Mars passenger demographic

[KBs mum]

On 12/28/2023 at 6:21 PM, travel4b said:

I’m afraid that pretty much parallels our experience. A shame, really, as the ship is gorgeous and the crew generally great. We are booked on an Athens to Mumbai itinerary in the fall but will probably cancel for the above reasons.  

It's since covid, and one of the reasons we have filed Viking under 'only if able to get a budget price deal' the others being the increase to  constant noise from live music and the decline in food and drink quality. 

We like the ships and crew, and the itineraries are decent, but overall they are now charging premium prices for a budget product 

[longterm]

On 12/27/2023 at 5:06 PM, travel4b said:

As for dress, not to open Pandora’s box, but there might as well not be a dress code. Every night we’ve seen more than a few tee shirts and grubby jeans. “Casual Elegant” seems to be a wishful concept for those that do clear the tee shirt/jeans bar. 

Yep; a lot seems to go unchecked lately. We were on the Grand European river cruise in October, and this one goober wore what appeared to be the SAME pair of nasty khaki shorts every day, along with about 3 different t-shirts. He wore it to dinner, on excursions where it was sometimes very cold outside, didn't seem to care about dress codes... or common sense.

 

On one of our ocean cruises, our suitcases got to our staterooms after our dinner reservation, and I was wearing jeans; I was graciously allowed into Chef's Table after explaining that my clothes had yet to arrive in our room.

[longterm]

On 12/27/2023 at 4:14 PM, travel4b said:

We are currently on the Mars Ft. Lauderdale to LA Panama Canal cruise - our first on Viking.  The ship really is gorgeous and service very good as expected. One thing that has surprised us though is the average age, health status and dress of our fellow passengers.  I mean no disrespect whatsoever; I’m just wondering if this is the norm or a one off with this cruise. Any veteran Viking travelers aboard who care to comment?

Based on all the Viking cruises we've done, both river and ocean, I'd put the average age at somewhere around 60. We're in our late (extremely late) 60s but are healthy, but yes, we see a lot of guests who clearly have serious mobility issues, but I commend them for getting out of their homes and traveling while they can. 

 

On a recent Rick Steves tour in France, there was a man who was 85, who looked like he'd never be able to keep up with the long walks we were taking each day. He surprised us all--we walked an average of 5-6 miles per day, and he was there for all of it.

 

This reminds me of another quick story: on another Rick Steves tour this May, through the hills of Tuscany, my brother and his wife accompanied us. On the first day, after walking miles through Florence, my brother started commenting that his ankle was hurting him. 

 

Eighteen days later, he was no better, and limped through miles of walking up and down Tuscan hills. After all of that, when he arrived home, he found out he'd torn his Achilles tendon! He walked at least 5 miles a day with a torn Achilles tendon. Amazing.

 

[mariners]

My DH and I have been among the youngest passengers onboard a variety of cruise lines for many years.  IMO, it's not the age of a passenger that matters,; it's all about consideration of other passengers, as well as the willingness to recognize personal limitations, cognitive decline (which gets to a point where someone else might have to make decisions), etc. 

 

We loved our experience on Viking Ocean, but we now know that we have to change our expectations.  This was my first cruise where I was told that I was too formally dressed for dinner (took it as a compliment given how they were dressed). This was also my first cruise where I was told that I walked "too fast" and needed to "slow down".  I walk for exercise, but do not run or jog.   I also try to be respectful of the crew who are working, and the individuals who are strolling the deck.  

 

It wasn't until the end of the  cruise when I watched passengers self disembark with their limited luggage that I realized that, despite my younger age, I might be "old".  One can take a whole variety of clothing as there is self laundry (free, though that likely isn't what matters given the cost of the cruise) even if one only has a carry-on.  We have never experienced so many passengers who were completely oblivious to dress codes (main dining room/specialty dining dinners). 

 

Still, we cannot wait for our next Viking cruise!  It was a great time, wonderful CC members and other cruisers, and a fabulous crew!

 

 

[SoCray4Cruz]

I suspect this is driven more by itinerary.  We’ve been on Viking when it felt like a floating nursing home, and also when it felt a bit like a Virgin cruise!  Our 2024 cruises will be 13 & 14 for us with Viking, and I will admit to hoping both lean more towards the latter than the former!

[CCWineLover]

1 hour ago, mariners said:

My DH and I have been among the youngest passengers onboard a variety of cruise lines for many years.  IMO, it's not the age of a passenger that matters,; it's all about consideration of other passengers, as well as the willingness to recognize personal limitations, cognitive decline (which gets to a point where someone else might have to make decisions), etc. 

 

We loved our experience on Viking Ocean, but we now know that we have to change our expectations.  This was my first cruise where I was told that I was too formally dressed for dinner (took it as a compliment given how they were dressed). This was also my first cruise where I was told that I walked "too fast" and needed to "slow down".  I walk for exercise, but do not run or jog.   I also try to be respectful of the crew who are working, and the individuals who are strolling the deck.  

 

It wasn't until the end of the  cruise when I watched passengers self disembark with their limited luggage that I realized that, despite my younger age, I might be "old".  One can take a whole variety of clothing as there is self laundry (free, though that likely isn't what matters given the cost of the cruise) even if one only has a carry-on.  We have never experienced so many passengers who were completely oblivious to dress codes (main dining room/specialty dining dinners). 

 

Still, we cannot wait for our next Viking cruise!  It was a great time, wonderful CC members and other cruisers, and a fabulous crew!

 

 

Caroline - we enjoyed meeting you and John on the just finished Neptune cruise.

I've had the same said to me - that I need to slow down, but I just think I'm walking normally.  Usually that's in the hallways or down the docks.  I too have been amazed at the post-COVID degradation of the wardrobes people  bring.  I used to think Viking just looked the other way because of COVID, but now it appears they just don't want to offend.

 

Contrary to Longterm's estimate - we have a different estimate of the age.  We've now done 14 Ocean and 1 River Cruise (which had younger age people).   Every cruise we each estimate what we think the age is.  It definitely has gotten older, and especially since COVID.  My analytical mind theorizes that COVID made lots of folks realize life is short and they better get out there and cruise.

I personally would put the median age on all our cruises at around 75.   I think median is more relevant than average, since one 18 year old skews the average downwards.  Certainly the cruises we've done in the Americas (no cross-ocean flying for Americans) are much older crowd - approaching 80 for median age in my opinion.  The port a day Scandinavia / Mediterr. cruises seem to be more 65-70.    So I do think a lot depends on itineraries.  Certainly cruises in/out of Florida are going to be dominate in a bit older age.

 

Regardless what we debate, everyone just needs to factor in their own personal requirements for cruising when deciding future cruises.  

 

At some point, however, Viking is going to have to decide who they are going to market to, and to what length they are willing to set AND enforce guidelines/rules, involving not only dress, but safety concerns such as the number scooters and walkers left in the hallways at night (even though prohibited for safety reasons).  Will be interesting to see how Viking shifts or not to the certainly changing landscape of potential customers.

[travel4b]

The comments have been very interesting. It’s good to know that it’s not just us. I think the thing that has disappointed us the most is not the age or health status.  I get that now with this particular itinerary.  What I don’t get is the pervasive sloppiness of guests. I’m on a spectacular ship with a great crew surrounded by passengers who are dressed like they are headed to Walmart.  Everyone is certainly old enough to know better and respect Viking’s dress code. 

[SWFLAOK]

We are a one and done on Viking Ocean. We enjoyed our Viking River cruise in May 2022, which we booked and paid for in November 2018, and was delayed until Covid was still being tested for many times, but didn't disrupt our trip. We enjoyed the people on our cruise, the food was OK, but a very limited and repetitive with nothing exceptional, we enjoyed the excursions, but found the hallways between cabins to be too close for comfort.

We were looking for a Panama Canal cruise, and booked Viking Mars for a Classic Panama Canal cruise from Panama City to Fort Lauderdale. Since our Viking Air did not work at all for our Viking River Cruise (paid for business class and didn't get it), we booked our own air from Miami to Panama City, and booked a very nice hotel in Casco Viejo for 3 nights pre. Our cabin was great, and the trip through the canal was as good as we expected. However, the things that we disliked on our Viking River cruise were even worse on Viking Ocean. For a much larger ship, the hallways were still very narrow. There were more food venues, but everything was repetitive, with the same thing being served one day after another in the restaurants. The specialty restaurants, which we had looked forward to, had the worst food of all. We had more onion rings and chicken wings than we've ever had on a cruise because they at least tasted good for lunch, or an after excursion snack.

We also found that there was no dress code at all. On our river cruise, there were a few people that had to be reminded to take their hats off, or that they couldn't wear shorts for dinner. But on our ocean cruise, people wore whatever they wanted. We did see people in their bathrobes at breakfast, and plenty of them for coffee and a pastry on deck 1 for early breakfast. At dinner and the lounges afterward, a large number of people wore the same t-shirts and shorts or capris with sneakers that they had worn for the excursions that day. Having brought and worn clothing that met the dress code, we felt overdressed. When disembarking, we were held onboard for a long time while those with only a carry-on were allowed to leave soon after we docked. After waiting several hours in the atrium, we were finally told that our luggage was available. In fact, all luggage was already available, and sorted by color and number. I suspect it had been ready for quite a while. Since we were a small ship, and waited so long for our luggage to be sorted and ready for us to disembark, a much larger ship docked closer to the port entrance several hours after us. Pickups for cruise passengers always stopped at the larger ship, filling them, and headed out. Those who were waiting for rental car pickups, or park and go pickups had a hard time getting our rides because of the larger ship being ready first. We were up at 6 for coffee and pastry on deck 1 (where they thought they didn't open until 6:30. It was 11 before we made it back to our car at park and go. The time through immigration was about 15 minutes, and no time through customs in Fort Lauderdale.

We did not have a lot of passengers onboard who had disabilities. There were a few push walkers, but no scooter chairs. On our excursions, we had some passengers who used a cane or walking stick(s), but  they kept up quite well, and even chose to do extra walking to see a little more at our excursion sites without hold up the tour.

 

[PasadenaDave]

We saw a great deal of sloppy dress yesterday and it was the line of people boarding the three day P&O cruise out of Melbourne.  We even saw a kid on the Adventure Ropes Course 

[jimdee3636]

The baffling thing about old people being sloppy dressers is that the easiest way to look better (and sometimes younger) is by dressing better. If you're 75, 80, or older, you can't get by on youthful good looks anymore, no matter what you looked like forty or fifty years ago. But if you put on a decent shirt and sport jacket, neat pants, and "real" shoes (i.e., not sneakers), in other words a nice but age-appropriate look, you'll get noticed in a good way---for very little time and effort. 

 

For me, the worst examples are men who look like hell even when their wives are clearly making an effort to dress well. It conveys a selfish and disrespectful attitude, both to their wives and to other guests on the ship. 

[travel4b]

57 minutes ago, jimdee3636 said:

The baffling thing about old people being sloppy dressers is that the easiest way to look better (and sometimes younger) is by dressing better. If you're 75, 80, or older, you can't get by on youthful good looks anymore, no matter what you looked like forty or fifty years ago. But if you put on a decent shirt and sport jacket, neat pants, and "real" shoes (i.e., not sneakers), in other words a nice but age-appropriate look, you'll get noticed in a good way---for very little time and effort. 

 

For me, the worst examples are men who look like hell even when their wives are clearly making an effort to dress well. It conveys a selfish and disrespectful attitude, both to their wives and to other guests on the ship. 

Very well said. There are a LOT of couples on this ship that fit that description. I’m guessing that the wives sold their husbands on a cruise by promising them they could dress like they were going to cut the grass. 

[SantaFe1]

2 hours ago, CCWineLover said:

Caroline - we enjoyed meeting you and John on the just finished Neptune cruise.

I've had the same said to me - that I need to slow down, but I just think I'm walking normally.  Usually that's in the hallways or down the docks.  I too have been amazed at the post-COVID degradation of the wardrobes people  bring.  I used to think Viking just looked the other way because of COVID, but now it appears they just don't want to offend.

 

Contrary to Longterm's estimate - we have a different estimate of the age.  We've now done 14 Ocean and 1 River Cruise (which had younger age people).   Every cruise we each estimate what we think the age is.  It definitely has gotten older, and especially since COVID.  My analytical mind theorizes that COVID made lots of folks realize life is short and they better get out there and cruise.

I personally would put the median age on all our cruises at around 75.   I think median is more relevant than average, since one 18 year old skews the average downwards.  Certainly the cruises we've done in the Americas (no cross-ocean flying for Americans) are much older crowd - approaching 80 for median age in my opinion.  The port a day Scandinavia / Mediterr. cruises seem to be more 65-70.    So I do think a lot depends on itineraries.  Certainly cruises in/out of Florida are going to be dominate in a bit older age.

 

Regardless what we debate, everyone just needs to factor in their own personal requirements for cruising when deciding future cruises.  

 

At some point, however, Viking is going to have to decide who they are going to market to, and to what length they are willing to set AND enforce guidelines/rules, involving not only dress, but safety concerns such as the number scooters and walkers left in the hallways at night (even though prohibited for safety reasons).  Will be interesting to see how Viking shifts or not to the certainly changing landscape of potential customers.

You have made my day!!  We are in the young contingent!!

[HUNKY]

travel4b - could the weather have been a factor?

 

Seems that temps in the high 80's and low 90's with very high humidity would be a factor in what people chose to wear during the canal crossing.

 

I just women would stop using their LV Neverfull tote bags as purses!

[travel4b]

So last night was New Year's Eve on the Mars and the transformation was amazing.  For the last two weeks I could probably count on one hand the number of men I saw in sport coats.  Last night probably almost half the husbands suddenly remembered they brought one along and actually put it on.  There were even a few tuxedos.  As for the women, there was a dramatic increase in ones who you could fairly characterize as fulfilling the "elegant casual" dress code.  Hooray for Viking.  BTW, the New Year's brunch today around the pool was a knock out.  Kudos to the incredible crew who clearly worked very hard to pull it off.

[taiwan_girl]

We recently finished the Viking Venus Athens to Rome, and had a chance to speak with the captain.  Our four kids were with us (late teens to mid 20's) and the captain commented that there were quite a few younger demographic on the cruise.  I agreed, as it was more than I had anticipated.  Did not see any really problems with the dress code, though I did notice that the staff at the main dining room did make one gentleman remove his baseball hat before entering.

 

(Also, Viking did enforce the no drinking unless 21 or older.  LOL. Even though in European waters the whole cruise.  Not a big deal for my daughter as she really doesn't drink, but it was funny that they knew who she was when we first sat down and that she was underage.)

[millybess]

1 minute ago, taiwan_girl said:

 

(Also, Viking did enforce the no drinking unless 21 or older.  LOL. Even though in European waters the whole cruise.  Not a big deal for my daughter as she really doesn't drink, but it was funny that they knew who she was when we first sat down and that she was underage.)

When we were on the second leg of our Med cruise last year, the demographic was much younger than on the first leg.  There were many young-aged tour groups and families and it was a lot of fun to have them on board.

 

One of the bartenders said that the day before the groups boarded, there was a food and beverage staff meeting and by the time the meeting had ended they all knew who the kids were that couldn't be served.  But the patrons over 21 could order and then give it to the person under 21, which would absolve Viking of any responsibility  🥂

[CCWineLover]

21 minutes ago, millybess said:

When we were on the second leg of our Med cruise last year, the demographic was much younger than on the first leg.  There were many young-aged tour groups and families and it was a lot of fun to have them on board.

 

One of the bartenders said that the day before the groups boarded, there was a food and beverage staff meeting and by the time the meeting had ended they all knew who the kids were that couldn't be served.  But the patrons over 21 could order and then give it to the person under 21, which would absolve Viking of any responsibility  🥂

Will be interesting to see how it goes on our Rome-Athens cruise this Feb/March.  Hopefully we'll have some young and fit people onboard after the last 2 cruises we had that ended in Ft Lauderdale and the median age was easily 78-80.   Glad they are out there traveling, but for us this will be more interesting (14 days - all port days + 7 pre-cruise days on our own + 3 Viking pre-extension days + 4 Viking post-extension days).  Whew!!!

[Breckski]

On 12/30/2023 at 5:05 PM, CCWineLover said:

Contrary to Longterm's estimate - we have a different estimate of the age.  We've now done 14 Ocean and 1 River Cruise (which had younger age people).   Every cruise we each estimate what we think the age is.  It definitely has gotten older, and especially since COVID.  My analytical mind theorizes that COVID made lots of folks realize life is short and they better get out there and cruise.

I personally would put the median age on all our cruises at around 75.   

 

My wife and I estimate as well and have come to the 70-75 conclusion.  Many fit for their ages, but many with mobility constraints.

[Twitchly]

Our last cruise with Viking was the British Isles in September 2022. I recall the demographic being 60s, 70s. No walkers, wheelchairs, etc. It’s a port-heavy itinerary with multiple tenders, which may have put off the more senior crowd. People by and large dressed according to the Viking standard. So basically we didn’t see the infirmities or sloppiness described in this thread.

[longterm]

13 hours ago, mwike said:

 

My wife and I estimate as well and have come to the 70-75 conclusion.  Many fit for their ages, but many with mobility constraints.

You're probably right; on our last cruise, which was the Grand European river cruise in October, I'd say the average age was early to mid-60s, but on every ocean cruise we've done, I'd put it a little older. Headed out in July for the British Isles Explorer, will be interested to see who we're traveling with.

[PasadenaDave]

We got home this morning from the long flight from Australia and I am wasted.  This cruise had more people needing assistance from walkers, scooters and canes.  There were also many young people in 20-40 range, I think that was due to the holiday season when the entire family could get time to go together 

[janetcbl]

We are on the Mars now. The passengers seem a bit older than the usual crowd, and there are a lot more mobility devices (walkers, poles, etc.) than usual. Dress is very casual, lots of shorts, t-shirts, but this is a Panama Canal, warm weather trip, so I would expect it. No bathrobes in the Cafe or anything really absurd like that.

 

[travel4b]

29 minutes ago, janetcbl said:

We are on the Mars now. The passengers seem a bit older than the usual crowd, and there are a lot more mobility devices (walkers, poles, etc.) than usual. Dress is very casual, lots of shorts, t-shirts, but this is a Panama Canal, warm weather trip, so I would expect it. No bathrobes in the Cafe or anything really absurd like that.

 

So you boarded yesterday in LA after we disembarked.  It sounds like the same guest profile we experienced.  So I’m still puzzled.  You seem to be saying it is a one off from the norm. On the other hand we finally asked two crew members (one very senior management and the other a waiter) and they both said this demographic was the norm.  

[lisiamc]

On 12/27/2023 at 11:37 PM, CILCIANRQTS said:

Viking’s demographic has always been an older crowd.

As a laid- back experience, with no Broadway shows or climbing walls, etc., older folks tend to gravitate toward the small ship, simpler experience.

As a relatively pricey cruise, well-to-do older folks are more prevalent, and wealthy older folks tend to have more infirmities.

As for the dress, my theory is that Viking has to go further down the demographic ladder to fill their ever-expanding fleet of ships. In addition, while they publish supposed standards, they obviously don’t enforce them.

Viking has never had a diverse cross-section of travelers, which many of us are fine with.

 

On our recent Neptune cruise, I can report that I saw two people gently turned away from The Dining Room one evening because they were dressed in jeans. So it may depend on the ship and the Maitre d’. 

[travel4b]

19 minutes ago, lisiamc said:

On our recent Neptune cruise, I can report that I saw two people gently turned away from The Dining Room one evening because they were dressed in jeans. So it may depend on the ship and the Maitre d’. 

That’s all well and good but how does one enforce an “elegant casual” standard?  I’m being generous to say that at most 25% of the guests met that goal.  And I’m grading on a curve here!