reason so many crew want you to write that you received great service from them).

 

Just know that it isn't a simple, "you pay $11.50 a day and the crew receives $11.50 a day."

 

Bizarre. This makes a good argument for paying crew members actual salaries and rolling all gratuities and service charges outside the spa and such into cruise costs.

[JoMoe]

Part of the tips go to the supervisor and trainer of the waiters.

 

The crew are guaranteed a certain salary. When you tip a crewmember, the cruise line deducts it from what they would have paid the crewmember. This is why the crewmembers are much more concerned with your review of their service than of any money you give them.

 

It is just a surcharge that short changes the cruisers and the crew. Including it in the price is much more transparent and fair to everyone.

[JoMoe]

Sorry, some more info I forgot to include on my last post.

 

On my last cruise I took a behind the scenes tour. It was great. We asked various crewmembers how they were paid and what was their benefits package. They did not give salary amounts but were very glad to explain benefits packages and how they were paid. When I asked the waiters about their pay, they acted like they were not sure. When I pressed them they said it was some combination of salary and tips. Seemed like they were not supposed to say.

[DirtyDawg]

Sorry, some more info I forgot to include on my last post.

 

On my last cruise I took a behind the scenes tour. It was great. We asked various crewmembers how they were paid and what was their benefits package. They did not give salary amounts but were very glad to explain benefits packages and how they were paid. When I asked the waiters about their pay, they acted like they were not sure. When I pressed them they said it was some combination of salary and tips. Seemed like they were not supposed to say.

 

Hi Joe, of course they would not say. Would you? We have lots of clients that I have regular contact with. They are entitled to lots of information from me because they pay handsomely for it. But they are not entitled to know how my compensation is structured. That's between my employer and me....... and my tax accountant.:);)

[Cruisin' Chick]

 

 

Have you ever tipped the chef on a cruise? When your steak comes out exactly as you asked, why do you tip the waiter when it was the chef who provided great service. When the Captain does a great job of piloting the ship, do you tip him? Why do we tip some people who directly provide us with great service and not others? Because tipping is used as way for the employer to pay the person less and put the responsibility on the customer to pay the person.

 

My point is that although many tip out of good intentions, they are enabling the unfairness to the crew and customers.

 

The answer is that the chefs and ship's officers are on a different pay scale.

[navybankerteacher]

Depending upon the cruise line, the tips "kinda" go to the room steward and the waiters. On HAL, for instance, if you leave the Hotel Service Charge in place and pay by credit card, HAL deducts the credit card service charge from the total amount. HAL also deducts an amount (less than 1%) and reallocates it to other ships. In other words, you are contributing to tips for a cruise you didn't take.

 

 

 

Just know that it isn't a simple, "you pay $11.50 a day and the crew receives $11.50 a day."

 

Can you let us have the source of this information of how HAL handles tips?

[cbr663]

Item 4D, Hotel Service Charge http://welcome2hal.com/seadailyratemlc.php

[JoMoe]

Hi Joe, of course they would not say. Would you? We have lots of clients that I have regular contact with. They are entitled to lots of information from me because they pay handsomely for it. But they are not entitled to know how my compensation is structured. That's between my employer and me....... and my tax accountant.:);)

 

DirtyDawg,

 

You missed my point. They were open and glad to share how everyone's compensation was structured except for those who get tips. My point was to show that they are not transparent and there is no way to know what happens to the tips. Why are the cruise lines so up front with how some of the crew is paid and not others? If you are being asked to pay extra for something you have a right to know why and who the money is going to. All the crew members have a contract with the cruise line. They are not just there to work and only get tips. If you don't tip do they still get paid? If you do tip do they get to keep it all? Is their salary reduced by how much they get in tips?

 

If they wanted tips for the Captain would you just pay it and say it is none of your business. Isn't he paid a fair salary. I know he provided a great service by getting us to all the locations timely, safely and comfortably, so maybe he should be tipped also. I am trying to show the ridiculousness and unfairness to the passengers and crew members of the surcharge that is called tipping

[donaldsc]

No they never explained any of that to us. When I received the bill at the end I went to the desk and asked to have that gratuity in cash so i could personally give it to them so I knew it would go to the right people. They said that was fine and gave me the money. It was on carnival.

 

In the end, the people who would have received the money if you left the tip alone got it regardless of who you actually gave it to - so your gesture was useless and futile.

 

DON

[DirtyDawg]

DirtyDawg,

 

You missed my point......

 

I was commenting on your post about "pressing" the crew members for their compensation details. Quite frankly, I don't care how the cruise line gratuities/resort fee/tax/employee salary top-up is used. That's between the cruise line and it's employees. As a customer all I care about is what is the total all-in cost of this type of vacation vs. another type. If cruising has value I'll cruise. If not, I won't. Hey, If you want to know all the details - go for it. I just think you're wasting your time "pressing" the crew for that info. You might have better luck buying the cruise line stock and asking management at the annual shareholders' meeting.