If You Don't Like Being Violated Don't Book A Cruise To Jamaica

[nolaAlive]

I wasnt whining, I was informing people of what I (and others I think) consider to be a unjustifed practice by local authorities in Jamaica. I guess you are just the kind of person to take the abuse and move on, being that you are a tough truck driver and all. Well, I am not that kind of person. I believe in standing up for my rights. I spent 26 years of my life in the US Armed Forces defending my (and your) freedom. Maybe that was wasted on you. Sheep dont need freedom, they need sheep dogs.

 

As I mentioned, I have been to Jamaica a number of times and not subjected to groping. I understand that when I am on foreign soil, I am subject to foreign laws; others apparently do not. I guess some people should just stay home.

[hogtyde88]

I think A LOT of the posts in this thread have been worthy of an academy award.

 

I'm just of the mind that people should realize that when in someone elses sandbox you have to play by their rules...whether they are considered right or wrong. Ya don't have to like it...ya just have to do it.

 

True, but does it have to include having your "wedding Tackle" groped???:eek:

[jetskier]

Sorry to interrupt with a silly question, but I apparently missed the story about Costa Maya. Can anyone let me know what happened? Thanks!

 

 

It was Costa Rica. A private van at a beach was held up at gunpoint. A former Marine who was a passenger in the van reached over and snapped the robber's neck.

 

Dave

[nolaAlive]

 

Thought I might mention, since you think I am some kind of whiner and maybe you think I was intimidated by the Jamaicans and my post was an over reaction, that I work everday measuring kitchens in occupied public housing units in Brooklyn, Bronx & Harlem. Nothing I have seen in Jamaica was as bad or as intimidating as that, and I do that about 4 times a week.

 

I much prefer fixing America's problems, instead of dragging other countries down to our level.

[newt98]

OK--I have to point out that your entire post is flawed and should be summarily dismissed.

 

They DO have the right to touch you. They do have the right to pat you down. You are in THEIR country. You have to play by their rules. If it means that less drugs get back on the boat, then pat EVERYONE down. I have no problem with that. I have nothing to hide, so go right ahead. It is no more fun for them than it is for you. Trust me, I know.

 

Also, you said that we don't pat people down at airports and cruise terminals. Have you flown in the past 7 years?

 

I just did a month ago, and got the full pat down, a bomb swab and my shoes checked. It happens. it is accepted. You waive the right to a pat down by going through security. You can choose not to have it done, but by doing so, you will not be allowed through the security checkpoint.

 

 

Your post says that it's all because they're worried about someone smuggling a little weed? So I assume you think it is OK to do that? You don't seem overly concerned. It is ILLEGAL! There is no minimum acceptable amount of drugs. If it is illegal, then all acceptable measures shall be taken to find it.

 

Back off my soapbox

 

sorry dude, you're still flawed. dramatic or not, you are are saying they can do whatever they want because you are in their country. if that is true, then what stops them from crossing that line?

[L2J]

True, but does it have to include having your "wedding Tackle" groped???:eek:

 

No it doesn't...AND SHOULDN'T...but sometimes it happens. (see post 176)

[Canuker]

To Joedog (originator) and all others reading this.

We went to Jamaica once, some years ago (a land vacation, not a cruise) and we vowed we would never return.

And we haven't.

I'm not going to go into the details, the politics, etc. but suffice to say that is one country of extremely angry people.

The times we were confronted (and I mean "confronted") with the equivalent of "I've got a problem, now what are you going to do about it?" was countless.

My advice to anyone considering Jamaica is:

1. Don't go. It's nothing like those tourist ads portray it to be.

2. If you must, go to an all-inclusive, gated resort with proven security and don't venture out - even on an escorted tour. Make sure you have exclusive access to a secure safe for your valuables.

2. If you're on a ship that docks there, treat it as a sea day

[sixgun8]

 

After spending the day spending money in this port I (and almost every other male passenger returning to the ship) were separated from the women passengers and forced to go through a "pat down" search by the local authorities where the "frisker" actually grabbed our penises and testicles through our clothes and squeezed them.

 

 

The more I think about this the more flabbergasted I become and the madder I get at Carnival for taking me to a port where I was treated so shabbily. For the life of me I do not understand why Carnival allowed us to be treated that way without some protest on their part but they did not even have anyone present in the terminal to oversee their passengers being fondled.

 

 

 

Joedog, I was there the same day as you and saw some of the process. I saw people get their pockets grasped and patted, but didn't see anything like what you describe. Matter of fact, when I went through the checkpoint I wasn't even touched. more surprisingly I brought along a fresh coconut water in my hands. I just ran it through the x-ray and went about my business. Carrying liquor the whole way. Nice big backpack and everything.

 

As for carnivals role in this, well they can't control a country. You weren't dealing with Walmart or sears checking you out. It was a government. Sorry you had a bad experience, but it's part of the process. I'd rather that than see drugs just roll through unchecked.

[Joedog]

As I mentioned, I have been to Jamaica a number of times and not subjected to groping. I understand that when I am on foreign soil, I am subject to foreign laws; others apparently do not. I guess some people should just stay home.

 

I think I have a pretty good understanding that I am subject to foreign laws when in foreign countries having been to more foreign countries than just about everyone else I know, but I am not an expert on Jamaican law.

 

For all I know, being searched as I was without being arrested first may be a violation of their law. Interpreting Jamaican law is not my business or the intent of my post. I was just informing fellow CC members of MY experience in Jamaica which I thought was unjustified and I was wondering why Carnival would continue to take it's customers to a place that treats their customers like that.

 

You feel different, fine. Personally, nothing I saw in Montego Bay was so special that it was worth being treated like I was in order to see it. Again, you feel different, fine.

[DqALEX]

To Joedog (originator) and all others reading this.

We went to Jamaica once, some years ago (a land vacation, not a cruise) and we vowed we would never return.

And we haven't.

I'm not going to go into the details, the politics, etc. but suffice to say that is one country of extremely angry people.

The times we were confronted (and I mean "confronted") with the equivalent of "I've got a problem, now what are you going to do about it?" was countless.

My advice to anyone considering Jamaica is:

1. Don't go. It's nothing like those tourist ads portray it to be.

2. If you must, go to an all-inclusive, gated resort with proven security and don't venture out - even on an escorted tour. Make sure you have exclusive access to a secure safe for your valuables.

2. If you're on a ship that docks there, treat it as a sea day

Very honest post. I could not agree more

[Joedog]

Joedog, I was there the same day as you and saw some of the process. I saw people get their pockets grasped and patted, but didn't see anything like what you describe. Matter of fact, when I went through the checkpoint I wasn't even touched. more surprisingly I brought along a fresh coconut water in my hands. I just ran it through the x-ray and went about my business. Carrying liquor the whole way. Nice big backpack and everything.

 

As for carnivals role in this, well they can't control a country. You weren't dealing with Walmart or sears checking you out. It was a government. Sorry you had a bad experience, but it's part of the process. I'd rather that than see drugs just roll through unchecked.

 

Sixgun,

 

Glad you made it through "untouched".

 

As for Carnival's role, I have a different opinion. A long time ago when I was fresh in the Navy I was walking down the passageway on the ship and stepped over a piece of trash on the deck. A senior person behind me stopped me and had me pick up the trash and told me that by stepping over the trash I was setting the cleanliness standard for the ship at a lower level.

 

That is what I feel Carnival is doing. By allowing this kind of treatment of it's passengers it is setting the standard of acceptable treatment of it's passengers at a level lower than I think is right. Sure, Carnival is not the Jamaican goverment but they did take us all there on their ship. If you were on my ship and I saw you treated badly and I did nothing about it would you think it was okay. If it continued to happen wouldnt you wonder why I kept taking you there?

[douglinc@msn.com]

I much prefer fixing America's problems, instead of dragging other countries down to our level.

 

 

Somehow, I have a problem thinking that we are dragging Jamacia down to our level. I think that should be trying to raise them to our level!

 

Doug

[halos]

I think A LOT of the posts in this thread have been worthy of an academy award.

 

I'm just of the mind that people should realize that when in someone elses sandbox you have to play by their rules...whether they are considered right or wrong. Ya don't have to like it...ya just have to do it.

 

That's 100% correct. 'When in Rome'...and all that.

But thanks to people giving us information on this board, we are then able to decide if we want to have to go through this just to see an island.

To those who decide this is no big deal, that's great. For someone like me who thinks that I'll put Jamaica at the end of my 'must see list', this information that the OP posted as well as everyone elses' input is very helpful.

[Thirsty Cruiser]

If Jamaica tourism was smart, they would spin this thing:

 

"Free happy ending with every excursion". :eek: :D

[L2J]

That's 100% correct. 'When in Rome'...and all that.

But thanks to people giving us information on this board, we are then able to decide if we want to have to go through this just to see an island.

To those who decide this is no big deal, that's great. For someone like me who thinks that I'll put Jamaica at the end of my 'must see list', this information that the OP posted as well as everyone elses' input is very helpful.

 

Not disputing that fact one bit. I never said the OP shouldn't have posted his experience - that's what this forum is all about. What I did say was many many of the posts in this thread have been REALLY dramatic...way overboard IMO. (I'll have to go back and find specific ones)

 

Some people like Jamaica, some don't. Some will continue to go there even after reading this and some won't. I loved Jamaica and want to go there again and yes, while there we were verbally accosted and approached MANY times to buy drugs but that's not going to stop me, not even the groping of the family jewels.

[big_duck]

True, but does it have to include having your "wedding Tackle" groped???:eek:

 

That's how they measure pants. :p

[L2J]

If Jamaica tourism was smart, they would spin this thing:

 

"Free happy ending with every excursion". :eek: :D

 

(you forgot the free red stripe) :p

[sixgun8]

Way I see it is this. They are not concerned with us bringing drugs INTO Jamaica, they have plenty. Their concern is us bringing it OUT! I didn't get to go to the excursion meeting, but I did watch it on the TV and I think I do remember them telling us that we would be searched. If you really feel it is a carnival problem, then contact them and let them know. I personally would rather let a few be inconvenienced and upset rather than run into that foul smell on the ship.

[L2J]

That's how they measure pants. :p

 

But was there "cupping?" :p

[Mikel1733]

I don't believe for one minute the Jamaicans have any concern about whether drugs are consumed by cruise ship passengers. This isn't rocket science. They have found this to be a profit center to impose fines and fee's. If you don't mind having your sons, daughters, and wives manhandled then by all means submit to their game.

[MonaCD]

Thanks joedog for sharing your experience. Even the possibility of this happening along with reports I’ve heard from friends who have visited Jamaica would be enough to deter me from visiting Jamaica. It was never high on my list anyway.

 

You’re wasting your breath trying to explain your position to those who have flamed and called you a whiner. There will always be those who read only what they want to read and interpret posts as they choose to interpret and no amount of explanation will ever make them see the logic and reason behind your original post. They just enjoy flaming and the "sound of their own voice" so to speak.

 

For those who are saying that this is what is done in Jamaica and we have to follow their rules, etc, etc, I would find that argument a whole lot easier to swallow if everyone was treated the same, however a couple of people have commented that the RCL passengers were not subjected to even a cursory pat down or search and allowed to return to their ship unhindered.

 

I suppose the local police think they will get rid of their drug problem if they arrest the buyers. Just like many North American law enforcement authorities thought they could get rid of prostitution by arresting the johns. If nobody wants to buy, then nobody will have to sell. Might work but I doubt it.

[kyrisong1]

True, but does it have to include having your "wedding Tackle" groped???:eek:

Some peoples "wedding Tackle" is harder to avoid than others:p

[nolaAlive]

As it is, there is almost no random searching of passengers returning to the United States so it is good that someone is at least trying.

 

I made a mistake (is that possible?) - Carnival's contract doesn't expire until the end of this year. They are required to bring 500,000 passengers to Jamaica annually and 80,000 of those to Montego Bay.

 

RCL's contract doesn't expire until the end of 2009, but with Jamaica building new port facilities for their mega-ships, I suspect there is a contract covering that.

 

It's all about the money.

[DqALEX]

I didn't Like what the lady said to me in Jamacia after she did the pat down of me. She told me I must have African American blood somewhere in my family tree.

[suzski]

Not disputing that fact one bit. I never said the OP shouldn't have posted his experience - that's what this forum is all about. What I did say was many many of the posts in this thread have been REALLY dramatic...way overboard IMO.

 

Some people like Jamaica, some don't. Some will continue to go there even after reading this and some won't. I loved Jamaica and want to go there again and yes, while there we were verbally accosted and approached MANY times to buy drugs but that's not going to stop me, not even the groping of the family jewels.

 

My thoughts exactly. Do you visit NYC (or LA or Sioux City, SD) for 5 hours and get a good vibe on the entire USA? If you've had a bad experience you are more than welcome to express your personal feelings, but again, to bash the entire nation and every Jamaican for their rudeness, disrespect, etc., is absurd....isn't that called stereotyping?

 

As to why the men are searched more thoroughly....perhaps it has to do with the fact that normally women are not offered drugs...in all my visits I've never been asked if I wanted drugs but my husband has...I believe that may be a cultural thing.

 

Also, I get "fondled" or squeezed twice each year by random doctors as part of medical exams, so I guess I just wouldn't see it as much of a violation as some obviously do. Again, not to make light of the situation, but I wouldn't flame a country over it.