Veendam 'too big' to get into St Georges, Bermuda

[Copper10-8]

Sory Copper - mis-read your earlier post - thought you meant there would be a problem when the ship sailed from Hamilton to NY (hence my response). Having said that, since Bermuda is only 21 miles long and 1 mile wide, it's no big deal to get from one side to the other. Plenty of buses and cabs and ferries (and for the more adventurous, moped rentals).

 

The ship (even though it is making two port calls) really only has to treat the whole time on the island as one. Get off the first day at St. George's - just be sure to be back on board Friday afternoon in Hamilton 1 hour before sailing or you're flying back to NY! It has been done for years by all the other ships making multiple stops in Bermuda. I really think the whole thing comes down to a reservation agent who isn't aware of what goes on on these trips. (The old Veendam and Volendam used to do a St. George's/Hamilton shift on their 7-day Bermuda runs from 1980 to 1983 or so.)

 

Thanks Ships!:)

Take care and be safe!

[CruisFran]

OMG!! I can't believe there are over 400 posts on this subject!! Unreal. All on the word of one HAL phone rep!! Tendering into St Georges is now a given...all else is just rumor.

 

People, just wait, as BermudaMal said, and see what happens AFTER the first few sailings of the Bermuda season.

 

Personally, I believe, if they is such a new rule in place at the moment, it won't last long!!

 

Have a Bermudaful day!!:)

[TPKeller]

OMG!! I can't believe there are over 400 posts on this subject!! Unreal. All on the word of one HAL phone rep!! Tendering into St Georges is now a given...all else is just rumor.

This simply isn't true. The facts which are well established are: Tendering from Murray's Anchorage, which is a known location, and "weather permitting". The use of the Bermudian ferry has also been well established.

 

From these facts, many other conclusions can be confidently reached, even though these conclusions may not have been confirmed by the cruise line or a Bermuda government official. There are many well experienced folks here who know a thing or two about Bermuda, tendering, ferry service, etc... Time will tell how well this plan will work, but many of the scenarios depicted in this thread are hardly "just rumor".

 

If the only ingredients in your kitchen are flour, eggs, shortening, milk and sugar, I'm pretty sure it's not "just a rumor" that you aren't having steak for supper. :)

 

Theron

[iheartbda]

Found an interesting editorial in The Royal Gazette. People on this board are not the only ones concerned about tendering as stated in this article....albeit for different reasons, the economic future of St. George, but the main thrust of what people are saying here is expressed by those in Bermuda.

 

http://www.royalgazette.com/rg/Article/article.jsp?articleId=7da172b30030009&sectionId=75

Here's the "meat" of the article.

"Public concern about the disappearance of St. George's-dedicated cruise ships forced the Government to go out and get one for 2010. But then, after signing a contract to bring it here, we learned the vessel is too big to get through Town Cut. Instead, the ship is to anchor at Murray's Anchorage each visit with her passengers ferried into the Old Town. This is a planning and logistical calamity from safety, seasickness and ease of mobility points of view. It should tell everyone that this Government is not paying attention, that it is downright incompetent and disconnected when managing the interests of St. George's."

[peaches from georgia]

I found this article online in Bermuds4U, a Bermuda paper. I know someone else posted that the ferry would be tendering on Tuesday, but reading this it certainly sounds like there might not even be a choice of tendering on Weds. morning into StG before the ship leaves for Hamilton. It certainly seems clear that the Bermuda tender service is a one day thing on Tuesday. At least that is how it reads and they probably need it for service elsewhere on the island and will just give the Veendam the one day.

 

 

Veendam to tender to St George

December 16th, 2009

Today, the Ministry of Tourism and Transport announced The Holland America Line ‘Veendam’ cruise ship that had been scheduled to come into St. George and Hamilton in 2010 will not dock at Pennos’s Wharf but will instead go to anchor at Murray’s Anchorage.

 

 

Premier and Minister of Tourism and Transport Ewart Brown said, “We had hoped the ‘Veendam’ would be able to navigate Town Cut and dock in St. George’s in 2010, however simulations have shown this will not be possible. This situation illustrates the challenge we have in regards to St. George’s.” The Premier went on to say, “Although the ‘Veendam’ will not physically dock in St. George’s in 2010, the tendering arrangement will still provide their guests with a St. George’s experience during their stay in Bermuda. It is often the case that cruise passengers who tender rather than dock stay longer in the destination, including having lunch and participate in activities. This also shows our commitment to keeping a cruise ship presence in St. George’s.”

 

The Ministry will implement a ferry service on Tuesdays from Murray’s Anchorage. The ‘Veendam’ will continue to Hamilton on Wednesdays as currently scheduled, and will depart Bermuda on Fridays. The ‘Veendam’ is scheduled to make 24 cruises to Bermuda in 2010 and will contribute an estimated $7 million to Bermuda’s economy. The ferrying from Murray’s Anchorage will be weather permitting.

 

In 2008, a computer simulation of the ‘Veendam’ was conducted and Holland America Line commenced with marketing and selling the twin-port Bermuda cruises. Although Holland America was confident the ‘Veendam’ could safely navigate Town Cut Channel, it was decided to conduct additional simulations of the ship. Two other simulations were conducted in July and November 2009 and it was concluded that it would be unsafe for the ‘Veendam’ to navigate Town Cut in 2010.

 

The Ministry is discussing specific plans with Holland America Line to ensure their cruise passengers participate in shore excursions and other activities.

[ziggypup]

I found this article online in Bermuds4U, a Bermuda paper. I know someone else posted that the ferry would be tendering on Tuesday, but reading this it certainly sounds like there might not even be a choice of tendering on Weds. morning into StG before the ship leaves for Hamilton. It certainly seems clear that the Bermuda tender service is a one day thing on Tuesday. At least that is how it reads and they probably need it for service elsewhere on the island and will just give the Veendam the one day.

 

 

Veendam to tender to St George

December 16th, 2009

Today, the Ministry of Tourism and Transport announced The Holland America Line ‘Veendam’ cruise ship that had been scheduled to come into St. George and Hamilton in 2010 will not dock at Pennos’s Wharf but will instead go to anchor at Murray’s Anchorage.

 

The Ministry will implement a ferry service on Tuesdays from Murray’s Anchorage. The ‘Veendam’ will continue to Hamilton on Wednesdays as currently scheduled, and will depart Bermuda on Fridays. The ‘Veendam’ is scheduled to make 24 cruises to Bermuda in 2010 and will contribute an estimated $7 million to Bermuda’s economy. The ferrying from Murray’s Anchorage will be weather permitting.

 

The Ministry is discussing specific plans with Holland America Line to ensure their cruise passengers participate in shore excursions and other activities.

 

If they want to ensure passenger participation, then move the ship to Hamilton for the whole cruise. Then the "weather permitting" won't be a issue.

[CruisFran]

This simply isn't true. The facts which are well established are: Tendering from Murray's Anchorage, which is a known location, and "weather permitting". The use of the Bermudian ferry has also been well established.

 

From these facts, many other conclusions can be confidently reached, even though these conclusions may not have been confirmed by the cruise line or a Bermuda government official. There are many well experienced folks here who know a thing or two about Bermuda, tendering, ferry service, etc... Time will tell how well this plan will work, but many of the scenarios depicted in this thread are hardly "just rumor".

 

If the only ingredients in your kitchen are flour, eggs, shortening, milk and sugar, I'm pretty sure it's not "just a rumor" that you aren't having steak for supper. :)

 

Theron

 

"Weather permitting" is just plain common sense! It is a fact we will not dock in StG, as the itinerary listing has already been changed by HAL. I do agree it's been said it will be the large (700 pax) ferry. As to well experienced, I would put myself among them with 20 visits to our credit. As to tendering in Bermuda...not much of that had been done for ages! We do also agree on "time will tell". The rumors I'm refering to are mainly in reference to that we "must" be onboard for the repositioning to Hamilton, and nothing to do with tendering.

 

Regarding what's going on in my kitchen, you would be surprised what magic I can make happen...LOL:D

 

As Johnnie Barnes, says "Good morning, I love you"...with a welcoming smile!:)

[Bermudamal]

After re-reading the Bermuda newspapers regarding this matter, and the fact noted by them that "The Ministry will implement a ferry service on Tuesdays from Murray’s Anchorage. The ‘Veendam’ will continue to Hamilton on Wednesdays as currently scheduled", I think we may have to rethink whether or not this sailing will work for my DH and me.

 

This quote by Ewart Brown clearly indicates (to me anyway) that tendering on Wednesday will not even be an option, and the move to "Hamilton as currently scheduled" will amount to a total waste of a day in Bermuda. Let's face it....if we do not start the transit to Hamilton until 2:00 PM, we won't arrive until around 4:00 PM. My idea of a day in Bermuda is not sitting on a ship staring at Ft. St. Catherine and Tobacco Bay waiting for a two hour move to Hamilton.

 

I guess time will tell since, I think that people on the first few sailings may be up in arms. Perhaps HAL will actually hear them and try to make different arrangements with Bermuda. We're lucky since our final payment is not due until July, so we'll have plenty of time to cancel without penalty if we decide to do so. Needless to, say we'll be following CC very closely this spring with regards to this matter.

[RalphWiggum]

I am one of the guinea pigs on the first sailing. I choose to believe that there is a tender on wednesday for two reasons. The first reason is that the itinerary on my docs and the HAL website has a TR notation in superscript next to day 4 in St George, so if there is no tender currently scheduled, which HAL would surely know, then it is poor form rising to the level of deceptive business practice to have added this notation. The other reason is that Bermuda clearly wants passengers in St George spending money so why would it not provide a tender on Wednesday as well? From Bermuda's perspective, they are better off with us either in St. George that morning or in Hamilton that morning (meaning that they will let the ship into Hamilton before 2 in the alternative) then stuck on the HAL ship all morning and afternoon spending no money onshore.

 

I choose to believe that reason will prevail before my sailing. That said, as a newbie to the HAL boards and HAL, it looks like HAL doesn't always act rationally (the decision to not have reduced fare shakedown cruises for ships out of dry dock, e.g.). I love Bermuda and I know I'll have a great cruise but if I'm stuck staring at ft Catherine all day Wednesday, I doubt I'll sail HAL again because I think they have more than enough time to fix this.

[Janet S.]

I also believe that tender/ferry service will be provided on the transfer Wednesday. HAL has shore excursions offered for St. George's on their website for that Wednesday (on my cruise that is Wednesday, October 6). One departs at 9:30 am for 5 hours ending after the ship has moved from St. George's to Hamilton at 2:00 pm so it will be interesting how HAL handles those people. Other excursions are for less time so those people will be back on board for the move. I guess we have to wait for April to see how this all turns out.

[RichNY]

I am one of the guinea pigs on the first sailing. I choose to believe that there is a tender on wednesday for two reasons. The first reason is that the itinerary on my docs and the HAL website has a TR notation in superscript next to day 4 in St George, so if there is no tender currently scheduled, which HAL would surely know, then it is poor form rising to the level of deceptive business practice to have added this notation. The other reason is that Bermuda clearly wants passengers in St George spending money so why would it not provide a tender on Wednesday as well? From Bermuda's perspective, they are better off with us either in St. George that morning or in Hamilton that morning (meaning that they will let the ship into Hamilton before 2 in the alternative) then stuck on the HAL ship all morning and afternoon spending no money onshore.

 

I choose to believe that reason will prevail before my sailing. That said, as a newbie to the HAL boards and HAL, it looks like HAL doesn't always act rationally (the decision to not have reduced fare shakedown cruises for ships out of dry dock, e.g.). I love Bermuda and I know I'll have a great cruise but if I'm stuck staring at ft Catherine all day Wednesday, I doubt I'll sail HAL again because I think they have more than enough time to fix this.

 

I hope it all works for you. At least then we can have some first hand information as to how the process will work....

[chief d]

OK, after a few cruises to Bermuda and MANY land vacations there this came up between my wife and I last night. What about customes? With the ship anchored out it will take longer to clear the ship than it would tied to the pier. (Getting the agents out to the ship.) So now we have something else to cut into our time getting ashore. Honestly this cruise is starting to become a cruise from hell.

[TPKeller]

The rumors I'm refering to are mainly in reference to that we "must" be onboard for the repositioning to Hamilton, and nothing to do with tendering.

 

Regarding what's going on in my kitchen, you would be surprised what magic I can make happen...LOL:D

 

As Johnnie Barnes, says "Good morning, I love you"...with a welcoming smile!:)

Ahh... I see now, and yep, I agree... that bit of info is ripe for being wrong, because it makes absolutely no sense. But I am not going to be the one to bet against a big company doing something that makes no sense, at least until they have the chance to be overwhelmed by the collective screaming of thousands of passengers to wise them up a bit.

 

I'd love to see a "pound cake steak" some time! :)

 

Theron

[iheartbda]

I am one of the guinea pigs on the first sailing. I choose to believe that there is a tender on wednesday for two reasons. The first reason is that the itinerary on my docs and the HAL website has a TR notation in superscript next to day 4 in St George, so if there is no tender currently scheduled, which HAL would surely know, then it is poor form rising to the level of deceptive business practice to have added this notation. The other reason is that Bermuda clearly wants passengers in St George spending money so why would it not provide a tender on Wednesday as well? From Bermuda's perspective, they are better off with us either in St. George that morning or in Hamilton that morning (meaning that they will let the ship into Hamilton before 2 in the alternative) then stuck on the HAL ship all morning and afternoon spending no money onshore.

 

...................

This is one reason why I don't think HAL will dock the whole time in Hamilton. There have been a number of newspaper articles lamenting the fact that St. George is suffering the loss of cruise pax revenue, one said 17 stores have closed and has become a commercial ghost town. It also said the govt. went out and found a ship to bring in, the Veendam, so it seems to me that they will do all in their power to keep it there, even though it's anchored, forcing people to tender and despite the fact that some, including the opposition leader feel tendering is a "planning and logistical nightmare".

[Milaandra]

Milandra, please let us know when you get final word from HAL. I'm not trying to disagree with you, but HAL has not clearly stated it's position regarding meeting the ship in Hamilton to everyone. When I called on Saturday, I was told that all passengers who tendered had to tender back and there was no release available. I asked the rep to confirm this with her boss but s/he'd left for the evening and I wasn't able to call back yesterday but plan to call tonight.

 

I did get permission. However, I still might bail and go with the cheaper cruise.

 

If they had chosen instead to dock at Hamilton the whole time then it would be worth paying the extra money for the additional day in Bermuda, even without the St. George docking.

 

I don't even know if I'll end up panicking on a gangplank between a ship and a boat with nothing below me but a thin bit of metal and the great blue! (Sometimes being a non-swimmer comes out in weird moments) And seriously, what happens if the seas are choppy? :eek:

[Milaandra]

If you looked at the cruise itineraries for the HAL Veendam cruises to Bermuda on the HAL website, you would have seen that there is a posted code TR (Tender Required) for St. George's!;)

 

Not when we book, it didn't!

[chief d]

This is one reason why I don't think HAL will dock the whole time in Hamilton. There have been a number of newspaper articles lamenting the fact that St. George is suffering the loss of cruise pax revenue, one said 17 stores have closed and has become a commercial ghost town. It also said the govt. went out and found a ship to bring in, the Veendam, so it seems to me that they will do all in their power to keep it there, even though it's anchored, forcing people to tender and despite the fact that some, including the opposition leader feel tendering is a "planning and logistical nightmare".

 

What you say is true. When we were there last May (land vacation) NCL bused it's paxs from the Dockyard to St George's. And most really didn't want to be there. One gent I was talking to couldn't wait until the bus returned so he could go back to the ship. Thats how bad it's become. Some of the stores and restaurants had closed their doors for good. It was funny sitting at the White Horse Travern without a ship tied up. If something isn't done soon, St. George's will become a sleepy little town. And that is sad to me a long time Bermuda visitor.

[WeatherBoy]

OK, after a few cruises to Bermuda and MANY land vacations there this came up between my wife and I last night. What about customes? With the ship anchored out it will take longer to clear the ship than it would tied to the pier. (Getting the agents out to the ship.) So now we have something else to cut into our time getting ashore. Honestly this cruise is starting to become a cruise from hell.

 

We were considering this cruise in August but now we're going with Celebrity to Dockyard.

[sail7seas]

Is it possible they may use Bermuda's large tender on Tuesday but ships tenders on Wednesday?

 

[BigGreenFan]

Is it possible they may use Bermuda's large tender on Tuesday but ships tenders on Wednesday?

 

 

I believe Topsham said a Bermuda pilot had to be on each tender making it unlikely the ship's boats would be used.

[NextOne]

Found an interesting editorial in The Royal Gazette. People on this board are not the only ones concerned about tendering as stated in this article....albeit for different reasons, the economic future of St. George, but the main thrust of what people are saying here is expressed by those in Bermuda.

 

http://www.royalgazette.com/rg/Article/article.jsp?articleId=7da172b30030009&sectionId=75

Did you also notice that according to this article, the high speed ferry is no longer running to St. Georges? It almost does seem like the BDA government is trying to make St. Georges disappear!

[iheartbda]

Did you also notice that according to this article, the high speed ferry is no longer running to St. Georges? It almost does seem like the BDA government is trying to make St. Georges disappear!

YES, I did and couldn't believe what I was reading. Just as an outside observer, I DO wonder about some of the things going on there as far as the present government is concerned. How can they possibly want to help St. George but at the same time, cut off a good way to get there?:confused:

[Opinions]

HAL has shore excursions offered for St. George's on their website for that Wednesday (on my cruise that is Wednesday, October 6). One departs at 9:30 am for 5 hours ending after the ship has moved from St. George's to Hamilton at 2:00 pm so it will be interesting how HAL handles those people.

 

No problem...According to the HAL website that tour ends up in Hamilton where the ship will be docked.

[RichNY]

Did you also notice that according to this article, the high speed ferry is no longer running to St. Georges? It almost does seem like the BDA government is trying to make St. Georges disappear!

 

I'm not 100% sure but I think in the past the high speed service did not run all year round...It was seasonal..

[WomanRN]

Tendering

Just received this directly from HAL - they are also trying to get me a tender schedule (times of operation). I have gotten permission for both of us to remain on the island during the repositioning. It was really quite easy. They also said that this situation is not likely to change (I specifically asked about docking the whole time in Hamilton). Still have NOT made a final jump ship decision yet....

 

:mad:

Lynette,

 

I just got confirmation from the Administrative Assistant in the Port/Nautical Operations department that the tender is 45 minutes each way.

 

Bummer.

 

Hopefully we’ll get back to your travel agent about the tender schedule just as fast!

 

Take care,

 

Crystal Brooks

Reservations Agent

Direct Reservations | Direct Group Reservations

1-877-724-5425

HOLLAND AMERICA LINE