Tipping now more important than ever

[LGW59]

2 minutes ago, frantic36 said:

 

Here in Australia if someone has gone above and beyond what they need to do not for regular service I tip and tell them why. Unfortunately more recently we see more expectation that tipping be the norm especially in high tourism areas. This is because of tourists who choose to ignore the normal tipping culture of the places they visit. This makes it annoying and frustrating for the locals who live there...but you do you.

I am thinking if locals, the staff do not expect more. which is all well and good.  But for me, as my tipping  culture is different, I do me and will continue to do me, no matter what others think/like/say, no matter the country I am in. 

[LGW59]

5 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

You complained about other posters not wanting to tip in USA so I would say hypocrisy is a real problem😂 and if your form of appreciation is causing harm to society and changing their culture for the worst then again it is a real problem. As you have answered yes to my previous questions you obviously don't care about the places you travel to and are only in interested in self gratification. It is a pity as the world could do with less ugly tourists😔. 

stay in Sydney and how does tipping harm society?  Jeez get a life already

Edited February 27, 2022 by LGW59

[ilikeanswers]

3 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

I am thinking if locals, the staff do not expect more. which is all well and good.  But for me, as my tipping  culture is different, I do me and will continue to do me, no matter what others think/like/say, no matter the country I am in. 

 

If a destination has a dress code do you disregard that as well and do whatever you like? 

[LGW59]

3 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

If a destination has a dress code do you disregard that as well and do whatever you like? 

I follow the dress code only if I ever meet the Queen.  Otherwise, nah, a bunch of nonsense and yes, I disregard.

Edited February 27, 2022 by LGW59

[ilikeanswers]

Just now, LGW59 said:

I follow the dress code only if I ever meet the Queen.  Otherwise, nah, a bunch of nonsense.  

 

So if they say you can't visit a sight without dressing a certain way you do you just not go or try to force your way in? And why do you respect the Queen so much😳? 

[LGW59]

Just now, ilikeanswers said:

 

So if they say you can't visit a sight without dressing a certain way you do you just not go or try to force your way in? And why do you respect the Queen so much😳? 

When I went to the Vatican, I of course followed their protocols.  If I were to have audience with the Queen (won't happen) I'd of course again follow the protocols.  I respect her because of what she has meant to her country.  Personally think the monarchy thing is silly, but I respect her and what she means to her "subjects"  Anyway, I am respectful, regardless of whether I may agree or disagree with something.  Still has zero to do with my tipping philosophy.  I will tip wherever I am, like it or not. 

[ilikeanswers]

7 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

stay in Sydney and how does tipping harm society?  Jeez get a life already

 

I just posted it creates discrimination between tourists and locals. Locals can't get into restaurants, resorts and on tours but it also over values the tourism either making it out of reach for locals and taking people out of more necessary industries. But as you stated you don't care about the locals so you don't care about the issues. However you also shouldn't complain if tourists in the USA refuse to tip. If you are willing to ignore local culture in favour of your own you should allow the same for tourists in your country. 

[ilikeanswers]

1 minute ago, LGW59 said:

When I went to the Vatican, I of course followed their protocols.  If I were to have audience with the Queen (won't happen) I'd of course again follow the protocols.  I respect her because of what she has meant to her country.  Personally think the monarchy thing is silly, but I respect her and what she means to her "subjects"  Anyway, I am respectful, regardless of whether I may agree or disagree with something.  Still has zero to do with my tipping philosophy.  I will tip wherever I am, like it or not. 

 

I still don't understand why do you have respect for symbolic protocols but not renumeration customs? 

[LGW59]

1 minute ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

I still don't understand why do you have respect for symbolic protocols but not renumeration customs? 

Remuneration customs are totally subjective, I do me, and you do you, end of discussion.  I tip no matter where I am in the world.  Nothing further needed

[frantic36]

5 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

I still don't understand why do you have respect for symbolic protocols but not renumeration customs? 

 

Best put this troll LGW on ignore, that's what I have done. He is either too entitled or just stirring the pot. Either way not worth wasting time with. 

[LGW59]

6 minutes ago, frantic36 said:

 

Best put this troll LGW on ignore, that's what I have done. He is either too entitled or just stirring the pot. Either way not worth wasting time with. 

please do

[ilikeanswers]

1 minute ago, frantic36 said:

Best put this troll LGW on ignore, that's what I have done. He is either too entitled or just stirring the pot. Either way not worth wasting time with. 

 

😂 I'm a curious person so like to understand their thinking. I don't think they are troll but entitled might be right. They did say they tip for self gratification not because they care about the staff. And maybe that is one of the issues with tipping it puts so much power into the customer they can't let that go when they visit somewhere that does not entitle them to that power🤔. 

[LGW59]

2 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

😂 I'm a curious person so like to understand their thinking. I don't think they are troll but entitled might be right. They did say they tip for self gratification not because they care about the staff. And maybe that is one of the issues with tipping it puts so much power into the customer they can't let that go when they visit somewhere that does not entitle them to that power🤔. 

"they" are not a troll.  Good night, put me on ignore, it's all good

Edited February 27, 2022 by LGW59

[Hlitner]

46 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

I will be on a land vacation in Mexico, in April for two weeks, all inclusive, I will be tipping.  I am certain they will be happy with the tips.  Not trying to change their culture, just showing my appreciation for what they do. Go find a real problem already. 

Tipping in Mexico (especially by Gringos) is fine (we live in Mexico 10 weeks every year).  But there are some places where tipping is actually seen as in insult and tippers are quietly viewed as naïve idiots.  Some others might call it the Ugly American syndrome where some Americans try to project American culture where it is neither wanted nor considered proper.  Japan (a place I once lived for 2 years) is one such place and there are quite a few others.

 

This entire thread is kind of sad but also enlightening.  Most wise travelers try to learn something of the culture of the places they visit and adapt to that culture.  But there are others who insist on sticking with their own culture (like saying "mine is better then yours") which is not something that makes friends.  I still remember the first time we visited Australia and were out with some Aussie friends who made it a point to discourage us from leaving a tip.  They explained that "they pay folks a living wage" and that they resent anyone trying to impose their own culture on their country.  We have met folks in the UK who have the same attitude although in more recent years there does seem to be more folks in the UK who do tip. 

 

So in the USA it is now considered proper (by many) to tip around 20% in decent restaurants.  But in Italy, a 20% tip would be considered ostentatious and although accepted would not engender any respect (you would probably be considered an idiot and a show off).   And it is the same the world over where countries (and even regions within a country) have their own culturally based tipping standards.

 

Having lived in a foreign country (Japan for 2 years) I too often saw fellow Americans projecting our culture which I knew was very insulting to most Japanese.  Not only was it embarrassing (for me to see) but it did nothing to get the respect of the locals.  This taught me at an early age (I was in my 20s) to respect local culture and do my best to show my respect by adhering to the customs of my host country.  Perhaps that has now changed and it is OK to push one's own beliefs onto the world...but I am still old fashioned and will continue to respect local cultures.  Maybe that is why after more than half a century as an avid world traveler (and cruiser) I have never tired of travel and its many related adventures.

 

Hank  

[ilikeanswers]

5 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

"they" are not a troll.  Good night, put me on ignore, it's all good

 

I did say I don't think you are a troll. I have met tourists who care little for local customs or the impact they have in local communities so I know your type of traveller exist in RL. But by that token you can't also complain of tourists in USA not tipping. If you can do you than tourists in USA can do themselves😉. 

[ilikeanswers]

11 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

Tipping in Mexico (especially by Gringos) is fine (we live in Mexico 10 weeks every year).  But there are some places where tipping is actually seen as in insult and tippers are quietly viewed as naïve idiots.  

 

I probably should have clarified that I didn't mean there was no tipping in Mexico but that the tipping culture is different to USA and by tipping like Americans in Mexico it is causing problems for the locals who also want to enjoy tourism in their own country. Point being if you want to show genuine appreciation learn and respect the ways locals do things🤗. 

Edited February 27, 2022 by ilikeanswers

[ldubs]

4 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

It is easy for you to say don't overthink it because you are not a tourist so you are well accustomed to your culture. As a tourist I'm trying to "fit in" and it does make it much more confusing when the locals can't agree😂. 

 

Yes, I was attempting to assist with your apparent confusion on tipping.  The approach I gave will work just fine at any restaurant you visit in America.   

   

 

 

[ldubs]

11 hours ago, Peter Lanky said:

So you are suggesting that I am not well travelled purely on the basis that I have not been on a cruise, or on an organised tour prior to 10 years ago? Surely that fact that people will not know about something they are not looking for is reasonable. I have never been skiing, and other than knowing that you fasten a couple of lumps of wood to your feet, I know nothing about the features of a skiing holiday, and why would I? I don't need to know so I have never looked into it. It's the same with cruises.

 

I cannot find any data on how long auto tipping has been in operation, but I suspect that it is relatively modern, when operators realised that it could be used to pretend the holiday was cheaper than it really is. Maybe somebody knows the answer?

 

No, I'm suggesting if you were not aware of expected gratuities on cruise ships, then your experience is lacking -- just like your experience with whatever kind of skiing you are talking about is lacking.   

 

 

[ldubs]

11 hours ago, KBs mum said:

Not true, it became widespread with the rise of the US based megaships. It is still not usual on ships which don't have a majority of US passengers. 

 

Expected gratuities were around 45 years ago when I was first exposed to cruise vacations.  And, I expect they were around long before that.  I do suspect the process is geared towards the American market.  The auto-grat, or prepaid grats are more recent.  Maybe in the last 10 years?   IMO, they made the process that much easier.   

 

 

[ldubs]

11 hours ago, KBs mum said:

We are discussing tips on ships with international crews and passengers, and with different registrations, and the pros and cons of tipping in general, using examples we know of from our travels. It's not all about the US, although as the primary example of a tipping culture it has been cited in examples of pro tipping culture. Many cruisers will never visit US territory. 

 

?? My comment was in reply to another post about restnt tipping in America.  

[ldubs]

5 hours ago, onlyslightlymad said:

Of course they do.  We have very high standards of service.  If they don't chin the bar they don't stay.  Why would we employ people who were unwilling to meet our standards.  Conversely, why should some of them get more money than others because they are prettier or blonder or accept poorer behaviour from customers or whatever.  They deserve respect for what they do

 

I am fascinated that employee performance is uniform across the board.  I understand that the standards are uniform and set high.   But surely some, whatever metrics you use, exceed the standards.  Is there any incentive for those who outperform the minimum standards? 

[ldubs]

11 hours ago, KBs mum said:

Outside the US, tipping is not usually required for this service, proving that tipping is not necessary to make it happen 

 

This is good to know as I was pretty sure tipping of bell-persons was routine in Europe and the U.K.  

[ldubs]

12 hours ago, KBs mum said:

Complain to the establishment. The bad waiters won't remain waiters for long, if bad service continues the establishment won't be in business for long.

 

 

6 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

 

Yes, I could "complain to the establishment" -- but why not cut out the middleman by reducing the compensation for service found to be unsatisfactory?  

 

Absolutely any good manager would want customer feedback.  And, I can assure you it happens.  That is not replaced by our tipping custom.   

[ldubs]

6 hours ago, onlyslightlymad said:

 But if I'm in the US I'll tip.  I just wish I could do it at the start of the meal.

 

According to Ms. Manners, that would be a "no no".  😁   Don't get me wrong the server would happily take your offering and might even pay you more attention with the expectation of a nice tip.  

[KBs mum]

4 hours ago, frantic36 said:

 

Best put this troll LGW on ignore, that's what I have done. He is either too entitled or just stirring the pot. Either way not worth wasting time with. 

I'm thinking LGW is taking a tipping discussion as an attack on the US, and is unable to comprehend that we are using US tipping culture as examples, not talking about it, if we are it's only about how it has spread to different countries. 

 

By the way, as someone mentioned the Queen, she doesn't tip, she famously doesn't carry money. There isn't a dress code for meeting her, any dress code is that of the event or establishment. Not intending to derail the discussion, just thought I'd add a factoid.