Celebrity charging credit cards twice, need help

[Doudounka]

Hello,

 

Sorry in advance for this long post

 

We got off the Constellation march 13th. FANTASTIC CRUISE

 

We got our onboard statement the last night and everything was fine.

 

I do not know if it has anything to do with the fact that we have a Visa Debit Card, which instead of being a credit card is a Visa linked to our bank account, so charges are taken directly from bank account.

 

We got off the ship and stayed 2 more days in Fort Lauderdale, there was wi-fi in our room so I was able to log in into my bank account and check if Ship statement was in line with my bank account and it was, every end of day charges was there (total per day).

 

On march 18th I was surprised to see that our bank account was charged 938$ (total of all onboard spendings) and that a 638$ (second day charges of cruise) was reversed. And since then no other daily charges were reversed....

 

Seems Celebrity charges card on a daily basis (like some kind of hold), and at the end of the cruise, they add up everything and charge that and then reverse or release the holds...... Very weird way of doing things IMO, much more clerical work involved

 

But since march 18th no other reversals or releases have been made, leaving our bank account with 300$ missing....

 

That happened same day a check was going through our bank account, so Celebrity's credit card stunt, caused our check to bounce, having us to pay 45$ in bank charges + having to pay check holder 20$ for his charges and making a dent in our credit history.

 

I had seen this our last Celebrity cruise, same exact way of doing things, and charges or holds were released a day at a time according to cruise, I had found that peculiar last year, but charges were minimal, so did not make a fuss. Forgot about it because our last cruise in October was with Disney and they do not do things like Celebrity, daily charges and that is it, no adding up total of cruise and charge it again. Even though it infuriated me, this year i waited a few days for other amounts to be released, they never came.

 

Called my bank to explain to them what was happening, they said that since WE gave Celebrity's our credit card, there was not much they could do...

 

I called Celberity and explaineed the whole situation on march 21st (they told me it was standard for Celebrity to double charge the way they did). Got transfered to another department, they checked things out and did not understand what was happening and why and told me they would call back. A lady did call back last tuesday and explained the whole situation again and she asked me if I could send her our bank statement showing the daily charges, the total charge of march 18th and the first reversal. So i printed out our bank statement and send it to her.

 

Since then no news, so I call last night and was lucky enough to get a hold of same lady we talked to, and she told me that issue had been escalated in the account department and that we should get a call middle or late next week.....

 

Called my bank and again they told me that since we gave authorisation to X to charge the card, there is nothing they could do

 

On my e-mail of last tuesday i wrote this :

 

"We are very displeased and disappointed with the whole situation and with Celebrity, cruise was fantastic, but aftermath seriously puts a damper on everything, including looking forward to our already booked (not paid in full yet) up-coming back to back cruises on the Summit next October.

 

As you can see it is not only the money we are missing in our bank account, but it's the collateral damage of the whole situation we suffer.

 

We are looking forward to hearing more from you and hope the situation will be resolved quickly with reversing the charges and hope Celebrity will propose some kind of compensation for all the trouble and damage done to us. "

 

Anyone have any ideas or suggestions? Any department or person at Celebrity I could contact to speed things up?

 

Once again sorry for this long e-mail and we thank you in advance for your answers.

[Stede Bonnet]

No answers here but thanks for the caution. I plan to buy sufficient OBC beforehand and not provide a card for the account on board.

I find it strange that your bank would not dispute the charge on your behalf

[monicajay]

This is just a reminder to all about the risks of using a debit card rather than a credit card. If there are errors made on a credit card, there is lots of time to fix them and sort it all out before the money is actually due. On a debit card it is gone from your account.

[cle-guy]

Sorry you are having a hassle.

 

I never use a debit card at hotels and such for this very reason. with debit cards, my bank account is tied up until the preauthorizations release, sometimes takes 30 days - they aren't actual charges but holds usually, but it makes no difference to the consumer since the money is "unavailable" to them anyway.

 

Normally there are signs posted telling people about the issue of using a debit card on arrival, but even without, the consumer should be aware of these types of issues when they sign up for one.

 

It really sucks, and there really is little to nothing the merchant can do to release the holds until they expire (speaking as a merchant who has customers ask about this periodically).

Edited March 29, 2014 by cle-guy

[patty1955]

We had almost the same problem on our first cruise. We were double billed and had used our debit card. I contacted Celebrity multiple times (they still use the same hold music, ugh!) and each time they'd tell me they were reversing the charge. I started bouncing checks and the bank charges started adding up. It was a nightmare! I finally discover that Celebrity had reversed the charge, but my bank credited my savings account instead of my checking account. Although the bank took care of all charges, it affected by credit score for a while.

I've never used the debit card for a cruise since. Double billing is much easier to deal with on a credit card.

[north29]

over the years, I have heard of toooooo many issues with travel payments, using a debit cards, not only cruise lines, but hotels etc.

I do hope they find out what the problem is then please get a CC to travel with especially a CC with no foreign transaction fees seems best.

 

Please separate ATM transactions from Companies, cruise line, hotels etc.

[Doudounka]

Thank you for your messages.

 

Being from Canada, our Visa card is linked with Visa with all the advantages and protection from Visa, but yes it has the downside if Holds will be placed, it will affect our bank account. I cannot get a true credit card because of credit score.

 

In the case of Celebrity, it was never mentioned holds or double charges would be made. It is not the case with Disney Cruise Line. If I knew, I would have gone to an ATM, withdraw money with my Visa and give it as a deposit to guest relations.

 

With X method of doing things, what happens if soneone as let's say, a credit card of 1000$ limit and spends 750$....X would not be able to take full payment at the end...... very peculiar thing to do

 

What annoys me off mostly, is that X does not seem to be able to retrace what should be reversed.....

 

So yeah in the future, if we still decide to go on our October Summit cruise and not cancel it (depending on how X resolves our issue and how fast), will either put on a deposit at guess relations, get a pre paid card or not spend a dime on board (the way things are looking out with the resolution of our case, the later would be best)

 

Thank you

Edited March 29, 2014 by Doudounka

[forceten]

Not sure whats happening with your card and celebrity but i will tell you our experience with debit cards.

 

Debit cards are always a pain and how big a pain will depend on the bank the card got issued from and their policy.

 

We have been in business over 20+ years and this is how we process credit cards for our customers. When a customer gives us a credit card for an order, we take the card and authorize for the full order amount to make sure there are funds before we make a delivery. When we authorize the card a hold gets put on those funds. The hold is typically for 3 days but I have seen it as high as 7-10 days.

 

When we make the delivery we go ahead and force the charge through using the same authorization as the hold.

 

When its with a real credit card the credit card company takes that authorized hold and converts it to a charge and gives the money to our processor which in turn gives the money to us.

 

When its a debit card several different things happen depending on what bank the debit card is from. What should happen is just what happens with a real credit card. The authorized hold should convert over and turns it into a charge. but what does happen with a debit card is the bank will take the force that we do and put it as a separate NEW charge. So now somebody with a debit card sees the original hold AND they see the actual charge as two seperate holds on their account. Most banks will wait 3 days and see the authorization not be forced over and the first original hold will drop away leaving only the final charge.

 

But we see lots of banks not drop away for 5,6,7 and a few 10+ days. Of course leaving us to deal with a customer on the phone telling us we charged them twice and they want a refund. On our end and our processors end we only got paid once, not twice. We only asked the debit card bank for one charge. It's the banks bad way of doing things that they don't recognize the force being the same transaction as the original hold, and they will not release that first hold until whatever their bank policy is.

 

Customers have called and asked us please reverse the first charge - but we can't on our end as its not in our system. We only asked the bank to hold the funds and then push it through once. There is nothing to refund on our end and we have only been paid once on our side. So its the bank holding on to funds for no reason.

 

We authorize first because way too many times a customer will use a card that doesn't have funds available. They get a delivery from us, which we can't take back. Then we go to charge their card and it's declined and they have no other way to pay - and now we are stuck.

 

We always try to advise our customers of this when using debit cards. Some banks are great and process debit cards almost like a credit card. Some banks are terrible.

Edited March 29, 2014 by forceten

[Theodorable]

I am also from Canada and I would never dream of using a debit card for on board expenses on any cruise line or hotel. Every cruise line puts holds on debit cards, and before I replied to this post I actually checked the frequently ask questions on Celebrity's website and it does mention that they do this.

 

The holds will eventually drop off depending on your bank timeline as mentioned in the post above.

[daisy-mae]

I am also from Canada and I would never dream of using a debit card for on board expenses on any cruise line or hotel. Every cruise line puts holds on debit cards, and before I replied to this post I actually checked the frequently ask questions on Celebrity's website and it does mention that they do this.

 

The holds will eventually drop off depending on your bank timeline as mentioned in the post above.

 

As a Canadian, I am also concerned about the currency exchange aspect of placing and releasing holds. Since the buy/sell rates are different, would the amount that is eventually released be the same as the initial amount? In other words, does the bank convert the first amount from US to CDN dollars, then back again?

[Minoushka]

Be aware cc companies charge 1price for buying currency and 1for selling .when Carnival double charged me by mistake i lost 30$ in the transaction .i called and got it back as ObC

So watch that currency exchange

[goodycruising]

We found that a prepaid credit card was not accepted at the service desk for payment, as they say it is not in our name. However, for the simple fee of US$6 we took the money we had put into US$ on the card, from the on board ATM, and paid our seapass bill in cash.

 

The $6 fee saved any other hassles, and by locking the currency into our multicurrency prepaid visa, we knew exactly how many $ we had to spend on board without worrying about the currency rate after a 2 week trip, and it did move quite a bit the time we used it.

 

We used a normal credit card for starting the seapass account, and the holds were on there every day as has been stated on this thread, but they cleared after about a week.

[Ando]

 

So yeah in the future, if we still decide to go on our October Summit cruise and not cancel it (depending on how X resolves our issue and how fast), will either put on a deposit at guess relations, get a pre paid card or not spend a dime on board (the way things are looking out with the resolution of our case, the later would be best)

 

Another caution - most cruise lines won't accept the pre-paid cards either. Do check with the cruise line directly if you are considering this option.

 

We also use debit cards and to avoid these issues on cruises, as others have suggested, we purchase onboard credits to cover our expected spending and select a cash account option. Never had any problems doing this.

 

For further insight into the holds issue, I believe the reason this situation arises is because the holds are done on a daily basis and the final charge is put through for the total amount meaning that the holds and the final charge do not correspond so the banking system assumes that these are unrelated items. When the hold and the actual charge are the same amount they cancel each other out. Even if the total of all the holds and the actual charge are the same, this doesn't cancel out all the individual holds, hence the problem you are currently experiencing.

 

In the past when I have experienced a similar issue with a hold & charge both reducing my available balance I was able to get the merchant to send a fax to my bank advising the holds are no longer required and the bank released the holds within 24 hours. Hope this info helps.

 

Cheers

Ando

[daisy-mae]

Another caution - most cruise lines won't accept the pre-paid cards either. Do check with the cruise line directly if you are considering this option.

 

In the past when I have experienced a similar issue with a hold & charge both reducing my available balance I was able to get the merchant to send a fax to my bank advising the holds are no longer required and the bank released the holds within 24 hours. Hope this info helps.

 

Cheers

Ando

 

Just wondering how likely it would be for Celebrity (or any other cruise line) to agree to send a fax to a bank while the cruise is underway, considering the additional charges involved?

[Lunna]

So this is how I know it works:

 

X makes an authorization every day and only actually charge your credit card on the final day.

 

if you have OBC you will only get "authorized" after the OBC is used.. until then.. nothing gets to the credit card

 

It's up to YOUR bank for how long the amount will be on hold - depending on your account you might not even have a hold.

 

Yes you can use prepaid cards -ON THE VERY LAST DAY - disembarkation morning - Guest Relations never close.. so get up early :)

 

Always advise your bank that you are traveling so you dont get a message saying that there is a problem and your credit card was declined - most of the times - I bet - its for security reason so the banks block the card...

 

For X only one credit card per ship account. If you want two credit cards split the accounts (ex: One credit card for Mary and one for John) and then play with it.

 

On the tv screens you can see the ship account.. if it is split account will show the separate accounts, if one account for two passengers you will see the same charges for both - it is just how the system works.. it's a mirror of the accounts...

 

remember the "hold" if you decide to split the accounts mid-cruise..

 

and if you add cash into your account and have a credit card on file, remember that you have to collect any unused cash.. or you will get a message on the way out of the ship

[Ando]

Just wondering how likely it would be for Celebrity (or any other cruise line) to agree to send a fax to a bank while the cruise is underway, considering the additional charges involved?

 

NO chance whilst on the cruise, only after you disembark and the final charge has been processed to your card

[Ando]

This is from the Celebritycruises.com.au website under Terms & Conditions regarding debit cards & pre-paid credit cards

 

 

16. Onboard purchases

 

Onboard currency

 

The currency used on board all Celebrity Cruises ships is US Dollars.

 

Your onboard account

 

All Celebrity Cruises ships operate on a ‘cashless’ system. When you check in you will receive a SeaPassSM account card and all purchases made onboard the ship are made using this card. At the end of the cruise you will receive a statement summarising the charges on your account. To settle your account we require you to register your credit card at check in. As all onboard accounts are payable in US Dollars, your credit card provider or financial institution may levy a foreign exchange transaction fee. Please note that when paying by credit card we obtain daily authorisations from your bank or financial institution, in some cases these may be held for up to 10 days for credit cards and 30 days for debit cards, after your cruise ends and will show as a pending/pre-authorisation transaction. For this reason we do not recommend the use of Debit Cards.Our ships do not accept Australian bank issued foreign currency cards if these do not contain your name either printed or embossed on the front of the card.

 

Celebrity Cruises SeaPassSM accounts may be settled in cash. We cannot accept personal cheques and any currency other than US Dollars. A cash machine is available on all Celebrity Cruises ships which dispenses US Dollars (US$5 fee per transaction will be levied for this service), and Euros (€6 fee per transaction) for European sailings.

[Doudounka]

This is from the Celebritycruises.com.au website under Terms & Conditions regarding debit cards & pre-paid credit cards

 

 

16. Onboard purchases

 

Onboard currency

 

The currency used on board all Celebrity Cruises ships is US Dollars.

 

Your onboard account

 

All Celebrity Cruises ships operate on a ‘cashless’ system. When you check in you will receive a SeaPassSM account card and all purchases made onboard the ship are made using this card. At the end of the cruise you will receive a statement summarising the charges on your account. To settle your account we require you to register your credit card at check in. As all onboard accounts are payable in US Dollars, your credit card provider or financial institution may levy a foreign exchange transaction fee. Please note that when paying by credit card we obtain daily authorisations from your bank or financial institution, in some cases these may be held for up to 10 days for credit cards and 30 days for debit cards, after your cruise ends and will show as a pending/pre-authorisation transaction. For this reason we do not recommend the use of Debit Cards.Our ships do not accept Australian bank issued foreign currency cards if these do not contain your name either printed or embossed on the front of the card.

 

Celebrity Cruises SeaPassSM accounts may be settled in cash. We cannot accept personal cheques and any currency other than US Dollars. A cash machine is available on all Celebrity Cruises ships which dispenses US Dollars (US$5 fee per transaction will be levied for this service), and Euros (€6 fee per transaction) for European sailings.

 

Thank you for all your answers...WE should have read more about it before cruising

 

We know now and won't make same mistakes.

 

Just wish X would do like DCL, but it is what it is

 

But 2 thing though,

- Our card even though it is lnked to a bank account, Outside of Canada it is truly a VISA, all charges are handle by Visa and then sent to our bank.

 

- we are well past the 10 days for the releases, so I still don't know what to do.

 

But like I said, i thank you very much for your answers

[Clydesmom7865]

But 2 thing though,

- Our card even though it is lnked to a bank account, Outside of Canada it is truly a VISA, all charges are handle by Visa and then sent to our bank.

 

The MC or VISA logo merely allows you to use it as a credit card for merchants that will process it that way. The first four digits tell the merchant whether it is a debit or credit card. The difference is that for a debit transaction you must enter your PIN. The bank still processes it as a debit to your bank account when you choose "credit" with no PIN regardless of the VISA logo or what network sends the transaction to them.

 

- we are well past the 10 days for the releases, so I still don't know what to do.

 

It is standard banking policy that debit cards may take up to 30 days to have a hold released. That is entirely YOUR bank's issue and you would have to address that with them.

[forceten]

The MC or VISA logo merely allows you to use it as a credit card for merchants that will process it that way. The first four digits tell the merchant whether it is a debit or credit card. The difference is that for a debit transaction you must enter your PIN. The bank still processes it as a debit to your bank account when you choose "credit" with no PIN regardless of the VISA logo or what network sends the transaction to them.

 

It is standard banking policy that debit cards may take up to 30 days to have a hold released. That is entirely YOUR bank's issue and you would have to address that with them.

 

 

This!

 

When the hold and the actual charge are the same amount they cancel each other out. Even if the total of all the holds and the actual charge are the same, this doesn't cancel out all the individual holds, hence the problem you are currently experiencing.

 

In the past when I have experienced a similar issue with a hold & charge both reducing my available balance I was able to get the merchant to send a fax to my bank advising the holds are no longer required and the bank released the holds within 24 hours. Hope this info helps.

 

Ando

 

We wish!

All of our authorizations (holds) and then force (final push through charge) are always the same amount. It all falls down to what bank the debit card is from. Customers who really really needed the extra hold dropped off (sometimes we are talking $700-$800) have tried talking to their bank, even with us on the line getting them to drop their hold. Nothing we could do or the customer would get them to drop the hold. Heck even if we gave a credit back to the customers card - that would only go to cancel our the actual charge. The customer would still owe us the actual amount and then the authorization charge would still be there. I wish the banks would allow us to fax a letter saying we do not intend to use the hold. but what is messed up is we DID USE the hold, we use the same authorization number from the hold for the actual charge. STupid banks just won't see it.

 

Not every bank, but enough of them that its a serious problem!

 

 

Oh and for the OP, my advice to you is if it goes past 15 days and any hold is still there go to your bank and say you want to dispute the charges. The amount is not what you authorized celebrity for and there is fraud going on (even if its a mistake). All banks have to allow you to dispute charges. Its gonna be a long process with a debit card 30+ days but you can do it. So much easier with a credit card.

Edited March 30, 2014 by forceten

[nyctravelerwithkids]

This exact thing happened to us when we cruised on Sillouette last year. Since then we NEVER use our Debit card for the onboard account. Only credit cards.

[Lunna]

NO chance whilst on the cruise, only after you disembark and the final charge has been processed to your card

 

Actually Guest Relations and the Finance team can do it if it is for the release of the amount on hold.. just insist with them but you have to have ALL bank information..

 

and if you need to they can scan things for you and send to your email too :)

[tinykygal]

This sounds complicated and I am a retired bookkeeper :)

I am considering, for the first time, paying off Sea Pass charges in cash or putting some up front or however it works.

 

How and what is the procedure? I know we submit a CC when we board the ship, but does that person accept our cash or do we visit Guest Relations toward the end and give them cash.

 

I can't imagine the persons who are so busy getting us on the ship handling cash.

 

Thank you.

Edited April 5, 2014 by tinykygal

[Lunna]

This sounds complicated and I am a retired bookkeeper :)

I am considering, for the first time, paying off Sea Pass charges in cash or putting some up front or however it works.

 

How and what is the procedure? I know we submit a CC when we board the ship, but does that person accept our cash or do we visit Guest Relations toward the end and give them cash.

 

I can't imagine the persons who are so busy getting us on the ship handling cash.

 

Thank you.

 

Just go to guest relations and make a payment.. if you decide for a cash account you dont need to give your credit card on the check-in time.. with X you will have a limit of 500 to spend until the system gets it as a cash account and block your card until you make a payment.

 

You can give cash on the first day of the cruise and be "on credit" or pay it in the end.. just remember the 500 usd limit

[Lois R]

This sounds complicated and I am a retired bookkeeper :)

I am considering, for the first time, paying off Sea Pass charges in cash or putting some up front or however it works.

 

How and what is the procedure? I know we submit a CC when we board the ship, but does that person accept our cash or do we visit Guest Relations toward the end and give them cash.

 

I can't imagine the persons who are so busy getting us on the ship handling cash.

 

Thank you.

 

Hi, I echo the previous poster. All you need to do? Go to Guest

Relations and they will be more than happy to accept your money:)

You can go there as many times as you like....if you want to give

them $$ several times over the course of your cruise? That is fine.

You may also check your account balance from your tv. I do that

alot.......if not every day, at least every other day. You can see

your charges as well as any credits/payments.