The 'As You Wish' Concept

[hammybee]

Heather, I don't know the answer.

 

I have read other occasional posts that made mention of single seatings on HAL. My sense was this was a 50-60's thing, the good ole days. I am thinking one of the posters might have been Host Doug.

 

Given HAL's 134 year history, short term is relative.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Heather, I don't know the answer.

 

I have read other occasional posts that made mention of single seatings on HAL. My sense was this was a 50-60's thing, the good ole days. I am thinking one of the posters might have been Host Doug.

 

Given HAL's 134 year history, short term is relative.

 

That's true, but for our purposes here where no one has probably cruised much more than 30 to 40 years tops, I consider 27 years not to be a short period of time.

 

During that period of time, on most lines, there have been 2 sittings. Can't speak for HAL since I didn't cruise on HAL until 2001.

[ncsongbird]

Am I missing something? As I see it "as you wish" dining is just adding another option. It does not require the folks who like or want traditional dining to change. It seems to me that now everyone will get to choose what works for them personally. So why do the traditional dining folks seem to be kicking and screaming about this?

[O2B@C]

Am I missing something? As I see it "as you wish" dining is just adding another option. It does not require the folks who like or want traditional dining to change. It seems to me that now everyone will get to choose what works for them personally. So why do the traditional dining folks seem to be kicking and screaming about this?

 

Yes, sadly, you are missing something, but it's not your fault. You should be right, and if you were, we would not be kicking and screaming. But if you read the "sticky" thread on this topic (http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=582072), and the "book early" thread (http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=601536), you'll see what the problem is. In a nutshell, the way HAL is implementing the new system, it is NOT true that "everyone will get to choose." Instead, it appears that only those who book early and/or have suite preference - and sometimes not even they -are getting confirmed traditional dining on request. Most people who request traditional are being wait-listed, or forced to accept open seating. So, as some have said on those other threads, it's not really "as you wish," it's "as HAL wishes." Hence the uproar.

[SharonN]

Am I missing something? As I see it "as you wish" dining is just adding another option. It does not require the folks who like or want traditional dining to change. It seems to me that now everyone will get to choose what works for them personally. So why do the traditional dining folks seem to be kicking and screaming about this?

 

Because we're NOT being given a choice, we're being waitlisted for Traditional seating which is not what we'd like to choose.

[cruz chic]

Am I missing something? As I see it "as you wish" dining is just adding another option. It does not require the folks who like or want traditional dining to change. It seems to me that now everyone will get to choose what works for them personally. So why do the traditional dining folks seem to be kicking and screaming about this?

 

I am one of the folks who likes the traditional early seating. I used to be able to book about 6 months in advance and get the early seating. Now I am booking over a year out and I am barely able to get early seating. I wanted the 6:15 and it's already gone. I travel by myself so I enjoy eating with the same people every night. I get to experience the open seating at breakfast and lunch and I always seem to have to sit with people who completely ignore you or are telling you their gory pet operation stories etc. I think people have a tendency to act a little better when they see you night after night. I don't know maybe I've been lucky with my table mates at night. Frankly I don't know why it's such a big deal to have open seating on every cruise line. Just because you can get it on a land vacation does a cruise have to be the same?

[hammybee]

Because we're NOT being given a choice, we're being waitlisted for Traditional seating which is not what we'd like to choose.

 

It seems to me that what is happening is uncertainty as to when/where some will land for dinner. Being waitlisted is not the same thing as being denied.

 

So many sails over the past 18 months have been showing all dining as waitlisted on cruises that were, at the time, far from being sold out, well before this AYW thing. This tells me that HAL is holding space for a large group or giving preference to some travel consortiums who have options on many cabins.

 

As we all know, so many thing we wish for, don't come true. I think the naming convention is rather appropriate, don't you?

 

In any event, you are sailing on the Rotterdam early next year with a fine bunch and regardless of come what may, you will be just fine.

[SharonN]

It seems to me that what is happening is uncertainty as to when/where some will land for dinner. Being waitlisted is not the same thing as being denied.

 

...

 

As we all know, so many thing we wish for, don't come true. I think the naming convention is rather appropriate, don't you?

 

In any event, you are sailing on the Rotterdam early next year with a fine bunch and regardless of come what may, you will be just fine.

 

 

The naming convention is probably making it worse based on what we're seeing so far :) but I guess Marketing/Sales people don't really care if what they say is totally truthful or not. I'm sure my trip will end up being great but this will definitely impact how/when I book the next one. In the meantime there are obviously more important things to worry about but guess this is giving us all a place to let off some steam:D

[HeatherInFlorida]

It seems to me that what is happening is uncertainty as to when/where some will land for dinner. Being waitlisted is not the same thing as being denied.

..........................

As we all know, so many thing we wish for, don't come true.

............

 

Hammybee, I don't think anyone would disagree with what you're saying because while being waitlisted is not being denied, neither is it saying you'll get your choice.

 

Not all wishes come true, but for those of us who cruise once a year and pay quite a bit of money for that privilege, it really should be more than a "wish". We should be able to enjoy the dining we prefer or be given the option to cancel.

 

We are not given that option. The people who find themselves waitlisted may or may not get confirmation before final payment. After that, it's too late. If it doesn't matter to the person, than no biggie. But it does matter to some of us.

 

Picture this .............

 

Imagine if you pick your cabin number, perhaps a longed for aft cabin overlooking the wake, and your reservation form says "waitlisted".

 

Now imagine you're told that they're waiting to see if they get any large groups who would like their cabins all close together so your cabin may, down the line, become unavailable.

 

But not to worry! They'll find you a cabin somewhere else on the ship.:rolleyes:

 

I can see this board lighting up now. Talk about a HOT TOPIC!!!

[Brownie Scout]

Nicely put, Heather! I'm jumping into this discussion a bit late, but I too feel that As You Wish is a misnomer. We were waitlisted on the Noordam for our July cruise, and when we made out final payment were told we had AYW. However, when we actually boarded, we were given assigned seating, much to our delight. We were never told--and we never asked-- how we got so lucky, but HAL's methodology seems to be something akin to a coin toss.

 

That said, I often sail solo, and have become very reluctant to book HAL (or Princess) since I too don't want to get stuck with "musical dinner companions" every night. That leaves me with the choice--for now--of Celebrity of RCCL for my solo voyages: So be it.

[kryos]

Am I missing something? As I see it "as you wish" dining is just adding another option. It does not require the folks who like or want traditional dining to change.

For now, it won't change. But who's to say what the future will bring? And I know people will say that both formats have existed successfully on Princess for years, but remember ... Princess ships have mostly been built to accommodate this sort of thing ... two entirely separate dining rooms. HAL ships are not built that way ... especially the smaller ships in the fleet. This is going to be a major problem for HAL ... offering these two options. If more people want As You Wish, HAL is gonna wind up not just using one level of the dining room for that format, but also converting part of the other level to accommodate it. It's gonna be a major pain in the you know what for them. So, I would imagine HAL will run "parallel" for a year or so, and then if As You Wish becomes the overwhelming choice among passengers, traditional will be phased out at some point. Then everyone will have to take As You Wish and like it.

 

Also, even while both formats are being offered, if Traditional is filled for your cruise, you'll get As You Wish Dining ... whether you "wish" it or not.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

I travel by myself so I enjoy eating with the same people every night. I get to experience the open seating at breakfast and lunch and I always seem to have to sit with people who completely ignore you or are telling you their gory pet operation stories etc. I think people have a tendency to act a little better when they see you night after night.

We are the exact people who this "As you Wish" is gonna screw. We're gonna be eating at big tables every night, always with a different group of people, with no chance for forming any friendships. I have many wonderful memories of dinners onboard HAL ... great tablemates most of the time ... where we had become fast friends by the end of the cruise, exchanging email addresses and telephone numbers, taking pictures, the whole shebang on the last night of the cruise. We're not gonna get that with "As You Wish." And that's why I honestly don't care for it.

 

But, as I said before ... the majority will rule, and I think the majority of people ... the overwhelming majority ... do not travel alone. For them, "As You Wish" will probably become the favorite, simply because of the flexibility it offers. I honestly think "As You Wish" dining is going to rapidly become the favorite to the point where the line will not too long down the pike eliminate Traditional dining entirely.

 

Now, I've talked to friends who have sailed on some of the luxury lines that have had open seating for years. They tell me my fears about "As You Wish" are unfounded. But I doubt that. They tell me that they have never had a problem on some of those other lines being seated with very enjoyable table partners and they came away loving open seating. I myself loved it on the QE2 ... but there I was traveling with a friend. I would have hated to be in the Caronia Dining Room as a single. I watched a priest at the next table dining alone almost every night ... with the one exception being when the Hotel Manager joined him one evening.

 

The luxury cruise lines carry less people than the mass market or even premium lines do. The staff to guest ratio is also much lower. The matri 'd in one of their dining rooms has more than ample opportunity to get to know his guests ... who wouldn't mind a single joining their table ... and who would. He can put people together based on what he has gotten to know about their personalities ... who would enjoy meeting who ... that sort of thing. On a mass market line, good luck. That matri 'd is not gonna have the time to query other guests about whether they would mind a single joining them. If he has a large table forming, he'll put the single there ... even if everyone at that large table is part of the same group traveling together ... and even if that group is not too crazy about a stranger being shoved in their midst. If the matri 'd has a problem locating the single somewhere, he's gonna just take the easy way out and plop them at a table for two ... by themselves. Open seating dining is not going to be the same thing on a mass market line as it is on a luxury ship only carrying maybe 300 passengers tops.

 

That's why I am so against this. I love sailing HAL and hate to see the day when I will have to stop simply because dining time has become too awkward for me on their ships.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Krazy Kruizers]

And How will it apply to the Prinsendam which has only a one level dining room????

[esther e]

I'm getting stressed out that we may have to do traditional when all we want is open!!!:D Open may be such a draw that it will become filled right away.

[O2B@C]

.... The luxury cruise lines carry less people than the mass market or even premium lines do. The staff to guest ratio is also much lower. The [maitre d'] in one of their dining rooms has more than ample opportunity to get to know his guests ... who wouldn't mind a single joining their table ... and who would. He can put people together based on what he has gotten to know about their personalities ... who would enjoy meeting who ... that sort of thing. On a mass market line, good luck. That [maitre d'] is not gonna have the time to query other guests about whether they would mind a single joining them. If he has a large table forming, he'll put the single there ... even if everyone at that large table is part of the same group traveling together ... and even if that group is not too crazy about a stranger being shoved in their midst. If the [maitre d']has a problem locating the single somewhere, he's gonna just take the easy way out and plop them at a table for two ... by themselves. Open seating dining is not going to be the same thing on a mass market line as it is on a luxury ship only carrying maybe 300 passengers tops. ....

 

That's a very good point, Rita, and extremely well explained. Thank you for adding it to the discussion.

[cruz chic]

I'm getting stressed out that we may have to do traditional when all we want is open!!!:D Open may be such a draw that it will become filled right away.

 

I don't think you will have to worry about that one. On HAL and Princess it seems anytime or AYW is the last one to fill up.

[hammybee]

I don't think you will have to worry about that one. On HAL and Princess it seems anytime or AYW is the last one to fill up.

 

Actually, there is a poster on this board, who chose the Noordam because it offered AYW. Unfortunately, she did not get what she wished because a large group trumed the entire venue.

[cruz chic]

Actually, there is a poster on this board, who chose the Noordam because it offered AYW. Unfortunately, she did not get what she wished because a large group trumed the entire venue.

 

 

I'm amazed. I've never heard that one before. Must have missed that post.

[CDRMark]

We are the exact people who this "As you Wish" is gonna screw. We're gonna be eating at big tables every night, always with a different group of people, with no chance for forming any friendships. Snip...And that's why I honestly don't care for it.

Snip.....

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

I also forsee a significant increase in people "wishing" for a table for two, rather than being forced into this scenario.

Cheers

Mark

[prescottbob]

Ahoy!

I started this thread as a philosophical concept, i.e., how would this impact your life if we 'did' everything on the 'As You Wish" basis. Great replies but again it's turning into the recently implemented or soon to be implemented dining room arrangements aboard a cruise ship. Some care for structure and/or the ability to maintain a tradition that, appears to many on this board, meets their comfort level, their desires and their prior experiences. Others, prefer a change for convience sake whether it be a desire to dine when the 'urge calls', a desire to dine anytime following a port visit or desire to not be 'nailed down' to a specific appointed dining time while vacatoning.

Myself, I believe both 'sides of the aisle' can be granted their wishes with proper implementation of the program. I guess some of us questions HAL's ability to do so while maintaining a high level of customer service and satisfaction. I only say this because of past prior policy changes (e.g. tipping, smoking restrictions, internet gifts and liquor packages, etc.) often times found 'us' wondering if the left hand, Seattle, knows what the right hand, the cruise ship, is doing and visa versa. Time will tell.

In any event, keep the debate alive on this thread and others yet to be written and, more importantly, HAVE A GREAT CRUISE! Thank God we all have the ability to experience and/ worry about such things. How spoiled we are.....

 

Bon Voyage and Good Health!

Bob:)

[bruceh4]

And How will it apply to the Prinsendam which has only a one level dining room????

Very easy the Prinsendam actually has 2 dinning rooms on one level.

[RevNeal]

Very easy the Prinsendam actually has 2 dinning rooms on one level.

 

Do you mean the two areas of the La Fontaine Dining Room: the large area in aft and a narrow area on the starboard side? I have not yet been aboard the Prinsendam, but I was under the impression that it was still one dining room.

[Copper10-8]

Do you mean the two areas of the La Fontaine Dining Room: the large area in aft and a narrow area on the starboard side? I have not yet been aboard the Prinsendam, but I was under the impression that it was still one dining room.

 

The La Fontaine is currently used as one big dining room with two seatings however, there are a set of fire doors where the long end on the starboard side ends and the larger portion that covers the entire width of the aft part of Prinsendam begins. Here's a couple of problems:

#1 There is only one entrance/exit to the 'large part' of the La Fontaine and that is via the 'narrow part' (even if you take the aft stairwell, it still deposits you at the end of the 'narrow part') so if you want to call it 'two dining rooms' be aware that you can't get to the one in 'the back' unless you go through the one 'on the side';) .

#2 The 'narrow part" is just that: narrow. I don't believe it comes close to even half the capacity of the 'large part'. Plus there's only that central aisle to walk through.

Prinsendam will be the last ship in the fleet to start AYW dining next year. Before she's ready to do just that, there's gonna be some heavy thinking taking place in the emerald city. Might even take some stuff taking place in drydock.

 

 

[RevNeal]

John,

 

That was what I was thinking, based upon the photos and the deck plans.

Perhaps Doug was meaning the Pinnacle Grill? HAL isn't going to do away with revenue Dining to enable AYW and Traditional divisions.

 

Perhaps they'll do AYW in the starboard-side narrow area, where the coming and going of AYW diners won't disturb the two set dining session aft.

[Copper10-8]

Perhaps Doug was meaning the Pinnacle Grill?

 

Doug or Bruce? Who's on first?;)