Veendam 'too big' to get into St Georges, Bermuda

[TPKeller]

Folks if you're late to this party (thread) then please take the time to read through it before you post and make yourself look.... well, let's just say uninformed.

 

The early word from HAL was that passengers would not be allowed to stay ashore during the ship's move to Hamilton unless you had arranged for special permission, involving paperwork and a release of liability.

 

Granted, it is hard to comprehend why this would be required because it makes no sense. And that is the very reason why we are talking about it in this thread!

 

:)

 

Theron

[sapper1]

Folks if you're late to this party (thread) then please take the time to read through it before you post and make yourself look.... well, let's just say uninformed.

 

The early word from HAL was that passengers would not be allowed to stay ashore during the ship's move to Hamilton unless you had arranged for special permission, involving paperwork and a release of liability.

 

Granted, it is hard to comprehend why this would be required because it makes no sense. And that is the very reason why we are talking about it in this thread!

 

:)

 

Theron

Just a thought----on our Copenhagen to New York cruise on the Eurodam last August, we chose to jump ship in Halifax and drive home as it was much more convenient. HAL had us sign a release that involved us promising not to seek compensation from them for the part of the voyage we did not participate in. Perhaps they are looking at the possibility that some passengers might take the view that since they did not take the "voyage" from St. George's to Hamilton, they would be entitled to compensation.

Do you think I am way off the mark here or does that make sense?

[chief d]

Being a long time cruiser, but first time Hal cruiser, I'm not getting a warm and fuzzy feeling from Hal. On 1/18 my wife (who has cruised Hal before) sent them a very nice e-mail asking very pointed questions about the tendering and staying ashore during the move. Still no reply. She explained we have sailed and flown to Bermuda many times, and know our way around the island. (It's not real hard anyway.) And that we plan to stay ashore most of the time in Bermuda anyway. We have VERY DEAR FRIENDS who live there. So I guess what I'm saying "when and if" we get a reply then it will be official. That way there is paper with a name and date attached.;):)

[Charles4515]

Just a thought----on our Copenhagen to New York cruise on the Eurodam last August, we chose to jump ship in Halifax and drive home as it was much more convenient. HAL had us sign a release that involved us promising not to seek compensation from them for the part of the voyage we did not participate in. Perhaps they are looking at the possibility that some passengers might take the view that since they did not take the "voyage" from St. George's to Hamilton, they would be entitled to compensation.

Do you think I am way off the mark here or does that make sense?

 

Compensation for two hours.....LOL. Yes, I think you are way off the mark.

[Cinema15]

The way I see it the crusielines have no problem leaving a port without you if you return late from a self-touring shore excursion. Of course it is up to you to make your way to the next port to re-board the vessel. So why is this any different? Simply "miss" the boarding time in St. Georges and make your way to Hamilton to reboard at your leisure. ;)

[sapper1]

Compensation for two hours.....LOL. Yes, I think you are way off the mark.

I don't know---the more I read these boards, the more I see that people want compensation for the smallest details.:)

[RichNY]

Not a deal breaker for us! We love sailing to Bermuda on small ships. Tender or no tender, I would rather sail on HAL's small ship to Bermuda than being with all the masses in Dockyard! Half the cruise experience is the SHIP, and I'd rather be on HAL. In the past we have not had too many options from NY to sail to Bermuda, so we had to settle. Now we don't.

 

 

I'm with you on this.....:D

 

I find totally amazing how so many people put a negative spin on the subject...:(

[Charles4515]

I'm with you on this.....:D

 

I find totally amazing how so many people put a negative spin on the subject...:(

 

Tendering to St. George is negative. The Dockyard is a negative too but not as much as the tendering at St. George. And at least from the Dockyard I can get to the South Shore beaches easily every day. Also been on Summit and like that ship. Before the tendering issue it was a slam dunk that I would book Veendam. However with this mess I am leaning towards doing an Alaska cruise this summer rather than Bermuda at all. I don't blame Bermuda. HAL screwed up.

[fann1sh]

Charles4515, when I first posted on this thread (pages and pages ago) I also believed this was a HAL screw up. However, the more I read (ie. Bermuda solicited a St. Georges stop), the more I wonder.

 

I wonder if Bermuda assured "of course the ship fits the cut, please schedule the stop!" --- then mired HAL pax and HAL itself in this mess.

 

I especially didn't like the tone of the news report suggesting pax "trapped" by tendering would stay longer and buy more.

 

For those who consider tenders no big deal, please remember (also discussed pages and pages ago) some of us are handicapped, or assisting handicapped pax, as I would be. There is a HUGE difference between docked and tendered for pax in wheelchairs, or with other mobility issues!

[Charles4515]

I wonder if Bermuda assured "of course the ship fits the cut, please schedule the stop!" --- then mired HAL pax and HAL itself in this mess.

 

I especially didn't like the tone of the news report suggesting pax "trapped" by tendering would stay longer and buy more.

 

 

I don't see any "tone'" at all in the quote of the tourism official. It is just a local politician spinning a negative it to the locals to make it appear positive. Those local politicians said the same thing about Dockyard. That taking the ferry to St. George and Hamilton would mean cruise passengers would spend more at those places. Instead it meant closed businesses.

 

As far as the ship fitting thru the cut, I think the owner of a ship would do due diligence to make sure their property would fit thru a channel and not get damaged. So I blame HAL for the mess. Also HAL modified the ship after committing it to Bermuda and it is quite possible that tthose changes by HAL resulted in the ship not being able to fit.

[fann1sh]

Certainly not arguing with you. I agree about modifications. I speculated in an earlier post about swapping in an unmodified S class for this route, but that would create more chaos than it would solve.

 

I'm just leaning to the opinion it wasn't *only* a HAL screw up. This took a committee :rolleyes:

 

Bottom line: I'm not booking this itinerary. Too difficult with a mom in a wheelchair.

[iheartbda]

Not a deal breaker for us! We love sailing to Bermuda on small ships. Tender or no tender, I would rather sail on HAL's small ship to Bermuda than being with all the masses in Dockyard! Half the cruise experience is the SHIP, and I'd rather be on HAL. In the past we have not had too many options from NY to sail to Bermuda, so we had to settle. Now we don't.

I agree whole heartedly on the small ship aspect. :)

 

We have sailed to Bermuda on three different small ships all of which are now gone. Although Dockyard for us is not our preference, we could deal with it since the beaches are so close. However, it's the size of the ships that dock there and like you say, the masses of people. That's why we were so excited about the Veendam, it had everything......small size, more traditional and St. George/Hamilton docking.

 

Where we differ is, the cruise experience is one third and the itinerary is two thirds.;) We've been on at least one ship to Bermuda that many would not step foot on but it got us where were were going and we actually liked the ship.

 

As far as deal breakers....it's about preferences, everyone has their own.:) Right now, it's a wait and see to hear what people from the first sailings say. Normally, we would be booked by now. If the reports are good, we'll see if we can snag something late even if it's in what some people call "steerage", if it gets us to the prize at the end of the rainbow, we're good.:D

[RuthC]

So I guess what I'm saying "when and if" we get a reply then it will be official.

Don't count on it. Seattle is often wrong. Then they change their mind.

[broberts]

Compensation for two hours.....LOL. Yes, I think you are way off the mark.

 

I disagree. There are enough posts on this board where compensation is felt deserved for equally trivial reasons. And for someone who would make such a claim it's not just 2 hours. It's an entire night that the cabin isn't used and at least two meals.

[peaches from georgia]

I disagree. There are enough posts on this board where compensation is felt deserved for equally trivial reasons. And for someone who would make such a claim it's not just 2 hours. It's an entire night that the cabin isn't used and at least two meals.

Maybe I'm missing something. The 2 hour compensation this thread is posting about is for the 2 hours the ship sails from St George to Hamilton. Miss the ship? Just go over to Hamilton. Ship leaves StG at 2 and arrives in Hamilton at 4. No meals or night missed.

 

I don't think anyone would ask for compensation and certainly not get any. Everyone knows it leaves at 2. Not there is your own fault. Just take the bus to Hamilton and meet the ship.

[Charles4515]

Maybe I'm missing something. The 2 hour compensation this thread is posting about is for the 2 hours the ship sails from St George to Hamilton. Miss the ship? Just go over to Hamilton. Ship leaves StG at 2 and arrives in Hamilton at 4. No meals or night missed.

 

I don't think anyone would ask for compensation and certainly not get any. Everyone knows it leaves at 2. Not there is your own fault. Just take the bus to Hamilton and meet the ship.

 

You are not missing anything. It is broberts that is missing iand does not understand that Bermuda is a small island and that the reposition from St. George is two hours. As you describe it will be two hours in the afternoon of the same day. None need miss a meal or a night in their cabin. In fact a passenger could have lunch, tender to St. George right before the ship left, take a bus to Hamilton from St. George and be in Hamilton before the ship arrived in Hamilton. And have dinner on the ship.

[peaches from georgia]

You are not missing anything. It is broberts that is missing iand does not understand that Bermuda is a small island and that the reposition from St. George is two hours. As you describe it will be two hours in the afternoon of the same day. None need miss a meal or a night in their cabin. In fact a passenger could have lunch, tender to St. George right before the ship left, take a bus to Hamilton from St. George and be in Hamilton before the ship arrived in Hamilton. And have dinner on the ship.

;) I was trying to be gentle. I think some people post never having read even the basics of the thread conversation.

[Copper10-8]

I'm not a operational deployment planner (or whatever it's called in Seattle) but it seems to me Veendam is commencing her Bermuda runs from New York on 25 APR with the last one on 03 OCT. Her older sister Statendam, a "S"class ship, is starting a 21-day Panama Canal cruise on that same date (25 APR) from Ft. Lauderdale on her way to Alaska.

Swap those two out and have them assume the other's 2010 schedule and your Bermuda (St. George's tendering) problem is solved. Doing this will more than likely cause someone headaches with both cruises leading up to 25 APR involving two different ports (NYC & FLL), so I'm probably missing the big pic

[chief d]

Don't count on it. Seattle is often wrong. Then they change their mind.

 

So what your saying is, Seattle is just like our New England weather huh, don't like it, just wait awhile it will change. LOL;)

[DRWhit]

I'm not a operational deployment planner (or whatever it's called in Seattle) but it seems to me Veendam is commencing her Bermuda runs from New York on 25 APR with the last one on 03 OCT. Her older sister Statendam, a "S"class ship, is starting a 21-day Panama Canal cruise on that same date (25 APR) from Ft. Lauderdale on her way to Alaska.

Swap those two out and have them assume the other's 2010 schedule and your Bermuda (St. George's tendering) problem is solved. Doing this will more than likely cause someone headaches with both cruises leading up to 25 APR involving two different ports (NYC & FLL), so I'm probably missing the big pic

I love that idea. I know there are some differences now that the Veendam has a re-fitted back-end. There are more cabins now on the Veendam than her sister ships, so people in those new cabin locations would have to be moved. I am sure it would be a potential head-ache to make sure people got the right class cabin, but if they started planning now, it seems to me that it would be do-able.

[AlexandNessa]

Can someone help me understand why it will take 30/45 minutes for the tender?

It is simply distance or loading/unloading 700 pax?

Or, will the tender ferry pick up at the Veendam and make other stops before arriving at St. George's?

 

Anyone know yet?

[TPKeller]

Can someone help me understand why it will take 30/45 minutes for the tender?

It is simply distance or loading/unloading 700 pax?

Or, will the tender ferry pick up at the Veendam and make other stops before arriving at St. George's?

 

Anyone know yet?

All of the above in bold. There would not be any other places for the tender to stop along the way, but it's probably very important to note that the ferry would likely have to stay in the channel all the way, which is a bit longer than simply skirting the coast. You can see the channel in the map below.

 

Murray's Anchorage is north and west of Tobacco Bay. So that's outside the cut, around the point of Fort St. Catherine, then a bit farther to the west. It is open ocean. The 700 passenger ferry is large, but how long does it take to load 700 people single file, plus extra time for those who need assistance, and are in wheeled devices of various sorts?

 

Here is an image of an old map I found with Google, you can see the area of Murray's Anchorage:

 

 

I've also updated my Cruise Map of St. Georges. There really isn't any way to tell exactly where they will anchor, it appears to be quite a large area.

 

Theron

[AlexandNessa]

Thank you, Theron. I appreciate your time and explanation.

On another note, I am glad my husband and I are late sleepers and won't be getting on the first or second ferry.

[CruisFran]

Great map!!! Purely guessing, not knowing how much depth the ferry needs, would be that the ship would dock in Murray's Anchorage, possibly close to "The Narrows". Assume even the ferry must travel in the Narrows to the St. Georges Cut. If all that is true...a good reason for it being a 40-45 ferry ride.

 

Study the map, all the shaded area off shore is REEFS...hence Bermuda's other/older name "Isle of Devils"...immortilized in Shakespeare's "Tempest".....for all the ship-wrecks!!

 

For you history buffs...Bermuda is loaded with it!!!

[Charles4515]

Study the map, all the shaded area off shore is REEFS...hence Bermuda's other/older name "Isle of Devils"...immortilized in Shakespeare's "Tempest".....for all the ship-wrecks!!

 

For you history buffs...Bermuda is loaded with it!!!

 

Those who stay on the ship for the move from St. George to Hamilton will get a great view of the reefs.