Review of Formal Nights

[seamist]

It's been my opinion for a while that the mass market lines are keeping formal nights alive solely for the income opportunities from the photography department. I also wonder at what point, as the cruising demographic changes and some of us age out of cruising, the tidal wave of "selfies" will do in cruise photographers.

 

BINGO. That is the quote of the day right there.

 

I am absolutely convinced you are correct, and DH and I have been saying this for a while now.

 

As long as people buy formal night photos expect formal night to hang around, simply because it is a revenue generator. Stop buying the photos and formal night will ultimately go into the graveyard of corsets and long white gloves.

[BlueRiband]

Should cruise lines still require formal /suits ie or country casual since airlines are now downsizing the carry on size suit case ?

 

What is your opinion :)

 

Count me in for keeping formal nights. It serves as a filter on guest behavior and I don't want to think of how some people will dress if it becomes "anything goes". The older well all get the less good we look in minimal attire.

 

Formal nights, on lines that observe it to a better degree, are a chance to feel elegant and enjoy a long tradition at sea. If I want to dress like I'm staying at Motel 6 then I'll book Motel 6.

[The-Inside-Cabin]

~

 

 

 

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[dbsb3233]

OK, I'll wade into this minefield.

 

I think the way things are now, with some cruises still formal (sadly only Cunard) and others "anything goes," the cruise industry offers something for everyone.

I still haven't found one of those "anything goes" cruises. I've been on 14 big-ship cruises in recent years (RCCL, Celebrity, NCL, Princess, Carnival) and they've all had formal nights. Admittedly, Carnival was weak. We dressed up in jacket and tie in Alaska last week and we were in the minority. Less than half the men wore a jacket. But it was still advertised as a requirement, so we complied, even though it would have been easier to pack less. It was only a 7-night cruise so packing wasn't a problem like it is on a 2-3 week cruise.

[dbsb3233]

It's been my opinion for a while that the mass market lines are keeping formal nights alive solely for the income opportunities from the photography department. I also wonder at what point, as the cruising demographic changes and some of us age out of cruising, the tidal wave of "selfies" will do in cruise photographers.

You're probably right.

 

Which is ironic, because most everyone brings their best cameras on a cruise with them. To actually PAY for photos (and pay dearly at that) on a cruise seems crazy to me when I already have a very good camera that can do the trick, but it never ceases to amaze me the number of people that actually buy them (at least based on how many people are clogging up the hallway where they're displayed, anyway).

 

The sheer waste of all that photo paper and ink always bothers me too.

[dbsb3233]

Have never and still do not understand what airline luggage size/weight/cost/etc restrictions have to do with formal nights on a ship...

I'll reply to this comment not to try and convince anyone to change their mind, but simply to explain how it can be an issue with luggage.

 

It doesn't make it impossible to pack extra (formal) clothes, but it does make it harder. Many people aren't willing to pay extra bagage fees, or overweight luggage penalties. Or they just prefer to pack lighter, perhaps because they struggle to shlep a full 50 lb bag + regulation carry-on between airports/hotels/ports. Or don't want to fold up their dress jacket into a suitcase. Dress shoes and jacket add 3-4 lbs to a suitcase. For a long cruise (2+ weeks), every pound is precious, especially if you want to bring back any souvenirs you might have bought during the trip.

 

I know many people don't care about any of that, and are just fine paying extra fees for baggage, or shipping items home, or laundry on the ship. That's fine for those that don't mind those extra charges. But for those that do, packing formal clothes just to wear for 2 hours to get past the MDR doorperson on a few nights can be an issue.

[ithaca gal]

It sounds like you only want opinions that agree with yours. Contrary opinions are considered slams and bullying. Too many say they ask for opinions on this topic and what they really want is some kind of permission not to follow they rules they know exist.

 

Now THAT is the quote of the day!

[POA1]

Or they just prefer to pack lighter, perhaps because they struggle to shlep a full 50 lb bag + regulation carry-on between airports/hotels/ports.

 

Excellent point! Whenever I have to schlep my formal wear aboard, I find myself singing "Swing Low, Sweet Chariot."

 

z9Y_GLT4_9I

[cruz chic]

I'll reply to this comment not to try and convince anyone to change their mind, but simply to explain how it can be an issue with luggage.

 

It doesn't make it impossible to pack extra (formal) clothes, but it does make it harder. Many people aren't willing to pay extra bagage fees, or overweight luggage penalties. Or they just prefer to pack lighter, perhaps because they struggle to shlep a full 50 lb bag + regulation carry-on between airports/hotels/ports. Or don't want to fold up their dress jacket into a suitcase. Dress shoes and jacket add 3-4 lbs to a suitcase. For a long cruise (2+ weeks), every pound is precious, especially if you want to bring back any souvenirs you might have bought during the trip.

 

I know many people don't care about any of that, and are just fine paying extra fees for baggage, or shipping items home, or laundry on the ship. That's fine for those that don't mind those extra charges. But for those that do, packing formal clothes just to wear for 2 hours to get past the MDR doorperson on a few nights can be an issue.

 

I'm a person that used to bring two suitcases and a carry on. That all changed when my luggage got lost. Now I bring one suitcase and a larger carry on. My luggage hasn't been over 50lbs with my formal clothes. It depends on what you want to bring. I've seen others say they bring tablecloths for the balcony. I'd rather bring clothes. If people don't want to bring formal then don't. I just admire someone that says they don't because they don't want to dress up.

[The-Inside-Cabin]

I enjoy dressing for formal night. I have no problem with those who don't want to dress, they should just enjoy another dining venue on formal night. I don't have a higher or lower opinion of anyone regardless of how they dress. The reason someone chooses to not dress on formal night is irrelevant. You can't get a waiver because you lost your luggage, don't want to pack formal, choose not to rent, are weary of wearing ties after a long career of wearing ties, live in a part of the country that never wears jacket/tie- whatever. No one owes me an explanation of why they don't want to wear a jacket and tie.

 

Conversely, don't ask me to sanction bending the rules to suit someones preference to not dress or ask me to explain how someones disregard for a dress code affects me.

 

Some of these threads involve someone wanting/hoping for non-enforcement of well established guidelines and justify their exemption seeking for one of the reasons above. A few will also cast those who enjoy dressing formal in a negative way implying that if you enjoy dressing up you have other negative qualities.

 

My simple plea; establish an easy to understand rule - jacket and tie is about as simple as it gets....then enforce it - no exceptions.

 

Back to the main point of the OP. Should cruise lines still have final nights? Yes, but only if they enforce the dress code.

 

If HAL determines most people don't want Gala nights....fine..I will still cruise with them, but please change the rules to match what you are willing to enforce.

Edited August 4, 2015 by Pete and Judy

[ithaca gal]

I'm a person that used to bring two suitcases and a carry on. That all changed when my luggage got lost. Now I bring one suitcase and a larger carry on. My luggage hasn't been over 50lbs with my formal clothes. It depends on what you want to bring. I've seen others say they bring tablecloths for the balcony. I'd rather bring clothes. If people don't want to bring formal then don't. I just admire someone that says they don't because they don't want to dress up.

 

Exactly. I bring one 25" rolling suitcase and one large tote bag. Not only do I have plenty of makeup items, lots of casual clothes and a couple of nice outfits for formal evenings (including shoes), I have room for 12 Diet Dr. Peppers! If I end up buying any souvenirs (have been there, done that at most of the islands), they fill up the space where the DDP bottles were!

 

If you don't want to dress up, just say so. (Oh -- and enjoy the same meal from Room Service or treat yourself in the Lido!)

[dbsb3233]

I'm a person that used to bring two suitcases and a carry on. That all changed when my luggage got lost. Now I bring one suitcase and a larger carry on. My luggage hasn't been over 50lbs with my formal clothes. It depends on what you want to bring. I've seen others say they bring tablecloths for the balcony. I'd rather bring clothes. If people don't want to bring formal then don't. I just admire someone that says they don't because they don't want to dress up.

I know for us, it comes down to the length of the cruise. For a 7-day cruise, we bring jacket and dress shoes because we have no problem fitting it in with 7 changes of clothes.

 

14+ days is a different matter.

 

But again (as you say), everyone packs differently. We don't pack a tablecloth, but we do bring some other things that others may not. And we want to leave some room for buying souvenirs.

Edited August 4, 2015 by dbsb3233

[dakrewser]

The reason someone chooses to not dress on formal night is irrelevant. You can't get a waiver because you lost your luggage.

 

Actually, you can. I've known people that this has happened to.

[The-Inside-Cabin]

Actually, you can. I've known people that this has happened to.

 

 

I correct my comment. You shouldn't get a waiver.

 

People get into the MDR on gala night not properly dressed on some ships, not on others, for some reasons and not others.

 

But that inconsistent enforcement of rules is the source of all this discussion.

 

Inconsistent application of rules causes frustration to everyone.

[cruz chic]

I know for us, it comes down to the length of the cruise. For a 7-day cruise, we bring jacket and dress shoes because we have no problem fitting it in with 7 changes of clothes.

 

14+ days is a different matter.

 

But again (as you say), everyone packs differently. We don't pack a tablecloth, but we do bring some other things that others may not. And we want to leave some room for buying souvenirs.

 

Sorry, I should have added that most of my cruises are between 15 to 18 days (cruise and hotel stay). I don't have much of a problem with 7 day cruises.

[cruz chic]

Actually, you can. I've known people that this has happened to.

 

It happened to me when my luggage was lost. That said I'm a rule follower to a fault. Before my cruise started I did some quick shopping and managed to pick up something for formal. Hal did offer up formal clothes for free from the rental so no reason to not conform.

[dbsb3233]

Sorry, I should have added that most of my cruises are between 15 to 18 days (cruise and hotel stay). I don't have much of a problem with 7 day cruises.

That's impressive. You really do pack light!

[dakrewser]

I correct my comment. You shouldn't get a waiver.

 

Glad you aren't running the ship. It's bad enough that it might be 2, 3 or more days until your luggage catches up with you but you'd have those folks eating room service 3 meals a day for that time...

 

Expecting HAL's overworked dining room personnel to also act as "fashion police" is a little over the top. In my view, HAL expects passengers to "do the right thing". Sadly, on board ship as in some many other areas, that simply doesn't happen.

[cruz chic]

That's impressive. You really do pack light!

 

Now that is funny:D. No one ever accuses me of that;). It's a struggle but I manage to do it.

[AncientWanderer]

Like some here, I really don't want to see the HAL employees made to be dress code enforcers. Seems to me that might be one of the reasons for the change in wording of the guidelines. It puts HAL in a really awkward position to "require" certain dress of its guests. I think some posters here are really underestimating how belligerent some guests may be when they are turned away from the MDR or even handed a jacket to put on. People in general aren't as polite and compliant as they used to be and there's no need to invite hostility to the MDR on a nice evening.

 

I'd rather leave it up to the honor system of the guest. I'd rather see one slob in the MDR than a humiliated and verbally abused HAL employee. The crewmembers work really hard and I see no reason to put them in a difficult position. It just isn't worth it, as far as I'm concerned. And I DO really love formal nights.

[cruz chic]

Like some here, I really don't want to see the HAL employees made to be dress code enforcers. Seems to me that might be one of the reasons for the change in wording of the guidelines. It puts HAL in a really awkward position to "require" certain dress of its guests. I think some posters here are really underestimating how belligerent some guests may be when they are turned away from the MDR or even handed a jacket to put on. People in general aren't as polite and compliant as they used to be and there's no need to invite hostility to the MDR on a nice evening.

 

I'd rather leave it up to the honor system of the guest. I'd rather see one slob in the MDR than a humiliated and verbally abused HAL employee. The crewmembers work really hard and I see no reason to put them in a difficult position. It just isn't worth it, as far as I'm concerned. And I DO really love formal nights.

It is the requirement of Hal to dress formally. If they request it, they should enforce it or end it. People will try to get away with anything. I'm amazed that people would get belligerent about it given they should know better.

[The-Inside-Cabin]

It is the requirement of Hal to dress formally. If they request it, they should enforce it or end it. People will try to get away with anything. I'm amazed that people would get belligerent about it given they should know better.

 

I agree. Enforce or end. It's really pretty simple.

 

Unfortunately, when some people are caught breaking the rules: smoking in unauthorized locations, wearing pajamas to the lido, saving deck chairs, not attending muster drills, jogging on the promenade in front of the "no jogging" signs, taking flash photos during the shows, they often get belligerent and rude.

 

HAL wrote the rules, and in some cases laws, and have a duty to the 99% of the compliant passengers to enforce them.

Edited August 4, 2015 by Pete and Judy

[AncientWanderer]

I agree. Enforce or end. It's really pretty simple.

 

Unfortunately, when some people are caught breaking the rules: smoking in unauthorized locations, wearing pajamas to the lido, saving deck chairs, not attending muster drills, jogging on the promenade in front of the "no jogging" signs, taking flash photos during the shows, they often get belligerent and rude.

 

HAL wrote the rules, and in some cases laws, and have a duty to the 99% of the compliant passengers to enforce them.

 

Oh, I'd hate to throw the baby out with the bath water. Sometimes we need to pick our battles, I guess. Enforcement of safety issues would, of course, be nonnegotiable. Meanwhile, I'm gonna go pack my party dress.

[The-Inside-Cabin]

Like some here, I really don't want to see the HAL employees made to be dress code enforcers. Seems to me that might be one of the reasons for the change in wording of the guidelines. It puts HAL in a really awkward position to "require" certain dress of its guests. I think some posters here are really underestimating how belligerent some guests may be when they are turned away from the MDR or even handed a jacket to put on. People in general aren't as polite and compliant as they used to be and there's no need to invite hostility to the MDR on a nice evening.

 

 

 

I'd rather leave it up to the honor system of the guest. I'd rather see one slob in the MDR than a humiliated and verbally abused HAL employee. The crewmembers work really hard and I see no reason to put them in a difficult position. It just isn't worth it, as far as I'm concerned. And I DO really love formal nights.

 

 

If they enforce the rules CONSISTENTLY and kick belligerent passengers off the ship, the problem won't be a problem for long. It wouldn't take many disrespectful passenger to get the boot for the word to get around. People do it because they get away with it. Stop accepting it and they will stop.

 

Airlines will routinely kick belligerents off their planes and ban them from future travel. Cruise lines can do the same thing - they shouldn't cave into the bullies. It only encourages them.

 

I once wandered by the room where they held luggage that contained contraband liquor people tried to smuggle onboard......talk about belligerent guests. HAL seemed to handle them ok.

Edited August 4, 2015 by Pete and Judy

[Beejay4016]

Thankyou!

 

 

 

I understand that there will be exceptions, but there are some who travel just for the cruise & make statements about not taking formal outfits due to airline restrictions.. :( That's hogwash! Just because you take the longer vacations, is not a reason for HAL to cancel Gala/Formal nights.. There are many who still enjoy dressing up & can do it without a problem..

 

When we flew, my DH always took at least one jacket or suit with a tie & wore it on the plane... I was required to be dressed in a suit or dress with hose, when we were Non Revenue on our carrier as well as all other carriers around the world.. It was only much later in my career, that I was even permitted to wear a pantsuit.. To this day, we must be appropriately dressed if we want to fly Non-Rev, especially in First or Business class.. Our Son was so proud at the age of 13 when he was dressed in a suit & was able to fly first class..

 

We've also met many Europeans, Asians & Australians as well as young people from all over the world, who have been able to take the appropriate clothes without a problem.. See the post I quoted above from Beejay who is from your area..:)

 

Thanks for your comments. We'll certainly be taking formal gear for our cruise on the Noordam next March. Dressing up in a long dress on a beautiful ship is the closest I'll ever get to a bit of old-fashioned Hollywood glamour, so I would be really sorry to see it disappear. :)

Edited August 4, 2015 by Beejay4016