SS United States won't return to service after all

[Cruise Liner Fan]

I know that this is the Cunard Line message board but this news means that the Queen Mary 2 will not have any competition after all on transatlantic crossings and other cruises.Remember that last February Crystal Cruises announced plans to return the SS United States to service pending a feasibility study. 2 days ago Crystal Cruises announced that they will not go forward to renovate the SS United States because of price and technical issues. The technical issues were about the stern section of the SS United States would have to be rebuilt from 4 to 2 propeller shafts and the problems of finding similar new steel to match the older steel from the early 1950s that forms the stern section of the SS United States. If Crystal Cruises did go forward to renovate the SS United States the project would have also transformed the SS United States from a Steam Ship to a Motor Ship meaning replacing the steam plant with a diesel-electric plant like what was done to the QE2 in 1986-87. Here are 2 links to the news http://www.torontosun.com/2016/08/05/crystal-cruises-ss-united-states-ocean-liner-restoration-too-pricey and http://www.travelweekly.com/cruise-travel/crystal-wont-proceed-with-ss-united-states-revival Regards,Jerry

Edited August 7, 2016 by Cruise Liner Fan

[emileg]

How sad. We lived in Philadelphia for 4.5 years up to 3 years ago. It was always a pleasure to pass the S.S. United States whenever we drove past her on our way to Target or IKEA, where she is berthed almost right across the street. We were hoping she would be brought back to life like NCL did with the S.S. France and did a beautiful conversion into the Norway back in 1980. We just might have to enjoy some of the ambiance recreated in the S.S. United States restaurant on the Celebrity Infinity, unless it has been or will be replaced by the Tuscan Grill. Again, how sad.

 

Thanks for letting us know. - An Ocean Liner Fan.

Edited August 7, 2016 by emileg

[balf]

This was just the latest no hoper. Never was even a possibility. By the way , anyone know of progress on Titanic 2. Gone a bit quiet lately.

 

Anyway, we can now give full attention the QE2, another lost cause.

 

David.

[BlueRiband]

Although the France was successfully converted to the Norway her steam power plant was not replaced and SOLAS 2010 along with Safe Return to Port requirements were not in effect then. A more detailed article stated the hull would need to be reconfigured for a double-shaft rudder among other things. The extent of the rebuild would have placed her into the Safe Return to Port requirements. While I'm not surprised, I am disappointed as one who would like to have seen her sail again.

[Cruise Liner Fan]

This was just the latest no hoper. Never was even a possibility. By the way , anyone know of progress on Titanic 2. Gone a bit quiet lately.

 

Anyway, we can now give full attention the QE2, another lost cause.

 

David.

David, Here is the latest news from the vintage news on March 30,2016 concerning the Titanic II and let's just sat that Titanic II will never be built. Clive Palmer the alleged Australian billionaire who first proposed the Titanic II project in 2012 is just a fake, phony, fraud. Here is the link https://www.thevintagenews.com/2016/03/30/titanic-ii-plans-put-hold-likely-wont-ever-go/ Regards,Jerry Edited August 7, 2016 by Cruise Liner Fan

[BlueRiband]

Although Clive Palmer's representatives claimed that he "might" work on the Titanic II project in his retirement there is no signed contract with any shipyard. Deltamarin, the firm which designed the ship, had finished all contracted work in December 2014. They refer all questions regarding the project status to the Blue Star Line. (BTW, Blue Star has not updated their web site since May of 2014.)

Edited August 8, 2016 by BlueRiband

[canoncruiser]

It’s really a shame about the BIG U but entirely understandable. Shipping lines exist to make money-Crystal has decided they could not afford the re-do of the United States. Just as Stephen Payne had to prove to Carnival that QM2 could make money, Crystal decided that it could not.

My parents had a very good friend who was a senior Cabin Class Dining Room steward and I remember going down to the pier to look her over when I was a little boy in 1953; one great thing was the air-conditioning which was not common in those days.The first time we went over her was on a very hot August evening and the shock of the outside heat was great. She was a great piece of marine architecture but as I got older and came to know the French, British and Italian ships, her American moderne decor left much to be desired IMHO. She was nevertheless a glorious statement of American know-how.:)

[emileg]

Originally Posted By canoncruiser

... She was a great piece of marine architecture but as I got older and came to know the French, British and Italian ships, her American moderne decor left much to be desired IMHO. She was nevertheless a glorious statement of American know-how.:)

Yes, I have seen pictures of the interior of the SS United States. I agree that the interior design lacked the charm of the European ocean liners of the time.

Edited August 8, 2016 by emileg

[BlueRiband]

Yes, I have seen pictures of the interior of the SS United States. I agree that the interior design lacked the charm of the European ocean liners of the time.

 

And for that reason some preferred to sail on her running mate, SS America which had a late art deco interior much like the original RMS Queen Elizabeth. Given the tortured end-of-life stories of both ships - where their carcasses were left to rot - I'm convinced that scrapping is not the worst thing to happen to a ship.

 

Still, I would have liked to have seen the United States and QM2 together in New York. What a horn exchange that would have been.

[DWhit]

So, Blue Riband, I sam guessing you will know. Who has the record and the last official Blue Riband?

[chengkp75]

So, Blue Riband, I sam guessing you will know. Who has the record and the last official Blue Riband?

 

Are you asking about the "Blue Riband" or the "Hale's Trophy"?

 

The Blue Riband is an unofficial award and required the vessel to have the fastest average speed of both eastbound and westbound crossings. The last holder of the Blue Riband is the SSUS.

 

The Hale's trophy only requires the fastest crossing, usually the eastbound. The current holder of the Hale's trophy is Fjord Cat (Cat-Link V), a catamaran ferry built by INCAT who have the trophy in Tasmania.

[loubetti]

The Big U was the last holder of the Blue Riband, and she also held the Hales trophy even into her retirement.

 

Now, let's see how my memory serves:

 

Prior to the Big U it was Queen Mary, who finally took it from Normandie after trading it a couple times back and forth. Then the Rex had it, and Bremen and Europa. Bremen took it from Mauretania in 1929, with the latter having held it for some 22 years! Of course the list goes on...

[loubetti]

Yes, I have seen pictures of the interior of the SS United States. I agree that the interior design lacked the charm of the European ocean liners of the time.

 

This was due to Gibbs' obsession (though prudent) that almost everything had be be fire proof. Remember, the Big U was built with government subsidy to be quickly converted into a troop ship, not that such mattered with the Queens, as they did a superb job as troop ships in WWII!

[chengkp75]

This was due to Gibbs' obsession (though prudent) that almost everything had be be fire proof. Remember, the Big U was built with government subsidy to be quickly converted into a troop ship, not that such mattered with the Queens, as they did a superb job as troop ships in WWII!

 

Prudent indeed, when you consider the Normandie. Conversion to troop ship was quite a deal. Even the QE2 had a warehouse full of plywood cut and labeled to fit over the carpeting just waiting for use, which it was during the Falklands War. Also, consider that the RMS Queen Elizabeth was designed for just 2300 pax, but carried 11,000 troops at a time.

 

Yes, the Hale's trophy was at Kings Point until claimed by the INCAT ferries in 1990. The Fjord Cat claimed the trophy in 1998.

[Cruise Liner Fan]

Prudent indeed, when you consider the Normandie. Conversion to troop ship was quite a deal. Even the QE2 had a warehouse full of plywood cut and labeled to fit over the carpeting just waiting for use, which it was during the Falklands War. Also, consider that the RMS Queen Elizabeth was designed for just 2300 pax, but carried 11,000 troops at a time.

 

Yes, the Hale's trophy was at Kings Point until claimed by the INCAT ferries in 1990. The Fjord Cat claimed the trophy in 1998.

 

Since those ugly looking INCAT Ferries are not Ocean Liners or even Cruise Ships, Why not just give the Hale's Trophy to the Cunard Line for continuing the transatlantic run and building the Queen Mary 2? Regards,Jerry

Edited August 9, 2016 by Cruise Liner Fan

[chengkp75]

Since those ugly looking INCAT Ferries are not Ocean Liners or even Cruise Ships, Why not just give the Hale's Trophy to the Cunard Line for continuing the transatlantic run and building the Queen Mary 2? Regards,Jerry

 

Well, the trustees of the Hale's trophy ruled that the ferries met the definition of a "passenger vessel", which was what the trophy was originally defined for. And why would it go to Cunard, unless the QM2 could beat the SSUS's times? If you want to disqualify the INCAT's (like they did for Branson's speed boat attempts), then it should rightfully revert to the SSUS. While the Blue Riband was defined as the award to the fastest ocean liner in regular service, even if the QM2 could cut in the afterburners and get above 34 knots, she is not in "regular service" as the crossings are only seasonal now.

Edited August 9, 2016 by chengkp75

[Cruise Liner Fan]

Well, the trustees of the Hale's trophy ruled that the ferries met the definition of a "passenger vessel", which was what the trophy was originally defined for. And why would it go to Cunard, unless the QM2 could beat the SSUS's times? If you want to disqualify the INCAT's (like they did for Branson's speed boat attempts), then it should rightfully revert to the SSUS. While the Blue Riband was defined as the award to the fastest ocean liner in regular service, even if the QM2 could cut in the afterburners and get above 34 knots, she is not in "regular service" as the crossings are only seasonal now.

But then even the original Queen Mary and Queen Elizabeth would end up doing about 10 or 11 Eastbound crossings and about 10 or 11 Westbound crossings per year because after doing a crossing either ship would spend about 4 or 5 days in the Ports of New York or Southampton before turning around and sailing across the Atlantic in the other direction. This year QM2 is doing 10 Eastbound crossings and 11 Westbound crossings. Regards,Jerry

[BlueRiband]

There is no formal governing body for the Blue Riband, but it was traditionally awarded to the ship in regular passenger service that set the record for the WB crossing. This is the more challenging route because the ship is sailing against the Gulf Stream.

 

At 34.51 knots the SS United States still holds that record. In order for any qualified ship to take it from her it would have to beat the record.

 

QM2 once hit 30 knots in her initial sea trials and it would be a physical impossibility for her. Even if some future advancement in pod technology let her economically rev it up her hull isn't designed to go above that. She cannot take the Riband from the SSUS any more than Titanic could have from the Mauretania.

[chengkp75]

But then even the original Queen Mary and Queen Elizabeth would end up doing about 10 or 11 Eastbound crossings and about 10 or 11 Westbound crossings per year because after doing a crossing either ship would spend about 4 or 5 days in the Ports of New York or Southampton before turning around and sailing across the Atlantic in the other direction. This year QM2 is doing 10 Eastbound crossings and 11 Westbound crossings. Regards,Jerry

 

And yet, the SSUS logged 1 million miles in 6.17 years of crossings, for an average of about 50 crossings, 25 round trips per year. :D

[Germancruiser]

As a ship lover all my life- even I can see that there is no point in bringing the " Big U" back to service! Totaly outdated main structure. I hope they put her to rest and use the steel for someting else! No point in keeping the Ship rusting away. Not a pretty sight anyway! Inside dark and gloomy with no big windows...! Well the Big U had her time - but it´s a bygone area!

Sooner or later the same happens to the old QE2 - outdated and no point in bringing her back to service!

[Cruise Liner Fan]

As a ship lover all my life- even I can see that there is no point in bringing the " Big U" back to service! Totaly outdated main structure. I hope they put her to rest and use the steel for someting else! No point in keeping the Ship rusting away. Not a pretty sight anyway! Inside dark and gloomy with no big windows...! Well the Big U had her time - but it´s a bygone area!

Sooner or later the same happens to the old QE2 - outdated and no point in bringing her back to service!

Well the QE2's interior is still intact so it would be much cheaper to put her into service as a floating hotel/convention center as compared to the SS United States whose interiors have been stripped down to the bare metal bulkheads and it would cost hundreds of millions of dollars to rebuild her interiors. Sadly I don't see the SS United States being converted to a floating hotel/convention center. The QE2 maybe but the SS United States No. Regards,Jerry Edited August 11, 2016 by Cruise Liner Fan

[BlueRiband]

Well the QE2's interior is still intact so it would be much cheaper to put her into service as a floating hotel/convention center as compared to the SS United States whose interiors have been stripped down to the bare metal bulkheads and it would cost hundreds of millions of dollars to rebuild her interiors. Sadly I don't see the SS United States being converted to a floating hotel/convention center. The QE2 maybe but the SS United States No. Regards,Jerry

 

The few who have manged to board QE2 in recent months claim that she literally stinks and is rotting from the inside out. Her air conditioning has been turned off since the initial caretaker crew was dismissed and her diesels shut down. While her exterior has been cleaned up and shore side power makes her look alive, the images are very deceiving.

[Cruise Liner Fan]

The few who have manged to board QE2 in recent months claim that she literally stinks and is rotting from the inside out. Her air conditioning has been turned off since the initial caretaker crew was dismissed and her diesels shut down. While her exterior has been cleaned up and shore side power makes her look alive, the images are very deceiving.

 

Well now it does look like the future for the QE2 looks very bleak too and now the QE2 joins the SS United States into the sea of lost causes. Regards,Jerry

Edited August 11, 2016 by Cruise Liner Fan

[BlueRiband]

QE2's owners refuse to talk to anybody and will only say vaguely that there are "plans" for the ship. The way things are going it appears that those "plans" are to make her look decent will she's sitting there until the 10-year "no forward sale" clock runs out. Then she'll be towed to Alang.

[Cruise Liner Fan]

QE2's owners refuse to talk to anybody and will only say vaguely that there are "plans" for the ship. The way things are going it appears that those "plans" are to make her look decent will she's sitting there until the 10-year "no forward sale" clock runs out. Then she'll be towed to Alang.

Sadly with only a little over 2 years left in the 10 year no forward sale clock, I would not be surprised that your prediction becomes true. Regards,Jerry