Veendam- If you think getting off was bad....

[gabbyisadog]

Just returned from 16 day SA cruise. Too tired to tell you the good, the bad etc.

 

Just a quick note re: Dec. 5th embarkation. I assume it was not HAL's fault that passengers were getting off at 5 PM- Brazil health inspection etc. How HAL handled departing passengers I do not know. But they failed big time in managing the problem for embarking passengers. This is HAL's responsibility- all companies run into problems beyond their control- the mark of an excellent company is how you handle them.

 

HAL provided no information- even saying we are having this problem and do not know when you will be able to get on ship is better than pretending there is no problem. Rumors were worse than the facts.

 

Inadequate food and drink. By 10:00 AM they should have understood they could have a big problem and began preparing platters of food. Some, not me, are diabetic or have medical issues requiring food.

 

Not enough personnel in holding areas to handle crowd and arrange for orderly embarkation - pushing etc resulted.

 

HAL handled the situation poorly. A free drink or free house wine at the first formal dinner would make passengers feel good about HAL.

 

 

 

Makes me wonder how HAL would handle a more serious problem.

[LoveHAL]

Just returned from 16 day SA cruise. Too tired to tell you the good, the bad etc.

 

Just a quick note re: Dec. 5th embarkation. I assume it was not HAL's fault that passengers were getting off at 5 PM- Brazil health inspection etc. How HAL handled departing passengers I do not know. But they failed big time in managing the problem for embarking passengers. This is HAL's responsibility- all companies run into problems beyond their control- the mark of an excellent company is how you handle them.

 

HAL provided no information- even saying we are having this problem and do not know when you will be able to get on ship is better than pretending there is no problem. Rumors were worse than the facts.

 

Inadequate food and drink. By 10:00 AM they should have understood they could have a big problem and began preparing platters of food. Some, not me, are diabetic or have medical issues requiring food.

 

Not enough personnel in holding areas to handle crowd and arrange for orderly embarkation - pushing etc resulted.

 

HAL handled the situation poorly. A free drink or free house wine at the first formal dinner would make passengers feel good about HAL.

 

 

 

Makes me wonder how HAL would handle a more serious problem.

 

 

Pertaining to the food: It is my understanding that it is NOT legal to bring food off a ship in a foreign port. We hear that announcement everytime passengers leave the ship. Do you realize (from the hotel manager) that HAL/Veendam did not receive permission from Local Officials to bring food or drink to the dock until approximately 2pm? They reacted pretty darn rapidly once they got the OK from Brazil.

 

Information/Staffing: How do you staff for a disaster? They had 1,400 plus guests on board the ship that were missing connections, etc. They had to be cared for. The number of dockside staff (local employees) seemed to be the normal number of people for greeting/registering passengers. 'While I do not know, I suspect that the ships officers were pretty darn busy trying to deal with the Brazilian Officials.

 

By the way, the Captain did provide a "free" drink to people in the Main dining room. I don't know about the Lido. And, once the ship departed Brazil, the Captain did make an announcement over the PA to try to explain what happened. Again, I just suspect.... but this was a little bigger than what the Captain could officially deal with. Just a guess, but something like this has to come from Corporate in Seattle.

 

It seemed to me at the time that there wasn't much they could do short of pointing fingers at the Local Officials. All that might do would be to delay departure even more.

 

No matter how you look at it, it was not a wonderful experience. But lets point fingers where they should be pointed.

[IRL_Joanie]

Pertaining to the food: It is my understanding that it is NOT legal to bring food off a ship in a foreign port. We hear that announcement everytime passengers leave the ship. Do you realize (from the hotel manager) that HAL/Veendam did not receive permission from Local Officials to bring food or drink to the dock until approximately 2pm? They reacted pretty darn rapidly once they got the OK from Brazil.

 

Information/Staffing: How do you staff for a disaster? They had 1,400 plus guests on board the ship that were missing connections, etc. They had to be cared for. The number of dockside staff (local employees) seemed to be the normal number of people for greeting/registering passengers. 'While I do not know, I suspect that the ships officers were pretty darn busy trying to deal with the Brazilian Officials.

 

By the way, the Captain did provide a "free" drink to people in the Main dining room. I don't know about the Lido. And, once the ship departed Brazil, the Captain did make an announcement over the PA to try to explain what happened. Again, I just suspect.... but this was a little bigger than what the Captain could officially deal with. Just a guess, but something like this has to come from Corporate in Seattle.

 

It seemed to me at the time that there wasn't much they could do short of pointing fingers at the Local Officials. All that might do would be to delay departure even more.

 

No matter how you look at it, it was not a wonderful experience. But lets point fingers where they should be pointed.

 

 

I like the way you explained it LoveHAL!! Very nicely!!:)

 

Joanie

[gabbyisadog]

Pertaining to the food: It is my understanding that it is NOT legal to bring food off a ship in a foreign port. We hear that announcement everytime passengers leave the ship. Do you realize (from the hotel manager) that HAL/Veendam did not receive permission from Local Officials to bring food or drink to the dock until approximately 2pm? They reacted pretty darn rapidly once they got the OK from Brazil.

 

Information/Staffing: How do you staff for a disaster? They had 1,400 plus guests on board the ship that were missing connections, etc. They had to be cared for. The number of dockside staff (local employees) seemed to be the normal number of people for greeting/registering passengers. 'While I do not know, I suspect that the ships officers were pretty darn busy trying to deal with the Brazilian Officials.

 

By the way, the Captain did provide a "free" drink to people in the Main dining room. I don't know about the Lido. And, once the ship departed Brazil, the Captain did make an announcement over the PA to try to explain what happened. Again, I just suspect.... but this was a little bigger than what the Captain could officially deal with. Just a guess, but something like this has to come from Corporate in Seattle.

 

It seemed to me at the time that there wasn't much they could do short of pointing fingers at the Local Officials. All that might do would be to delay departure even more.

 

No matter how you look at it, it was not a wonderful experience. But lets point fingers where they should be pointed.

 

 

We stayed in a Delux Ver. Suite and ate both first and second night in MDR and somehow missed the free drink.

 

I don't love HAL or dislike them having cruised 6 times with them, I'm inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt. In the end it is corporate's responsibility. As a former CEO of a consumer prtoduct company, I would have had platters of food ready to go when Brazil allowed me to take it ashore. I'm sure the kitchen help were not dealing with the officals from Brazil. Or maybe they were.

 

We all differ in what is acceptable. Those who find this ok will hurry back to HAL other will make a different choice.

[the_dylaness]

Having no personal interest in or connection to the event, I do have to wonder about the food situation. I understand the problems with HAL bringing food ashore from the ship, but I certainly do not understand why HAL could not have had food brought in from land? Costly, yes, perhaps, but what with diabetics, hungry cranky folks, and good will from customers at stake, worth it?

[sail7seas]

Having no personal interest in or connection to the event, I do have to wonder about the food situation. I understand the problems with HAL bringing food ashore from the ship, but I certainly do not understand why HAL could not have had food brought in from land? Costly, yes, perhaps, but what with diabetics, hungry cranky folks, and good will from customers at stake, worth it?

 

 

I'm not trying to be argumentative but where and how would they have been able to provide food for approx 1,300 guests with no forewarning? How could they be sure it would be safe and edible? One can't just pick up a phone and get immediate 'take out'for a crowd that size. The ship did not know in advance how lengthy the disembarkation would be.

 

Again..... who knows what was going on in the galley? Didn't we read about Brazil health inspectors being aboard? Maybe they were examining conditions in the galley which made it difficult for Chefs to do food prep? Of course, this is not anything I'd have knowledge of.

 

Perhaps local Officials were 'difficult' about permitting the ship to send food ashore. We did read at some point, some sandwiches were brought ashore I think but I don't recall much detail. Perhaps they were stopped from accomodating guests on shore. Again, just speculation on my part.

 

What I don't get is why any U.S. citizens would even think of spending their cash there when they seem to be saying they really don't want us. If I'm not welcome, I'll bring my $$ where I'm wanted or at least not abused.

[Krazy Kruizers]

Sad that this happened.

But the Captain can only do so much -- especially with these Brazilian people have the final say as to inspctions and to the clearing of the ship.

Sad to say -- but more and more I read how the Brazilians do not like us -- and I fear things are not going to be much different in the future.

Maybe it is time HAL rethink these itineraries and stop going there for a couple of years.

Glad we were there years ago and didn't have to face those conditions.

[Mary Ellen]

Maybe it is time HAL rethink these itineraries and stop going there for a couple of years.

Apparently you haven't noticed that HAL is sailing from BA next season, not Rio. They are ahead of your advice.

[lettienets]

I for one would prefer going to SA or Antarctica out of Buenes Aires rather than Rio. It irks me having to get a visa for a hefty price, let alone having to mail a consulate my passport. Princess Line has been going out of BA for years. Rio is such a spectacular port of entry, so beautiful to see, it is a shame people will miss it.

[wander]

Gabbyisadog,

 

You may have noted that I did express my feelings about your situation in the initial thread about that day. You had it much worse than we, on the ship, did.

 

I really, really did feel sorry for you all waiting to get on the ship, and even more so when I saw the terminal conditions. (Yes, I was on the ship and was called to disembark at 5:03 PM.) What a day for everyone, including the crew, but we waiting to disembark had a much better situation than those waiting to embark. Of course those who missed their flights would may not agree, but thankfully many (probably most) of the passengers leaving Rio that day apparently had evening flights. I did make comments about your unfortunate conditions on the original thread about the disembarkation.

 

Sail7seas,

The passengers stuck on the ship benefited from the food the galley had prepared for those embarking. At some point the Cruise Director announced that the Lido was open for lunch for those stuck on the ship. Several bars were also open. The Galley crew work did not go to waste and was much appreciated!

[tjcox9]

I for one would prefer going to SA or Antarctica out of Buenes Aires rather than Rio. It irks me having to get a visa for a hefty price, let alone having to mail a consulate my passport. Princess Line has been going out of BA for years. Rio is such a spectacular port of entry, so beautiful to see, it is a shame people will miss it.

 

It's too bad about the situation encountered for both disembarkers and embarkers. But, I've have to address the new reciprocity fee that we understand is to be in place shortly for those flying into BA. Similar to Chile, a $131 fee will be assessed at EZE for those arriving. Granted, it's easier than having to jump through visa hoops as one does for Brazil.

 

I'm aware of this because we are flying into BA in January for cruise, and this is what we're hearing and is on a warden's notice regarding immigration into Argentina. Supposedly, it was to go into place earlier, but was delayed and is nearing implementation very soon.

 

And the moral of the story is that they are doing unto others as they have done to them..............

 

 

[gregdude]

Since this was the first cruise of the season into Rio it may have been a one off situation. It will be interesting to see if future cruises into Rio experience a similar situation. Sounds to me like someone wanted a kickback (on the Brazil side) and didn't get it. I'm on a cruise out of Rio in March and will be watching very closely what happens over the next few months!!!

 

HAL has reduced the number of cruises into Rio next year but they still have a number on the schedule.

[lettienets]

It's too bad about the situation encountered for both disembarkers and embarkers. But, I've have to address the new reciprocity fee that we understand is to be in place shortly for those flying into BA. Similar to Chile, a $131 fee will be assessed at EZE for those arriving. Granted, it's easier than having to jump through visa hoops as one does for Brazil.

 

Yes that is a hefty fee as well but at least you don't have to send in your passport to get a visa(which eliminates any last minute deals to Rio). I guess Buenes Aires sees the flight in fee as a cash cow like Chile!

[gabbyisadog]

Gabbyisadog,

 

You may have noted that I did express my feelings about your situation in the initial thread about that day. You had it much worse than we, on the ship, did.

 

I really, really did feel sorry for you all waiting to get on the ship, and even more so when I saw the terminal conditions. (Yes, I was on the ship and was called to disembark at 5:03 PM.) What a day for everyone, including the crew, but we waiting to disembark had a much better situation than those waiting to embark. Of course those who missed their flights would may not agree, but thankfully many (probably most) of the passengers leaving Rio that day apparently had evening flights. I did make comments about your unfortunate conditions on the original thread about the disembarkation.

 

Sail7seas,

The passengers stuck on the ship benefited from the food the galley had prepared for those embarking. At some point the Cruise Director announced that the Lido was open for lunch for those stuck on the ship. Several bars were also open. The Galley crew work did not go to waste and was much appreciated!

Sorry, I did not mean to ignore your sympathy for those embarking. Many departing passengers,despite their own frustrations, expressed the same sentiments.

[bodget]

seven seas -

want food of guaranteed quality.contact any hotel you offer as an over night i'm sure they could knock up some sandwiches and refreshments

[sail7seas]

Yes, I suppose, maybe. But what do we know what instructions under which they were working? They must follow the instructions of local authorities. I'm not trying to make excuses for HAL and I certainly wasn't there. I just try to give benefit of the doubt when I have no idea what was happening/being said out of the view of guests.

 

[Gablin]

Rio is a huge city, with a lot of hotels and restaurants. I think it would have been smart business for HAL to phone around and get some fruit and sandwiches, plus coffee and water. I realize that they were really busy trying to deal with the Brazilian authorities, but the waiting passengers could have been fed and "watered" for about $10 US per person. The good will would be noted by those passengers, travel writers and others.

 

Mostly what I've learned from this is to choose a cruise leaving or ending in Buenos Aires, not Rio. (Maybe the Rio Chamber of Commerce equivalent would have been interested in helping to supply food and drink to the waiting passengers.)

[gabbyisadog]

Yes, I suppose, maybe. But what do we know what instructions under which they were working? They must follow the instructions of local authorities. I'm not trying to make excuses for HAL and I certainly wasn't there. I just try to give benefit of the doubt when I have no idea what was happening/being said out of the view of guests.

 

Anything is possible but I doubt HAL was instructed to bring one small tray of sandwiches and one of cookies and no more. My party was relatively young and in good health. Many on this cruise did not seem to be as they had canes, walkers, wheelchairs etc. Those are the ones I was most concerned about- they were not even allowed to board first in spite of several requests to do so.

 

I was there and still feel HAL let down the embarking passengers.

[wander]

I was there too, but on the "other side" of the gangway. Sitting in the Crow's Nest watching dockside proceedings for about 6 hours, we saw many, many things of interest. For one thing, in general, ship's crew was NOT getting off the ship as normally seen on embark/disembark days. Cannot say none got off, but very few if any. I do not know what that meant.

 

Gabbyisadog, I suspect your doubt might be wrong, but do not know for sure. However, there may be a twist to it. The one cart of what appeared to be sandwiches and cookies we saw taken off the ship probably were not for passengers, but for someone else. The tray was filled with white plates and what appeared to be a sandwich on each, may be 20 at the most. All was covered with plastic wrap. We saw it leave the ship it did NOT seem to be going to the waiting in line passengers, but rather right by the line waiting to board and into the terminal much further down the pier. Some may have been ordered and taken off the ship, but I do not think it was for passengers. Of course, I could be wrong. While I know what I saw, I do not know the reasons behind it.

[jcrandle]

I sympathize with the posters who were disadvantaged in this incident. I've been through numerous unexpected situations with HAL and other cruise lines. Almost universally the single most frustrating component of the problem has been the lack of timely, informative, consistent, communication by the staff in charge. I call it TICC as an acronym for the four components. The single most DAMing failure is to communicate the problem, the status, and the expected resolution. I've sat in embarkation lounges where I could see that there was a problem, but there were no status updates, or if there were, the public address system was non-functional, or overwhelmed by background chatter.

 

My advice (which will be ignored by HAL customer service) is when a problem happens, make regular, clear and concise announcement that can be heard by the affected parties. By regular, I'm reminded of a sports announcer by one of my rival teams who used a three-minute egg timer to insure that the score (the most important statistic of the game) was announced every three minutes. The second most important advice is to NOT assume that everyone in the area has heard the previous explanation, and to ensure that a complete narration of the problem, the action plan, and the escalation procedure is frequently repeated.

 

If every customer service organization would follow these guidelines, we would likely NOT board the ship more quickly, but we would feel like we were a part of the solution, rather than an impediment to the problem, and we would likely spend a lot less time grousing about the problem. Alas, I'm still waiting for the next time that these suggestions are actually followed.

[ScottishMaid]

Those of us on the ship waiting to disembark were updated, sometimes as often as every 15 minutes, by the cruise director. For example we were told when the Brazilian immigration officials on board were taking a lunch break and earlier when a signature had to be obtained.

I wonder if the Brazilian officials stopped HAL personnel from getting off the ship to talk to those awaiting embarkation? Also I don't think there are loudspeaker systems in departure terminals to address hundreds of people at once.

It seems HAL was in control of looking after the people waiting to disembark from their ship (food, information) but possibly they had no control over those waiting to embark in the Brazilian owned terminal?

It would be nice if all of us got a follow up explanation letter.