Business class not available? Disappointing Viking Air

[Mike07]

9 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

 

At one time, Southwest had a "direct" flight from Baltimore to Oakland.  It only made EIGHT stops along the way, but it was "direct" because the flight number never changed.

 

BWI-BNA-MSY-DAL-HOU-ABQ-PHX-LAS-LAX-OAK

 

So don't just assume that if you are told a flight is "direct" that you will be on a non-stop.

 

 

 

 

Yes, I 100% agree with you that in 1943 and 2023, there is a difference between "direct" and "non-stop". But in 2023, I think most people take direct to mean non-stop. While words do matter, I don't think beating people up over it makes much sense.

 

How far back was that "direct" Southworst flight you mentioned?

[FlyerTalker]

53 minutes ago, Mike07 said:

Yes, I 100% agree with you that in 1943 and 2023, there is a difference between "direct" and "non-stop". But in 2023, I think most people take direct to mean non-stop. While words do matter, I don't think beating people up over it makes much sense.

 

I think that the folks who buy a "direct" flight and find out that it involves both stops and an aircraft change would say that they wish they knew in advance.

 

If you take a post as "beating people up", well what more can be said than "wow".

 

 

[Breckski]

26 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

I think that the folks who buy a "direct" flight and find out that it involves both stops and an aircraft change would say that they wish they knew in advance.

 

If you take a post as "beating people up", well what more can be said than "wow".

 

 

Does this ever happen in the US today?  I've been on such flights a couple of times in South America.  It used to be and likely still is that in Chile you didn't have the option of non-stop flights to many spots.  The plane would land and some passengers would exit while other boarded. 

.

But I've never experienced this in the US and am curious how common this is in the US.  We typically only fly the big 3 carriers so that may be why I've never seen this in the US. 

[Mike07]

53 minutes ago, mwike said:

Does this ever happen in the US today?  I've been on such flights a couple of times in South America.  It used to be and likely still is that in Chile you didn't have the option of non-stop flights to many spots.  The plane would land and some passengers would exit while other boarded. 

.

But I've never experienced this in the US and am curious how common this is in the US.  We typically only fly the big 3 carriers so that may be why I've never seen this in the US. 

 

 

I second this question.

 

Southwest is the only one I'm aware of that makes routes where they may make the distinction between direct and non-stop or has a small note that "No plane change" happens during a layover. If FlyerTalk is the SME on aviation, I'm curious if Delta, United, or AA allow people to stay on the plane during a layover if they're on the following flight.

 

My guess is that Viking doesn't contract with Southwest. So good on them.

[OneSixtyToOne]

10 minutes ago, Mike07 said:

 

 

I second this question.

 

Southwest is the only one I'm aware of that makes routes where they may make the distinction between direct and non-stop or has a small note that "No plane change" happens during a layover. If FlyerTalk is the SME on aviation, I'm curious if Delta, United, or AA allow people to stay on the plane during a layover if they're on the following flight.

 

My guess is that Viking doesn't contract with Southwest. So good on them.

I’ve had it happen on American many years ago. Literally everyone got off the plane except me. The flight attendants started talking and were startled that I was onboard. There was a 90 minute layover and I didn’t feel like leaving.

[FlyerTalker]

2 hours ago, mwike said:

Does this ever happen in the US today? 

It's not as common as it used to be, but still exists.

 

DL does this for some international itineraries.  For example, they have intermittently marketed a "direct" flight from Miami to Tel Aviv.  But it flew to JFK, where there's an aircraft change.  It's a way to gain market penetration because a "direct" flight will show up higher in GDS outputs than a connection.

 

I don't keep track of them anymore, but do know that this is still happening within the USA, and often on longer haul international routes.  For example, the "direct" flights from Australia that make stops in Singapore or Bangkok or the Middle East.  Or flights from Europe to Chile or Argentina that first stop in Brazil.  Or Santiago to Auckland that stops in Easter Island.

 

Caveat emptor.

[CurlerRob]

34 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

It's not as common as it used to be, but still exists.

 

Caveat emptor.

 

Yep - still exists, although Air Canada gets a couple of points for noting it's "Direct, 1 Stop". But you have to open the details to discover you must leave and reboard in GRU. 🍺🥌

 

[MSEm]

When we were doing our China River Cruise with a pre-stay in Hong Kong, we were booked on a "direct" flight from Atlanta to Hong Kong.  There was a stop in Chicago with a plane change.  There was only 35 minutes between the flight from Atlanta landing and the flight from Chicago to Hong Kong. I found a connecting flight from Atlanta to LAX with a connecting flight to Hong Kong.  The flight connecting in LAS was $400 per person cheaper.

[MSEm]

We always book our air flights directly.  Most flights go on sale 11 or 10 months before the actual date for the flight.  I booked our flights for Japan R/T Atlanta to/from Tokyo 9 1/2 months before our trip.  At that time there were only 4 first class seats remaining on the flight.

[CCWineLover]

We often start looking at Biz class 11 months out.  I set up alerts as well.  Once we book we don’t look back.  And always do it ourselves.  Issue with Viking Air is them not ticketing soon enough like if you do on your own, and you are at their mercy.  We’d had biz class disappear on us by the time they ticketed.  Won’t chance that anymore.

[SJD117]

23 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

It's not as common as it used to be, but still exists.

 

DL does this for some international itineraries.  For example, they have intermittently marketed a "direct" flight from Miami to Tel Aviv.  But it flew to JFK, where there's an aircraft change.  It's a way to gain market penetration because a "direct" flight will show up higher in GDS outputs than a connection.

 

I don't keep track of them anymore, but do know that this is still happening within the USA, and often on longer haul international routes.  For example, the "direct" flights from Australia that make stops in Singapore or Bangkok or the Middle East.  Or flights from Europe to Chile or Argentina that first stop in Brazil.  Or Santiago to Auckland that stops in Easter Island.

 

Caveat emptor.

Alaska Airlines still operates its famed “Milk Run” flights in Southcentral and Southeast Alaska. These flights involve six routes that date back to the 1930s. The routes serve seven communities between Seattle and Anchorage that aren’t connected to the statewide road system. I’ve flown in or out of every one of these towns except for Yakutat, but not on a single “direct” flight from Seattle to Anchorage— that would make for a very long day of flying!

[oskidunker]

Book non stops. 

[SJD117]

3 hours ago, CCWineLover said:

We often start looking at Biz class 11 months out.  I set up alerts as well.  Once we book we don’t look back.  And always do it ourselves.  Issue with Viking Air is them not ticketing soon enough like if you do on your own, and you are at their mercy.  We’d had biz class disappear on us by the time they ticketed.  Won’t chance that anymore.

Kent — We’re flying Business Class in January for our trip to Egypt and Jordan and returning from Istanbul. You may ask, what’s unusual about that? Well, in five decades of flying commercially around the world, neither of us has ever flown in Business Class — not once. So we’ll have a much different flight experience than before (and a much more expensive one).

After we get back, I intend to start a thread about our experience from the perspective of a “first-timer.” It will be interesting to read the responses!

 

 

 

[Mike07]

I'm surprised at how many people need/demand Business Class. I'm a pretty big guy (height wise, not body weight), and I suck it up in economy mainly b/c I can be uncomfortable for 10 hours.as business class doesn't arrive at the destination any faster.

[FlyerTalker]

1 hour ago, SJD117 said:

Alaska Airlines still operates its famed “Milk Run” flights in Southcentral and Southeast Alaska. These flights involve six routes that date back to the 1930s. The routes serve seven communities between Seattle and Anchorage that aren’t connected to the statewide road system. I’ve flown in or out of every one of these towns except for Yakutat, but not on a single “direct” flight from Seattle to Anchorage— that would make for a very long day of flying!

 

Flown some of that.  Seattle to Juneau to Yakutat to Cordova to Anchorage.  Did it so that I could experience the 737 Combi, with the cargo containers in the front and the passenger compartment in the rear.  And yes, it was a "direct" flight from Seattle to Anchorage.

 

 

 

[wine-wine-wine]

2 hours ago, Mike07 said:

I'm surprised at how many people need/demand Business Class.

In DW’s case it is for medical reasons. Lie flat is a necessity for long haul for her. 
 

We flew economy for decades in the past. Those days are now done, although when I retire we will be much more open to multi stop and longer layovers. 

[Breckski]

3 hours ago, Mike07 said:

I'm surprised at how many people need/demand Business Class. I'm a pretty big guy (height wise, not body weight), and I suck it up in economy mainly b/c I can be uncomfortable for 10 hours.as business class doesn't arrive at the destination any faster.

I surprised at how many people cruise with Viking when they could visit the same places on Carnival.

[Mike07]

27 minutes ago, mwike said:

I surprised at how many people cruise with Viking when they could visit the same places on Carnival.

 

 

I see the point that you think you're making, but it's apples to oranges. The airlines realized a long time ago (sometime after deregulation) that people weren't going to choose an airline based upon comfort but on price. Hence how the ULCC came to be. On any given flight, the vast, vast, vast majority of fliers view the airline as the means to the end (final destination) and not the reason for the trip. There are a few that like flying for the sake of flying, but they are few and far between. IOW, even if you have the best ticket on an ultra long haul flight, after about 15-20 hours of that, you're ready to get off.  Even if you had a private charter on a Gulfstream, I am unaware of anybody that would love to spend a week in the air on one.

 

Cruise ships? Regent Seven Seas, Viking, Carnival, etc. can do trips to nowhere and people will come out for that if the price is right. Most people are not going to do a first class R/T experience on Delta, AA, BA, United where they fly from a major gateway, land in a foreign country, and then get off only to board in an hour for the return flight home. There are definitely journalists and YTers that will do it to market their brand or get cheap clicks, but tourists like you and I? Yes, they exist, but I would say they're exceptionally rare.

 

Who knows... when I hit MRA (min retirement age) in 20 years at my shop, I may be like FlyerTalker taking that Alaska Airlines jet with the cargo bay up front and seats in the back b/c I've run out of travel stuff that interests me and I'll be one of those people upgrading flights to get my kicks off.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Mike07

[Breckski]

3 minutes ago, Mike07 said:

 

 

I see the point that you think you're making, but it's apples to oranges. The airlines realized a long time ago (sometime after deregulation) that people weren't going to choose an airline based upon comfort but on price. Hence how the ULCC came to be. On any given flight, the vast, vast, vast majority of fliers view the airline as the means to the end (final destination) and not the reason for the trip. There are a few that like flying for the sake of flying, but they are few and far between. IOW, even if you have the best ticket on an ultra long haul flight, after about 15-20 hours of that, you're ready to get off.  Even if you had a private charter on a Gulfstream, I am unaware of anybody that would love to spend a week in the air on one.

 

Cruise ships? Regent Seven Seas, Viking, Carnival, etc. can do trips to nowhere and people will come out for that if the price is right.

Not apples to oranges.  People spend their money as they see fit.  Sure, you may not agree.  This thread just tells you that some on this forum do not share your belief when it comes to value of business vs economy.  Don't even try to understand the rationale for international first class.

 

Duration or regulation is irrelevant to the fact folks see value in different things.  

 

I can't believe someone would pay 3k/sq ft for a condo in Aspen when you can get the same experience in Vail for $2k/sq ft or in Breck for $1k/sq ft.

[WanderingBrit]

On 10/7/2023 at 12:04 PM, mwike said:

Does this ever happen in the US today? 

I flew SWA 2514 from MSP to MDW last Thursday, but that aircraft and flight number then continued to PHL. At the gate Flight 2514 is shown as having Chicago as the destination, then the display changes and it shows 2514 with Philadelphia as the destination.

[natshala]

OP here. Thank you all for your comments. I learned a lot from your experiences and plan to book ourselves going forward.

[chaunceyb]

On 10/6/2023 at 8:32 PM, FlyerTalker said:

 

Just so you don't get blindsided in the future.

 

"Direct" does NOT mean "non-stop".  A "direct" flight is one that has no change of flight number between A and B, but it may have both stops and aircraft changes along the way.  A "non-stop" flight is one that makes no stops between A and B.

 

At one time, Southwest had a "direct" flight from Baltimore to Oakland.  It only made EIGHT stops along the way, but it was "direct" because the flight number never changed.

 

BWI-BNA-MSY-DAL-HOU-ABQ-PHX-LAS-LAX-OAK

 

So don't just assume that if you are told a flight is "direct" that you will be on a non-stop.

 

 

Incorrect. For each leg there is a different flight number. Example: A United flight from Honolulu to Miami is UA 252 to Houston and UA 2442 to Miami.

Edited October 11, 2023 by chaunceyb

[FlyerTalker]

46 minutes ago, chaunceyb said:

Incorrect. For each leg there is a different flight number. Example: A United flight from Honolulu to Miami is UA 252 to Houston and UA 2442 to Miami.

 

Who ever said anything about a flight on UA from HNL to MIA?

 

 

[chaunceyb]

22 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

Who ever said anything about a flight on UA from HNL to MIA?

 

 

Please show me a major airline that has one flight number for two connecting flights. The United flight was an example. 

[chaunceyb]

27 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

Who ever said anything about a flight on UA from HNL to MIA?

 

 

Are you talking about the airline confirmation code/number?